Difficult situation...raspberry pi3 vs auralic aries g1

[Flyman]

Hello computer audio friends. Very good info here.what a mess!

well i read some thinks here....because i am in a big  dilemma .

 

 I have the raspberry pi 3 with a custom linear psu with moode player.i connect it to my dac via usb.reading some hot stuff i understand that the usb is not a good thing in rasp.so i decided to do something.thinking of buy hat with coxial or a hat dac. some guys reports good results in that.this is the cheapest choice.also some of them says that a rasp with a good dac hat kill anything at 1000e and more.

the other choise is to take the auralic aries g1.

 

yes i know  it's a big money difference.but is it a huge sound difference or not?have somebody make the comparison?

 

 

 

[DuckToller]

24 minutes ago, Flyman said:

Hello computer audio friends. Very good info here.what a mess!

well i read some thinks here....because i am in a big  dilemma .

 

 I have the raspberry pi 3 with a custom linear psu with moode player.i connect it to my dac via usb.reading some hot stuff i understand that the usb is not a good thing in rasp.so i decided to do something.thinking of buy hat with coxial or a hat dac. some guys reports good results in that.this is the cheapest choice.also some of them says that a rasp with a good dac hat kill anything at 1000e and more.

the other choise is to take the auralic aries g1.

 

yes i know  it's a big money difference.but is it a huge sound difference or not?have somebody make the comparison?

 

 

 

Hi Flyman, welcome to the CA forums!
You are in the same dilemma as most of us without unlimited spending power ... ?
The importance of your streamer/dac combo may probably vary, dependend on the other factors, that are important for music reproduction in your personal environment:
- your Room vs Headphone usage

- your listening position, i.e Deskotop environment or living room
- Speakers and Amplification
- Sources, i.e. Formats you listen to,  streaming quality (MP3 or Lossless), Hi-RES Flac, DSD etc.
Many here will say your room is most important, then the speakers, other will say, the source format and the mastering of it are very important ... nobody seems to be wrong here .. but it usually depends on each other for perfection !
As an example, my teeange son listens to his rap music via napster stream and a RPI3 and Hifiberry Plus DAC, using an 20 year old Harman Kardon Receiver w/ Infinity Reference speakers (retired living room system), he felt that the RPI/DAC enhanced the sound compared to the MF V90 DAC he used before (me too!).

OTOH, in my system the same box sounded definetly less good than a CAPS v3 Zuma/UA Regen with an iFi iDSD BL DAC. But there are some serious k's of euros more hardware investments (+room treatment) involved, and it would be a shame I could not hear a difference there.

To get some more responses and tips, it might help to report on your overall listening situation with details on your system.
Hope that helps a bit, Tom
 

[Flyman]

My room is 16 square meters.hegel 190 with harbeth c7es.position living room.my room will be soon measure and make it better with basstraps etc.

I listen flac music most.

[DuckToller]

45 minutes ago, Flyman said:

hegel 190

Hi Flyman,

first of all, serious investement in quality products! 
I do not know how amp and speakers interact, but I would assume very well for their price point.
Are you happy how they sound? How do you transport your flac files to the amp/dac?

I happen to have read a review of the Hegel last month, doesn't it have DLNA capabities and a 192/24 DAC?
With Bubble (Android) or Kinsky (for Apple, but I know nothing about Apple apps) this might do nearly everything you want to do with a RPI/DAC hat, apart from DSD. Do you use these capabilities already ? If I remember right, Hegel was supposed to work on an update for their network software, this was a bad point on the review. Have you recently updated ?
AFAIK, @cebolla is a very friendly guide in this forum, who is well known for explaining the Bubble app and its capabilities. ?
Cheer, Tom

[Flyman]

Thanx a lot guys for the quicks responces.

 

Well i am happy comparing to my old system.that's for sure.but my room isn't a good point for now.

 

I do my flac transfer with the raspberry.hd hard drive.

 

yeap hegel have dlna...and a good dac but not the best dac out there.but i think that isn't like auralic.am i right?

 

well i don't use bubble because i have my music into the hard drive.is useless fror me.

 

well my  dilemma is about if the raspberry plays better than auralic in flac that i have in my hard drive and also spotify.before days i read somewhere that there is also difference in spotify tidal...and how to do that.also i have a big dilemma if auralic makes the streaming better from my hegel dlna.as the most here know the power is about the 40% of the sound that a machine have.the auralic had linear psu with good compoments inside for very low noise.

 

I don't know how to make the update to my hegel.changes something?

