A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

[sandyk]

1 hour ago, feelingears said:

Thank you @austinpop! I would say this has been my experience, as I alluded to in my side comments about the Audio Alchemy DDP-1. I've found power cable and other power related "tweaks" to be essential to tuning my system, especially on the low end. Anyway, excited to see where we go from here. 

 

 Like the both of you, I have found that a far better than average power supply greatly benefits a Xtal Oscillator.

 In fact, a much better than average PSU may also benefit HF detail with Digital Audio, as well as Digital Video (!!!), even when HD .mpeg4 is recorded uncompressed to USB memory using a STB.

( I use a dedicated +5V low noise PSU to power the USB memory stick instead of SMPS derived +5V from the STB.)

This possible improvement also applies to the .ts streams sometimes found on the Internet for SNL etc. with it's special guest musical artists.

 

Yes, I know, it isn't supposed to be possible.  

 

 P.S.

 Low frequency material like Drums can often have VERY sharp Rise and Fall times, so low end may often have more impact if these fast rise and fall times are preserved.

 In other words, the HF area !

 

Click on the image for a larger image.

[sandyk]

11 minutes ago, Siltech817 said:

This poorly veiled insult is a common theme from you, we've all seen it posted in a number of different threads

 

It's not even an original insult. He copied this from Ralf11 !

[sandyk]

4 hours ago, seeteeyou said:

 

1A for Samsung 850 EVO

 

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/91gOObm6rFL.jpg

 

0.5A for another one from China

 

I am successfully powering both a Samsung 840 and 850 from the attached, which regulates the internal +12V down to a squeaky clean isolated +5V output for both SSDs.

Don't forget that the currents mentioned are not continuous currents.

[sandyk]

20 minutes ago, LTG2010 said:

The power supply is a critical component in any audio application, in a digital circuit a poorly designed one will introduce phase and timing errors in particular where high amount of ripple occur. The components in the regulator circuit are a critical ponit as is the reduction of emi and rfi.

 

 I agree completely.

 

What is a point ?

I find it interesting that after all these years, that the Software "Experts" STILL can't prevent typed letters from getting out of sequence. This weird phenomena can be seen in  millions of posts throughout the Internet, and I am sure that in the vast majority of cases , that they were NOT caused by the person typing them.

Damn software corrected my replication of the word that I highlighted at the time of posting.

 

"PONIT"

[sandyk]

26 minutes ago, RickyV said:

Reducing RFI/EMI with John Swenson's so called JSSG tweak has been profound. I have even used it on a simple coaxial spdif cable between a friend's Esoteric audio CD transport and Enlightened Audio DAC.

 Hi Larry

 

 How long was the Coax SPDIF ?

 Did you take a photo of your modified version ?

 

 Kind Regards

Alex

[sandyk]

Hi Larry

 Thanks for the info. I don't think that I will try that with my Coax SPDIF lead though, as I have fitted proper 75 ohm BNC  connectors to mine, which would make it a bit awkward to do.

 

Kind Regards

Alex

[sandyk]

18 minutes ago, lmitche said:

Alex,

 

I'd suggest that you reconsider.  You are really going to enjoy this tweak.  The tinned copper sleeving is just like a Chinese finger trap so it can be compressed and slides easily over an existing cable even with connectors with a larger diameter then the cable itself.  Once on the cable, it stretches out to the desired length.  Just avoid having it connected to the bnc connectors by adding a layer of insulation with shrink wrap or electrical tape under the sleeving.

 

It really not awkward at all, especially given your DIY skills.

 

Larry

 Hi Larry

 This time of year is hopeless for obtaining needed stuff from ebay, and I don't particularly want another 240KM round trip to Sydney to get stuff quickly , now that I don't need to go down there again until I am needed for transport duties when school resumes again.  Actually, I just realised that I have run out of some needed 1% resistor values to complete a project, but it looks like it will now have to wait until the new year.

Items like tinned copper sleeving that I used to use extensively (from Telstra damaged coax cables etc.)  aren't readily available here either.  It made great earthing braids in PSUs etc. when flattened, as well as being ideal for bonding car engine areas to reduce radio interference.

 

Kind Regards

Alex

[sandyk]

1 hour ago, TJHUB said:

It’s too early to claim awesomeness here, it’ll take me the rest of the week to really know, but so far this is just amazing for me.  I left spinning HDDs behind many years ago.  I find it strange that I’m back to one, only to find what I was missing.  I think my Samsung SSD is going in the garbage...(not literally, as it will find its way into a laptop).

 

You would have more than likely got the same improvement if you used the SSD the same way, which means no interaction with the internal PSU. In fact, if you markedly improve the power to an internal SSD you can obtain similar results.

It's actually easier to improve the power supply to an internal SSD than an internal HDD, because they don't draw so much current.They don't use the +12V supply either, unless you use this to regulate the power for the SSD down to the required +5V

as I am doing.

[sandyk]

29 minutes ago, TJHUB said:

 

Sorry if I wasn’t clear, but the SSD was powered the same exact way.  I was trying to convey that the ONLY change was from SSD to HDD.

 That suggests that the power supply used was not able to fully clean the power to the SSD where the current demand spikes are much more abrupt. The HDPlex PSUs are not very low noise, and I have made JLH PSU add-on PCBs for a couple of local members to further improve the power from their HDPlex to obtain the best from their SSDs. 

Incidentally, there have been quite a few problems with the HDPlex, where the 5V rail has failed with the voltage regulator going short circuit , applying +19V to the load ! Such a failure destroyed a friend's expensive USB card as well.

This can also happen if you set the adjustable voltage rail close to +5V with a reasonable load. Later models,( and repaired modules) have voltage and current overload installed/retro-fitted..

[sandyk]

4 hours ago, TJHUB said:

I did try the famous LT3045’s without success on my SSD, so I’m not certain what you stated is exactly the case here.  I have not tried the LT3045 on the spinner, but I might.  I didn’t like anything I got from my LT3045’s boards, so I should just sell them.  

 

TJHUB and sig8

 The LT3045 PCBs have been discussed in detail in the Uptone area of the forum.

Unless the amount of capacitance at their input is markedly increased using normal type electrolytic capacitors in parallel, they are likely to sound too detailed and perhaps a bit harsh sounding.

If they were used in a normal PSU which has a large value Filter Capacitor after the rectifier diodes they should sound far more tonally balanced with an improved low end .

 Don't forget too, that some SSDs , especially the much faster types require a great deal more current than others such as the Samsung Evo  840 and 850. Did the SSD work using the LT3045 , or did it just not sound tonally balanced ?

Obviously,  results will differ from System to System.

[sandyk]

12 minutes ago, hieukm said:

I am a bit thick here but might i ask how you power an external SSD with an LPS?

 

You would normally put it in an external enclosure, perhaps having inputs for USB and eSata etc. with a supplied SMPS wallwart which could be replaced by a suitable Linear PSU.

The post you are referring to is a bit short on detail for a proper understanding of how this was done.

[sandyk]

4 hours ago, hieukm said:

I got the external enclosure part but i thought the only connection is USB or SATA. The external enclosure dont require power input? 

 

 Looks like I am a bit out of date.

The last one I used was similar in function to the one at the link, but instead of a mini DC jack they used either a 4 or 6 pin  DIN socket for  plugging in a supplied +12V 2A  and +5V 2A SMPS plugpack. It accepted either an HDD or SSD. eSata was of course much faster than USB2.0

The one below could of course use a suitable external Linear PSU.

 

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Shintaro-Hard-Drive-Docker-eSATA-USB2-0-SH23SDOCKE-/401153262245?_trksid=p2349526.m4383.l4275.c10  

 

P.S.

 USB 3.0 may be the method of choice for easy connection of an external SSD, however given the well documented USB SQ problems, with other USB widgets, better USB cables etc. needed for improved SQ, it seems highly likely that a SATA or eSata connection may give higher SQ for externally saved music on an SSD. An external linear PSU would be preferred over USB power for the same reasons. 

 See the post by YashN at :

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/24275-ac-filtering-grounding-boxes-linear-psu-and-balanced-power/?page=68

[sandyk]

38 minutes ago, mansr said:

Didn't you know placing a large book on top of the DAC alters the sound according to the genre. Matching the book to the music gives the best results.

 

Not if the E.E. who designed it used appropriate anti vibration measures, especially in the area of the PCB mounting and Xtal Oscillator , and also used suitable " feet"  underneath the unit.

 Unfortunately, the " Bean Counters"  will often dumb down a good mechanical area design to save a few $$

[sandyk]

40 minutes ago, hurka said:

Exactly.serial-higher volts,and parallel-more capacity

 

 And if you want a higher voltage rating , divide the marked capacitance of each same value Ultracap by the number of series Ultracaps used.

[sandyk]

13 hours ago, Cornan said:

17 hours ago, hurka said:

in my dac dont have regulators,just ultracaps

 

 

 What do you think is used to ensure that all the Ultracaps are used within their maximum ratings ,and also to charge the Ultracaps ?

[sandyk]

52 minutes ago, hurka said:

sorry about my English!maybe I don't understand exactly. each dac stages use 2 u cap banks,relays switch between charge or works periods.

 

Somewhere there  has to be voltage regulators used in conjunction with the Ultracaps.

The Ultracaps are just large storage devices with much higher capacitance than the usual electrolytic capacitors used after a voltage regulator. and act  more like a battery. 

Basically, in this case they charge one bank of Ultracaps while the other bank supplies the load until the need to automatically change over to the charged bank.

This helps with isolation from the A.C. mains supply.

[sandyk]

1 hour ago, Cornan said:

It needs some experimenting. You'll need to mind where possible leakage goes for each additional LT3045 you add to the chain. You do want avoid that possible leakage ends up in the DAC.

  Micael

 You keep saying this, but I think you should discuss this area with John  Swenson before making further pronouncements

as to how series LT3045 can achieve this. Why should this be any different than using say a LM317T Pre-Regulator before the LT3045 ?Remember to, that the 0 volts line is connected all the way through too, perhaps to either an SMPS PSU or a Linear PSU which MAY also have it's 0 volts earthed directly, or via transformer Primary to Secondary winding capacitance to mains earth..

A series LT3045 can't have a lower residual noise output than a single properly implemented single LT3045 either.(Ultralow RMS Noise: 0.8μVRMS (10Hz to 100kHz)

Parallel LT3045 can however have a lower noise output than a single LT3045.

As I previously explained , unless the LT3045 have additional larger value capacitors at their input, (perhaps from the Filter capacitors of the PSU supplying it) there will be  added upper HF detail. Using another one in series, unless you fit a parallel larger value electrolytic at it's input too will further likely increase apparent upper HF detail.

Perhaps your system needs a little added HF detail, or you prefer the "airier" sound and apparent increase in soundstage that this results in ?

Perhaps Mansr or John can chime in on this and correct me if necessary, or explain how this "leakage" is reduced ?

Alex

[sandyk]

10 minutes ago, jean-michel6 said:

Can you use just ultra caps after a regulator just to replace the electrolytic cap. 

Is it possible ? And is there a benefit to do that ?

 

 It's not that simple . An Ultracap will act like a short circuit to a normal voltage regulator unless additional current limiting at start up is used , as it tries to draw HUGE amounts of current initially from  the voltage regulator and it's power supply.

Even  a high powered amplifier with large value filter capacitors may momentarily dim a nearby table lamp unless it uses a "soft start"circuit.

[sandyk]

2 minutes ago, marce said:

Generally it the mechanical team that put the hardware together not those poor EE's. Again though in a domestic environment I would wonder how much internal vibration the components will face and would it have any effect... 

 Marc

 Not all Amplifier manufacturers have the backup of an in-house mechanical team.

 Place your media player (BR players etc.) on a carpet instead of in the equipment rack and play a high quality music file , and you are likely to hear a difference in sound.

 

Alex

[sandyk]

2 minutes ago, marce said:

DAC's require very stable power especially if they use a voltage reference, the more stable the voltage the better the output.

 

 The Xtal oscillator area benefits most from a highly stable low noise PSU.

Add an  aftermarket low phase noise Xtal oscillator, and it will normally also come with a small additional low noise PSU PCB.

It's often a waste of time doing this unless you also improve it's PSU. 

This area has been discussed on numerous occasions in DIY Audio etc.

Even the humble SBT , so beloved of many,   benefits markedly from using an improved PSU .

[sandyk]

8 minutes ago, flkin said:

 

Please add cables too! Don't know why but they do make a huge difference, sometimes more than the component itself 

 

 Cables can sometimes be quite thick and heavy, and unless they are supported along their length they can couple vibration into the device.

[sandyk]

34 minutes ago, hurka said:

Uspcb also modded,but dont helps a lot

Are you feeding Linear power down into the USB cable ?

If so, wouldn't you be better off feeding it in at the device end of the cable ?

 I am fortunate that I don't need +5V from the cable, so I don't connect either +5V or shield through with my DIY USB-A to USB-B adaptor.

[sandyk]

34 minutes ago, hurka said:

iso regen need independent perfect 5v usb power,sound much better

 

 So does the original USB regen, but needs more than +5V for regulation purposes when powering a USB memory stick plugged directly into the adaptor. If the USB memory stick plays from System Memory you can also use a +12V Li Ion battery derived supply.

 

[sandyk]

23 minutes ago, Johnseye said:

It sounds like the sPS-500 is the way to go until the next LPS-1 (.2) is released.  Then we'll see.  A shame the SR4 wasn't a clear winner.  Considering the hassles in wait time, risk, etc, etc...well I've said enough.

 

It's a shame that you guys aren't into DIY. You could transform an existing PSU such as an HDPlex  etc. just by adding a JLH PSU add-on after the appropriate supply rail, at a far less cost .Perhaps around $60 plus the PCB you would need to etch yourself.  Unlike an Ultracap PSU there is also the possibility of fine tuning the sound a little just by changing an electrolytic capacitor or 2 for a different type to suit the direction you wished to go.

i.e. slightly less detailed , or slightly more HF detail. 

[sandyk]

Quote

1 hour ago, tapatrick said:

20 hours ago, Johnseye said:

..considering the hassles in wait time, risk, etc, etc...well I've said enough.

 

If you mean the SR4 - that is misleading. I ordered one and it arrived in a couple of days. It’s a very high quality LPSU.  - Tapatrick

 

 

 It's always best to seek out a local distributor where possible.

However , buying from overseas works well in the vast majority of cases, and may save money, except when the device fails and you have to send it back overseas for repairs, and the weight dictates how long it will take to arrive,(air or sea)  as well as perhaps incurring substantial postage costs.

 Then you have to wait for the item to be repaired and arrive back again. This often means delays of several months without the device.