Best DSD DAC(s) - Recommendations

[firedog]

It must be the latest as the unit is nearly new (demo). Do you mean filters? I have not yet changed anything from stock.

 

Now, I pointed out that I have never heard a level 5-7 Lampizator. Maybe they are quite a bit better than L4G4 DSD.

 

But they cannot, ideally in my view, go amp direct, because their attenuator (if you get it) is a resistive device. It throws away current as you attenuate. The best attenuator is either magnetic (TVC/AVC) or a truly lossless, full-current digital unit as in the DirecStream.

 

Everyone has their opinion and taste. Everyone's room and system sounds different. Arguing over which DAC is better is a waste of everyone's time. Please state your opinion/experience once and then leave it alone.

 

PaulF - as far as volume controls, your opinion is your opinion. Not fact. In lots of systems a magnetic or digital VC may not sound as good. My DAC has both an analog and digital volume control. Even the manufacturer says, "the digital attenuator measures better, but most users prefer the sound of the analog volume control" (not a literal quote). I personally run the DAC in direct mode through a simple passive pre, b/c to me that sounds the best. Technology doesn't matter. Sound does. Some implementations of one type of VC can sound better than some implementations of a different type, and vice versa.

[matthias]

Also the pre of the L4 was nowhere like the big 7 pre. I owned the AR ref 3 and currently have a Jadis but prefer my big 7 direct

 

Do you have the Lampi volume control module built in or do you use a software volume control?

 

Matt

[bmoura]

Everyone has their opinion and taste. Everyone's room and system sounds different. Arguing over which DAC is better is a waste of everyone's time. Please state your opinion/experience once and then leave it alone.

 

Agreed. I've always felt that the most important DAC review is your own. Then it's time to listen to the music!

[ALRAINBOW]

Paul on the home screen there is a gear symbol top left. Press it . This will take you to the info screen. Bottom right says the firmware loaded. The new one is pike . Anything before that is numbers. Also you should have a 2 gig memory card . Its needed to load or change firmwares . Try others it's like tube rolling but free . They each have there own flavors . Also join the ps audio forums. Very nice bunch like here but filled with knowledge for your dac. The dac is very good but like all audio there is our own choices as to what we like . The new poke is the best for me so far .

Al

[bonzo]

Do you have the Lampi volume control module built in or do you use a software volume control?

 

Matt

 

Built in

[PaulF]

Everyone has their opinion and taste. Everyone's room and system sounds different. Arguing over which DAC is better is a waste of everyone's time. Please state your opinion/experience once and then leave it alone.

 

PaulF - as far as volume controls, your opinion is your opinion. Not fact. In lots of systems a magnetic or digital VC may not sound as good. My DAC has both an analog and digital volume control. Even the manufacturer says, "the digital attenuator measures better, but most users prefer the sound of the analog volume control" (not a literal quote). I personally run the DAC in direct mode through a simple passive pre, b/c to me that sounds the best. Technology doesn't matter. Sound does. Some implementations of one type of VC can sound better than some implementations of a different type, and vice versa.

 

What's fact is that resistive volume controls throw away current, and that that seems to be audible in a whole lotta systems.

 

I have no idea what analog & digital VCs you're comparing above (nor how the manufacturer "measured" them), but the vast majority of digital attenuators are compromised. That was part of my point.

[PaulF]

Everyone has their opinion and taste. Everyone's room and system sounds different. Arguing over which DAC is better is a waste of everyone's time. Please state your opinion/experience once and then leave it alone.

 

And whom exactly are you addressing here? I am the one who pointed that, several times, that there is a "lot of subjectivity" in this hobby and that no conclusions whatsoever can be drawn about a piece of gear outside the context of a particular system.

 

I did that when I was told (twice, I think) that if I prefer the PS Audio DAC to a Lampizator I am simply mistaken, more or less.

 

But I certainly will not waste any time in arguments regarding this hobby.

[PaulF]

It turns out that my DAC is on 1.21 - this means I hear even worse than you guys thought!

[ALRAINBOW]

No it does not sir. Some prefure 121 to pike.

Pike is a completly new diversion in the voicing of the DS dac. But it's just a little too thin so far. It's lacks the body meaning the notes do not hang enough. So a piano dings

But does not ring with overtones. But in some systems this is fine as they need the extra details. Load it play with it. Again I'll help you if need be or join there forums.

Good luck and enjoy the product.

Now regarding volume controls

This is a hot topic. In the digital domain we loose bits period how many is debated

But it does effect the sound. But using a passive pre amp fixes it. A resistor volume control seems better. I have dacs with both.

But I do have a 40K MSB dac and it has a resistance volume control. And they claim it's what we should use. Also the B7 lampi is a resister volume control.

Al

[PaulF]

No it does not sir. Some prefure 121 to pike.

Pike is a completly new diversion in the voicing of the DS dac. But it's just a little too thin so far. It's lacks the body meaning the notes do not hang enough. So a piano dings

 

Others report close to the opposite - more body, more ambience. I'm a few pages into that huge thread on the PSA forum. Anyway, I have the SD card coming and will find out soon enough what I think.

 

 

This is a hot topic. In the digital domain we loose bits period how many is debated

But it does effect the sound. But using a passive pre amp fixes it. A resistor volume control seems better. I have dacs with both.