[DuckToller]

Flyman,

if you are not satisfied with the qualities of the Hegel streaming and DAC options, I would guess, that the Auralic is the better solution for you. Just think about how you want to send your flac files to the Auralic, a simples NAS  solution or a  harddisk connected to you router could do the trick (as well for DLNA with bubble, you may try that first before spending money), If it is to complicated, the Auralic products Altair and Aries G1would surely fit your needs. If you look to save money, you may check out a used Aries mini.
I can not base my ideas on own experience with the Aries, but I would assume, as a rule of thumb, that this type of equipment does suit your chain more (and more comfortable) than the RPI/Dac hat solution. Some RPI fans may think different, but the easy comfort is with that one box solution from Auralic. 
IMHO, the use of the Hegel DLNA/DAC is definately worth a thourogh listening session.
But I am very fond of saving money, where it is not necessary to spend.
Cheers Tom

[DuckToller]

Flyman,

you may like to look as well at the Lumin D2, which plays in the same leage, AFAIK.
Tom

[jventer]

@Flyman

I think you need to look at 2 things:

1. The Streamer/Renderer 
2. The Dac

The Raspberry and the Auralic Aries/G1 etc. are streamers/renderers. Your Hegel is an amp with a dac as well as a streamer.

 

I don't understand why you are not using the Streaming capabilities of your Hegel, but putting that aside you are using a RPi as a streamer.

 

Regarding your questions re streamers. I had an Allo Digione which was really good for the price. The microRendu however was better and then an Auralic Aries with special power supply was even better. From what I read in reviews I doubt that a RPi with whatever improvements can outperform the G1.

 

By adding a hat etc to the RPi you are changing the connection to your dac - it may make a small difference, but wont outperform a significant more expensive or better product. My recommendation would be to see what you can do to listen to the streaming capability of your Hegel before throwing more money at it. If you do need to add something look at microRendu/ultraRendu the SOtM and Auralic.

 

The second thing is the dac - again you can add that to the RPi, but will it be better than the dac in the Hegel? I unfortunately dont know.

 

All the best.

[Flyman]

I did read about  lumin but i don't know if it is better and cheaper than auralic.

 

well auralic had a usb for hard drive ...so no nas ....you need only a tablet for remote.

 

i am happy with hegel features and raspberry but i think auralic is an upgrade...

 

The dlna hegel don't play as good as raspberry.i find a bit hursh.also i don't know if i can play my hard drive to hegel via dlna.when i use raspberry is like that...raspbery-usb-iusb-usb-dac amp...and maybe the filter do the job.

 

ydrassil is my future end dac.for sure.i felt in love with it.so raspberry dac can't be near the ydrassil.i will keep the raspberry only if it will be as better transport from auralic...you tell me.

 

 

[DuckToller]

Flyman,

for upgrading your Hegel
the software: https://www.hegel.com/images/drivers/H190softwareupdatev14.zip
For instructions see attached files about upgrade and Bubble
you'll find all of this and more at https://www.hegel.com/products/integrated/h190
I understand, that you use the RPI as a transport for connecting your HD, couldn't you use your Router (WIFI or LAN) for doing this? Usually they have now an usb port (UPNP or DNLA) available for sharing files in the network. If that works, you would get rid of the RPI and you could test out the streaming options of your Hegel hardware.
For example, if you use JRiver for Windows, you could connect from your comp or from your Android phone with the jriver-App GIZMO to your source (HD on comp or Router) and play via DNLA to the integrated DAC. But this might be more complicated than using the Bubble App just from your android phone or tablet if your HD is connected to your router (Internet box).
Why don't you ask your the shop, who sold the Hegel to you, to support your network setup ?
Regarding pricing, in Europe (i.e. https://www.wifimedia.eu/en/streaming-audio/hifi-streamers/) the price is identical.
Good luck, Tom

H190 BubbleUPnPWalkthrough.pdf

H190howtoupdate.pdf

H190manualenglish.pdf

FindingNetworkDeviceWindows.pdf

[DuckToller]

Flyman, do you use apple products ?
Because , if not, using the aries might be kind of difficult, as their lighning app for android seems to be discontinued.
Good luck, Tom

[DuckToller]

Last but not least, 
if you are sure to have an Yggy in the future, you maý consider a Sonic transporter, for your needs, which you could use with your integrated dac as well as with the future Yggy. Costs may depend on the size of the integrated SSD and which LPS you choose with it.  But they are  essentially lower than Lumin and Auralic.You might find more info here in the Sonore subforum:
https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/forum/24-sonore-sponsored/
Good night, Tom

[Flyman]

I don't use network sharing at all because is a bad bad thing.too much noise guys.

 

well i didn't think of that you say....i will check my router if it has usb.good info.thanx.and i will make a small Comparison.

 the more is the system the best you get.one of my friend change the cable ethernet with an expensive one and guess what?he get more detail.a big mess.router also don't have linear pau...nas the same.you destroy a little bit quality.

 

i never see the manuals at the site.i thought that everything was in the box....the manual at the box says nothing.but now as i see in the site there are a lot.

 

i have apple ipad,tablet android and a laptop windows,so one of them will be ok.

 

tom thanx a lot.tell me more that i don't know for my hegel.hehe

[Flyman]

i see a thread lumin u1 mini vs auralic g1 but i don't understand the differences.

