MQA is Vaporware

[Brian Lucey]

40 minutes ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

 

While I have respect for your professional expertise, I have seen no evidence that you have a clue about audiophiles.  What they believe, what they know, what they want, and why they want it.  Your opinions in that realm have very little value, IMHO.  And it sure doesn't look to me like you want to learn anything about them.  Your mind is made up, and you wear your bigotry on your sleeve.

 

Do Audiophiles want best quality and authentic music as it was intended?

 

Yes or No

[Brian Lucey]

10 minutes ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

 

There is no simple yes or no here.  If you're sincere about having a discussion about this, head over to the "What is the definition of an audiophile" thread and ask there.  It's off topic in this thread.

 

It's a simple question.  A forum of answers is not needed.

 

Do you want the real deal, or do you want your ideas, your ego and your investment in system to be part of the "creative" process?

 

 

 

 

[Brian Lucey]

9 minutes ago, mansr said:

What microphones and speakers do you use?

 

Mics and pre amps are a choice, and ALL are colored.   Even the clean ones have a color.  Where they are placed is a creative choice.

 

There is no perfection in music production, no original sin, no straight wire with gain, no recreation of the live space.   That is all marketing.

[Brian Lucey]

16 minutes ago, firedog said:

 

I think most of us would love to get the master-however it was done.

 

 

 

That's great news.   Not the higher rates?  The ACTUAL SESSION file, from our mastering rooms.  Great !

 

Quote

I think those of us who are honest would agree that any difference we hear with high sample rates is generally on recordings with the first type of instrumentation rather than the second. 

 

Of course, and if I was recording a cello in a room for an perfectionist result, I would also go 96k or higher with the PM M2.  Yet for mastering the 44.1 M1 is the better sonic choice, and 99% of music is in my wheelhouse, modern, distorted, compressed, popular music.

[Brian Lucey]

19 minutes ago, wushuliu said:

 

I'm not aware of sites that provide that kind of information for recordings that aren't niche audiophile-oriented. 

 

Right?   Neither am I

 

Would be ideal to have this database, so that we could buy and listen to the REAL session file.

[Brian Lucey]

34 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

 

You appear to be in VIOLENT AGREEMENT with most audiophiles.

 

You'll find few people here or anywhere else in the audiophile community that want music released in DSD simply because the release format is DSD.

 

We always want our music in the format that it was recorded in. This is why sites that cater to audiophiles usually provide technical information/session information on the recording that they sell.

 

What sites?  Where is this info?   This should be our aim for all music.

 

 

I see a majority of consumers, and many posts here, that are "higher rates better".

[Brian Lucey]

2 hours ago, mansr said:

I'm only aware of obscure audiophile labels like Blue Coast and Sound Liaison that provide such details. Their recordings are generally superb, but I can enjoy music just as well without knowing the brand of microphone cables used during the recording. I listen to music, not equipment.

Of course.

 

Point being that the real master is the one at the same sample rate.  This should be the aim of every audiophile IMO.

[Brian Lucey]

1 hour ago, firedog said:

Don’t disagree with you. But Alison Klaus recordings aren’t very much like Kanye West, Beyoncé, or even The Black Keys. I think on those it would be much harder to hear the difference.

It's all about how the mastering compensates for the AD and creates a singular master.

 

192 or 96k or 44.1 from the same converter gets compensated with processing.

 

It's not like a great 44.1 can't capture all there is to hear.   Processing choices of 1/4db are more powerful than a converter sample rate change,

[Brian Lucey]

 

2 hours ago, Lee Scoggins said:

 

Rick Rubin is an audiophile who like Synergistic Research gear.

Rick has also at times listened to masters in a pick up truck, choosing between MEs.  Vlado Meller's Audioslave record, for example, sounds fine in car in the CH sections of some tracks, yet distorts badly on a good system.

 

Processes and people are complex, and I would not put he or I or anyone on the production team in one box such as "audiophile".   We are firstly creators, not only listeners who create with playback.

[Brian Lucey]

1 hour ago, Lee Scoggins said:

 

I also hear benefits on rock and pop recordings. For instance, the hirez files of Alison Krauss and Union Station’s Paper Airplane are a significant improvement over the CD.

 

Once we decide the details and air are "better" then we will hear "an improvement" in ANY higher sample rate version.

