Optical Network Configurations

[audiom3]

3 hours ago, R1200CL said:

The ER should also be looked as a DDC. If the ER2 will have fiber both sides, it may be worth trying the ER2. Especially with an 50 ohm external 10mHz sine wave clock.

I’m using an opticalRendu, and I do the “foolish” conversion with a 10 GB Mikrotik upfront 😀

 

I agree 100% on the fiber both sides and I would definitely give it a listen. But that remains to be seen. 

[audiom3]

15 minutes ago, audiophilac said:

Would there be another Layer 2 SFP+ switch, fanless that could work with eR?

I'm currently using Aruba POE switch with four SFP+ ports.

I'm not positive I'm answering your exact question, but I run a 1G SFP switch into my U2. I inserted a Finisar 1471 (SFP+ w/DFB laser) in the switch and a Finisar 1317 in my U2. SFP+ transceivers are incompatible with Lumin was my reasoning and this arrangement sounded best to me. All switches are on their own LPS unit. 

[R1200CL]

44 minutes ago, audiophilac said:

Would there be another Layer 2 SFP+ switch, fanless that could work with eR?

I'm currently using Aruba POE switch with four SFP+ ports.

All switches will work. So just find one you like. Mikrotik is popular cause of price. 
Is it important for you to have. 10GB L2 switch? Not sure they even exist. 
Most is L3 to my knowledge. 

[SQFIRST]

38 minutes ago, audiophilac said:

Would there be another Layer 2 SFP+ switch, fanless that could work with eR?

I'm currently using Aruba POE switch with four SFP+ ports.

It sounds like your issue is at the other end and not with the ER but you may have better luck on the ER thread if otherwise.  For context to folks following this now, what are the fiber modules you are working with? (at both ends)

 

Unless the networking device is restricting by manufacture ID, such as Cisco, then any SFP(1G) module works in pairs in most devices. If you are trying to make an SFP+ (10G) module inserted into a 10G port (as the Aruba) and connecting to a 1G port (as in the ER) then you cannot do this unless and until you use a Dual Rate Specified SFP+ module AND the ability of console management to set the speed to 1G in the 10G device. Keep in mind that specifications need to support this both for the SFP+ module (datasheet) and the network device board specifications.

 

Others in this thread and myself have used dual rate SFP+ in Mikrotik (CRS305 in my case) and connected with a 1G device (ER in my case) just fine. I found that RouterOS, the default OS for Mikrotik, does not provide the option to set the speed but Switch OS (needs to be selected manually) has the option. Ultimately, I found no gain in doing this and no longer use the Dual Rate speed setting for my purpose.

 

Audiom3 has covered some really good experience in his original post, specifically about using 10G multimode optical for core networking and Single mode for endpoints. I wanted to reiterate this information for the Optical networking thread as my experience concurs with this to be providing good results. Combined with proper power isolation this will get most folks all that they need.

 

I still use the ER with my X1 in B>A for that last mile uptick. Quantitatively - I move my volume up 3db with the ER as compared to without, Subjectively- vocals are more pleasing. As with all audio treatments results will vary and we all have our preferences.

 

Hopefully not stirring things in the wrong direction but just wanted to add my experience.

[audiophilac]

I have a CRS309, pair of ftlx1475d3btl modules.

 

I tried couple stuff - disabled auto negotiation on CRS309, link is up. Switched to Switchos, disabled autonego. etc.

its similar old issue as others, devices at ER end don't receive any connectivity despite the webpage stating "link is up".

 

No problem, I'll probably upgrade the eR.

[SQFIRST]

31 minutes ago, audiophilac said:

ftlx1475d3btl

In a 10G board, such as the CRS308, the SFP+ module specifications hold. From the Datasheet:

https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/610/finisar_ftlx1475d3btl_rohs-6_compliant_10g_10km_13-1272466.pdf

As mentioned in datasheet bullet #2 this only supports 10G

I have seen the term dual rate used interchangeably to indicate running an SFP+ at 1G on a 1G network device vs the actual dual rate specification from the manufacture. Seemingly both are dual rate, except one is restrictive and official (when using 10G board).

example: Ftlx1475d3BCV

https://datasheet.octopart.com/FTLX1475D3BCV-Finisar-datasheet-137383310.pdf

 

If you have a 1G device with optical port you should be able to use the modules you have and connect with the ER. It is frustrating when things do not work.

 

[R1200CL]

1 hour ago, audiophilac said:

No problem, I'll probably upgrade the eR.

