Grateful Dead - the Most Overrated Band Ever?

[Priaptor]

I was never a huge Dead fan and in fact, stupidly, when I was a kid of 16-18 in 69-71 you had to swear your allegiance to either the Dead or The Allman Brothers. I was an AB junkie what can I say. 

 

I never really sit down to listen to the Dead anymore, but do find some of their music fun while driving around the mountains in MT. Now I will say this about the Dead and for those of you who aren't old enough to understand what it was like when you were at a party or concert with air filled with Dead tunes (among other things), it was much more than just the music. It literally was what we referred to as A SCENE and few bands elicited that to their audiences and listeners the way the Dead did. 

[Priaptor]

These threads kind of remind me of a thread LONG AGO when Dylan won the Nobel prize. I initially took the POV that it was ridiculous when some of you convinced me that Dylan was so much more than his music but more of a cultural icon that through his music had huge impact on a huge % of his audience. I agreed when I said "why not Dylan". 

 

The Dead as well as some of these other groups being mentioned really go beyond their music. Like Clapton, no one does them their true justice if we, in the year 2021, just evaluate them based on some of their music. I can make a strong case that The Dead (and they are NOT one of my top or even close to one of my favorites from that era) had as much if not more of an influence on the same generation as Dylan did. 

[Priaptor]

20 hours ago, sphinxsix said:

 

 

Ok, I can understand that, I happened to witness such phenomena here in Europe where GD has never been as popular as in the US, I guess. Never been a part of such let's say 'fan club' though, BTW never been a member of a proper fan club as well.

 

 

Do you really think so.? Do you also think that the artistic value of their lyrics can be compared in any way with Dylan's.?

 

 

I didn't mean 'cult' in religious sense, I meant it in a sense in which 'cult' can be called 'Pulp Fiction' or Martens shoes. IMO they are absolutely cult band - huge, devoted following, some legend or myth surrounding the band etc..

 

 

 !

 

No by no means am I comparing their "artistic value" to Dylan. What I am comparing is their effect on the masses and their followers; their historical contribution. Again, I don't know how old you are or how old most of the people responding to the this post are but few had the amazing influence on our young/revolutionary population in the 60s and 70s as The Dead did. Trust me, I am not a huge fan and not trying to prop them up, however, anyone living in America during those times need give them their just due in the history of the era. 

 

While I didn't live on the west coast, I did see them many times before, during and after college and it was truly an experience no group, no musician could elicit from their audience. I was fortunate enough to see just about all of them, including Jefferson Airplane, Allman Brothers, Traffic, The Band, The Doors, Dylan (with and without the Band), etc. and none had the influence on their audience that The Dead did. Watkins Glen perfect example. LOL. Probably the greatest concert of my life with The Band, The Dead and The Allman Brothers. While I obviously loved and enjoyed The Band and The ABs more, it was like a transcendental switch that went off with the HUGE crowd when the Dead took stage including my then girlfriend; at least that is my recollection which to this day I still don't get. 

 

My last Dead concert was one of Garcia's last appearances in Madison Square Garden, where my AMEX executive friend got a box for us to attend. I was truly amazed. It was literally a concert that reminded me of Night Of The Living Dead. LOL. All these old burned out people marching and "dancing" to a different tune. 

 

Their influence cannot be understated. 

 

 

[Priaptor]

17 minutes ago, Bill Brown said:

 

Wow, I am envious (and my son would be also) with you having seen the ABB, especially if it was before Duane died.  Wow again.

 

Bill

Yes I saw Duane multiple times. I also saw what I believe was their first concert after he died, at CW Post in Long Island. It was horrible, from an emotional and music standpoint. They pretty much cut their concert short and this was in the days that they did minimum of 3 hour concerts. None of us AB fans/junkies thought they could ever recover without Duane but they did but it was nothing like with him. 

 

The GREATEST concert I have ever been to, which is actually on CD but the CD sucks, was when they played in my college at SUNY Stony Brook in Long Island. (The Allman Brothers Band - SUNY at Stonybrook - Amazon.com Music)

 

They scheduled them to play Rosh Hashana. There was literally almost no one on campus as everyone had gone home for the holidays (during that era, it was at least 75% Jewish and almost all were from NY as it was a BAD recession and few could afford the private schools; it was funny as NYU was a piece of garbage back then and had to sell their uptown campus to stay afloat).

 

They played 2 concerts and I went to both (it was really just one morphed into each other). It was in a very hot gym, few people and they jammed their hearts out. It was one of the first times they ever played Blue Skies and definitely the only time Duane played it live as he died just 4 or 5 weeks after. They played for hours. My good buddy "Dumbo" was among 8 of my friends who had come for the concert literally passed out from the heat and the weed. While my parents weren't too happy that I wasn't coming home for the high holy days, some things come before God and in this case it was the Allman Brothers. 

 

I had seen Duane just a few times prior but this was literally the greatest concert of my life. Just a couple of hundred of us and it was amazing. 

