Very Disappointed with Tekton Double Impacts

[PhilBarone]

I am a musician of many years and was responsible for making some really great players sax mouthpieces which I did for almost four decades and I also have my own line of saxophones for what that’s worth.

 

I bought my Double Impacts on a few months ago and at which time was informed that they would take about ninety days to receive.  When I didn’t receive any tracking info I emailed and received a response saying that they were waiting on parts and that it would be another two weeks. When I didn’t hear anything after two weeks I called and spoke with Eric Alexander who sounded very stressed out and said they’d be two more weeks and rushed me off the phone.  I just about thought he was gonna have a heart attack so I wrote him an email explaining that I was in a similar business making saxophone mouthpieces and that I had my own line of saxophones and made a couple of suggestions including meditation to calm down. 

 

Two weeks went buy and I called and spoke to a very nice women named “Connie” at which time she told me that they’d be shipping out in a few days and I did receive them a few days later by which I was very excited.  I hired a couple of guys to help me get them up the stairs of our place and set them up and boy, was I disappointed.  They weren’t complex sounding, lacked bass and highs and completely lacked definition.  They had no presence and above all were not at all exciting and I played everything on them from Bach’s Goldberg Variations, Scarlatti piano sonatas, BB King with a full horn selection, Bill Evans, Mozart’s symphony #41 in C major, even some rap, my whole playlist plus a bunch of CD’s. They sounded very one dimensional and almost like surround sound which I’m not a big fan of only, the sound didn’t reach me.  They didn’t project and when I hear the left hand on a Rachmaninoff piano concerto it had better have some umph.  Even when I listen to my much smaller Yamaha studio monitors, I can hear them in the next room and when I use my car’s stereo which only costs two-thousand dollars, its exciting.  Now, the Double Impacts did do better at higher volumes but never sounded full no matter how loud and I can’t listen to them loud all the time.

 

When you boil it down, I bought them on what reviewers had to say.  One reviewer said something like that they were worth speakers costing more than ten thousand dollars and another one said that some audiophiles were trading in their THIRTY-thousand-dollar speakers for the Double Impacts.  Well, I’d like to meet those people.  Ultimately, after doing lots of research, I bought into something that from my perspective just wasn’t true.  It reminded me of when I bought two of those “My pillows” which I won’t go into here.  For all I know they could be good speakers but NOTHING like they’re described to be in reviews, no way.

 

So, I wrote several comments on YouTube and Eric commented back saying that something was wrong and to call him which I did and I found him very, very defensive as if I personally insulted him.  I had frustrated artists syndrome myself so I know it when I see it.  He even at one point in the conversation said to one of his employees “Connie! How many Double Impacts have we gotten back out of the last 200 we sold?” To which of course she said “none”.  I could barely even get a word in edgewise but managed to say that I’d be willing to buy a more expensive speaker to which he said that it wouldn’t help.  Ultimately, he suggested that I send him photos so instead I sent him a video to which he made one comment but these speakers have a long way to go before I'll ever like them so today I ordered a pair of Klipsch Forte IV's.  My amp is a PrimaLuna EVO 300.  My rant is over.  Don't believe the reviews.  

 

[PhilBarone]

Yes, I can return them but I just found out that it's going to cost me $385.00 EACH to ship them back.  So, they originally cost me $3000 and if it costs them $385 each to ship to me then in reality they really only cost about $2400 + shipping.  So, think about what you get for $2400 and certainly not a 10 or 30 thousand dollar speakers like the reviewers would have you believe.  Not much plus the additional rudeness from the service.  You can bet that I'll be putting a video up on YouTube.  

[PhilBarone]

44 minutes ago, firedog said:

Sorry, Phil, but I'm not understanding: you don't like the speakers and have bought replacements, but aren't going to send them back even though you will net over$2K? Sounds like you are "letting your money make you mad", as the saying goes.

 

Or see if you can find a local or driving distance away buyer.  

 

Not trying to comment to you, but just a general comment: I'd never buy speakers over about $500 or so a pair that I didn't hear first (unless it was an upgrade in the same speaker line).
Reviews are for helping to create a list of speakers to audition, IMO.

Reaction to speakers is very personal. One man's poison is a another's favorite drink. So I'd either buy something sold locally after audition or if the speaker was really expensive, travel to audition it. That's what I did before I bought my last pair. Better to spend the amount it costs to ship them than to get stuck dealing with speakers you don't like.

