iFi micro iDSD

[Jumbosausage]

The iPurifier is effectively already built into the micro iDSD. Even though it will not work with the split head gemini cable, you may consider the Schiit Wyrd as an alternative to the iUSB Power.

 

I have used the iUSB Power + Gemini into the micro iDSD and it may bring a little refinement, but it's definitely deminishing returns there. The main reason (IMO) to get the iUSB Power with the micro iDSD would be for simplifying the power management and being able to just leave it on all the time in port mode rather than in battery mode. For that purpose, a Schiit Wyrd will work just as well and costs half the price (it also has a USB repeater.) I haven't used the Wyrd, but by all accounts it is a good device that works well.

 

In that case I'll likely leave it for the time being then. I think I can probably live with the power management via the battery but I'll see how I get on when I get it. Is there any value to adding the Mercury USB cable between PC and iDSD or is a standard USB cable ok? If it's only improving things slightly then again I'll probably leave it.

 

Thanks Kelly.

[Jumbosausage]

Apologies for all the newbie questions and I've posted this elsewhere but just wanted confirmation that my issue below couldn't be caused by the iDSD?

 

Today was the first time I put my system together and on the very first time I played some music through it I could clearly hear a buzzing/fuzzy sound coming from both speakers..it's actually from the tweeters.

 

I've got 2 x Focal CMS50's with the IDSD and this is connected to my laptop using jriver. I can hear it whilst the music is playing (generally more noticeable at low volumes) and then if I shut down JRiver and turn the volume up on the speakers it becomes really evident. I've got the iDSD set up in direct output mode. I've also tried different RCA cables and have moved the system away from my PC thinking at may have been interference. I've also tried playing mucic through my browser and it's exactly the same. So I'm thinking this is either some settings on my speakers or iDSD that I need to change or I've got a fault with something. I'm really not sure what to change or try next.

 

Any advice at all would be appreciated.

[YashN]

Sounds like a ground loop somewhere, maybe an RCA cable with directionality could help (shield only connected at source end) if you can borrow a pair.

[Jumbosausage]

Sounds like a ground loop somewhere, maybe an RCA cable with directionality could help (shield only connected at source end) if you can borrow a pair.

 

I didn't even realize about directionality of the cables. I purchased these ones but I didn't check when I connected them. I'll have to have a look when I get back home. Not sure what these are I have?

 

https://www.production-room.com/product-details/MONSTER-CABLE-M-SL-R-3-MC-600318

 

Thanks.

[Kelly]

Jumbo,

 

Did you get your noise issue figured out with iFi?

[Jumbosausage]

Jumbo,

 

Did you get your noise issue figured out with iFi?

 

Hi Kelly, I've still got the white noise coming through the tweeters. I connected the speakers up to the RCA out on my TV and the white noise is still there. I've also tried connecting my phone to the iDSD and it is better than when using my laptop but I can still hear the hissing. I can play around with the volume on the speakers and the source to improve things but I'm really not happy with them. I've spoken to the shop I purchased them from and they assure me they were tested and are functioning as normal. They also said that all Monitors will have some white noise to a certain degree. I'm not sure how true that is but this is pretty bad to my ears and not something that I think I can live with.

[YashN]

Check with the directional interconnects.

 

If those do not work, I would open a ticket directly with iFi Technical Support and take it from there.

[One and a half]

Hi Kelly, I've still got the white noise coming through the tweeters. I connected the speakers up to the RCA out on my TV and the white noise is still there. I've also tried connecting my phone to the iDSD and it is better than when using my laptop but I can still hear the hissing. I can play around with the volume on the speakers and the source to improve things but I'm really not happy with them. I've spoken to the shop I purchased them from and they assure me they were tested and are functioning as normal. They also said that all Monitors will have some white noise to a certain degree. I'm not sure how true that is but this is pretty bad to my ears and not something that I think I can live with.

 

If you hear a problem, the brain will listen for the problem and it won't go away and it stops you enjoying the music. Below are a couple of tips, see how they go.

 

The Focal CM50's have a wide range of adjustment on tone controls, although nothing wrong with that, but can cause problems with the noise you hear. Set the values on the rear of the CM50 to flat (no gain) for now and make sure the same settings are for both speakers.

 

I often find that 0db is different from one manufacturer to another. If the ifi DSD micro is changed to pre-amplifier mode rather than direct mode, this should give not so hard and high a signal to the speakers, reduces distortion as a bonus

 

The other thing to look at is where the AC power is connected to the Focals. Is it at some distant point than the computer? Try to power these from the same power strip even if you use a longer power cable from one to the other is no matter, but the source is important. This should remove the 50/60Hz hum but the hiss is coming from the speakers. So try the settings on the back of the speakers and reduce the gain into them, it might drop the noise down far enough.

 

Changing cables (for now) won't minimise noise, if they did, they would colour the sound and that's far from acceptable. RCA cabling is single ended which means the return path is through the shield and that's where the music is too. Another alternative is to use the balanced input on the speakers to remove the 50/60z hum, but that's not available on the iDSD micro.

[Bikutoru]

If you hear a problem, the brain will listen for the problem and it won't go away and it stops you enjoying the music. Below are a couple of tips, see how they go.

 

I've been in computer audio since I discovered mp3s about 15 years ago and I did not hear any hissing unless it is 'built into' a recording. Currently with my 702K headphones and with my speakers setup I was caught by a surprise with iDSD, just did not expect it from a company of supposedly audiophile reputation. As you said "the brain will listen for the problem." I've removed iDSD and listen and listen and listen with one cheap dac, than another one, then built-in dacs of my two different receivers. All of them are as silent as a grave. I chose to return iDSD(thanks to musicdirect return policy) and stay with my cheaper dacs that produce silence in silent music passages, which are plenty in classical, opera and vocal jazz.

 

BTW, I heard hiss only in bit-perfect mode, all others were silent.

[jhwalker]

I've been in computer audio since I discovered mp3s about 15 years ago and I did not hear any hissing unless it is 'built into' a recording. Currently with my 702K headphones and with my speakers setup I was caught by a surprise with iDSD, just did not expect it from a company of supposedly audiophile reputation. As you said "the brain will listen for the problem." I've removed iDSD and listen and listen and listen with one cheap dac, than another one, then built-in dacs of my two different receivers. All of them are as silent as a grave. I chose to return iDSD(thanks to musicdirect return policy) and stay with my cheaper dacs that produce silence in silent music passages, which are plenty in classical, opera and vocal jazz.

 

BTW, I heard hiss only in bit-perfect mode, all others were silent.

 

Bitperfect mode is *no* filtering, which means all aliasing is audible. Some people don't mind this (or even like it, as it sounds less "polite" / more immediate than a filtered mod), but if you are especially sensitive to higher frequencies, you may hear the aliasing and not like it.

 

The standard or minimum phase modes, as you note, filter out this distortion - surprised you didn't just keep the DAC and use one of these modes, instead.

[YashN]

Changing cables (for now) won't minimise noise, if they did, they would colour the sound and that's far from acceptable. RCA cabling is single ended which means the return path is through the shield and that's where the music is too.

 

That's a rather obvious display of ignorance of the finer details of equipment grounding and their mis-implementations since using RCA cables with inner twisted pair and outer shield connected to the source end only are known to have beneficial effects in unbalanced connections with ground loops.

[Jumbosausage]

Well I've decided to return the Focal's. I tried them with a completely different source and the hiss was still present all be it nowhere near as bad as when connected through the iDSD and using my laptop. I also didn't hear the hiss with a pair of headphones connected to the iDSD. I'm wondering if the Focal's and the iDSD just aren't very compatible?

 

As this is for a desktop setup I thought active monitors would be the best solution but I'm now wondering if I should get an amp and some passives or maybe just try another pair of studio monitors. Can anyone recommend a pair known to work well with the iDSD or do you guys think I'd be best going the passive route?

 

Thanks.

[Jumbosausage]

Since had a reply from iFi regards my issues with the Focals, here it is for anyone interested.

 

 

I have passed this onto our designers and they have some information I thought to pass onwards.

 

"The Focal Actives are VERY HIGH sensitivity on the RCA Line in, less on the XLR.

 

Even Eco Mode will be of limited value, as they generally do full output (something like 110dB/1m) at 0.3V input levels.

 

Another issue is that there is a mains earth, so together with a PC/Laptop and incautious mains connections they can introduce ground loops.

 

The suggestions:

 

1) Make sure PC and Monitors are plugged into a single mains distribution, it may still be necessary to use a "cheater-plug" on the PC to cut the earth loop. Note that some external HDD's (WD MyBook come to mind) also track a dirty earth connection in to the system so they too may need "cheating".

 

2) Use RCA to XLR cables/adapters and use lowest available gain settings, only increasing gain on the monitor if the iDSD micro in preamp mode at normal setting with the volume at around 12 O'Clock does not provide sufficient loudness for normal listening.

 

3) It there are no gain controls and even in Eco mode the volume control on the iDSD micro cannot be advanced to around 12 O'Clock for normal listening (not headbanging), use in line attenuators, e.g. these:

Harrison Labs 12 dB RCA Line Level Audio Attenuator Pair

 

The iDSD micro has 115dB SNR, meaning if the system is correctly set up for gain etc. and the speakers can handle 115dB/1m SPL (read VERY LOUD - few small monitors can, think 15" Coaxials for that SPL) the actual noise from the iDSD micro will be at the threshold of hearing at 1m distance from the speakers.

 

If there is noise, there is a mismatch somewhere in the system that needs resolving, not a problem with the iDSD micro in itself.

 

Pure Hiss (like snake/cat) suggests gain mismatch, while a hum/buzz/angry bees noise is usually a ground/earth-loop."

 

Hope this helps.

[YashN]

Thanks for sharing.

 

If you notice the end of they text, they speak of the possibility of ground loops, so that's where a directional RCA could help.

 

It's good you managed to test and return before committing to the Focals.

[Jumbosausage]

Yes I'm glad i was able to return the Focal's, I'm still stuck on what to go for next though. It's tough getting home auditions here and I really can't decide between another set of Monitors or an amp + passives instead.

[YashN]

There's a third option too: build your own!

[kurb1980]

iFI just released the latest firmware update today!

 

micro iDSD – Firmware | iFi Audio

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/728236/ifi-idsd-micro-dsd512-pcm768-dac-and-headphone-amp-impressions-reviews-and-comments/4185#post_11784243

[Slippers-on]

Yes I'm glad i was able to return the Focal's, I'm still stuck on what to go for next though. It's tough getting home auditions here and I really can't decide between another set of Monitors or an amp + passives instead.

 

are you looking for an amp and speakers for the Micro? What's your budget?

[Jumbosausage]

Yes exactly that, my budget is £2000 for speakers and an amp to pair with the iDSD and Itube. No idea which route to take.

[john57]

If what IFI says about the Focals that can do full output at 0.3V input levels. That is crazy sensitive. With that kind of sensitivity, no wonder you can hear the HF noise. I use the gain controls on the back on my monitors as limiters never full on. Have been using JBL305. Many active monitors have some hiss on the tweeters if you listen at one inch. Here is some info from Focal about noise from another user.

 

I heard back from FOCAL.

 

This is what they have to say:

 

"Hi,

 

Yes, it's normal that there's a very small amount of hiss but only if you

are VERY close to the drivers. This is mostly induced by the transformer

directly since we're using a massive toroidal transformer for great

dynamics. However, this can induce a bit of hiss. The amount could vary

(unfortunately) from one unit to the other depending on the exact

orientation of the transformer. So it's possible that in one of your CMS 50,

the transformer is a few degrees off the optimal positioning, resulting in

slightly louder hiss. This is not in the signal path so it would not affect

sound quality or dynamics.

[Slippers-on]

Yes exactly that, my budget is £2000 for speakers and an amp to pair with the iDSD and Itube. No idea which route to take.

 

Look for a [h=1]Vincent Audio SV 500 Hybrid Integrated Amplifier[/h]

And a Pair of Canton Vento 820.2 Speakers.....you will love the combination with the IfI. Canton Vento 820.2 - Surround/Bookshelf speaker - Lowest price, specs and reviews

[Jumbosausage]

Look for a Vincent Audio SV 500 Hybrid Integrated Amplifier

 

 

And a Pair of Canton Vento 820.2 Speakers.....you will love the combination with the IfI. Canton Vento 820.2 - Surround/Bookshelf speaker - Lowest price, specs and reviews

 

Thank you, I will look into both of those. I've actually never heard of either brand. How do those speakers compare to the Kef LS50's?

[Slippers-on]

Trust me...they will Kill the LS50's which to my ears sound to metallic! The Cantons have a ceramic tweeter.

[likethesoup2]

Is an adapter required for the Dragontail to connect the Regen to the Micro?

 

Will the Dragontail connect the iUSB to the Micro?

[Lionelh2]

Is an adapter required for the Dragontail to connect the Regen to the Micro?

 

Will the Dragontail connect the iUSB to the Micro?

 

The Dragontail is USB M to USB F and no adaptor is needed. I use it to connect Regen to iDSD Micro and it sounds great.