T+A DAC 200

[SPAZ]

3 hours ago, OE333 said:

I am currently working on the DAC200 firmware.

I have learnt from the discussions on this forum that there is interest for some additional features like

• making the "USB-SYS" input available as a second USB in
• storing certain settings (Oversampling, Filter and Invert) independently for each input

These features will (for the near future) not be included in the standard T+A firmware, but I could make a special version of the DAC200 firmware including these features as a private project.

This special firmware could be flashed on to the DAC200 with either the official T+A programming adapter (recommended) or with the home-brew DIY adapter (https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/63998-ta-dac-200/page/15/#comment-1239207)

 

Anybody interested ?

 

Any suggestions for other additional features ?

 

 

I’m super interested! Having a 2nd USB input would be a game changer for me.  Thanks OE333

[Asdfgh]

19 hours ago, OE333 said:

I am currently working on the DAC200 firmware.

I have learnt from the discussions on this forum that there is interest for some additional features like

• making the "USB-SYS" input available as a second USB in
• storing certain settings (Oversampling, Filter and Invert) independently for each input

These features will (for the near future) not be included in the standard T+A firmware, but I could make a special version of the DAC200 firmware including these features as a private project.

This special firmware could be flashed on to the DAC200 with either the official T+A programming adapter (recommended) or with the home-brew DIY adapter (https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/63998-ta-dac-200/page/15/#comment-1239207)

 

Anybody interested ?

 

Any suggestions for other additional features ?

 

 

Both would be great features, thank you @OE333. Storing PRE Output setting independently for each output would be great for HT bypass or DSP volume control etc.

[Hydrology]

Ordered a DAC200 and a pair of M200 monos this week (moving from a wonderful Hegel H590).
Looking forward to receiving my new toys in a few weeks!!

 

 

[jrsub]

2 minutes ago, Hydrology said:

Ordered a DAC200 and a pair of M200 monos this week (moving from a wonderful Hegel H590).
Looking forward to receiving my new toys in a few weeks!!

 

 

Nice!

[OE333]

 

@Apollo, @SPAZ, @Asdfgh

 

Here comes a short answer to your questions:

• There will be a way back to the original T+A firmware
• I have access to the T+A firmware source code, so I can make a new FW version with the extended features whennever this is needed
• HT PassThrough is likely to be a new feature in the next major release of the standard T+A firmware but maybe I can integrate a pre-view of this feature in my "special edition" FW

I will be on holiday next week but I will respond in more detail when I'm back home.

I think I could release the "SE" firmware by mid of October.

 

[SPAZ]

@OE333

 

Amazing, ty! FYI, The parts came in today to make the homebrew cable (incuding the resistors) so I will work on it this weekend. I am looking at my DAC200 info and it shows Firmware 1.19 and USB 1.10. Is there a newer version I can download and update to test?

 

Thanks

[OE333]

Hi SPAZ,

good luck with your homebrew adaptor project !

 

V 1.19 is quite up-to-date.

You can test your homebrew adaptor with the Flash tool. When you click the "connect" button, the flash tool will perform a communication test and inform you of the result. If the connection can be established, your adaptor is working properly.

If you successfully reached this step, lean back and wait for the SE firmware...

 

 

[davidv100]

Dear OE333,

I have a suggestion for a firmware evolution indeed.

Long version (to relate)

I just received my Hifiman HE1000 Stealth planar headphones and they work fantastic plugged into the DAC200.
Then using my new headphones, I had confirmation that I had an imaging issue in my speaker set-up.
Then I tried to do a first easy room-correction with changing the balance on my Speaker Plinius PreAmp. It worked.
Then I realised for the first time that my Speaker Plinius Preamp had an issue as there is a hum I never heard before. So I had to remove it immediately from the chain for service. It could obiously not remain there one more minute.
Then I thought I have an easy temporary fix : I will use the preamp function of my DAC200 to directly feed my Plinius Amp.

But I still have to adjust the balance (-5 Db left) for room correction which I did on the DAC200.
Everything works and it is all fine.
Then I wanted to continue enjoying my new HE1000 headphones connected to the DAC200, so that I could forget about my broken pre-amp and not think about the crazy amount this will cost.
Then I realised that the balance adjustment on the DAC200 for the line out the amp (-5 Db left) also applied to the headphones.
Which is not a good idea.

Short Version

 

I think the balance setting for the "Headphone Out" should be independent from the balance setting for the "Line Out". I mean, it is not just me, I guess :
- Adjusting the Line-Out balance (Speaker Balance) is a first fix for room-correction (asymmetric room, glass panels on the side).
- Adjusting the Headphone balance is... something no-one should do, unless the person is hearing impaired.

Is this fixable with a firmware ? If not, I can obviously change manually every time... but it is a bit sad for such a nice device. An "in-between" fix (that would work for 99% of people I guess) would be to propose an option to disable the balance setting for the headphone output ("Headphone Balance : Bypass : Y/N"). I actually thought this is how DAC200 would work natively, as it seems natural (Balance only applicable for Line Out).

Does my suggestion make sense (I hope so) ?
Thank you very much !
Have a great day.