 

One thing audio forums are good for: finding someone who owns the equipment you are interested in. Most serious audiophiles would be more than happy to let an interested party hear their equipment. 

 

Oh no, I'm sending them back and I offered to spend more money with them but the guy said it wouldn't make any difference.  So right, maybe I screwed up but there's not many places I can go to around here although I did go to one and wasn't blown away for the money.  Besides, correct me if I'm mistaken but wouldn't all the other variables such as amp, room and all other devices have to be used with the speakers to get an accurate assessment?

 

Given the Tekton's size and weight, I think it's going to be hard to find a local buyer so I'll send them back and write it off as a lesson learned, actually two.  The other one is never listen to reviews.  Yes, they can be used to make a list but I can do that just by doing a search, no? My friend used to write for an audio magazine said that reviews are all BS and I noticed that I never saw a bad one which indicates to me that they won't get stuff to review if the give manufacturers a negative review, right? But it's not my money that's making me mad, it's feeling duped. 

 

Thank you for your input and feel free to offer me advice since you're obviously more experienced than I am.  I'm kind of in a different league than you folks in that I'm not an audiophile, I really just wanted a nice unit and buying, selling, trading, driving all over the place is something I'm not that interested it.  

 

Peace, Phil

 

[PhilBarone]

12 hours ago, bluesman said:

Hi and welcome to the AS community, Phil!  I have no experience at all with Tekton or their products, so I can't help you with that.  But we see so many rants about similar problems with so many products and vendors that I thought yours called for a bit of clarification.  I've been a professional musician for 60+ years (Local 77).  Although my main instruments are guitar and keys, I follow at least one web forum for each instrument I've played over the years, of which sax is one. 

 

I've never played one of yours myself, but I can tell you (and any on AS who might be tempted to take issue with your post) that you have a rock solid reputation among those who own and play Barone instruments and accessories.  Although the sound and playability of your instruments and mouthpieces draw nothing but praise in the many posts I've seen (e.g. on Sax on the Web), I've been particularly impressed with the praise for your level of customer interaction, responsiveness, and care.  As a working musician, I want to thank you for the level of service you provide us.  

 

So when someone who takes it as seriously as you do complains like this, it's worth hearing.  I don't recall having seen any posts here from sax players at any time over the years I've been participating, so I'm fairly certain that few (if any) AS regulars are familiar with Barone saxophones.  So to all who are tempted to take the OP as just another rant, please take my word for it - he's not asking for anything he doesn't provide his own customers.  By reputation, he's as good as it gets in this regard.

 

We hope you find sonic satisfaction, Phil.  

Thank you, you made my day. I thought I was old news but I guess some people still remember me.  My ears are still good, there's this one A in the left hand of my vintage Steinway that I can always pick out. It's so amazing, it's so rich and dark and has like a million overtones and I keep trying to get my tech to make all the registers sound like this A but he can't! 

 

Have a great day! Former 802 member, Phil

[PhilBarone]

11 hours ago, abdodson said:

I'll be interested to hear your take on the Fortes when you get them.

 

Okay, but they're not exactly beautiful to look at. P

[PhilBarone]

13 minutes ago, GregWormald said:

While it is always best to have a real, lengthy audition in your own home, that is getting less and less likely, so you'll have to find another way of reducing purchasing errors.

 

IMO the way to use reviews goes something like this:

 

Learn to separate real reviews from advertorials. Hint—advertorials are always over the top. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

 

Real reviews always comment on the shortcomings as well as the positives. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

 

Work out which reviewers seem to appreciate the same thing you do in music and secondarily, in sound. This means you have to read a lot! 

 

Work out what the consensus is among the reviewers that match your preferences? The wider the opinion gap, the more likely something is off somewhere.

 

Work out what the reviewer has to gain from his review. Hint—the more gain, the more likely it is that the review is exaggerated.

 

This is some great advice, I printed it out but I haven't seen reviews that are like the ones you describe.  Where can I find them?  

 

Thank you! Phil

[PhilBarone]

1 hour ago, Shimei said:

Shouldn't be difficult moving Tektons used even if selling pricewise for same or more because of the delay in manufacturing. Some guys are still waiting for their orders after having been pre-paid for nearly 9 months. 

 

I do know a reviewer that recently purchased Double Impacts and from his observation they didn't sound great in his room. Mind you, he experimented w/ distance between the D.I.'s and noted how sensitive they were in this regard. He also stated that "most" speakers didn't sound good in his room and he could get the same kinda fidelity from a pair of Klipsch book shelves. 

I own the Tekton Design Ulfberhts and the sound signature I note about these in particular is that they don't exaggerate the bottom end. When listening to replication vs a live concert the kinda bass most listeners want is exaggerated and not accurate to live concert. Most want the kinda exaggeration that is not there without a separate subwoofer. When listening to percussions for example in a live concert the kick drum doesn't send shock waves as well as sternum shots to the listener.... I however, really enjoy this over exaggeration of low frequencies and added two more Tekton Design 4-10s which in my 20x20 ft listening room can now achieve 130+ spl. 

Lastly, upstream component selection was something I didn't put much emphasis on before owning Tektons. Sub-par amplification which sounded good w/ other speakers resulted in Tektons bitching and moaning about the working relationship w/ the gear upstream. I take it that this occurred because of the ohm load the Tektons placed on my then Emotiva XPA Gen 3 amp in which I then upgraded to a DR3 only to describe the fidelity likened to spreading cold butter over toast. It wasn't until I upgraded to Parasound's Halo line of amplification before I changed that to warm butter over soft bread. I'm not too sure about the ohm load of the D.I.s but w/ the Ulfberhts the ohm load dips down to 2.3 ohms .... makes me think that a high current amp is best suited to drive such speakers:

 

Above shows a 2.3 ohm load dip between 100-108hz. 

 

Okay but the Ulfberhts  are a much more expensive speaker although I did see a video of them and on the video they sounded spectacular and I would have bought them but the owner of Tekton steered me away from another speaker of his.  I'm not a big fan of bass in the extreme but I do love hear lows that aren't exaggerated.  I played some Bach cello suites and Rach piano concertos and the sound overall just wasn't present.  No umf.  In my room, they had nothing redeemable. Thank for the info. Phil

[PhilBarone]

Just now, PhilBarone said:

 

Okay but the Ulfberhts  are a much more expensive speaker although I did see a video of them and on the video they sounded spectacular and I would have bought them but the owner of Tekton steered me away from another speaker of his.  I'm not a big fan of bass in the extreme but I do love hear lows that aren't exaggerated.  I played some Bach cello suites and Rach piano concertos and the sound overall just wasn't present.  No umf.  In my room, they had nothing redeemable. Thank for the info. Phil

Just one question, where do I go about selling them? 

[PhilBarone]

11 hours ago, AudioDoctor said:

Those Tektons were actually suggested to me by someone who's musical tastes I trust so I am at a bit of a loss here. What kind of amplification were you using?

PrimaLuna EVO 300

[PhilBarone]

I'm not in the city but aside from that I'm told that I'd have to use my own amp and there's still no guarantee in my room.  I'll give the Klipsch Forte's a shot then I'll start traveling but it's getting old.  I'm not all that picky. Thanks to all who helped. Phil

[PhilBarone]

I ordered them yesterday, I'm in danger of becoming a chucklehead instead of just a knucklehead but I'll tell you a couple of stories.  I made a solid silver mouthpiece for one of my customers which he cherished.  One day he dropped it and called me very upset and said that it didn't play anymore so I told him to come over.  I had him play it and it was just squeaks and squaks.  So I inspected and measured it and it was fine so I handed it back to him and told him to play it and  it sounded fantastic.  It was purely psychological.  

 

Another story.  The great, late alto player and a dear friend of mine, Jackie Mclean, gave the great drummer Arthur Taylor my number to make some drumsticks for him because his favorite stick had been discontinued by Promark.  Arthur calls me and asks me to go over to his flat in Harlem so I go over there.  

 

He had two sticks, a Promark which he liked and a copy of the Promark made in Germany.  Both were the exact same shape and size but the Promark was a lacquered bare oak look and the German stick was stained a darker color.  He played both sticks for me and insisted that the Promark sounded better and was different so I had him close his eyes and I handed him a stick.  I did this a few times and he couldn't tell the difference and he got so mad. Holy s**t Lol!

 

3's or 4's, probably wouldn't make a difference to me since I don't read the advertisements.  Oh, and I have other stories.  

 

Peace! Phil

[PhilBarone]

6 hours ago, GregWormald said:

They aren't awfully common, but they are out there, and by people who are skilled, insightful and wanting to inform and help others.