I don’t think ER2 is a SFP+ unit. Has Alex stated that ?

 

The solution to your problem is SFP+ (1475) in ER, and the 1421 in Mikrotik. 
 

 

finisar_ftlx1475d3btl_rohs-6_compliant_10g_10km_1310nm_single_mode_datacom_sfp_transceiver_productspecrevb1_0.pdffinisar_ftlf1421p1xtl_oc-48_ir-1_stm_s-16.1_rohs_compliant_pluggable_sfp_transceiver_product_specification_rev_b1.pdf

[audiom3]

2 hours ago, SQFIRST said:

In a 10G board, such as the CRS308, the SFP+ module specifications hold. From the Datasheet:

https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/610/finisar_ftlx1475d3btl_rohs-6_compliant_10g_10km_13-1272466.pdf

As mentioned in datasheet bullet #2 this only supports 10G

I have seen the term dual rate used interchangeably to indicate running an SFP+ at 1G on a 1G network device vs the actual dual rate specification from the manufacture. Seemingly both are dual rate, except one is restrictive and official (when using 10G board).

example: Ftlx1475d3BCV

https://datasheet.octopart.com/FTLX1475D3BCV-Finisar-datasheet-137383310.pdf

 

If you have a 1G device with optical port you should be able to use the modules you have and connect with the ER. It is frustrating when things do not work.

 

I am using 10 or 12 of the 1471BCV modules in my network.  Most are connected to two of my CRS309s.  They work fine (in all of my 1G AV gear/video streamers/OLED/etc).  I use cheap, 1G media converters on the gear side of each component.  It took a lot of trial and error to figure out what and where things just worked.  Single rate (BCL) modules wouldn't work in the same scenario where BCV modules would.  A very steep learning curve indeed.

[R1200CL]

53 minutes ago, audiom3 said:

1471BCV

Is that the correct number?

https://www.digikey.de/htmldatasheets/production/3368495/0/0/1/product-guide.html

[audiom3]

3 hours ago, R1200CL said:

Is that the correct number?

https://www.digikey.de/htmldatasheets/production/3368495/0/0/1/product-guide.html

Well other than my abbreviated version, yes. Here are a few of my extras....

[R1200CL]

Nice. 
 

https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/610/bKSb5LFTLX1471D3BCV Product Specification RevB-274860.pdf

[audiophilac]

7 hours ago, SQFIRST said:

In a 10G board, such as the CRS308, the SFP+ module specifications hold. From the Datasheet:

https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/610/finisar_ftlx1475d3btl_rohs-6_compliant_10g_10km_13-1272466.pdf

As mentioned in datasheet bullet #2 this only supports 10G

I have seen the term dual rate used interchangeably to indicate running an SFP+ at 1G on a 1G network device vs the actual dual rate specification from the manufacture. Seemingly both are dual rate, except one is restrictive and official (when using 10G board).

example: Ftlx1475d3BCV

https://datasheet.octopart.com/FTLX1475D3BCV-Finisar-datasheet-137383310.pdf

 

If you have a 1G device with optical port you should be able to use the modules you have and connect with the ER. It is frustrating when things do not work.

 

it's odd the aruba jl683a sfp+ works with eR. but oh well.

[SQFIRST]

6 minutes ago, audiophilac said:

it's odd the aruba jl683a sfp+ works with eR. but oh well.

Sounds like you got past your issue? That's great!

 

If you dig into the device specifications for the Aruba you may get your answer. My guess is that it does not enforce the SFP+ specifications by design, unlike the Mikrotik. A quick glance at model JL683A I noticed that they specify their 10G ports as 'SFP/SFP+' perhaps indicating a specific ability to handle both ways. 

 

[dbastin]

19 hours ago, R1200CL said:

This is Microtik answer:

 

Hello,

The CSS610 do not support setting Rate Select (RS0) signal to the Low state.
Unfortunately, we cannot make 1G support in CSS610 for 1G/10G SFP+ modules which firmware strictly follows that.
All MikroTik SFP+ modules also support 1G/10G speeds and work in both speeds in the CSS610, we can only suggest using them instead.

Sorry for inconvenience.

Regards,
Jānis B.

Do you happen to know if that is the case with all Mikrotik SwOS or just that switch?

 

And does the same limitatiin apply with RouterOS?

 

I am using CRS 305 with RouterOS.

[R1200CL]

6 hours ago, dbastin said:

Do you happen to know if that is the case with all Mikrotik SwOS or just that switch?

 

And does the same limitatiin apply with RouterOS?

 

I am using CRS 305 with RouterOS.

