Racerxnet Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 15 hours ago, fas42 said: SpaceX ... you know, this ridiculous mob who think they can get to Mars in a couple of years 😀 - nothing like having a bunch of well paid experts from, say, NASA telling someone that what they want to do can't be done 15 hours ago, fas42 said: anything else is bound to be breaking at least half a dozen Laws of Physics - as all the best objectivists know, Yes, The scientists devoloped, tested, and executed the rockets on subjective laws of physics. NOT. Teresa 1 Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 4 hours ago, Racerxnet said: Yes, The scientists devoloped, tested, and executed the rockets on subjective laws of physics. NOT. The laws of physics don't dictate how the human mind can subjectively interpret the data it receives - a convincing illusion relies on the brain "deceiving itself"; and doing it in such a manner that even conscious, rational awareness that a trick is being played on it, doesn't make the illusion go away ... again, because this happens but rarely in the auditory world, it's easy for people to pooh-pooh that it can happen; but there are a vast array of visual tricks, found in plenty of textbooks, etc, that demonstrate how us humans interpret what we sense, when the data is of the right order. I was very fortunate that the the setup I had 30 years ago was so precisely on the edge, that it could slip between a convincing illusion, and just normal stereo presentation, at will. I could repeat the switching between the two states as often as I liked; which meant I had plenty of time to investigate how it manifested - a very key difference was the level of visibility of the speakers; with the illusion in place, my brain refused to acknowledge that the speaker driver mere inches away from my face, with eyes open, was the source of any sound; when the illusion collapsed, I could pick where a speaker was, with my eyes closed, on the other side of the room ... there was a dramatic change in how my mind dealt with the data coming in. Getting good hifi is about exploiting this - knowing that this is possible makes it much easier to evolve a rig in the right direction ... @ray-dude is doing precisely this, and so reaps the rewards of making good moves ... Teresa 1 Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 26 minutes ago, fas42 said: The laws of physics don't dictate how the human mind can subjectively interpret the data it receives - a convincing illusion relies on the brain "deceiving itself"; and doing it in such a manner that even conscious, rational awareness that a trick is being played on it, doesn't make the illusion go away ... again, because this happens but rarely in the auditory world, it's easy for people to pooh-pooh that it can happen; but there are a vast array of visual tricks, found in plenty of textbooks, etc, that demonstrate how us humans interpret what we sense, when the data is of the right order. I was very fortunate that the the setup I had 30 years ago was so precisely on the edge, that it could slip between a convincing illusion, and just normal stereo presentation, at will. I could repeat the switching between the two states as often as I liked; which meant I had plenty of time to investigate how it manifested - a very key difference was the level of visibility of the speakers; with the illusion in place, my brain refused to acknowledge that the speaker driver mere inches away from my face, with eyes open, was the source of any sound; when the illusion collapsed, I could pick where a speaker was, with my eyes closed, on the other side of the room ... there was a dramatic change in how my mind dealt with the data coming in. Getting good hifi is about exploiting this - knowing that this is possible makes it much easier to evolve a rig in the right direction ... @ray-dude is doing precisely this, and so reaps the rewards of making good moves ... Ooh You can dance You can jive Having the time of your life Ooh, see that girl Watch that scene Digging the dancing queen Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Well, it's easy to tell who has never experienced convincing audio replay ... 😁. Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 1 minute ago, fas42 said: Well, it's easy to tell who has never experienced convincing audio replay ... 😁. Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Must be nice to live in a universe where you know you're always right ... 🙂. Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Just now, fas42 said: It's nice to live in a universe where I know I'm always right ... 😃. Rexp 1 Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Science and engineering have a long, long history of those at the top of the current order dictating what is possible, and what is impossible ... which is why I mentioned SpaceX. NASA being the big boys in the game declared that certain technical approaches "were impossible!" - and Elon did the finger sign at them ... and mankind moves on ... 😉. Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 18 minutes ago, fas42 said: Science and engineering have a long, long history of those at the top of the current order dictating what is possible, and what is impossible ... which is why I mentioned SpaceX. NASA being the big boys in the game declared that certain technical approaches "were impossible!" - and Elon did the finger sign at them ... and mankind moves on ... 😉. Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 3 minutes ago, kumakuma said: Right ... so all breakthroughs in current thinking, that progress understanding - can be undone by pointing by a single instance pf possibly wacky experimental research ... is that what we're saying, hmm? Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 2 minutes ago, fas42 said: Right ... so all breakthroughs in current thinking, that progress understanding - can be undone by pointing by a single instance pf possibly wacky experimental research ... is that what we're saying, hmm? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Since we're pointing here, even cold fusion has "survived" - there is something going on here, but it's hard for research to nail precisely what ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_fusion It's far more interesting to climb down from the balcony where the gang are having great fun hurling rotten tomatoes at the stage - enjoying the vibe of being "part of the gang"; the crowd energy thing ... and looking closer at what might actually be happening, in what the chap is demonstrating - ignore what he says is occurring, and consider what it might be telling you about how the world can work... Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Teresa 1 Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Actually, there is no such thing as, "right" ... what one does is expand one's understanding of what is possible, add more tools to one's armoury in aid of explaining what one comes across - no-one is "right" in their explanation for how the cosmos out there 'works' - they all agree that their understanding is still poor - yet it exists, and couldn't care less about any human conceit, of some individual thinking they know more than someone else knows ... Teresa 1 Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 13 minutes ago, fas42 said: Actually, there is no such thing as, "right" Actually, there is... Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Ah, you're talking history - not, "rightness" ... archival footage, and text - which can be doctored of course; these days it's easier and easier to "fake it" - and plenty of regimes have used such approaches, right up to current times. Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, fas42 said: Ah, you're talking history - not, "rightness" ... archival footage, and text - which can be doctored of course; these days it's easier and easier to "fake it" - and plenty of regimes have used such approaches, right up to current times. Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Ah, you live in that very strange country - where it's a national passion to disbelieve things; sort of a hobby, it appears 🤪 ... name just about any part of the human story, and there will be a pack of people who have fun "proving otherwise" ... 😉. Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 45 minutes ago, fas42 said: Ah, you live in that very strange country - where it's a national passion to disbelieve things; sort of a hobby, it appears 🤪 ... name just about any part of the human story, and there will be a pack of people who have fun "proving otherwise" ... 😉. I don't live there but it sounds like you'd fit right in... 57 minutes ago, fas42 said: Ah, you're talking history - not, "rightness" ... archival footage, and text - which can be doctored of course; these days it's easier and easier to "fake it" - and plenty of regimes have used such approaches, right up to current times. Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 19 minutes ago, kumakuma said: I don't live there but it sounds like you'd fit right in... Ah, born and bred in a very, very cold place - got it! And since biases have been mentioned, I think I'm dealing with a solid example of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 17 minutes ago, fas42 said: And since biases have been mentioned, I think I'm dealing with a solid example of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias Nothing to be embarrassed about, Frank. It's just how the mind operates. Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Okay, enough fun for the day ... Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 2 hours ago, fas42 said: Ah, you live in that very strange country - where it's a national passion to disbelieve things; sort of a hobby, it appears 🤪 ... name just about any part of the human story, and there will be a pack of people who have fun "proving otherwise" ... 😉. My apologies ... you (used to) live next door; where quirkiness is part of the package, 🙂. Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 On 1/19/2021 at 9:23 PM, fas42 said: Phase, eh ... ? Let's see, then - I'll pull the audio down, and see what I find inside ... 😉. OK, got around to this ... chopped out two chunks of the Passive and Active versions, joined them up so one track just Active, the other only Passive - and manually aligned and gain adjusted. Enormous differences in the waveforms - so used DeltaWave to find out more. The spectrums are so massively different from each other, I wouldn't know where to start ... 😀 - an area which is about the worst; Blue is the Active configuration, White is the Passive: Link to comment
Confused Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 11 hours ago, fas42 said: Science and engineering have a long, long history of those at the top of the current order dictating what is possible, and what is impossible ... which is why I mentioned SpaceX. NASA being the big boys in the game declared that certain technical approaches "were impossible!" - and Elon did the finger sign at them ... and mankind moves on ... 😉. That is actually quite interesting. Which technical approachs did Nasa state "were impossible"? I too am interested in the adventures of SpaceX, but the only technical disputes I can recall relate to hard it would be to terraform Mars, which is obviously purely theoretical at the moment. Windows 11 PC, Roon, HQPlayer, Focus Fidelity convolutions, iFi Zen Stream, Paul Hynes SR4, Mutec REF10, Mutec MC3+USB, Devialet 1000Pro, KEF Blade. Plus Pro-Ject Signature 12 TT for playing my 'legacy' vinyl collection. Desktop system; RME ADI-2 DAC fs, Meze Empyrean headphones. Link to comment
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