[Priaptor]

4 hours ago, Bill Brown said:

Another wow.  Great.  Anxious to tell my son you were at SUNY, we have the discs (basically everything from when he was alive).  Coltrane was his favorite having grown up with me, but Allman supplanted him when he began playing (Les Paul of course).

 

And agree.  Never the same after.

 

He found another live recording of Blue Sky from The Warehouse; listened to it every day, several times, for months.  Extended Duane solo, just fantastic.  Sound quality no good (don't care):

 

 

Also that night, during the "second show" they did an absolutely stunning jam of Elizabeth Reed. 

 

They actually loved "The Brook" and considered it one of their main venues. They played there multiple times and loved it. There are some interesting interviews of some of the band members about their love for Stony Brook and that night in particular. 

 

Had I known it was the last time we were going to seen Duane I would have woken up my passed out friend. 

[Priaptor]

55 minutes ago, bobbmd said:

are the DEAD as 'overrated' as gerry mcnamara was in the 2006 Big East Tournament?

While I am no Syracuse fan and usually don't like the "coaches kid" except The Pistol for LSU, Buddy Boeheim has been awesome. 

 

Just another tidbit. Jim Boeheim was Dave Bing's roommate as a freshman!

 

[Priaptor]

1 hour ago, ARQuint said:

People requested Grateful Dead songs at Bar Mitzvahs? Who knew?

 

Well tells you something. Could you imagine them playing In Memory of Elizabeth Reed at a Bar Mitvah or wedding??

[Priaptor]

1 hour ago, bobbmd said:

@Priaptor hey thanks for the response did not think anyone would reply but try to find the hx(SU Basketball or on YouTube ) of that 2006 Big East Tournament Gerry McNamara singlehandedly won that tournament and was rated the most ‘OVER RATED’ guard by the national press and especially NYPost NYNews. The best was Boeheim’s post game press conference rant.

Yes I know about Jim and Dave Bing(they are still close)—I saw them play their senior year in Manley Fieldhouse against St Johns. Thanks again for the reply. This thread is a HOOT... keep it up everyone—I will have more to say later

Yes I REMEMBER that Big East tournament well.

 

As a competitor myself in HS and college, I was a BBall junkie. Went to the first game Bill Bradley ever played. One of my coaches, Elmer Ripley, may he RIP, who is a hall of famer, got me tickets to that game a few rows behind the basket. Well they played the Pistons and the Knicks were getting beat and my buddy and I were leaving literally a couple of feet from the court when Bing gets the ball in the corner, takes a jump shot and his feet were literally at the height of my chin. I got to meet him that night as no one from the Knicks were in the mood. Bing was close to Elmer so he got me to see Bing instead of Bradley. A really nice guy. 

 

Tons of NY Basketball stories. My arch nemesis in HS was Mike Dunleavy. I played with 13 guys who made it to the NBA including Lloyd (World B) Free, Ernie Grunfeld, Bernard King and many more including a future amazing pitcher by the name of John Candeleria. 

 

Howard Schultz, of Starbucks fame, was captain of Canarsie HS same year I was captain of my team. World B. was a year behind me. Schultz was actually very good. 

[Priaptor]

1 hour ago, bobbmd said:

@Priaptor Wow what a BB history you have and none of those guys you mentioned or games you saw were OVERRATED were they-I am old enough to have watched the Syracuse Nationals play, saw the ‘62 NBA all star game in Syracuse and saw Cousy, Chamberlain, Russell, Baylor Oscar, Dolph Schayes etc and Hal Greer’s wife was one of my HS teachers plus those horrid refs Sid Borgia and Mendy Rudolph!

 

But back to the overrated DEAD/The Band and not so good Clapton(no one has ‘spit’ upon The Beach Boys yet)—y’all have to realize just what all bands groups solo artists meant to our generation caught up in assassinations and a war with wasted efforts/promises of presidents gone wrong. They(the artists) gave us something to gravitate to, hold on to, dream about and rally around and just enjoy their words phrases and foot stomping good music. For later generations who never saw them/heard/listened to their music originally— to denigrate their worthiness/and consider them ‘over-rated‘ is unfair and not their right or privilege only those of us ‘of the age’ have that right/privilege.

Couldn't agree more. And you are older than me so it goes more for you than even me, but I was close.  Those bands and individuals really did have a huge influence. 

 

Speaking of Hal Greer. Elmer would coach Hal Greer alone off season to teach him to get a quicker first step. He had me do the same exercise over and over and over again. Having a chair at the foul line and taking layups going around the chair in 30 seconds. I think, if memory serves me, Greer was ultimately able to do 7 in 30 seconds. 

[Priaptor]

 

1 hour ago, sphinxsix said:

 

Think you need to be more clear - do I have the right to say it or judge them or no.? 

 

I think everyone needs to judge any historical figure(s) in the context of when they lived (and performed).  

 

Of course on a personal note you can judge The Dead strictly on the merits of their music but without context you lose who and what they were and just how much influence their music had. 

[Priaptor]

you can close it now