A (Slightly Early) Christmas DAC Story Part One

[AudioDoctor]

7 hours ago, Ralf11 said:

part of the fun of an older car is fixing it up - either as stock, period-correct, or hot-rod (mine has a few hundred pounds removed and the hp doubled)

 

If only I had the time.

[AudioDoctor]

10 hours ago, accwai said:

In a decade, likely nobody will be doing any driving at all.

 

First, self driving cars become non self driving cars up here in the north when there is snow on the roads because they can't see the lines.

 

Second, God Bless Aston Martin...

 

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/aston-martin-db4-gt-continuation-driven-a-brand-new-old-car-review

[Ralf11]

Tesla has a new patent appl. for super accurate GPS - the no lines issue will be dealt with

[AudioDoctor]

2 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

Tesla has a new patent appl. for super accurate GPS - the no lines issue will be dealt with

 

Really? Thats cool.  Do you want to trust it?  ha.

 

edit: They are also reportedly putting a 200kWh battery in the new roadster, once that goes in the Model S I think will be my buy in point for a Model S as my daily driver.

[accwai]

14 hours ago, gmgraves said:

One doesn't have to buy self-driving cars. There are always used cars like Alfas, Porsches, Ferraris, Maseratis even C5-C7 'Vettes, Mustangs and Camaros and old E-Types or Aston Martins. Not to mention MGs, Triumphs, Even the odd Fiat X1/9 or Morgan. If you want to drive, there will be cars around that one can drive for many decades to come.  

 

Stangs? This, Ford:

 

 

Made right here in Toronto, Canada... Only if one got more money than one know what to do with of course

 

But in today's internet age, even the original Ford GT40 could be located without great difficulty. In fact, all kinds of obscure things can be found on the net: Lola T70, Lancia Stratos etc. Speaking of Lancia, came across a first generation Lancia Delta parked in the street of Genoa, Italy earlier this year, among a sea of tiny city cars. The thing was sparkling like new. Not a Stratos but still, this generation hasn't been made since 1999. I guess on internet, you can get anything done if you're crazy enough. As for myself, have been thinking about Toyota Celica GT-Four ST205 WRC for a while. The WRC Group A homologation specials hadn't been sent to North America as far as I know. But after I retire, I just might be crazy enough to try and pull something like that together.

 

In any case, I've always wondered about the quality of available gas in the future. After alternating between 91 octane E0 and 93 octane E10, I've finally settled on 94 octane E10 only. There is one school of thought that goes like "Octane rating doesn't matter, go with the freshest E0 possible." That's just wrong. The difference between 91 E0 and 94 E10 isn't trivial. What can one say...

 

Speaking of which, I've also been wondering what kind of gas restored classic cars would need. News of a fully restored 1943 VW KdF-Wagen has been making the rounds on the net lately. That's Beetle #20 out of more than 21 million. The thing can go down the road normal now. Does it run on pump gas or need some special brew?

[gmgraves]

5 hours ago, accwai said:

 

Stangs? This, Ford:

 

 

Made right here in Toronto, Canada... Only if one got more money than one know what to do with of course

 

But in today's internet age, even the original Ford GT40 could be located without great difficulty. In fact, all kinds of obscure things can be found on the net: Lola T70, Lancia Stratos etc. Speaking of Lancia, came across a first generation Lancia Delta parked in the street of Genoa, Italy earlier this year, among a sea of tiny city cars. The thing was sparkling like new. Not a Stratos but still, this generation hasn't been made since 1999. I guess on internet, you can get anything done if you're crazy enough. As for myself, have been thinking about Toyota Celica GT-Four ST205 WRC for a while. The WRC Group A homologation specials hadn't been sent to North America as far as I know. But after I retire, I just might be crazy enough to try and pull something like that together.

 

In any case, I've always wondered about the quality of available gas in the future. After alternating between 91 octane E0 and 93 octane E10, I've finally settled on 94 octane E10 only. There is one school of thought that goes like "Octane rating doesn't matter, go with the freshest E0 possible." That's just wrong. The difference between 91 E0 and 94 E10 isn't trivial. What can one say...

