HQ Player

[giordy60]

2 minutes ago, GMG said:

I meant playing the same synced music on multiple zones at the same time

ah! ok
here only Jussi can answer you 

[Miska]

1 hour ago, GMG said:

Does HQPlayer have a multi-zone option? is it in future plans?

 

55 minutes ago, GMG said:

I meant playing the same synced music on multiple zones at the same time

 

This would require synchronizing DAC clocks on those zones, or resorting baking in jitter with ASRC.

 

Solution is to use audio devices that have such clock synchronization over network. For example Merging's RAVENNA protocol. There you can manage such zone routings with ANEMAN. And to HQPlayer it'll look like a single output.

 

[bogi]

22 minutes ago, Miska said:

Solution is to use audio devices that have such clock synchronization over network. For example Merging's RAVENNA protocol. There you can manage such zone routings with ANEMAN. And to HQPlayer it'll look like a single output.

When I imagine HQPlayer upsampling to DSD512, all DACs playing in parallel would need to support the same rate e.g. DSD512. I did only few minutes searching and it seems Ravenna does not support DSD512, but it seems to support DSD256. That's still nice, but the requirement that all involved DACs should be able to play the same format (including for example native/DoP for DSD) seem to be restricting. Or does Ravenna do format conversion to adapt to device capabilities? Any conversion would destroy the HQPlayer filtering result. So it doesn't look to me so easy.

[Miska]

2 minutes ago, bogi said:

When I imagine HQPlayer upsampling to DSD512, all DACs playing in parallel would need to support the same rate e.g. DSD512. I did only few minutes searching and it seems Ravenna does not support DSD512, but it seems to support DSD256.

 

Yes, current maximum is DSD256 (you can do for example 8 channels of DSD256 for full multichannel).

 

2 minutes ago, bogi said:

That's still nice, but the requirement that all involved DACs should be able to play the same format (including for example native/DoP for DSD) seem to be restricting.

 

I don't think it is too much to ask for synchronized playback.

 

2 minutes ago, bogi said:

Or does Ravenna do format conversion to adapt to device capabilities?

 

No, it is bit-perfect.

 

[GMG]

34 minutes ago, Miska said:

Solution is to use audio devices that have such clock synchronization over network. For example Merging's RAVENNA protocol. There you can manage such zone routings with ANEMAN. And to HQPlayer it'll look like a single output.

Thanks Miska,

Couldn't you manage multiple NAA's that are communicating with the DACs and assure the sync? similar to RAAT protocol (not that it's close to being perfect...)

[Miska]

18 minutes ago, GMG said:

Couldn't you manage multiple NAA's that are communicating with the DACs and assure the sync? similar to RAAT protocol (not that it's close to being perfect...)

 

When you have USB Audio Class 2 with asynchronous audio, DAC owns the clock. NAA doesn't own any clock.

 

One could run ASRC to fine-tune output sample rates on the fly based on perceived drifts. But these end up baking jitter into the output data, thus bad from quality perspective. Then there are of course even more horrible ways, such as the mechanisms used by AirPlay.

 

As usual, I'd suggest to either implement things properly or not implement them at all.

 

[ted_b]

16 hours ago, Miska said:

 

Yes. Dealing with settings and such is web browser access + HQPlayer Client. So just like Desktop, but instead of VNC you use browser.

 

Version changes is that you just flash new version with Etcher.

 

So I have my i7-6700k now booted up with HQP Embedded, and running Roon to my fitlet2 NAA.  I will head downstairs soon to evaluate sq, etc.

 

Question: since it is on the same machine as my Win10 license (which is not booted up of course) do I use the same license key?  I ask cuz otherwise I have to trudge back upstairs every 30 min to reboot the server, get into the bios and pick the USB to boot from.  Argh!

[Miska]

14 minutes ago, ted_b said:

Question: since it is on the same machine as my Win10 license (which is not booted up of course) do I use the same license key?  I ask cuz otherwise I have to trudge back upstairs every 30 min to reboot the server, get into the bios and pick the USB to boot from.  

 

No, Desktop key won't work on Embedded.

 

But you can restart the service with command "systemctl restart hqplayerd" from console.

 

[Quadman]

I just installed HQP 4.15.4 on my windows 11 pro PC server. i7-10700K, RTX3060 GPU.  I have checked Cuda Offload, left Multicore DSP grayed (I get same results if I check this as well) and now up sampling 16/44.1 music to DSD512 with Poly-sinc-xtr-short-LP & DSD5v2 256+fs,  task manager shows CPU usage at 7-8% usage and GPU usage very close to 100%!!   I have never seen this before can this be right, GPU almost 100% usage?  Before 4.15.4 CPU would usually be in the 20's% range and GPU 20-30% range.