 

Doesn't make it better, just subjective for you. 

 

Better is closer to the master in the room.

[Brian Lucey]

10 minutes ago, Lee Scoggins said:

 

Hey man, give me more credit than that.  I'm experienced enough to consider a wide variety of factors beyond just air and details.  The midrange has to be right or nothing else matters.  Instrument timbre has to be right.  Placement of instruments on the soundstage in a live to 2 track recording has to be right.

 

Sure but this is all subjective.

 

The best master is one one in the room, everything else is the ego of the listener ...

[Brian Lucey]

54 minutes ago, synn said:

 

here’s a hint: none of the cookie cutter music you work on figures in this conversation.

 

 

 

What music recording is not "cookie cutter" to you?

 

 

[Brian Lucey]

8 minutes ago, esldude said:

What's your opinion regarding MQA on cookie cutter music?  Not claiming the music you work on is cookie cutter. Just wanting your opinion about using MQA on other types of music.

 

My take on MQA has nothing to do with musical or production style, it's about the codec, the marketing, the lies, and the desire to dominate.

 

What is cookie cutter?  What is not ?

 

All recordings are cared for by those who create and love them, each is someone's baby ... and all are products, judged by the market and critics, etc.  So what's the distinction here?  

 

The music you think is important vs. that which you don't?  A certain DR?  The lack of creative distortion vs. dense and processed productions?

 

I don't see a distinction in any objective way.  What am I missing oh wise consumers of music?

[Brian Lucey]

4 minutes ago, synn said:

https://shop.klicktrack.com/2l/411252

 

one example.

 

i have heard one of the tracks in every format between 44.1 and DXD (plus DSD). I have done a blind test too, playing the files in random and not looking at the playlist to see the sample rate.

 

It doesn’t take an industry expert or have bat’s ears to hear how much more breathing space  the music has at 192 vs 44.1. 

 

 

You heard the same mix in every format?   How was it recorded?

 

[Brian Lucey]

12 minutes ago, synn said:

 Try reading instead of asking to be spoon fed. All the information is on the site. If you buy the record, they will even send you a nice PDF that even covers the mike placements.

 

I'm busy making music and trying to have a conversation here.  Unlike you I'm not an armchair listener with free time.

 

if you can't answer the simple question then ok.

 

 

 

12 minutes ago, synn said:

A whole world of music exists outside the Beats headphones and car stereo optimized pop music world. The music that comes out of is produced under different benchmarks. The people who buy that music have different expectations.

 

 

 

Sure, I'm aware of the world of music, I'm asking you how you define "cookie cutter"

 

Man up, you're being a coward with the attacks.  STAY ON TOPIC, you created the term, Define it please

[Brian Lucey]

16 minutes ago, synn said:

 Try reading instead of asking to be spoon fed. All the information is on the site. If you buy the record, they will even send you a nice PDF that even covers the mike placements.

 

 

MIC not mike, there are no Mikes in a recording you arrogant fool.

 

I see it was recorded in 5.1 SURROUND + STEREO produced in DXD (Digital eXtreme Definition 352kHz/24bit) by Lindberg Lyd, Norway

 

SO OF COURSE that is the actual master.

[Brian Lucey]

11 minutes ago, esldude said:

Cookie cutter wasn't even the point.

 

 

It's a dismissive term with no definition, so I asked for a clarification.   Seems like a normal thing to me.

6 minutes ago, synn said:

To be fair, I don’t yet have any MQA capable hardware or software at my disposal. I tried a demo of Amarra and it was crashing every 10 seconds, so I gave up on that.

 

my initial feeling, which I may reconsider now is that the MQA Version(non unfolded) sounded a bit reverbey and the 192khz version sounded better.

"Reverbey" from the harmonic distortion is very possible, yes.

 

6 minutes ago, synn said:

 

next week, I will be getting a DAP which does MQA, PCM and DSD, after which I will be able to evaluate things more evenly.

 

Great!   Be sure and get the source masters to compare to, nothing higher or lower in sample rate.

 

11 minutes ago, esldude said:

 

The point is you are being an arrogant ass to people who would prefer you not be. 

 

 

How so?   I'm telling the truth about how records are made, and standing up for all music in the face of some real elitism and snobbery.

 

Also defending artists, whose work is being altered by MQA for profit.  Sorry if that's hard to take.