 

Speaking of which, I've also been wondering what kind of gas restored classic cars would need. News of a fully restored 1943 VW KdF-Wagen has been making the rounds on the net lately. That's Beetle #20 out of more than 21 million. The thing can go down the road normal now. Does it run on pump gas or need some special brew?

Couldn't mention them all, but yes, there are lots and lots of "driver cars" to choose from. The problem with ex-race cars like the original GT-40 and the Lolas is that they weren't designed as road cars and are not really suited to be driven on "the street". They will fall apart quickly as they were designed to be light and to drive in one race between complete overhauls. But, one can buy, from the South African firm of Superformance, "continuation" models of Shelby Cobras, Re-designed Cobra Coupes (to be more road-worthy by the original designer, Peter Brock) and modified GT-40s, that, while maintaining the look and handling characteristics of the original, have been somewhat "tamed" with air-conditioning, "safe" gas tanks, and a bit more structure to make the cars more durable. There's a dealer here in Reno that sells all of these cars and I've looked them over pretty thoroughly. They are reasonably priced (for what they are) with a "Continuation" model GT-40 costing around  a hundred grand (depending on the power plant you've put in it!). So, self driving electric cars are not ready to retire all of us who enjoy driving just yet. That means that gasoline will still be available for some time to come. There's a Sinclair station about two blocks from where I live that sells several grades of gasoline above 100 octane. They aren't cheap, but they are available. Things aren't looking that bad!

[gmgraves]

17 hours ago, AudioDoctor said:

 

Really? Thats cool.  Do you want to trust it?  ha.

 

edit: They are also reportedly putting a 200kWh battery in the new roadster, once that goes in the Model S I think will be my buy in point for a Model S as my daily driver.

Tesla makes a big deal about the speed of their cars (a new Model 3 will do 0-100 KpH in about 3 seconds flat) and they never talk about handling. Truth is, Teslas' handling isn't so great. Sabine Schmitz, the "queen of the Nürburgring" once took a (then new) white Ford Transit panel van around the Nordschleife circuit in just under 10 minutes; which is also what a Tesla Model S did it in. Cars like the Alfa Romeo Giulia Quadrifoglio sedan do it in the low sevens, and race prepared Porsches do it in the low 6's. Of course, no "record" at the Ring stands for long, and I'm sure these records will fall soon (if they haven't already).  

[Ralf11]

an EV can be manf. to outhandle any IC engine'd car - the center of mass can be made very low as the battery packs can be lodged in the chassis

 

I am surprised to hear the Tesla S did poorly on the North 'ring.  You can bet the forthcoming Porsche Taycan will handle well.

 

re: the quality of available gas in the future - and the present... this is a concern to me and one reason I twin-plugged my 911 motor and kept the compression ratio under 11:1

 

I keep thinking I could mold or 3D print some tweeter enclosures that fit right into the corner of the windshield at the A pillar ..

[AudioDoctor]

4 hours ago, gmgraves said:

Tesla makes a big deal about the speed of their cars (a new Model 3 will do 0-100 KpH in about 3 seconds flat) and they never talk about handling. Truth is, Teslas' handling isn't so great. Sabine Schmitz, the "queen of the Nürburgring" once took a (then new) white Ford Transit panel van around the Nordschleife circuit in just under 10 minutes; which is also what a Tesla Model S did it in. Cars like the Alfa Romeo Giulia Quadrifoglio sedan do it in the low sevens, and race prepared Porsches do it in the low 6's. Of course, no "record" at the Ring stands for long, and I'm sure these records will fall soon (if they haven't already).  

 

My desire for the bigger battery has nothing to do with speed and everything to do with range, specifically range in cold weather, which as I am sure you know has a significant impact on battery performance.

 

I know all about Sabine Schmitz and ring times...

[Ralf11]

you are in luck!

 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/custom-media/pictet/batteries-beyond-lithium/

[AudioDoctor]

1 hour ago, Ralf11 said:

you are in luck!

 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/custom-media/pictet/batteries-beyond-lithium/

 

If only I was in luck tomorrow...

