ECdesigns

[matthias]

Is there a consensus so far if the SX on its own is superior or inferior to a very good SX/poweramp combo with high sensitivity speakers or is it too early to answer this question?

Thx

[Marijn]

1 hour ago, matthias said:

Is there a consensus so far if the SX on its own is superior or inferior to a very good SX/poweramp combo with high sensitivity speakers or is it too early to answer this question?

Thx

Be aware that the Powerdac-sx is semi-balanced, so when connecting to a poweramp it needs to have a balanced input or input transformer.  So the SX, at first glance, is not the easiest/most interesting model of the series to connect to a poweramp

[matthias]

50 minutes ago, Marijn said:

Be aware that the Powerdac-sx is semi-balanced, so when connecting to a poweramp it needs to have a balanced input or input transformer.  So the SX, at first glance, is not the easiest/most interesting model of the series to connect to a poweramp

OK, thanks,

so the question is SX standalone vs BX plus pre/power vs RX plus poweramp.

[tapatrick]

On 1/2/2024 at 4:22 AM, yogibear said:

Further impressions on the SX:

 

The bass bloomed like a flower with time. What’s baffling is, looks like the bass extension on my bookshelf speakers extended by itself while playing through the SX. Despite the volume at the SX, be it at just 15 on 88dB BS or full throttle 24, the distortion is non-existent and I hear low low end notes from some recordings that never existed before ! 
 

How about a 40 watter DAC in future ????

Agree there is zero distortion on the SX volume and stays remarkable at any setting. The volume is as magic as the DAC (its basically a resistor attenuator). I wouldn't see the point of buying an SX and adding an amp. The BX is for that surely.

 

On some recordings even on lowest settings the volume is enough for late night listening and agree that the bass stays significant at any setting, as opposed to usual amps that need more power (with more distortion) for more bass output.....

[Marijn]

51 minutes ago, matthias said:

OK, thanks,

so the question is SX standalone vs BX plus pre/power vs RX plus poweramp.

From a technical standpoint it would be sheer madness to go for anything else than a PowerDAC-SX:  zero distortion, no interconnects, no extra gear,...  But it all depends on what you expect from a system, according to your taste.  The wide bandwidth, huge dynamics and zero distortion are very impressive at first, but for me personally I like a pleasant distortion profile added somewhere in the chain.  I also listen to vinyl as well, so in my system I am bound to having poweramps.
If i were to start over I would go for an R(X), the model with volume control (as said before, this is indeed part of the magic of the PowerDAC universe) and some nice poweramps, according to taste.

But as usual in this hobby, YMMV!

[tapatrick]

3 minutes ago, Marijn said:

...The wide bandwidth, huge dynamics and zero distortion are very impressive at first...

Not just at first... :))

[Marijn]

Just now, tapatrick said:

Not just at first... :))

Haha, I knew that remark was going to come back and bite me!  
 

[mevdinc]

Happy New Year to all.

Can anyone comment on the possible combination of PowerDAC SX and PureAudioProject Open Baffle speakers with 96db sensitivity and 8ohm impedance?

Many thanks.

Mev

[tapatrick]

2 hours ago, matthias said:

OK, thanks,

so the question is SX standalone vs BX plus pre/power vs RX plus poweramp.

the big question is which one is Matthias going to finally go for...  😂

[Khronos]

6 hours ago, mevdinc said:

Happy New Year to all.

Can anyone comment on the possible combination of PowerDAC SX and PureAudioProject Open Baffle speakers with 96db sensitivity and 8ohm impedance?

Many thanks.

Mev

 

I've listened to PAPs

 

They should mate extremely well with the powerDAC-SX because of their neutral-warm tonality, huge dynamic power (in the bass especially), and precise flow.

 

Which model are you going for? I'd personally go for the horn, since they have the first order xo, are extremely coherent, and plenty room filling (depends on whether you like Horns though).

 

The PAPs I listened to were driven by amps half the rating of the PowerDAC or less. And it felt like the thing still had huge reserves on tap. Those things are really efficient. They work decently in a small room as well, though I think an offering from Bastanis would work better, while following similar sound philosophies (yes, I'm talking about the horn, not the €20k Open baffles)

[mevdinc]

7 minutes ago, Khronos said:

 

I've listened to PAPs

 

They should mate extremely well with the powerDAC-SX because of their neutral-warm tonality, huge dynamic power (in the bass especially), and precise flow.

 

Which model are you going for? I'd personally go for the horn, since they have the first order xo, are extremely coherent, and plenty room filling (depends on whether you like Horns though).

 

The PAPs I listened to were driven by amps half the rating of the PowerDAC or less. And it felt like the thing still had huge reserves on tap. Those things are really efficient. They work decently in a small room as well, though I think an offering from Bastanis would work better, while following similar sound philosophies (yes, I'm talking about the horn, not the €20k Open baffles)

Thanks for the detailed reply, much appreciated. That sounds very encouraging.
I also considering the Qualio IQs  but they are quite a bit less sensitive at 89db.