 

David, Belgium



 

[OE333]

@davidv100   thank you for your suggestion. I will think about what can be done. More details next week.

[davidv100]

Dear OE333,

Following my question above, I have a rather candid question for you.

As I explained earlier, My speaker chain used to be DAC200 -> Plinius M8 PreAmp -> Plinius SA201 Amp -> Martin Logan Summit Electrostats.
Now, since my PreAmp needs servicing, my chain is DAC200 -> Plinius SA201 Amp -> Martin Logan Summit Electrostats.

At first, I was thinking about servicing/replacing the Plinius M8 PreAmp.
But I am now questioning this as DAC200 seems to do the job pretty well (But I cannot A/B test).

So, my candid question :
Would you say the preamp of DAC200 is "state of the art", meaning I need no other preamp actually.
Or would you say DAC200 is mainly a DAC, with a rather good preamp coming as a perk, but an external preamp would still be better.

Also, is the volume control of DAC200 done digitally (before/in the DAC Stage), or is it done in the analog stage (not digital) ?
And which is better ?

Thank you very much for your highly valuable advice,

David  

[Apollo]

19 minutes ago, davidv100 said:

Would you say the preamp of DAC200 is "state of the art", meaning I need no other preamp actually.
 

My 2 cents:

 

When I upgraded my T+A Dac 8 DSD to a 200 Dac, I compared the 200 dac with and without pre-amplifier (Violectric HPA 550 PRO)

I preferred without, not necessarilly because of sound quality reasons, as for me their was no 'clear' difference.

I.e. the Violectric pre-amp does not bring any value-add compared to the dac 200 pre-amp.

Easy decision: I removed the  Violectric pre-amp from my audio chain.

Dirk

[davidv100]

Thank you Apollo / Dirk.

I didn't know about this Violectric HPA 550 PRO preamp. But I googled a bit an it seems to be a very decent pre-amp.
So your feed-back is very interesting indeed. Thanks a lot for this already from a Belgian fellow.

Still wondering what OE333 will have to say about it from his own POV, but in the meantime, let's wish him very nice holidays.

[Hydrology]

8 hours ago, davidv100 said:

So, my candid question :
Would you say the preamp of DAC200 is "state of the art", meaning I need no other preamp actually.
Or would you say DAC200 is mainly a DAC, with a rather good preamp coming as a perk, but an external preamp would still be better.

Also, is the volume control of DAC200 done digitally (before/in the DAC Stage), or is it done in the analog stage (not digital) ?
 

 

Its been confirmed many times that the volume control is purely analogue, so no concerns there. Regarding preamp status, I would consider this "state of the art" relative to its price point. I have just committed to a 200 stack and will be using the DAC200 an an analogue preamp for my TT/phono pre combination (having moved from dedicated Hegel H590).

 

Perhaps the only way to convince yourself is to do the A/B comparison, but that of course would infer a repair of the Plinius.

[OE333]

23 hours ago, davidv100 said:

So, my candid question :

Would you say the preamp of DAC200 is "state of the art", meaning I need no other preamp actually.
Or would you say DAC200 is mainly a DAC, with a rather good preamp coming as a perk, but an external preamp would still be better.

Also, is the volume control of DAC200 done digitally (before/in the DAC Stage), or is it done in the analog stage (not digital) ?
And which is better ?

 

No question, the pre-amp inside the DAC 200 is a state of the art pre-amp. It is based on the discrete (no OP-Amp) circuit technology from T+A's highly rated HV series and it is really a no-compromise top design.

 

The volume control in DAC200 is purely analog. It is a so-called logarithmic switched resistor ladder using hermetically sealed gold contact relays and audiophile non-magnetic high precision resistors. This kind of volume control is quite expensive but it is hard to beat and it is superior to digital volume control because it does not loose resolution when turned down to normal listening level. In contrast, the only advantage of digital volume control imho is its low cost - in a DAC it comes for free at absolutely zero cost.

 

[davidv100]

11 minutes ago, OE333 said:

 

No question, the pre-amp inside the DAC 200 is a state of the art pre-amp. It is based on the discrete (no OP-Amp) circuit technology from T+A's highly rated HV series and it is really a no-compromise top design.

 

The volume control in DAC200 is purely analog. It is a so-called logarithmic switched resistor ladder using hermetically sealed gold contact relays and audiophile non-magnetic high precision resistors. This kind of volume control is quite expensive but it is hard to beat and it is superior to digital volume control because it does not loose resolution when turned down to normal listening level. In contrast, the only advantage of digital volume control imho is its low cost - in a DAC it comes for free at absolutely zero cost.

 

 

Thank you very much OE333,

And thank you very much also to Apollo and Hydrology,

The return of experience of Apollo and Hydrology, plus the confirmation by OE333 will lead me to do just as they did.
I will be skipping the external preamp and use DAC200 in full : DAC + Preamp.
Less connectors, less cables, less loss... my only remaining issue will be to cope with the funeral of my previous preamp, and dig a decent grave in my backyard, in loving memories and stranded money.