But I do have a 40K MSB dac and it has a resistance volume control. And they claim it's what we should use. Also the B7 lampi is a resister volume control.

Al

 

The PSA digital volume control does not lose bits.

 

Yes, I am aware the Lamp VCs are resistor ladders. They throw away current. The more you attenuate the more you lose.

 

A good resistor ladder will beat many an active line stage when impedances are well-matched, but none has beaten a good autoformer-based unit in the systems I've tried.

[ALRAINBOW]

Maybe I confused my post. I mean pike is thin

And 121 is thicker. But pike has more details

It's a good thread but it does show how we all to hear different

I did a post on that there very good read too. The folks there have taut me plenty

Al

[PaulF]

I got your point. Some, early reporters at least, said Pike had "more body", verbatim. Others said "more treble" (more? as in 10 cubits vs. 8, or what?), which seems contradictory. Who knows is what I must say now, having not heard it.

 

Right now the tonal balance is about perfect for me. And it mirrors my Rega RP8 analog source very well. Thinner would be a step back. So, I'll have to see.

[ALRAINBOW]

Do try it though. Never stop for someone else's view. But it does sound like it's not for you. I am beta tester for the bridge 2 coming release. I have been hearing pike for while.

Bits a a time. The final release is the best of the bunch so far. But Paul says more is coming soon. So my hope is pike woth some more meat.

Anyway I roll tubes and thus has shown me how the same equipment can be very different.

The bridge 2 is pretty good but the new firmware just released is better over the usb then the bridge. But they are working the bugs out for it working better sound is second for now. It's funny how digital can be so altered with the firmware and tubes do the same but at great expense

[PaulF]

Now I just installed my new bridge 2 rev 2 thanks ps audio. After the install I did a reboot still on pikes . I could not beleave what I heard . This dac is now amzing. The details the timbre the total separation of everything is off the chain. When I checked the firmware screen it new says pike next to the rev. As i do not know why but don't really care these 58 year old ears are in heaven . Bless Arnie and his brain for voicing perfection for me anyway and I am a pain to please . Horns and all,the rest are now in my head . The warmth it had is gone way gone. I hear brass sizzle . I can hear into the mix of the recording. This is something only two other dacs give me.

 

Sounds like you like(d) it.

[ALRAINBOW]

Yes compared to the error firmware before

Funny to read that. And I do like it better than anyone before. But it does need some work. Read on sir. But having it sound this way is very good for me as before it lacked the details i like. Try it when u can. Also a 4 gig card works to load firmwares too. Just only out the files need to load firmware.

[PaulF]

Yes, I did read on, and see the picture is changing. This conversation is occurring in real time in multiple senses.

 

Only 8 Gb SD cards in da house here, unfortunately.

[ALRAINBOW]

Sorry for that. It's still good to know there is choices in your dac. That's ones one the reasons I still have it. I do feel they are getting closer to what I want for headphones.

I also have a pwt for it. My plan is a office desktop rig. And my hdvd 800 and hd800 setup. It's very revealing. Headphones show me more than most speakers can minus the ambience they lack.

I am a analytical detail guy. So the new pike hits higher on Te mark than any other before.

I also build servers so I use a win 2012 and audio optimizer as well making the dac as good as it can be.

[ted_b]

Yes, I did read on, and see the picture is changing. This conversation is occurring in real time in multiple senses.

 

Only 8 Gb SD cards in da house here, unfortunately.

 

What's wrong with 8GB cards. It's what I used. Both for PP and 1.2.1

[ALRAINBOW]

Hello teds in the house

Cool Paul try it man

Funny I only read about the 4 gig on ps audio

No one knows the 8 will work.

Fat 32 format still ??

[PaulF]

What's wrong with 8GB cards. It's what I used. Both for PP and 1.2.1

 

PS Audio says only 2 Gb cards work - I guess they were wrong. Anyway, I ordered cards from them (2), one with PP and one with 1.21 (in case I wanted to go back). I like PP better - by a good margin. But I can see how in systems where more treble information is a negative it could be a step back.

 

I have a Bricasti M1 in the house on dealer loan. This is one seriously amazing DAC. PP brought the PS Audio unit closer to it. In fact I'm not even confident I could name a clear favorite now. A big factor here is software also - I was making the mistake of having HQPlayer set to upsample & filter PCM - the DirectStream sounds much, much better when you let it do all the upsampling and filtering.

 

My DirectStream only has about 200 hours now so is still not fully broken in, I'm sure. The sound is still changing.

[ALRAINBOW]

According to some your not half way there yet.

Regarding up sampling I have tried it many ways but never liked it.

But I do read HQ player is the one to change that. I need to done the time to try it.

Enjoy both dacs. The one advantage for me is the firmwares . It's digital tube rolling and it's free . The pike is the fav for me too.

Al

[Le Concombre Masqué]

Are you still converting everything to dsd with hqplayer with you new dac ? I understand PS Audio DirectStream is sort of HQP already inside

So, I've had the PS Audio DirectStream since yesterday. It's been powered-up for about 32 hours and playing most of that time.

 

The sound from this DAC no matter what it is fed (redbook, 24/192 PCM, DSD64, DSD128) is unlike any digital I have heard before. And better than any digital I have had before (BTW, I have had a DSD-capable L4G4 Lampizator). That's about all I can say for now. EVERYTHING is is extremely good - everything.