 

I think, barring some major breakthrough, it will be a while for battery tech to advance to the point of every day usage replacing fossil fuels.

[Ralf11]

it is advancing very quickly, really

 

look at how fast virology advanced after HIV - when you throw a lot of money at something, rates generally increase

 

but the real question is "every day usage" by who...  EVs need to get cheap for masses of people to buy them, tho the AV can make lots of people buy them quickly

 

Like the man said "The future is already here, it just isn't evenly distributed."

[TubeLover]

On 12/9/2018 at 11:40 AM, accwai said:

 

 

 

As for DACs, I'm a totaldac person. Michael Lavorgna loves the stuff so everybody on CA knows it's garbage. So I'm not going to embarrass myself in front of the distinguished audience here.

I don't necessarily care who loves them, but TotalDac's are superb. Along with the Golden Gate, they were at the top of my dream list, but no one ever sells them! Apparently there is a reason why:)

[TubeLover]

I have to say I'm impressed. Other than the single, original reply from Doc  relating to my story, you've gotten this all the way up to three pages, and counting while discussing but cars.....amazing!

[Ralf11]

27 minutes ago, TubeLover said:

I have to say I'm impressed. Other than the single, original reply from Doc  relating to my story, you've gotten this all the way up to three pages, and counting while discussing but cars.....amazing!

 

so... blazing acceleration?

[TubeLover]

3 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

 

so... blazing acceleration?

At least it's not "unintended acceleration"!

[Ralf11]

that's only in Audis

[TubeLover]

Actually almost every major manufacturer has had problems related to this:

 

Toyota is not alone in major recalls due to incidents of sudden unintended acceleration. These issues are also not limited to the big five manufacturers. According to the NHTSA database, recalls have also been issued for vehicles made by Nissan, BMW, Volkswagen, Mitsubishi, Subaru, Mercedes-Benz, Kia, Mazda, Land Rover, Suzuki and Volvo.Feb 6, 2010

Fact Check: Toyota not alone in acceleration problems - CNN.com

 

 

[AudioDoctor]

2 hours ago, Ralf11 said:

it is advancing very quickly, really

 

look at how fast virology advanced after HIV - when you throw a lot of money at something, rates generally increase

 

but the real question is "every day usage" by who...  EVs need to get cheap for masses of people to buy them, tho the AV can make lots of people buy them quickly

 

Like the man said "The future is already here, it just isn't evenly distributed."

 

Cars, homes, trucks, etc... In not just price, but convenience as well.

[accwai]

14 hours ago, gmgraves said:

Couldn't mention them all, but yes, there are lots and lots of "driver cars" to choose from. The problem with ex-race cars like the original GT-40 and the Lolas is that they weren't designed as road cars and are not really suited to be driven on "the street". They will fall apart quickly as they were designed to be light and to drive in one race between complete overhauls. 

 

That's one reason I'm more interested in homologation cars. However, I would image no street condition would come close to grinding it out for a whole day at Le Mans. A single GT-40 chassis had won Le Mans twice. That feat has not been repeated as far as I know. By the way, Ross Bentley mentioned in Endurance Racing Guide that modern top echelon enduro cars requires no holding back. You run them flat out all day long (literally ). Perhaps some babying was given in the old days? In any case, there is probably no way to plug a data logger into old cars like GT-40. Current generation GT should be equipped for this kind of thing.

 

Quote

gasoline will still be available for some time to come. There's a Sinclair station about two blocks from where I live that sells several grades of gasoline above 100 octane. They aren't cheap, but they are available. Things aren't looking that bad!

 

Yeah, some people are into E85 these days. Unfortunately the stuff is nowhere to be found in Canada. There is supposed to be a place in one of the Toronto satellite cities that can supply E80. The stuff is brutally expensive but has has lower than usual energy content Plus installing a flex fuel kit is often required. Too much trouble for now...