I was thinking of either the Duet15 Prelude (From €5,970) or the Trio15 Classic (From €7,350) both with the Voxative AC-1.6 driver.
After your informative and encouraging reply I will seriously consider the PAPs with the PowerDAC-SX.
This should be quite a departure for me after having been listening to the active ATCs for the last 25 years!

[Khronos]

33 minutes ago, mevdinc said:

Thanks for the detailed reply, much appreciated. That sounds very encouraging.
I also considering the Qualio IQs  but they are quite a bit less sensitive at 89db.

I was thinking of either the Duet15 Prelude (From €5,970) or the Trio15 Classic (From €7,350) both with the Voxative AC-1.6 driver.
After your informative and encouraging reply I will seriously consider the PAPs with the PowerDAC-SX.
This should be quite a departure for me after having been listening to the active ATCs for the last 25 years!

Qualio IQs are relatively power hungry. They're detailed, delicate, and open, which if it is whay you are after, they'd do well.

 

ATCs on the other hand are more transparent and somewhat muscular (at least from what I remember), aren't they?

 

Try thinking about what exactly you are looking for in speakers, and definitely audition and don't buy blind. Voxativs are extremely delicate, very good for jazz, small ensembles, and vocals; but if you are a Rammstein fan they'll feel polite.

 

If possible, see if anyone near you auditions Lii Audio speakers. You might be surprised by their performance.

 

If you live near Munich, there's a man named Oleg Rullit who makes the best field coils in the world.

Here's his E-bay page.

https://www.ebay.com/str/rullitaudioultrafiandvintage

They're good all-rounders. I highly recommend you at least try to audition them (mind, the €8500 euro there is his flagship. He has options down to €1200)

[mevdinc]

17 minutes ago, Khronos said:

Qualio IQs are relatively power hungry. They're detailed, delicate, and open, which if it is whay you are after, they'd do well.

 

ATCs on the other hand are more transparent and somewhat muscular (at least from what I remember), aren't they?

 

Try thinking about what exactly you are looking for in speakers, and definitely audition and don't buy blind. Voxativs are extremely delicate, very good for jazz, small ensembles, and vocals; but if you are a Rammstein fan they'll feel polite.

 

If possible, see if anyone near you auditions Lii Audio speakers. You might be surprised by their performance.

 

If you live near Munich, there's a man named Oleg Rullit who makes the best field coils in the world.

Here's his E-bay page.

https://www.ebay.com/str/rullitaudioultrafiandvintage

They're good all-rounders. I highly recommend you at least try to audition them (mind, the €8500 euro there is his flagship. He has options down to €1200)

I'm not really after anything in particular. I sold my amazing ATC EL 150 actives 2 years ago and instead of simply getting ATCs again I thought why not try something different first. :)
Yes, ATCs sound really lovely with great dynamics and headroom. And that wonderful 3inch midrange ddriver is really something.

I listen to all kinds of music as long as the recording is good quality, from Jazz to Heavy Metal. :) I have been following the PowerDAC topic for sometime and I thought it would be worth trying the SX version with a suitable open baffle design. If I like it then I'll keep it for a while and then move back to ATCs again or perhaps try the new Dutch & Dutch 8C with the BACCH add-on.  I do like active speakers, just adding a nice DAC with a decent pre or volume control is all I need.
PowerDAC-SX + open baffle speakers also seem to offer a very simple solution.

I have recently moved to the lovely little city of Spoleto in Italy. How long I stay here will determine what sort of system I end up with eventually.
Thanks again.

[Khronos]

3 hours ago, mevdinc said:

I'm not really after anything in particular. I sold my amazing ATC EL 150 actives 2 years ago and instead of simply getting ATCs again I thought why not try something different first. :)
Yes, ATCs sound really lovely with great dynamics and headroom. And that wonderful 3inch midrange ddriver is really something.

I listen to all kinds of music as long as the recording is good quality, from Jazz to Heavy Metal. :) I have been following the PowerDAC topic for sometime and I thought it would be worth trying the SX version with a suitable open baffle design. If I like it then I'll keep it for a while and then move back to ATCs again or perhaps try the new Dutch & Dutch 8C with the BACCH add-on.  I do like active speakers, just adding a nice DAC with a decent pre or volume control is all I need.
PowerDAC-SX + open baffle speakers also seem to offer a very simple solution.

I have recently moved to the lovely little city of Spoleto in Italy. How long I stay here will determine what sort of system I end up with eventually.
Thanks again.

 

Time and time again, I've figured that listening through YouTube is not  as accurate as actually listening to the speakers in real life. However, it does give you an idea as to the general tonality of a piece of equipment, the synergy of the system, and how well it does some things- or doesn't.

 

If you have a decent pair of headphones, you can use YouTube to try to have a decent idea as to what to audition.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[yogibear]

A few of my friends have bought bookshelf speakers called Scansonic. And they are raving about their sonics as big bang for bucks.  They have other brands of speakers too like ATC / BRX….

