Masterclock, New Terminator DAC or GAIA D/D Convertor

[Bling]

Hi All

 

I currently have an sotm front end, Network switch 10g, ultra 200 streamer, and tx USB. I have it connected to my Hegel H390 integrated Amp via USB. I was considering getting the sotm master clock forl the sotm boxes but then I though about maybe a new DAC like the Terminator plus or also the Denafrips GAIA D/D convertor ( im not sure what this does exactly ).

 

Where do you think the best bang for buck would be and I should upgrade first.Also on a separate note is it possible to connect 2 network switches together say the 10g and ether regen for example to get double the impact, I think I read someplace of 2x sotm 10g switches connected yield really great results.

 

Thanks 

Sean

[Abyss Man]

On 8/15/2020 at 3:48 AM, Bling said:

Hi All

 

I currently have an sotm front end, Network switch 10g, ultra 200 streamer, and tx USB. I have it connected to my Hegel H390 integrated Amp via USB. I was considering getting the sotm master clock forl the sotm boxes but then I though about maybe a new DAC like the Terminator plus or also the Denafrips GAIA D/D convertor ( im not sure what this does exactly ).

 

Where do you think the best bang for buck would be and I should upgrade first.Also on a separate note is it possible to connect 2 network switches together say the 10g and ether regen for example to get double the impact, I think I read someplace of 2x sotm 10g switches connected yield really great results.

 

Thanks 

Sean

Hi Bling,

Welcome to CA, first off, I feel for your wallet and my condolences to it. LOL. As the saying goes, you are only good as your weakest link.

As an Intergrated amp, the DAC section is probably using a chip, which, I'm not sure which one as it looks like a in-house design and they don't say. The TP would definietly bring about a big change in SQ presentation and the biggest jump here. Have you heard a R2R DAC in action before? 

 

The Gaia is a DDC (Digital to Digital Converter), basically what it does is take your USB and convert it to another format digital signal, having said that, the TP prefers i2S connection (LVDS). It's a much quieter connection than a USB. A good USB implemenatation is very diffcult to do given the real estate available. Think Innuos Phoenix, soTm Tx-usb which are all external boxes which clean up the USB signal. 

 

Is your switch a fully loaded one? Also, I would personally advise changing out the sps-500 to a good quality LPS, the jump in SQ is very evident. 

 

Have you upgraded the trifecta to evox cap and silver internal cables (Preference here)? That brings a jump in SQ as well.

 

I am personally running 2 x fully loaded soTm switches with the sms-200 (Fully upgraded) and tx-usb ultra (Fully upgraded) which are all master clocked by the soTm master clock. My LPS are all Farad 3.

 

I'm also using the TP as DAC and my Gaia is yet to arrive but I do have the Iris with me. All your cables all make a difference including the DC and BNC cables. 

 

The best combo so far for switches as tested by some of our friends from another forum is:

1. 1x Sotm and 1 X Melco

2.  2x sotm

 

There is so much more to this hobby and I urge you to read thru this and other forums to gain some insight knowledge. The seniors here are all very helpful and will definitely can give you some very good guidance and advice.

 

Do be on the lookout for some used gear as well which can help you limit the damage to your poor wallet. Audit as much as you can, different equipments, gears, cables etc. Read up and enrich your knowledge. Good luck on your journey Bling. Stay safe.

 

 

[Bling]

Hi Abyss Man

 

Thanks for the reply I appreciate that. Yes my wallet has taken massive collateral damage 😝!!! but I am getting some decent sound for the first time. Interestingly I was messing around with my system and changed up the way I had everything connected and I got a decent improvement just by changing how everything was connected. I ran a Lan cable with the sotm isolation transformer from my router into the NUC rather than using it up the chain into the 10g switch and the results were very noticeable. Yes all my sotm gear is maxed out and has the BNC connections. I didnt hear much adding the sms 500 and as you say I might change out. Can you give me some info on the "trifecta to evox cap and silver internal cables" maybe this is the maxed out option you get at purchase,also did you find a big improvement in running two 10g switches over 1.