 

I downloaded and installed the latest Nvidia driver yesterday 515.xx or 505.xx

 

 

[Miska]

1 hour ago, Quadman said:

Before 4.15.4 CPU would usually be in the 20's% range and GPU 20-30% range.

 

With same filter, modulator and output rate? There have been no changes in GPU code in quite some time.

 

[Fleecyears]

Hi All,

 

Just a quick update and hopefully some encouragement for others on this crazy digital journey.

 

For the 1st time, I’m now able to upsample to DSD512 with ASDM7ECv2 and poly-sinc-gauss-xla with NO dropouts.

Yes DSD512 is possible with some of the highest filters, but does require one to download the latest AMD optimised version of HQPlayer from the website (special directory)

 

Amazing result. Thanks Miska
 

Current Setup

 

Roon / HQ Player Server

• AMD Ryzen 5800x
• RTX3060TI
• 64Gb of Ram
• Fanless PSU
• Fully Passive case from Turemetal UP10
• Ubuntu 20.10
• HQplayer 4.15.4.66amd-amd64

Roon End Point

• Intel i5
• 32 Gb of Ram
• JCAT Femto USB powered externally 
• JCAT Ethernet Card powered externally 
• HDPlex 400w LPS 
• HDPlex H5 Case all passive. No fans
• HQPlayer embedded OS. Running off a USB stick

EternetRegen with fibre from the switch

 

any other tweaks I should be considering?
 

[Kalpesh]

31 minutes ago, Fleecyears said:

Hi All,

 

Just a quick update and hopefully some encouragement for others on this crazy digital journey.

 

For the 1st time, I’m now able to upsample to DSD512 with ASDM7ECv2 and poly-sinc-gauss-xla with NO dropouts.

Yes DSD512 is possible with some of the highest filters, but does require one to download the latest AMD optimised version of HQPlayer from the website (special directory)

 

Amazing result. Thanks Miska
 

Current Setup

 

Roon / HQ Player Server

• AMD Ryzen 5800x
• RTX3060TI
• 64Gb of Ram
• Fanless PSU
• Fully Passive case from Turemetal UP10
• Ubuntu 20.10
• HQplayer 4.15.4.66amd-amd64

Roon End Point

• Intel i5
• 32 Gb of Ram
• JCAT Femto USB powered externally 
• JCAT Ethernet Card powered externally 
• HDPlex 400w LPS 
• HDPlex H5 Case all passive. No fans
• HQPlayer embedded OS. Running off a USB stick

EternetRegen with fibre from the switch

 

any other tweaks I should be considering?
 

it's a great achievement, I can't even go DSD256 from 64 with 7EC, best I can is 5EC, but

xla or any such filter applies only to PCM source

I got rid and did not even bother to keep rips of Esoteric SACD, to my ears they are awfully bright and sourced from we don't know what. The MFSL of Round Midnight is quite good and cheaper

[Rune]

6 hours ago, Fleecyears said:

Yes DSD512 is possible with some of the highest filters, but does require one to download the latest AMD optimised version of HQPlayer from the website (special directory)

This also works for me on windows 10 X5950, RTC 3090. I just use the standard windows version of 4.15.4 build. multicore=gray and cuda=true. (dropout if cuda=false)

Nice to see that X5800+RTX 3060Ti is sufficient.

[Quadman]

14 hours ago, Miska said:

With same filter, modulator and output rate?

Yes, I have pretty much been in the XTR-short family for a few weeks.  XTR-short MP & LP.  Last night 7 hour listening session the GPU stayed pegged near 100% but according to Win 11 task manager and HWinfo monitors GPU temps stayed in the mid 50 C range.  This leads me to believe The reported GPU usage may not be correct, it seems to me if GPU usage was really near 100% the temps would be much higher then mid 50's. I wonder if the new Nvidia driver 511.09 could be causing the monitoring sensors to go wacky?  Overall CPU usage was lower then normal 6-9%, which also seems odd for such a demanding filter as XTR-short. 

[Miska]

10 minutes ago, Quadman said:

Yes, I have pretty much been in the XTR-short family for a few weeks.  XTR-short MP & LP.  Last night 7 hour listening session the GPU stayed pegged near 100% but according to Win 11 task manager and HWinfo monitors GPU temps stayed in the mid 50 C range.  This leads me to believe The reported GPU usage may not be correct, it seems to me if GPU usage was really near 100% the temps would be much higher then mid 50's. I wonder if the new Nvidia driver 511.09 could be causing the monitoring sensors to go wacky?  Overall CPU usage was lower then normal 6-9%, which also seems odd for such a demanding filter as XTR-short. 