 

The sensitivity on Scansonics seems to be quite decent as well. I would be demoing SX with a pair of models next week. 
 

These could be an option along with a pair of larger speakers to be played by SX. Easy to snug in a room and a few things that BS do cannot be replicated by large speakers. I guess owning them is a must….

[Marijn]

7 hours ago, Khronos said:

If you live near Munich, there's a man named Oleg Rullit who makes the best field coils in the world.

Here's his E-bay page.

https://www.ebay.com/str/rullitaudioultrafiandvintage

They're good all-rounders. I highly recommend you at least try to audition them (mind, the €8500 euro there is his flagship. He has options down to €1200)

I have a pair of Rullit field coils, highly recommended!

[mevdinc]

Thank you all for the additional info.
There are just so many options out there. :)

What I get will also depend on what sort of listening room I will have, so the first thing to sort out is a place to live.
PowerDac-SX plus the PureAudio Duet15 combo seems worth trying.  I'll keep you posted.
 

[Lebouwsky]

What an interesting journey guys, it’s a joy following this thread. The approach of elimininating the pre/power amp, making the chain from source to speaker as short as possible must have advantages in all kind of regionaal of the presentaties. But the concequence is one must use very  sensitive speakers and that does limit the speaker options a lot. It keeps me thinking.
 

Did any of you thought of using a less sensitive speaker in combination with 1 or 2 subs and splitting the signal, so the lower sensitive speakers won’t even be bothered by frequencies below x hz?

[jwr159]

I used to follow this thread maybe 2.5-3 years ago, and as a result, I purchased a Powerdac-r. I have been happy using the dac ever since. I now realize that Brown Bros have introduced a bunch of new dacs, including the Powerdace -rx.

 

My guess is this question has already been covered in this thread, but who has the time to search all 140+ pages. But may I ask what improvements will the "rx" offer over the older "r" version? Is the sound quality dramatically better, or just a minor improvement?  Is upgrading worth the cost?  Thanks for any feedback. 

[tapatrick]

14 hours ago, Lebouwsky said:

What an interesting journey guys, it’s a joy following this thread. The approach of elimininating the pre/power amp, making the chain from source to speaker as short as possible must have advantages in all kind of regionaal of the presentaties. But the concequence is one must use very  sensitive speakers and that does limit the speaker options a lot. It keeps me thinking.
 

Did any of you thought of using a less sensitive speaker in combination with 1 or 2 subs and splitting the signal, so the lower sensitive speakers won’t even be bothered by frequencies below x hz?

As mentioned, I have the SX with Omega Super Alnicos. These speakers are 94.5db (8ohms). I've tried 2 rel subwoofers which extend the bass down to 30hz (the Omegas go down to 40hz). To be honest they are not really adding much, a tad more bass 'feel' and immersion. It's delicate to dial them in as the bass can easily become too much. In my listening room the bass is already enough for my preference, without the subs... The SX with the right speakers needs to be heard to be believed and the bass is not just linked to 'oomph' from a higher volume setting, as can be in other setups.

 

There are lots of understandable comments with concerns about what might be missing with the SX and I was also hesitant to try blindly, living too far from EC Designs in the Netherlands. But with my enjoyable experience with the Fractal DAC, reports on here and exchanges with John & Gordon, I was confident to proceed. With the SX I honestly have never been happier with a system and it is now so simple - plus no more audio nervosa and messing with wires/capacitors/ram chips that never ends. But as always we all have different preferences and requirements.

[mevdinc]

On 1/4/2024 at 12:35 PM, mevdinc said:

Thank you all for the additional info.
There are just so many options out there. :)

What I get will also depend on what sort of listening room I will have, so the first thing to sort out is a place to live.
PowerDac-SX plus the PureAudio Duet15 combo seems worth trying.  I'll keep you posted.
 

Just discovered another potential open baffle candidate to go with the PowerDAC-SX!
Clayton Shaw CALADAN (Clayton is the designer behind the Spatial M3-M4) with 93-94db sensitivity. Direct sale and shipping from the States with around 3 months lead time but it's worth a shot considering the relatively low price tag of $3,000.

[yogibear]

Fired up the BX today. Initial impressions:

 

1. Striking dynamic range.

2. Excellent details and resolution.

3. Bigger soundstage. 
4. Incredible bass extension.

 

Played a few tracks from Spotify premium- 6SN7 transformer coupled preamp - 6L6 SE tube amp - 88dB BS Speakers. 
 

 

 

[matthias]

@yogibear

Sounding great!

Which music in the first and second one?

[Muzikmann]

1 hour ago, yogibear said:

Fired up the BX today. Initial impressions:

 

1. Striking dynamic range.

2. Excellent details and resolution.

3. Bigger soundstage. 
4. Incredible bass extension.

 

@yogibear

Very nice sounding with the tube preamp and amp.  I think the RX with a quality amp and the Qualio IQ speakers would work well for me.  I like the simplicity of the SX but the limits speaker choices.

[yogibear]

A small playlist you may want to che k out: