DIY DC power cables

[Cornan]

1 hour ago, sandyk said:

 

It seems to me, that if your DC supply leads were fairly long, that it might be a good idea to take this further and use an additional wire along with a Kelvin Sensor as John Swenson has provided as an option for his JS2 PSU .

This would of course necessitate a special kind of PSU.Some Voltage Regulators do however  permit the use of Kelvin Sensing.

 

 Does this seem worthwhile to you John or Alex C ?

 Perhaps an idea for a future Uptone general purpose PSU ?

 

I have external (boxed) shunt regulators with starquad Kelvin cables and Kelvin plugs on order that I will try post my ISO Regen and Aqvox switch in a couple of months or so. I will compare it to my LT3045s in series that I use on these spots as soon as I have received them. ?

So far ATLs shunt regulators are only suitable for roughly <480mA, but he's working on a <1.5A shunt regulator as well.

[Cornan]

1 hour ago, BigGuy said:

Just read contents of this thread which seems to have ended...

 

http://jplay.eu/forum/index.php?/topic/1128-can-the-guys-whove-used-emirfi-paper-sotm-3m-etc-post-photos-here-of-how-you-did-it/page-4

 

What does anyone think about putting an "air spacer", cotton sleeve or polyethylene foam tube <http://www.thefoamfactory.com/closedcellfoam/polyethylene.html>

(scroll down to near bottom) around the DC, USB, etc., cable before shielding? 

The tube might need to be split to avoid issues with terminations.  Certainly prices are reasonable.

 

Not sure where anyone is buying braid but did locate on Amazon...

 

https://www.amazon.com/Tubular-Copper-Bright-Diameter-Length/dp/B003R501TA/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1513612475&sr=8-1&keywords=tubular+copper+braid

 

Not sure whether tin plated is "better" than copper but I prefer the latter aesthetically and it is pretty easy to create a solder pad for attaching the ground wire...just put something that does not melt or burn inside the braid tube.

 

Not sure why you want to add a polyethylene foam tube before (inside) the shielding? IMO if you want to add a shock absorber you probably want it after (around) the shielding. I would have the JSSG as close to the wires as possible for best results. Remember that JSSG acts like a Faraday cage for cables. You want to keep all the electromagnetic fields close to and inside the JSSG. Adding too much space inbetween might give it an escape route through the air spacer. I think you want to avoid it as much as possible. My two cents ofcourse.

 

My Ghent DC cables have copper braid and my ATL have tinned braid. I have'nt detected any difference, but copper braid looks nicer! ? With that said silver plated braid sounds noticable better on coaxial cables IME. Not sure if it will matter much on JSSG though.

[Cornan]

53 minutes ago, charlesphoto said:

Bummed I just got a new dc cable from Ghent for between the rendu and LPS-1and didn’t know about the JSSG option. Got it on the ethernet cable and using the USPCB so all good there. Oh well.... 

 

Is there a post that has good instructions and/or pictures on building a dc cable with JSSG?

 

Best,

 

Charles

 

 

You have to special order the Ghent DC cables with JSSG. My versions with banana plugs in one end looks like this.

 

 

The JSSG is really just a braid with a insulated drain wire soldered to each end of the braid. You can add it on top of the DC cables as well as I beleive @lmitche have done it.

[Cornan]

30 minutes ago, fayerichard said:

Sorry, I did not catch that.

 

What is JSSG?

 

How can we apply it to our dc cables?

 

Here is a post on this thread by @R1200CL about JSSG that shows how it is constructed.

 

 

[Cornan]

1 hour ago, BigGuy said:

Based on post by JohnS indicating that in the case of DC (as well as ethernet & usb), the grounded shield is to keep crap in rather than letting it radiate, it does make sense that the shield should be as close as possible to the cable/conductors.

 

I have seen the use of teflon tubes, foamed polyethylene tubes, or cotton sleeves mentioned in other cable DIY threads.  Where would the use of these dielectrics be best used...interconnects?  other?

 

Secondly, I have some "aircraft grade" 26(?)ga 2-conductor, teflon coated, silver-plated copper wire which has a braided shield and teflon jacket.

I was thinking I could DIY a quasi-quad-core DC cable by taking 2 lengths, twisting them together,  and then using 1 conductor from each as the plus and the other 2 as minus.  I could connect an insulated wire to each end of the existing shields (x2)...OR just add a JSSG to the outside of the bundle.

Thoughts?

 

I would say that telefon tubes are great, if not one of the best wire insulation materials around. Works great IME. 

 

Not sure what a quasi-quad-core DC cable is, but it sound like starquad with dual braids. Here is a picture of my 8 conductor USB cable with dual shields JSSG style which sounds truly great.

 

 

It makes sense to use dual shields when you want to separate data+ & Data- from GND & 5v, but doing the same thing with a single DC cable does'nt sound like a good idea to me. You want to run the positive and negative wires from the same source together in a starquad configuration. If you have two DC cables running side by side a dual shield JSSG would make more sense, since you want to avoid coupling/interfearences between the two sources.

[Cornan]

50 minutes ago, BigGuy said:

Using Teflon tubes as a dielectric for DIY is good but getting wire centered within a (presumably) oversized tube to optimize the air (dielectric) distribution around the wire would definitely be a challenge.   I am pretty sure that is why foamed polyethylene tubes are a suggested alternative.

 

Usually you want to use solid wires for Teflon tubes since it is much easier. Otherwise there are ready made wires with thin teflon sleeves that is quite easy to find on eBay. Polyethylene tubes might be a good insulator as well.

 

50 minutes ago, BigGuy said:

Would I be correct in assuming that use of a dielectric around the + and - conductors is best suited for interconnects?

 

Yes!

 

50 minutes ago, BigGuy said:

What I am suggesting for my "quasi-star-quad" construction would be having 2 parallel runs of my twisted conductor wire and then joining the 2 "black" conductors for + at each end and then doing the same with the 2 "white" conductors for the -.  Then I would use a single JSSG around the whole assembly.

 

This sounds more like a proper starquad with JSSG. It is basically two twisted pair cables. In a starquad all wires are twisted in the same direction.

Here you can see how a starquad is made. Note that the wires are U-shaped when twisted and cut in two pcs afterwards.

 

 

50 minutes ago, BigGuy said:

 

Or, I could buy some star quad wire and use one quad for the D+ and D- and the other quad for 5V and GND like in your cable as pictured.

 

Yes, if you want to make your own USB cables it will work, but only if you can find USB plugs that fits. USB A male screw terminal plug fits thick wires, but you'll run into problems finding USB B male screw terminal plugs. Soldering even 8 pcs 22awg wires to a USB plugs requires a very steady hand! ? 

 

50 minutes ago, BigGuy said:

 

I was just trying to get close to a star quad using wire that I already have.

 

I think you would be best off butchering the cables by removing the inner wires, twist them in a U-shape in the same direction, add a JSSG and a braid sleeve on top. 

[Cornan]

6 hours ago, BigGuy said:

Thanks for the pic, Cornan.

 

There may be more than one version, but when I look up star quad, I find pics that look like this...

 

If you change the yellow to black and the red to blue, same colored conductors are not adjacent to each other as in your pic.   The twisted bundle would look like this...

 

 

 

Yes, with my example you will connect red/red & black/black together. Look inside the JSSG where you can see that the wires run black/red/black/red. I just showed it because I know it could look very complicated on most pictures online. It is really quite simple if you want to DIY. Just mind to use the right wires for positive and negative. 

[Cornan]

5 hours ago, Ralf11 said:

is something wrong with the Ghent cables?

 

Nothing wrong with Ghent. He makes great starquad cables with ready made cables from well-known cable manufacturers like Canare and Belden.

[Cornan]

1 hour ago, fayerichard said:

So, I would like to make my dc cable by using Audioquest NRG1.5. It is 4 x 19awg, which is 16awg total. It is also pure copper in a starquad design. I will remove the power plugs. Then I will try to install Oyaide DC2.1/2.5 plugs on both ends.

 

However, as you can see the NRG1.5 cable already has braided sleeves. How do I still install JSSG wire in this situation? Where should I buy it and what material should I use? Can I also use carbon fibre sleeve?

 

The shield of Audioquest NRG1.5 should not be connected to the plugs, so you'll need it to be floating. You can probably add a thin roughly 22awg insulated wire on the outside of the cable, strip the ends and solder it to each end of the shield braid. Now this will work, but I doubt it will be as good as if the thin wire is in close contact with the shield braid. 