Internet—YouTube, music and hi-fi forums, magazine back issues

Hi-fi clubs, get-togethers, demonstrations, ask individuals, talk to salesmen (risky, but there are good ones out there—they usually don't denigrate the brands the don't sell)

Do some auditions yourself and then you can compare what reviewers think. It doesn't have to be just about speakers to get an idea about them and their preferences.

Libraries, book stores

 

I know it's a bit of a hassle but you are spending good money on something that's supposed to give you pleasure for years. It's worth time and effort. (Remember the old saying: "Buy in haste, repent at leisure.")

I haven't seen an objective review on the Tekton's yet probably because people like Steve Guttenberg would't get anymore stuff from the manufacturers if they were to be honest and I find it incredibly dishonest myself.  I never would have bought these speakers had him and another chucklehead said that the speakers were worth much more.  The young kid that does the reviews on YouTube actually said that people were trading in their 30 thousand dollar speakers and I bought it hook line and sinker.   Such BS. 

 

Thank you, I'll be taking your advice. Phil

[PhilBarone]

2 hours ago, bluesman said:

The concept of worth is purely subjective, Phil.  With so many wonderful audio products now available at a fraction of the retail costs of their predecessors, MSRP and market/street price lack strong and consistent correlation with sound quality.  And with so many new methods and materials available, even design and build quality are less strongly tied to cost than they used to be.

 

My audio source and close friend for decades was a crusty lawyer-turned-dealer who opened one of the few high end shops in about 1950.  One of his many pet peeves was people who said things like "they sound great for small speakers".  For Dan, the question was only how they sound - period.  If he were still here today, he'd undoubtedly voice the same objection to those who say "they sound great for inexpensive speakers".

 

There are those (myself among them) who would sugggest that spending $30k on any but a select few speakers is buying it hook, line and sinker.  I've been blown away by a few 6 figure systems over the years, but I've been equally impressed with the naivete and stupidity of those who bought what I consider to be exotic audio debris.  And I've been more impressed with how close to greatness some $500 speakers can come than I have been with the marginal improvement for that extra $29,500.

 

You've given the world $3k saxophones that rival the best Mk 6s, so you understand this far better than most.  Quality is now almost independent of price, and speakers of equal sound quality to your ears are now classic  commodities.  They're differentiated from each other largely by price and esthetics.  Go with your ears and your gut. 

 

Thanks Bluesman, much appreciated.  If you ever need anything, let me know and I'll hook you up good. Phil

[PhilBarone]

34 minutes ago, Shimei said:

 

Terry London from Home Theater Review: "I personally know three other professional reviewers who have put their reference speakers (which average $30,000/pair) in the closet and replaced them with Tekton Design Double Impacts." - source: https://hometheaterreview.com/tekton-design-ulfberht-floorstanding-speaker-reviewed/

Personally, if one were to add up the costs of making the D.I.s w/ speakers, cabinets, and crossovers as well as shipping - well, I've come to the conclusion that there really isn't as much profit made by Tekton as other company's gear. The only sacrifice I think people which purchase Tekton make is letting go of furniture grade finishing. Given the psycho acoustical effects that many audio enthusiasts experience that's probably enough to lean away from Tekton. At least for me, I was in the market and about to pull the trigger on the really cool curved furniture pieces called Klipsch Palladiums before I purchased Tekton. Either which way I was not able to audition either so I was at the mercy of honest reviewers. 

 

My friend used to write for an audio magazine and he tells me flat out not to believe them, at all.  I'd like to meet the people that traded in their 30K speakers for the DI's.  

[PhilBarone]

1 hour ago, bluesman said:

I appreciate it, but I'm 'way too old to try to keep my chops up on wind instruments.  After playing piano for 70 years and guitar for 65, I'm finally developing some grace on both.  So I've chosen to focus my energy on further development of those skills.    😉

 

My use of trumpet and sax is probably of interest (and amusement) to you and many AS people, and it's consistent with the thrust of my AS article series on realism vs accuracy in audio systems.  I've probably played 2000+ weddings, Bar Mitzvahs, etc and at least as many jazz dates.  But I love to play the blues, and I've been fortunate enough to be a sideman for some outstanding national and international acts over the years.  Mosst bluespeople love to feel a horn section riffing behind them, but most bluespeople can't afford to pay one.  So I found a few ways to solve that problem.