 

11 minutes ago, esldude said:

 

But you just won't have it any other way.  You seem intent on making your idea of 'audiophile' some nincompoop you can dismiss and dazzle with your brilliance.  What not drop the bullshit and have a conversation instead of a tone deaf monologue?

 

I don't have one definition of Audiophile, each person is different.  Yet there are some trends.  Patterns are real.

 

11 minutes ago, esldude said:

Since the topic is MQA, why not address that. 

 

 

Have done so many times.  Am only on this forum as I was interviewed and that came on here for comments.

 

11 minutes ago, esldude said:

 

Or answer a simple question: whom do you hold in lower regard, MQA purveyors or audiophiles?

Such a defensive question.

 

Obviously MQA.   No respect.  Audiophiles love music.  That's a great thing.

 

11 minutes ago, esldude said:

At least the answer to that is marginally on topic.  If its audiophile's then fine, we'll know to dismiss you. 

 

Who is this "we".   You put forward the idea that Audiophiles are not one thing, then you use WE as part of an ad hominem?  INconsistent at best.

11 minutes ago, esldude said:

 

 

Your twaddle isn't worth hearing. 

 

And yet, you reply.

11 minutes ago, esldude said:

 

If it is MQA, then some of us have some common ground, or is that too difficult for you to accept? Go meditate and calm your mind enough to get on topic.  

 

Could not be more calm, I suggest you are projecting and need to calm your mind.

[Brian Lucey]

1 hour ago, synn said:

 

 

You seem even to be unraveling a lot faster this time around. Over under on the next forum goodbye, anyone?

 

in between your busy record making time, maybe you could try learning English the Queen’s way before calling others names

 

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/mike

 

see, now that is what one would call “Ignorance “.

 

No one who makes music uses that spelling, it's stupid.   Microphone.  Mic.  The end.

[Brian Lucey]

1 hour ago, synn said:

You see, this is exactly when I know you have lost the argument. Because every time you do, you pull out the busy famous professional card.

 

A busy professional who has a suspiciously large amount of free time to go foruming, by the way.

 

I post while I work, as a form of distraction.  Working now.  Printing a pass on in the background. It helps the focus to stay on principle with people who want to make things worse not better.

 

Very busy, 50 clients a month, I can't do more.

[Brian Lucey]

9 minutes ago, synn said:

 

“There is no U in color” - Mastering engineer Brian Lucey.

 

England in uproar. The queen mobilizes troops. More at 11.

 

I'm all for Colour, HERBs and Alu Min I Um

 

But we have to draw a line with Mike, he's not recording anything.

[Brian Lucey]

1 minute ago, esldude said:

Some might mention quality over quantity.  Whores have a different idea.  

 

Really? 

 

1. He implied I was not busy, so quantity was appropriate.

 

2. Maybe you would talk yourself up?  I don't need to do so.

 

 

Try again to be insulting, you are not up for this.

[Brian Lucey]

No wonder there are no pros here.

 

Anyone else want to post something personal and have it be allowed by the moderator?

[Brian Lucey]

3 minutes ago, synn said:

 

He doesn’t need to.

you have given enough evidence that you operate the McDonalds drive thru equivalent of music mastering and are ill equipped to objectively take part in any discussions that revolve around high quality music production, the likes of which audiophiles have an affinity to.

 

If I ever wanted advice on how to batch normalize tracks and set volume to 11, you’ll be the first to be contacted.

 

So rude.  I do the best work in the world according to many, and it's nothing you would understand.  Armchair nobody.

 

At the least have the balls to back up your insults with a definition.  What is "cookie cutter" music? 

[Brian Lucey]

44 minutes ago, Speed Racer said:

 

Hey, @Brian Lucey!

 

One thing you will notice here is that a certain subset of individuals think they talk for everyone and that they are special in some way. They can't handle the truth from someone that actually knows what the hell is talking about. They can't handle the brutal honesty that you provide. I find it refreshing! Keep up the good work both here and in the mixing room!!

 

Some very real sense of false authority in people who are consumers, first, second and third.

[Brian Lucey]

10 hours ago, synn said:

 

Hey Brian, who’s your favorite sports team?

 

are you devoid of opinions on how they perform? Or should I say, armchair opinions?

 

I respect the people on the field.   I have integrity.