[Cornan]

38 minutes ago, sandyk said:

 

Has anyone bothered to do the job properly and encase it all in heat shrink ?

They may work well, but they sure are home made looking !

 

Why would a heat shrink be more proper than a braided sleeve? Remember that most of the cables I have posted pictures off are while under construction. Not the end-result. The Ghent is pictures of the end result though. Do you really think it looks home made?

 

 

[Cornan]

Here is pictures of the end result of the two other cables.

 

 

[Cornan]

2 hours ago, fayerichard said:

Pictures?

 

Sorry, here they are 

The 8 conductor USB cable with JSSG and the DC cable which was shown earlier as a work in progress.

 

[Cornan]

25 minutes ago, fayerichard said:

OK, but where are the pictures?

 

Ghent's jssg's look really nice.

 

I only care about result, but if it looks good then that would be great.

 

How much are the DC jssg's?

 

20% more?

 

Here is how much Ghent quoted me in September when I place my order on the JSSG:

 

• 1pc 20cm 4mm banana plugs to DC2.1/5.5mm, $32/pc;

• 1pc 50cm 4mm banana plugs to DC2.5/5.5mm, $34/pc;
• 1pc 50cm 4mm banana plugs to DC2.1/5.5mm, $34/pc;

[Cornan]

1 hour ago, fayerichard said:

Sorry for my question, but the braided jssg wire should not be attached to the Oyaide dc plug.

 

Where exactly should it be soldered?

 

What is meant by shield?

 

"SO in an existing shielded starquad cable connect the four wires in the starquad geometry to the power plug, do NOT connect the shield to the plugs at all, and connect a separate wire to one end of the shield and the other end of the wire to the other end of the shield."

 

Maybe I should sketch this?

 

The nrg10 already has the braided sleeve, so I could just solder it directly onto the sleeve, or do I need to add another copper layer braided sleeve onto the existing sleeve to solder it on both ends? I guess this is meant by the shield right?

 

This is a shield braid tube...

 

 

...and here is how to make a JSSG.

 

 

The JSSG must not come in contact with any metal parts of the Oyiade plugs. It must be completely floating with just a insulated drain wire soldered at each end of the shield braid tube (making a loop) as shown on the picture.

 

[Cornan]

11 minutes ago, fayerichard said:

Good stuff!

 

So this has to be attached and then soldered directly onto the Audioquest NRG-10 sleeve?

 

See the picture pointing at the space.

 

Also, I need to buy the above shield braid tube, to layer it on top of the existing sleeve first?

 

Then solder the copper wire to THAT braided sleeve.

 

How to attach the braided sleeve to the existing sleeve so that it floats actually?

 

Yes, you fit the JSSG on top of that Audioquest cable. The shield braid is usually quite flexible and can fit even over Oyiade plugs (but best to put it on before the DC plugs though). It will flex/squeeze back into position. As long as the shield braid is not touching any metal parts on the plug it is floating. Secure it with electrical tape or shrink wrap on each end so it doesn't slide on the cable and come in contact with the plugs. The more of the cable that is covered with JSSG the better. Just make sure to choose a good size braid and to solder a roughly 24awg wire to each end of the shield braid before you put it on.

[Cornan]

46 minutes ago, charlesphoto said:

My question is, just how much difference on a 12 inch cable will a JSSG make? 

 

Difficult to say on only one spot. What I can say is that the more JSSG I add the better it sounds. All my DC cables are 50cm.

[Cornan]

29 minutes ago, fayerichard said:

Good, thanks!

 

What does jssg actually stand for?

 

Does the quality of the jssg wire matter? What about the insulation?

 

I was thinking of Neotech upocc 24awg with Teflon insulation, which sells for 3 pounds per meter.

 

JSSG= John Swenson Shield Ground

I think it was @R1200CL that named it.

 

As I said in an earlier post I havent noticed a difference between copper and tin plated shield braid. I havent tried various other qualities though.

No need to worry anout insulation with JSSG drain wire, but if you want good insulation go for teflon like the Neotech..

