Tuttle et al v Audiophile Music Direct

[The Computer Audiophile]

1 hour ago, Iving said:

Deception is a raw matter of right and wrong.

It is what I most object to as represented in all my contributions to this thread.

Those who care about the MoFi scandal care most about being deceived.

Exactly as represented by Stiles and his lawyers in the pdf posted.

 

Chris's reply suggests something about the folly of paying $10 to get back $1 or something. That is expediency. If you give up on correcting a moral wrong because of the $ price of doing so it is a fudge.

 

Honestly - I do NOT believe it was necessary to explain this in this way. Out of courtesy nevertheless - here you are.

 

We all have to pick and choose our battles. Suing MiFi over a $40 album, may spark memes that say MoFo, but really reminds me of this:

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

What timing. In my email today, "from the original 3-track master tapes." 

 

If @Rt66indierock is to be believed, the average consumer thinks this is fake because the original tapes are worn out and it's sourced from digital. 

 

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

13 minutes ago, Jud said:

And of course the other characteristic of digital is that in principle it is possible to make nearly unlimited numbers of copies. One of the reasons for the higher value of these records (and of the dye transfer prints described in the article you linked) is that they are limited editions. If there's no assurance the seller can't at some point simply decide to make more, that affects value.

This is mentioned in the document. The plaintiffs make it sound like the albums were purchased as investments or as collectable AAA memorabilia. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

1 minute ago, Jud said:

 

I think I've mentioned this before, but for anyone who hasn't seen it: A fellow law student was a record collector. He followed Goldmine(?) and other such publications religiously. All of these publications put a considerably higher value on LPs still in shrinkwrap.

 

So he'd never removed the shrinkwrap on the records he'd collected. Over the years, humidity had gotten in through holes in the shrinkwrap, expanding the cardboard album covers. Pushing against the shrinkwrap, they'd all cupped, warping the records inside to unplayability. There he was, with an extensive collection of music that had never been played and could never be played.

Wow.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Just now, Iving said:

 

 

I love it!

[The Computer Audiophile]

2 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

What timing. In my email today, "from the original 3-track master tapes." 

 

If @Rt66indierock is to be believed, the average consumer thinks this is fake because the original tapes are worn out and it's sourced from digital. 

 

 

 

However, now that I look at it, is there a digital step? 25,000 copies? I don't know how this works.

[The Computer Audiophile]

6 minutes ago, firedog said:

Note that your ad doesn't say it's an all analog process. Only that the source is the original analog- which a digital source made from the original master tapes is.

Sounds similar to how we got into this whole mess 🙂

[The Computer Audiophile]

2 minutes ago, Iving said:

 

Unless something we don't know (possible - trying to find out), the AP UHQR is a repress of the Classic Records plates - cut in 1994 by Bernie Grundman from the original three-track tapes i.e. presumed all analogue.

Not being familiar with this stuff, can those press 25,000 copies?

[The Computer Audiophile]

All so clear now 😳

[The Computer Audiophile]

Just now, Iving said:

 

What can we know these days?

Sometimes we just have to sit back and listen to the music. 😁

[The Computer Audiophile]

4 minutes ago, JoeWhip said:

When it comes to KOB, I want a transfer from the master using that alien recording tech recovered at Roswell, for the definitive version. Hate to tell Mr. Fremer, but the aliens use quantum digital, no analog in the chain. I can wait.

I thought they use digital with an analog step. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

12 minutes ago, Archimago said:

This whole MoFi controversy I think provides much-needed soul-searching for certain analogue audiophiles.

That is my hope as well. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

1 hour ago, PYP said:

They never asked him why a "vastly superior method" didn't become the point of their advertising, rather than showing deceptive information.   I think that is a fair question.

Because his customer base would’ve rejected it without even listening. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

2 hours ago, Norton said:

Unfortunately,  on the admittedly rare occasions now when I can put up with the inconvenience to listen to my (all analogue) LPs,  it just reinforces the “myth“ of digital inferiority in about 5 seconds.

I’d say it reinforces that you like your all analog LPs better than the digital versions of those albums. 
 

A live-to-two track, all digital capture at 24/192 is stunning, and more accurate than any analog capture. Plus, to play it back natively, it doesn’t need to be printed on plastic and have a needle dragged over it. 
 

I wish more albums were made this way. It at least gives us a benchmark with which to compare what’s possible in digital with other formats. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

7 minutes ago, hopkins said:

 

Can you give some examples (preferably available on Qobuz)? 

Bill Schnee, who recorded direct to disc with Doug Sax and Sheffield, created some live to two track recordings as the new version of direct to disc. Bravura Records was the label. Nothing available on streaming. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

Perhaps describing any vinyl process as one-step, isn't the best marketing anymore. 

 

 

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

3 minutes ago, Rt66indierock said:

Tuttle et al is in the beginning process of settlement. Full refunds + shipping or a 5% refund of the purchase price or a coupon for 10% of the purchase price are the basic terms.

Would love to see the final stats on this one. 

 

How many take the full refund w/return.

How many take teh 5% refund

How many take the 10% coupon

 

How much the returned copies are then sold for. 

 

My guess is the dog caught the car, for the most part. Now what. Many have the best sounding albums in their collections and they'll want to return those? Makes little sense.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Does anyone know if, in cases like this, insurance pays the cost for the company being sued?

[The Computer Audiophile]

5 minutes ago, Jud said:

 

Usually, but I don't know about Music Direct's particular coverage in the event of fraud claims (which is what this is listed as on the docket).

Thanks. 

 

I remember sitting in on a MN appellate court argument, where the insurance company for an out of business contractor, was arguing that a company that no longer exists can't be sued. The contractor had no skin in the game and couldn't have cared less and likely didn't even know the case was still going. It was just the insurance company lawyers arguing the case, which is what made me think about MoFi's actual liability and if this involves money out of MoFi's pocket.

[The Computer Audiophile]

47 minutes ago, Jud said:

Why would they worry about this if the insurer was paying for everything?

A very open ended question to which many answers could be given. Good point nonetheless. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

I know very little about vinyl, but it seems a bit strange to me that a giant label like Blue Note is producing an all analog AAA record of Miles Davis from 1952, 1953, and 1954. 

 

"This Blue Note Classic Vinyl Edition is mono, all-analog, mastered by Kevin Gray from the original masters, and pressed on 180g vinyl at Optimal."

 

https://store.bluenote.com/products/miles-davis-volume-1-lp-blue-note-classic-vinyl-series

[The Computer Audiophile]

6 minutes ago, JoeWhip said:

They are producing it because people are buying them. Some just are collecting them, others actually play them while others buy them, hold them and then resell them. Whatever floats your boat.

The strange part to me was the AAA and my belief that it really isn't possible top produce such an album for mass markets in AAA. Especially given the tape is from the early 1950s, and all the other reasons MoFi gave for not being able to produce its One Step albums from analog tape.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Perhaps my initial post wasn't very clear. I'm not surprised by the release of any album from any artist on vinyl. My surprise is that it's touted as being ALL ANALOG. Given what MoFi just went through and knowing a little about what it takes and the limits of producing an ALL ANALOG album on vinyl, this sounded like it may be too difficult to actually pull off today.

[The Computer Audiophile]

1 minute ago, MarcelNL said:

https://www.cohearent.com/  analalog mastering is offered

Analog mastering is offered by tons of people and places. 

 

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

it's clear I can't communicate this morning. Please disregard anything I posted earlier. it's totally normal that an AAA release is being advertised and released on vinyl.