Now of course, this also confirms that my previous question regarding the balance (headphone <> line out) makes sense.
If there were a way to disable the balance setting for the headphone, it would be perfect.
If not, I will obviously survive as I am super happy with my DAC200 anyway.
Plus this online support by OE333 is a very valuable add-on for the T+A community.

Thank you very much to the three of you,

 

David
 

[OE333]

29 minutes ago, davidv100 said:

 

I will be skipping the external preamp and use DAC200 in full : DAC + Preamp.
Less connectors, less cables, less loss...

 

👍

[droffen]

1 hour ago, davidv100 said:

I will be skipping the external preamp and use DAC200 in full : DAC + Preamp.

I’m doing this with my HA200 as well

[linuxprophet]

@Hydrology You most certainly won't regret it. I first purchased the DAC200, and a pair of M200s last November. In January I added the MP200.

The manual was so tempting, that I purchased a single A200 for the Highs/Mid for my Sonus Faber Olympica Nova IIIs and the M200s for the Lows.

The HA200 is in a separate room for private listening with the Solitaire P.

 

Be prepared! Your favourite music will sound 'unlocked'. I can't say more about the quality of dedication by the T+A team to excellence.

 

now, if only I could afford the Aurender N30... A guy can only dream!

[jonniema]

On 9/30/2023 at 7:27 PM, OE333 said:

 

@Apollo, @SPAZ, @Asdfgh

 

Here comes a short answer to your questions:

• There will be a way back to the original T+A firmware
• I have access to the T+A firmware source code, so I can make a new FW version with the extended features whennever this is needed
• HT PassThrough is likely to be a new feature in the next major release of the standard T+A firmware but maybe I can integrate a pre-view of this feature in my "special edition" FW

I will be on holiday next week but I will respond in more detail when I'm back home.

I think I could release the "SE" firmware by mid of October.

 

 

Other suggestion would be the ability to disable remote control but only for volume buttons. E.g: Options to be: (Enabled, Disabled, Volume Disabled)

This is because i use the DAC200 with a PA3100HV and would like to use the remote to control volume on the PA3100HV but still be able to control the remaining fuctions on the DAC200. Currently using the disable remote disables all possibilities. Besides using the PA3100HV remote also messes with DAC200 volume dials.

 

Tks!

[OE333]

This weekend I found the time to work on the DAC200 firmware with extended features. I integrated the following additional functions:

1. 2nd USB input
2. separate VOLUME & BALANCE settings for Pre-Amp mode and headphone mode
3. settings for OVS, WIDE and INVERT stored separately for each input
4. screen saver mode (automatic dimming of the display)

The other suggested features (disable remote control for Volume only &  HT Pass Through) I will probably include in the next eXtended firmware version.

 

I will do a little testing now with the new version and I will release it in short time.

If somebody is interested in this extended firmware, please send me a PM, I will then send you a link to download it.

 

[davidv100]

18 hours ago, OE333 said:

This weekend I found the time to work on the DAC200 firmware with extended features. I integrated the following additional functions:

1. 2nd USB input
2. separate VOLUME & BALANCE settings for Pre-Amp mode and headphone mode
3. settings for OVS, WIDE and INVERT stored separately for each input
4. screen saver mode (automatic dimming of the display)

The other suggested features (disable remote control for Volume only &  HT Pass Through) I will probably include in the next eXtended firmware version.

 

I will do a little testing now with the new version and I will release it in short time.

If somebody is interested in this extended firmware, please send me a PM, I will then send you a link to download it.

 

 

Hello OE333,
So you did succeed in separating VOL&BAL settings for PREAMP&HP.
This is great (not only for me, as I do think this is a real improvement overall).
Congratulations and thank you very much !!

David, Belgium

[Hydrology]

On 10/15/2023 at 11:00 PM, OE333 said:

This weekend I found the time to work on the DAC200 firmware with extended features. I integrated the following additional functions:

1. 2nd USB input
2. separate VOLUME & BALANCE settings for Pre-Amp mode and headphone mode
3. settings for OVS, WIDE and INVERT stored separately for each input
4. screen saver mode (automatic dimming of the display)

The other suggested features (disable remote control for Volume only &  HT Pass Through) I will probably include in the next eXtended firmware version.

 

I will do a little testing now with the new version and I will release it in short time.

If somebody is interested in this extended firmware, please send me a PM, I will then send you a link to download it.

 

Can this file be uploaded to the DAC200 through the MP200 or do you need the official/DIY cable for this one?

[OE333]

On 10/19/2023 at 8:44 AM, Hydrology said:

Can this file be uploaded to the DAC200 through the MP200 or do you need the official/DIY cable for this one?

 

Yes, currently (and in the near future)  a programming adaptor (official or DIY) is needed.

But it could well be, that some of the extensions will find their way into the standard firmware. Then an upgrade could be accomplished via MP200.

 

[linuxprophet]

@OE333I actually never thought of 4 x M200s! 

Great idea.

I have 2xM200 for lows and 1 x A200 for the Mids/High.

When I am rich, win the lottery, or a satellite falls on my BMW i7, I might be able to afford another pair of M200s

[Vangelis]

Is the fuse inside the DAC200 easily accessible? Anyone know the spec on the fuse?