[Cornan]

40 minutes ago, lmitche said:

Cornan, over here tinned plated braid is short for tinned plated copper braid. As such, I would not expect to hear a difference. Tinned plate is likely to prevent corrosion. I like the color better as well.

 

My system has absorbed 30 to forty feet of this stuff.  Sound quality is at a new high, much more relaxed and natural, but with a concrete-like image.

 

Thanks, that probably explains why it does'nt sound different. I however very much like the looks of copper braid. The Ghents really looks fabulous IRL. Almost like it glows from within. 

Have you tried the JSSG on ac mains cord yet? All my other cables (DC, Ethernet & USB) have JSSG. Only ac mains cords missing the party (99% starquad ac mains cables though), so I am really curious how it turns out! ? 

I have the very same impressions with JSSG. A great addition that gets even better the more JSSG you add to the chain.

[Cornan]

41 minutes ago, JohnSwenson said:

John Swenson Shielding Guidelines

 

4 hours ago, Cornan said:

JSSG= John Swenson Shield Ground

 

Close enough then! ? A really great guideline. Thanks a million for sharing it! ?

[Cornan]

2 hours ago, Superdad said:

 

Yes, and the R1200CL took it to Ghent Audio in China, who commercialized it--even using John's initials--without ever asking permission or offering some small royalty.

Before he generously shared his shielding therory and technique as it applies to cables in audio systems, we discussed keeping it private for a cable line or sharing it for DIYers.  I'm not keen on being in the cable business (was in the past; might be again in the future), so was fine with his desire to just put it out there.  

But I admit to some chagrin regarding his idea--and his name--being used without permission for profit by an overseas firm.  Live and learn I guess...

 

Yeah, live and learn. I do think that you could sell your own cables like hot cakes if start making them. I would surely order a bunch. Not to say the vast amount of good will you've already got by both JSSG and JSGT. You and John have both changed my audio life for the better. I am truly grateful for that and will stand in line when your next products will be released! ?

[Cornan]

9 hours ago, charlesphoto said:

 

And oh, the best size copper braid for a 4S11 Star Quad?

 

You´ll need to measure the diameter of Canare 4S11 and choose a shield braid that is roughly the same size (not much smaller though). Remember that the braid gets bigger when you push the braid and smaller if you pull it. 

[Cornan]

3 hours ago, fayerichard said:

 

Any input on the awg of the draining wire for JSSG?

 

24awg is very thin, would 16, 20 or 22 awg make any difference at all?

 

Probably not a noticable difference between 16-24awg drain wire.

[Cornan]

5 hours ago, fayerichard said:

Can you recommend a few - this is the first time I've seen it.

 

I can recommend Gophert csp-3205II (floating SMPS) that I own five of https://www.google.se/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjT89CM05rYAhXiQpoKHSX7DScQFgg9MAE&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.banggood.com%2FGOPHERT-CPS-3205-0-32V-0-5A-Portable-Adjustable-DC-Power-Supply-110V220V-p-934530.html&usg=AOvVaw19-xuR4wRRSKG32HpwyR4B

 

For my router I use Voltcraft FPS-1134 (floating LPS), but it seems to be discontinued now https://www.conrad.com/ce/en/product/1196063/Bench-PSU-fixed-voltage-VOLTCRAFT-FPS-1134-11-14-Vdc-4-6-A-56-W-No-of-outputs-1-x;jsessionid=989973CE130FDF92AE38186951C46106.ASTPCEN27

 

Add LT-3045 in series on the DC cables and use JSGT if used on network devices.

[Cornan]

8 hours ago, sandyk said:

I am also referring here to those who use an additional couple of series low noise regulators in  line with the power leads,without also perhaps considering the use of something like a diecast aluminium case to house them.

 

Here is how I enclose my LT3045s in series. With Entreq mini wraps containing copper flakes and tourmaline stones (plus other minerals)!  

I guess a JGGS would work as well.

 

[Cornan]

1 minute ago, fayerichard said:

Or are experiences with ferrite noise stoppers not all that positive?

 

Not at all! Many people here on CA use a lot of them on USB cables for example. I am not intirely sure it will have any affect on starquad DC cables though. On the other hand I cannot see any reasons not to use it either. I'll say go for it with option 1! Merry Christmas! ?