 

I learned to play trumpet and sax when I was in high school because I was writing tunes and arranging other people's music with no regard at all for how difficult it might be to play what I wrote.  Not playing wind instruments, I had no knowledge or experience to guide me.  This was made clear when I handed out my chart for the theme song to the TV show "That Was The Week That Was", and the horn players (high schoolers for sure, but more than decent because Atlantic City High was big and had a diverse student body) all screamed "nobody could play this chart".  So I borrowed a trumpet to find out what was what, following that up with an alto a few months later once I had some facility.  It was a evelation to play instruments that let me add my breathing to the factors that shaped my sound - and it taught me about phrasing, because guitar and piano players don't have to stop to take a breath.  I loved it!

 

Fast forward to the introduction of the vocal harmonizer (which, for you nonmusicians, is an electronic box that adds harmonized notes to whatever you sing into a microphone connected to it).  I bought one, played a horn into it, and a horn section came out of my amplifier!  So I brought it on a gig with a Louisiana bluesman, who loved it - and it got me a lot of gigs.  You have to set it for the scale and harmonies you want and the key in which the tune is being played.  Sometimes, you have to fudge the key setting to accommodate some different scales and harmonies, as necessary.  But the bottom line is that it works really well.

 

This meant having to keep up my chops on both sax and trumpet, to provide whatever the bandleader or contractor wanted.  For those of you who have never played a wind instrument, let me assure you that playing the sax or trumpet well is HARD!!  Maintaining strong enough facial muscles, wind power, etc to play well for a few hours is very difficult, and you have to practice every day (or, at least, I did).  But it gets worse...........I discovered that I could play the trumpet with my right hand and a keyboard with my left at the same time, which got me even more gigs but threw one big monkey wrench in the works.  A trumpet is a "B flat" instrument, which means that a C on the trumpet is a B flat on the piano.  This means playing different music in the same song at the same time on two instruments in two different keys.  Since you can't play much on a saxophone with one hand, I had to default to the trumpet.

 

I did that until the first good guitar synthesizer came along (the Roland, in about 1995), at which point I put Roland pickups on my working guitars, started playing the horn section parts from my guitar, and hung up my horns.  Between the harmonizer and the synthesizer, I've been the horn section on hundreds of club dates, concerts, and videos - and no one has ever noticed that the horns don't sound quite right.  The vocal harmonizers at the bottom of the price range are far from SOTA audio electronics.  And in addition to the imperfections in synthesized intrumental sounds, there's a slight delay in the guitar synthesizer.  So I had to learn to lead the beat just enough to be close to perfectly synch'ed with the band.

 

Interesting times for sure!

Imagine playing in the style of Warne Marsh and those guy, there's no gigs outside of Europe. Are you from AC? My best friend and incredible tenor player Frank Vicari used to gig there all the time.  When those gigs dried up he ended up helping me in the shop.  Very sad story given that he played with Maynard, Buddy Rich and tons of others and a tremendous friend and great guy which is probably why he didn't make much money.  

 

Maybe you should tell me which speakers to buy if I don't like the Klipsch Fortes I just bought.  If they don't work out I'm considering the Harbeth but now we're getting into much more money.   

[PhilBarone]

2 hours ago, Shimei said:

I don't mean to stir up stuff Phil or be offensive. I've read your listing on FB  to sell your Tektons and found it to be as questionable as allegedly dishonest reviewers... . 
Don't get me wrong, I realize it wouldn't help you selling your D.I.s if you posted that they sounded like crap in your listing. All I am saying is that not all reviewers make something from reviewing gear by the manufacturer. However, if we are going to speculate about everybody's motive or intent it probably be most consistent to exhibit the same optimism towards anyone including ourselves that lists their gear to sell. 
I know one particular reviewer that buys his own gear unaided financially by audio companies and then sells his reviews to a major publication. Matter of fact he recently purchased D.I.s and wrote a review which is awaiting publication now. 
I'll be sure to post a link here to that review when it is published. 

You don't?

[PhilBarone]

1 hour ago, UNICRON-WMD said:

Phil, you need to figure out what sound you are looking for instead of keep buying speakers blindly and bashing them. It is possible it is your amp too. Did you change the Chinese stock tubes? Did you try the 4ohm or 8ohm? Try Triode or Ultra Linear? Both speakers and your amp have distinct sounds and might not match to your liking. 