 

I think I will try to get the TP as my DAC first and then add quality LPS to everything, then if funds allow the sotm master clock and cables later.

 

Thanks for help and advise.

Sean 

 

 

[Abyss Man]

Hi Sean,

If your soTm are using Silver cables and evox caps with ebs damping material then u are fully loaded. As for running double switch, yes it’s a worthy upgrade and worth every penny. Personally I connect them using optical, which I prefer compared to ethernet.

 

what ethernet cables are u using? Get some good USB cables too. My entire digital front is soTm including 4 runs of dcbl cat-7 cables with 3 iso cat 6. My USB are Tellurium Silver Diamonds.

 

Take it slow Sean, don’t rush. Enjoy the journey.

[Bling]

Hi Abyss Man

 

I have read good things about he ether regen switch I might add it to the 10g.

https://uptoneaudio.com/products/etherregen

 

My ethernet cables are pretty good ( I think ) https://www.elecson.com/2780-1977-viard-audio-silver-hd12-ethernet.html

And my USB is Curious cable and sotm that came with USB reclocker. 

 

How do you like your FARAD LPS I was looking at them or Paul Hynes ,long wait for the PH and might not be any better than FARAD.The only other supply I have tried is the sotm sms500 I use it with Y cable for streamer and Usb clock. I can't hear much with it to be honest.

 

To be honest its an endless journey I think and does one ever get there ? are you even meant to get there? I just want to get the basics fairly bang on and add a few tweaks as I go. LPS could be the good place to go I have no power conditioning or anything done with power..What do you think yourself you seem to have things figured out and help advise is very much appreciated.

 

Thanks 

Sean

 

[Abyss Man]

Hi Sean,

The Farad 3 is a nice upgrade for sure, especially with the SR Orange fuse. For starters, use a Y-cable but I would recommend using induviual units to power each soTm unit. 

 

I would suggest u get a used etheregen or does Uptone offer money back guarantee? Try it out and see if you like it. I was also like you contemplating between the etheregen and soTm for my 2nd switch. In the end i went with soTm. I must add, don't look at soTm merely as switches, they are more like a re-clocker IMHO.

 

Power is of utmost importantance. If possible, run a dedicated line for your audio. Get a good power conditioner for your digital front. As for power amp, I would suggest going direct to wall with a Good power cord.

 

Are u using any server? or stream your music? 

[Bling]

Hi Abyss Man

 

Yes good idea on the Y cable and then work up to an individual LPS for each device ( its a lot of supplies ). I will check if ER do a return option. 

 

I was looking at a dedicated line but some are saying better results from a conditioner or regenerator and others say the exact opposite.To me the line makes sense but I'm no expert here. As far as conditioners go I was looking at the 156 which seems to be getting good reviews and doesn't clamp dynamics on amps.

http://www.puritanaudiolabs.com/products/master-purifiers/psm156/

I have also read no need for a conditioner if using an LPS, do you know if this is correct?

 

What power cord would you recommend, are the cords from farad any good, have you tried.

 

I have a NUC running Roon and I stream all my music

 

Weekend again time for some music to relax after hectic week. 

 

Thanks for your replies here btw , really appreciate you taking the time 👍

Sean

 

[Abyss Man]

Hi Sean,

i am running dedicated power line with its own MCB and using a Shunyata Triton conditioner. My wall socket is Furutech GTX.

 

My power cords are all Tellurium Silver or Black. My amp goes to wall directly, the rest thru the conditioner.

 

i have a Shunyata Alpha NR feeding my conditioner. I am sorry but I do not have any experience with other power cords as I love Tellurium and soTm products. My digital front is all soTm. My USB and master clock cables are Tellurium Silver Diamond.

 

Wishing you a wonderful weekend. Cheers.

[ducatirider]

I have the same SOtM stack as you.  I'm thinking of selling the trifecta and upgrading my Bricasti M1SE to ethernet. As ethernet is supposed to have timing information in the signal.

 

 Also on a whim, I bought a cheap $100 chinese clock from aliexpress https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000152539910.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.5f644c4dxCao2r and it did improve the soundstage and gave a more relaxing sound.