[accwai]

6 hours ago, TubeLover said:

Actually almost every major manufacturer has had problems related to this:

 

Toyota is not alone in major recalls due to incidents of sudden unintended acceleration. These issues are also not limited to the big five manufacturers. According to the NHTSA database, recalls have also been issued for vehicles made by Nissan, BMW, Volkswagen, Mitsubishi, Subaru, Mercedes-Benz, Kia, Mazda, Land Rover, Suzuki and Volvo.Feb 6, 2010

Fact Check: Toyota not alone in acceleration problems - CNN.com

 

Yeah recent cars would cut power on brake/throttle overlap mostly because of this kind of thing. Not only that, brake and gas pedals are normally really far apart and at different depth levels these days.

 

For most precise control during heel and toe, one would ideally keep the heel on the floor. That would require brake and gas pedals to be together close and at more or less the same level. Otherwise, one need to flip the foot sideways. Then heel off the floor, leg muscles get involved and you loose a lot of precision, especial when you're not braking deep.

 

I have a gas pedal spacer on my car to make the ideal arrangement happen. But you'd better know exactly where each pedal is at all times. I supposed that way too much to ask of regular persons off the street, let alone the type that turns on autopilot to get them back home when they're drunk (or stoned, up here in Canada )

[accwai]

17 hours ago, Ralf11 said:

an EV can be manf. to outhandle any IC engine'd car - the center of mass can be made very low as the battery packs can be lodged in the chassis [...] I am surprised to hear the Tesla S did poorly on the North 'ring.  You can bet the forthcoming Porsche Taycan will handle well.

 

"Well" is relative. Lets take a closer look at the Tesla S just for fun. Its CG height is reported variously to be 17.5" or 18" on internet. The lowly Toyota 86 is reported as 18.1". But, dealer installed option to drop the body by a little more than an inch is available. So for a couple hundred $s, CG would be around 17" off the ground. Now Tesla S is reported to weight between 4000 and 5000lbs depending on configuration. Toyota 86 on the other hand is below 3000lbs. To handle the much higher weight, Tesla has 245 tires all round or 265 at the back in higher configuration. Toyota runs 215 standard but can go much higher aftermarket. Bigger/wider tires have serious penalty in unsprung mass though. An acquaintance went to forged magnesium wheels to keep that side under control. But one pays through the nose for that kind of thing. At the end of the day, I doubt Tesla S would come anywhere close to outhandling the Toyota.

 

What about on the track? Well, EV lap record at Nordschleife was set by an NIO EP9 (1340hp, 3825lbs) at 6:46.90. The overall Nordschleife record was set by a Porsche 919 Hybrid Evo (710+430hp, 1900lbs) at 5:19.546. Yes *5* min 19 sec. Ouch! I think AWD hybrid is in the sweet spot right now as far as all out performance goes. Note the weight difference. EV would not stand a chance until there is a real break through in battery technology.

[Ralf11]

Whoa!  Hang on - there is on manf. that has been famous for making street cars that were grinding it out for a whole day at Le Mans.

 

Porsche.

 

they did it for several decades too - including back in the Late Holocene when cars were a lot less reliable

[Ralf11]

a CG around 17" off the ground is not particularly good - but when I said "can be made" I meant the ultimate design limit, not what people are doing today

 

wt. is the enemy, and current battery tech. means a heavier car than one with an IC engine - luckily we now have Class D to reduce the wt. of the stereo amp a bit

[gmgraves]

19 hours ago, AudioDoctor said:

 

My desire for the bigger battery has nothing to do with speed and everything to do with range, specifically range in cold weather, which as I am sure you know has a significant impact on battery performance.

 

I know all about Sabine Schmitz and ring times...

range is definitely  a real concern and on more than just a single level. While 300 miles on a charge is impressive, it's like the battery life on everything else that's battery powered - your milage may vary and it depends on so many things, of which temperature is only one. Average speed affects battery time, as does how the individual drives. A person who is smooth on the throttle, who pulls away from stoplights and stop signs smoothly and easily (rather than someone who "punches it" at every opportunity). Believe me, that 300 mile range specification comes with so many "ifs", "ands", and "buts" that I'd dare say that most motorists would have to go to Tesla "driving school" to realize it (is there such a thing?).