 

I had Martin Logans and Definitive Technology in my theater, now I have 13 Tektons and I love them. I have Parasound and ATI amplifiers to power all of them. In my art room I have a pair of Tekton mini Lore Monitors driven by a Willsenton R8 with rolled tubes. Fantastic combo.

 

I watched your few unboxing videos and you seem like a nice guy but a little "Technology enept".

 

Both your speakers have lots of fans. Learn more about setting up speakers and your equipment before selling or buying anything else.

I’m in total agreement.  I’m not an audiophile and nor do I want to be and I definitely don’t want to spend months trying to find the right location for the speakers especially an 118 pound speaker.  I just wanted a good stereo and I didn’t want to get drawn into something that I had no interest in.

 

It could be my amp but Eric over at Tekton said it was good but I don’t know at this point so I’m thinking about a solid state amp and if the Tektons don’t work out than I’ll try the Klipsch and if they don’t work than I’m listening to a guy who sold audio for a long time and tells me to buy Harbeths but after that I am DONE redwing around. 
 

Eric over at Tekton agreed to have me set them up but they’re in my basement and given their size and weight I’m not in a big rush and where the Klipsch sit they sound better than the Tektons.  For what it’s worth, they were both in the same spots and I have limited space.  
 

I understand that I can break them in by facing them toward each other, reversing the polarity on one, throwing a blanket over them and cranking bass heavy music.  Is that true? 
 

I know I’ll never replicate the sound of my vintage Steinway but I spent ten grand and expected to be floored, thus the negative post and video. I don’t know, I’m so disgusted with the whole thing but thank you.  Phil

 

 

[PhilBarone]

17 hours ago, botrytis said:

Tektons are a love/hate type of speakers - so are Zu. I have heard both and to me, they were not worth the money, but that is me.

 

I am not an audiophile - I have a tin ear (my wife says so 😁 ).

 

That said, you need to think what type of sound you want out of a speaker. I have been slowly looking and for I found my Revel M126Be's and using 2 REL 7/ti subs for the bottom end. For me, it sounds exactly what I wanted. It took a while for me to find this combo.

 

Just keep looking.

 

Questions

1. Budget?

2. Music types listened to?

3. Volume?

4. Room size?

 

I try to fill these in first and then look to see what fits for me. I also go to listen, if I can. I am lucky to be in the Northern Chicago suburbs  and there are many dealers here. 

 

I don't believe in speaker break in. It usually takes very little to break in (that is from a material science point of view). IF you didn't like them at the beginning, no amount of 'break in' will change that.

Ya know, maybe I didn't give them a fair shake, everyone says that they're placement picky and I'm not spending four months like some people say to find the best spots in my room not to mention that my space is limited so I can't move them around that much anyway.  I mean that's  ridiculous but from all the info I've gathered I'm getting the feeling that I didn't buy the right amp (PrimaLuna EVO 300) and a better choice would have been a solid state amp with more watts.  

 

I have an extremely knowledgeable person advising me now and he advised me to buy Proac Response 3's which I did  so I'm picking them up Saturday.  

 

I listen to classical and jazz

Budget for total system $20,000

Low to medium volume

Room-25 X 17 feet

 

[PhilBarone]

17 hours ago, Ben-M said:

(deleted, but I don't know how to clear the editor and remove the quote...)

 

To the OP, I'm not sure how many of us started out as wanting to be audiophiles, but I certainly didn't. I wanted good sound for a reasonable price. I learned more about what I considered to be "good sound" by trying things. I didn't want that, I never bought 1 item with the intention of hunting around and trying things, I bought them to listen to music. I learned along the way, and in that time "became" an "audiophile". 

 

I'm not sure how else you can get something satisfactory unless you pay someone who does know a thing or two to come to your house and -do it for you-. Otherwise, you've got to put in the time or just plan on getting lucky🎸🎸. 

 

As for Eric, I have also dealt with him and seen similar comments in reviews about him. He doesn't provide the kind of customer experience that I like from a small business owner. 

 

Good luck 🙂

 

Yeah, exactly but it would be cheaper to have someone to come over and advise me than buying and selling all kinds of stuff all the time.  

[PhilBarone]

23 hours ago, Ben-M said:

(deleted, but I don't know how to clear the editor and remove the quote...)