[Bling]

Thanks a nice chap upgrade so I might check out.

 

Sorry I am not familiar with the Trifecta or the Bricasti what are these 

Thanks

Sean

[johndoe21ro]

You should upgrade the LPS first (although, as I understand, the sPS-500 in not a linear power supply). tX-USBultra and sMS-200 Ultra scale a lot with a good LPS, power cable, fuse, etc. That's also the cheapest upgrade. A DAC is definitely costlier! 

[Abyss Man]

Sean,

The trifecta is used as a collective word for the sms-200, Txusb-ultra and the sps-500. Actually I was wrong in using that word cause I don’t use the sps-500, all my LPS are now Farad 3. The Bricasti is a DAC with built in ROON ready function. I have never heard it though but reports say it’s very good at what it does and pricey too. 

 

Maybe @ducatiridercan chip in with his FR of the Bricasti. Btw, which model Ducati are u riding sir?

[Abyss Man]

4 minutes ago, johndoe21ro said:

You should upgrade the LPS first (although, as I understand, the sPS-500 in not a linear power supply). tX-USBultra and sMS-200 Ultra scale a lot with a good LPS, power cable, fuse, etc. That's also the cheapest upgrade. A DAC is definitely costlier! 

You are very right the sps-500 is a SMPS and a very good one at that, but, there is always something better out there. You are also spot on with how the soTm gears scale with good quality PSU and the power cords and DC cables feeding them. The evoxcap, silver wiring and ebs upgrade is also a very worthwhile upgrade if u are using the basic unit. I just upgraded my upgrade from a soTm silver wiring to Audio Sensibility Silver cable. It’s still early days, but it sounds like a winner.

[ducatirider]

5 hours ago, Abyss Man said:

Sean,

The trifecta is used as a collective word for the sms-200, Txusb-ultra and the sps-500. Actually I was wrong in using that word cause I don’t use the sps-500, all my LPS are now Farad 3. The Bricasti is a DAC with built in ROON ready function. I have never heard it though but reports say it’s very good at what it does and pricey too. 

 

Maybe @ducatiridercan chip in with his FR of the Bricasti. Btw, which model Ducati are u riding sir?

 

[ducatirider]

Thank you for your interest. My former ducati was a Foggy Monster S4 which I loved as much as my audio. Unfortunately a driver decided he wanted my lane more than his and now it’s no longer. I ride an MV Brutale Dragster now and it’s not nearly as refined as the much older Duc. 
In the past I mistakenly thought all chip based DACs sounded the same so I thought FPGA or bespoke silicon DACs were the way to go. But the creamy 3D Bricasti changed my mind. It doesn’t sound like any other chip based DAC. And now they are available with Ethernet bridges so you no longer need USB conditioners and lps’ I am tempted to go this way to free up real estate on my rack. 

[StreamFidelity]

On 8/19/2020 at 12:10 PM, Bling said:

I think I will try to get the TP as my DAC first and then add quality LPS to everything, then if funds allow the sotm master clock and cables later.

 

I always find it difficult to give recommendations to others. Because what works well for one person can end in disaster for another. So use my recommendations with caution.

 

I've been using Denafrips Terminator-Plus for a few days. Like its predecessor, it benefits enormously from the upsampling and filter of the HQPlayer. I really appreciate the SOtM products and have seen that the sMS-200ultra has integrated the HQPlayer. The T+ has extremely high quality OCXO clocks, one for the base 44.1kHz and one for 48kHz. This means that whole numbers are always clocked without rounding errors. A FIFO buffer stores the data before it is re-clocked.

 

I have to admit that I've never heard music so well before. And I had much more expensive DACs such as B. T + A MP 3000 HV and Linn Klimax DSM.

[Bling]

Hi all

 

Thanks for all the input and advise. I will add LPS to my current sotm set up and see from there. 

 

Appreciate the help/advise here. I will report back my findings/results.

 

Thanks 

Sean

[rhmmmm]

If you’re thinking of dropping money on a new DAC and want electrical isolation, check out an MSB DAC using their ProUSB interface.

 

https://www.msbtechnology.com/accessories/prousb/