 

Yes, it is possible. It is also pretty much black box how the interaction between CUDA stuff and the Nvidia driver works.

 

You could try running "nvidia-smi -l 10" in command prompt and see what it says. Unfortunately on Windows it is not quite as useful as on Linux, since not all info is shown.

 

[Quadman]

1 minute ago, Miska said:

You could try running "nvidia-smi -l 10" in command prompt

I'll try is that Capital I, Vertical straight line or lower case L before the 10?

[Miska]

2 hours ago, Quadman said:

I'll try is that Capital I, Vertical straight line or lower case L before the 10?

 

Lower-case letter "L". Indicating that it should be updating every 10 seconds instead of just printing out once.

 

nvidia-smi at least used to get installed along with the driver. You may need to search for it, it could be under Windows system directory or Program Files.

 

[Zauurx]

Thank you Miska, you have opened up new choices that require demanding listening...
Between DSD256x48 ASDM7ECv2 and DSD1024 AMSDM7 512fs... I hesitate. 🙃

The 256 v2 seems more energetic on cymbals... compared to the 1024, which is softer.
The Pegasus is at max...and it's good! (for 1/4 of the May) 🤩

[Quadman]

4 hours ago, Miska said:

nvidia-smi at least used to get installed along with the driver.

I ran it through command and it found it immediately, no searching.  I think what I circled in green is GPU usage %.  It ran between 29%-41% for the 5 minutes I had it open.  Well below task manager which on same shot is showing close to 100%.  Temperatures of 53-54 C also seem to confirm the SMI reported lower usage %.  Thank you Jussi!!

 

Now I need to get me an 11900K as it is the cheapest upgrade path to 1024, and some 512 with EC filters.  Well done Jussi, you just keep making it better and better.

[Schafheide]

At present I use HQPlayer on my Mac Mini M1 - this has an upper limit of DSD256 (using ASDM7ECv2).

I want to explore the possibility of using an 11th Gen i9 PC, to get to DSD512.

By way of experimenting, is there a bootable image (installed on a USB drive), that will run Linux OS + HQPlayer, when plugged into a Windows PC??

[Miska]

40 minutes ago, Schafheide said:

At present I use HQPlayer on my Mac Mini M1 - this has an upper limit of DSD256 (using ASDM7ECv2).

I want to explore the possibility of using an 11th Gen i9 PC, to get to DSD512.

By way of experimenting, is there a bootable image (installed on a USB drive), that will run Linux OS + HQPlayer, when plugged into a Windows PC??

 

Yes, HQPlayer OS. Which is special Linux built just for running HQPlayer Embedded.

 

You could also install regular desktop Linux on a USB memory stick or external drive if you want, but it is a bit more effort.

 

[Schafheide]

4 hours ago, Miska said:

 

Yes, HQPlayer OS. Which is special Linux built just for running HQPlayer Embedded.

 

You could also install regular desktop Linux on a USB memory stick or external drive if you want, but it is a bit more effort.

 

So the bootable stick will run HQPlayer OS together with HQPlayer ?  How do I get it?

[stefano_mbp]

59 minutes ago, Schafheide said:

So the bootable stick will run HQPlayer OS together with HQPlayer ?  How do I get it?

It will run HQPlayer Embedded

You can get it from here https://www.signalyst.eu/bins/hqplayerd/images/

Remember that HQPlayer Embedded license if different from HQPlayer Desktop

As HQPlayer NAA functionality will run too you can disable it running these commands from console 

systemctl stop networkaudiod 

systemctl disable networkaudiod

Web interface will run too and if you want disable it run

systemctl stop hqpwv

systemctl disable hqpwv

 

[Zauurx]

@Miska 
To my knowledge in the case of just using NAA: an embedded version (with hqplayer server and hqplw killed) is equivalent to a NAA image version (without embedded).
The last optimizations concern only the upsampling server part (?).
In terms of SQ (kernel, latency...) the 2 versions, for a NAA use, are equivalent ?

 

EDIT
 

Reading the parallel thread on NAA, the question is asked in another form by SwissBear

 

[Achim]

@Miska  Hi Jussi,

 

in a scenario  where I have HQP on a server machine and play out over a NAA to the living room AND want to use the HQP input option - how can I attach the input interface to the NAA? NAA is one of your images.

 

I want to attach to the NAA in order to avoid long cables, possibly through a wall, to the HQP machine.

 

If I try to set NAA in HQP as input as well, the "must be different" error is thrown.

 

Achim