 

To the OP, I'm not sure how many of us started out as wanting to be audiophiles, but I certainly didn't. I wanted good sound for a reasonable price. I learned more about what I considered to be "good sound" by trying things. I didn't want that, I never bought 1 item with the intention of hunting around and trying things, I bought them to listen to music. I learned along the way, and in that time "became" an "audiophile". 

 

I'm not sure how else you can get something satisfactory unless you pay someone who does know a thing or two to come to your house and -do it for you-. Otherwise, you've got to put in the time or just plan on getting lucky🎸🎸. 

 

As for Eric, I have also dealt with him and seen similar comments in reviews about him. He doesn't provide the kind of customer experience that I like from a small business owner. 

 

Good luck 🙂

I just bought some Proac Response III's.  

[PhilBarone]

16 minutes ago, UNICRON-WMD said:

Wow, not a lot of speaker for the money.

 

Maybe look at used around you and audition them in their setup.

I bought a completely rebuilt pair for 3200.  

[PhilBarone]

1 hour ago, Kal Rubinson said:

How did you make that choice?

I have a friend that managed a high-end audio store.  He's living vicariously through me.  

[PhilBarone]

9 hours ago, mevdinc said:

Speaker and amp matching is a very difficult problem and people with money and time do a lot of experimenting, as this is part of the fun if one can afford it.
I am not an audiophile either but I do love listening to music and I can tell what sound I like when I hear it.

After several different passive speakers I decided to go for an active speaker system and bought my ATC SCM 20A Pros way back in 1998. Never looked back since and I just upgraded my ATC actives to bigger models over time. 

I simply concentrate on enjoying listening to music by getting a decent source and discover new music via many streaming services available.
The actual room and positioning also play an important role in achieving satisfactory results.
Just try and listen to different speakers/systems and decide which satisfies you the most.  There are many modern DSP aided active speakers that work better in difficult rooms.

Good luck.

Thank you,  wasn’t anticipating getting this heavy into it, just wanted something great especially since my time is limited.

 

 I think I’m going to be happy with the Proacs and from what I understand I might have to add a sub  but that’s okay.  
 

I’m beginning to think that I listened to the advertising and people reviewing the Tektons and it could be like a McDonalds vs. something more refined not that I didn’t live to eat McDonalds but it will mess you up but of course the masses go for it but I never went in the same direction as the pack, no way.  
 

Thank you, thanks everyone for your help.  I guess I have my work cut out for me   Phil

 

[PhilBarone]

56 minutes ago, chiricano said:

Can't speak for the double impacts but have a set of Lores and they punch way above their price point . I have owned and listened to many different Klipsch speakers and own 3k$ monitors listed on the "speakers to lust for" page  ,  Lores beat them in almost all manners , deliver life like  energy and texture with zero fatigue. Lores get close to 30hz as well .  

I think the DI's are rated higher than the Lores, no?  Anyway, I might have been doing something wrong, perhaps my amp which is a PrimaLuna tube amp but I couldn't see moving a 118 pound speaker around my room in an effort to find the right spot and I have limited space plus a bunch of people sent me photos of where they placed their Tektons and they were very far from the back wall and some people told me that it took them months to find the best location for them.  The heck with that.

 

When I inquired about one of their amps, the people at Pass labs told me that the Tektons and the Klipsch I also own would do better with one of their amps and the Proacs I just bought would do better with the PrimaLuna and they seem real honest.  

 

In their present location, where the Tektons were placed, the Klipsch are much nicer, more detailed, more bass and have a full sound but aren't fantastic for classical music and good for some jazz but still don't blow me away.  Thus the Proacs I'm waiting on delivery for.  

 

The Tektons are sold thank god since they weren't a pleasant experience for whatever reason.  Every time I turned them on I told my wife I hated them but I'm happy that you're happy with yours.  Phil

[PhilBarone]

On 6/12/2021 at 11:07 PM, chiricano said:

Lores are less expensive , rated lower is subjective    and in fact lores receive excellent reviews .I haven't listened to any speaker more lifelike yet non fatiguing   . For tube it seems larger drivers , full range paper drivers seem to deliver better than di type design  imho. They render texture and realism better which is logical because live performance drivers are almost exclusively paper and Lore woofers are very good pro bass drivers that are driven their full range to about 4khz.with an audax gold tweeter that has been used in some high end Wilson models.   It's all subjective anyways . Best of luck ! 

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