I don’t know for sure. Maybe you can email. [email protected]

This is my case number to put in heading if you like:

MikroTik support #[SUP-48642]: CSS610-8G-2S+IN Issue with Finisar 10GB module.

 

[Johnnydev]

On 8/7/2023 at 1:36 PM, R1200CL said:

Especially with an 50 ohm external 10mHz sine wave clock.

Why especially with an 50 ohm? not with an 75 Ohm?

[R1200CL]

13 hours ago, Johnnydev said:

Why especially with an 50 ohm? not with an 75 Ohm?

This is just the old 50 vs 75 ohm discussion. It may not be important at all. 
 

My reason to promote 50 is:

• Most relevant (cheap) clocks is native 50, and I don’t want amateurs in china modifying them.
• The only working splitter is 50 ohm. And I’m using it.
• The selection of good cheap cables and BNC’s is great.
• Some very nice DCC is only available in 50 (Singxer SU2 being one)
• You can order the EtherRegen with 50
• And you can have endless discussions here 😂

[TRHH]

2 X Finisar FTLF1318P3BTL arrived today - Until now it works fine with my Cisco Meraki Go 8 Port Switch (GS110-8-HW-EU).

 

 

Torben

[dgolh]

Hi,

 

would this switch https://www.amazon.com/Zyxel-12port-MultiGig-Switch-8ports/dp/B0842SWN2X?ref_=ast_sto_dp allow me to plug my 2,5 gbs Nuc ? I'll do the following : 

box==> this switch==>one 2,5 gbs port to NUC

                               ==> port to Zyxel  GX108B for isolation purpose==>Lumin U2 Mini

 

I imagine that this switch will make the DAC cable useless.

[m.i.c.k.e.y]

Just a head's up LHY Audio has a new switch: LHY AUDIO SW-6

 

[audiom3]

Although I wouldn't need the LHY switch for my audio, it might be interesting to use as a FMC for my video streamers and OLED TV. It would save me several boxes (LPS and FMCs).

[charlesphoto]

Holy Cow! Just installed a Cisco SFP-10G-AOC 2m between my opticalModule (1st gen) and opticalRendu. Wow. One of the biggest changes I've ever heard in this land of tweakery, that isn't even supposed to exist. I had single mode Finisair FTLF1421PBTL before, and they were somewhat better than the basic TPLink multimodes. But this. Stunned. 

 

The PRAT is somewhat slower than I'm used to, but I can really hear the separation between instruments. And I guess you can say they sound musical, like instruments are supposed to sound, with no hash or glare. Maybe slightly less detailed, but really takes the glare off the top end, which is always a problem for me as a tinnitus sufferer. I'll see how they burn in, plus my ears are stuffed up and recovering from an earache. But I've played Who's next, my favorite Vivaldi on Naive, and Cluster/Eno and Waltz for Debby 196/24, and they all sound deep and musical, and I can hears o much it's a bit overwhelming. I'll get used to it. If anything a bit too much bass, but that saves me and my wallet from my thinking I needed a sub before, and I can isolate the speakers a bit better. 

 

I got mine off eBay for $35 plus some tax, essentially brand new, from a US seller, not a knock off. 2 meters. Plug and play. Seriously, one of the biggest differences I've heard in a cable. I guess I would say if the SFP+ is even that much better, and you don't need to save $, go for it. I do right now, and this really completes my network side for almost nothing. Amazing upgrade. 

[R1200CL]

@charlesphoto

Very interesting observation. I like to understand some technical parts here better. 
 

Are you able to confirm your cable correct model number is SFP-10G-LRM

 

I got that assumption from this product article where orange color seems to be the only match:

https://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/products/collateral/interfaces-modules/transceiver-modules/data_sheet_c78-455693.html#CiscoSFP10GLRMmodule

 

 

[audiophilac]

I think Charles is using the "SFP-10G-AOC2M"

 

2 hours ago, R1200CL said:

@charlesphoto

Very interesting observation. I like to understand some technical parts here better. 
 

Are you able to confirm your cable correct model number is SFP-10G-LRM

 

I got that assumption from this product article where orange color seems to be the only match:

https://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/products/collateral/interfaces-modules/transceiver-modules/data_sheet_c78-455693.html#CiscoSFP10GLRMmodule

 

 

 

[R1200CL]

2 hours ago, audiophilac said:

I think Charles is using the "SFP-10G-AOC2M"

 

 

Did you take the time to open the link and study the variants ?

I do not think there is anything named SFP-10G-AOC2M