 

well...which plays best....and that's the advantages and disadvantages compare them?!

 

thanx guys.

[wklie]

17 hours ago, Flyman said:

I did read about  lumin but i don't know if it is better and cheaper than auralic.

 

well auralic had a usb for hard drive ...so no nas ....you need only a tablet for remote.

 

The dlna hegel don't play as good as raspberry.i find a bit hursh.

 

If I understood correctly you're using the internal DAC of the Hegel.  In this case, if you're interested in a Lumin product, I'd recommend D2 over U1 MINI - use the D2 XLR output to the Hegel (i.e. not using the internal DAC of the latter).  I have reasons to believe it will sound better this way.  Besides, it seems the Hegel H190 USB input maxes out at 24/96 and will not accept DSD, so I will not use it.

 

It is possible to connect a USB HDD to a Lumin player, although we recommend the use of the free MinimServer instead on a NAS or computer for browsing flexibility and efficiency.

[DuckToller]

31 minutes ago, wklie said:

If I understood correctly you're using the internal DAC of the Hegel.

Hello Wklie,

member of the trade for Lumin, pls allow me to correct you. The last stand of information was;

- OP will buy an Yggy DAC

- *essentially is looking for transport from his HD*

- prefers external LPU

- may use his tablets (apple/android) for setup and control

- uses no network storage

You may re-evaluate if the D2 is the best option you may advise from the Lumin products.

I have mentioned your products as alternative to the Auralic, but I have understand with his last post, that a DAC and network capabilities are not really necessary right now and in the future.

The op's ideas may change  if you could give an useful overview on the strength of Lumin products and their difference to the Auralic ones.

Cheers, Tom

[Cebolla]

The OP's low powered efficient Raspberry Pi should be good enough to attach the USB HDD to and run the MinimServer UPnP media server to provide the audio files over the network for the Hegel's built-in UPnP/DLNA streamer to play - so no need even to look for another device for that!

 

Installing MinimServer on the Raspberry Pi

[Flyman]

well d2 is out of my budget.

 

So unfortunately lumin u1 mini and auralic aries g1 don't have xlr.As a result coaxial and usb is the way to dac. I will connet the hard drive to streamer,as a result i will save some money and i think is better for quality.

 

Now my main question is if the lumin u1 mini is better from the auralic aries g1.

 

as the DuckToller says it will be a big help telling me the differences from theese two.

 

ps:good advice Cebolla.i will.But i will like better the straight connections for many reasons.

[Cebolla]

Hope you are not thinking that a 'straight connection' for providing a music file from storage is more important than a direct internal connection between the music file player and DAC in the same box (so no XLR, USB audio, coaxial, etc connections to consider) at least from a sound quality stand point - though I can see it being a matter of convenience.

[wklie]

I did read another DAC that was mentioned, but I didn't read it as happening in the near future.  The way I see it, it is much more important to bypass the internal DAC as the very first thing to do, than the choice of streamer.  If this is already determined, that's great, and I think I have said enough here and in the other thread.  I'd rather not interfere with you guys' discussions of streamers.

[DuckToller]

9 hours ago, wklie said:

I'd rather not interfere with you guys' discussions of streamers.

@Flyman,

my small review on units that I'd believe to cover your interest, made me think, that recent products are often more all-in-one (streamer - from NAS and Internet-, DAC AND transport) units for use within a network, rather than a single solution as you seem to look for. My assumption is based on your mention of the Yggy as the DAC you want to have in the future. If you are interest to have another DAC instead of the internal from the Hegel190 before you will invest in the Yggy, you may want to make that point more clear.
If the Lumin products can't deliver to your interest, one product that afaik seems to fit the bill might be the Aurender N100C/H (https://www.aurender.com/page/n100c) with 2 or 4 TB capacity, which is not one of the newest gadgets in town (it is from 2015), but imho focusses on the transport to the DAC via USB particularly (see pic below).

You may find them used for prices between 1500 and 2000 Euros. If you can find it new,  it is usually between 2.500 and 3000 Euros. There is a well an Aurender support thread in this forum 
-> 

Once again, good luck ! Tom

[Flyman]

I still i don't have clear answer.

 

i read as i said some things but nobody make me to understand.

 

which is the differences about lumin mini u1 and auralic aries g1.which plays better?

 

i think auralic have better build.

[DuckToller]

Flyman,

It may help, if you would formulate precisely (I know that this ain't easy in a foreign language ... nevermind), what you want, for example:
- Have another try with the RPI and minimserver (Cebolla Solution) - no cost
- Have another try with the RPI  + a DAC HAT and minimserver (Cebolla Solution) - low cost
Spend serious money:
- A new DAC (you mentioned the Yggy)
- A Transport (a digital music player for you Music on HD) - AURENDER N100C/H with Hegel-DAC or Yggy
- A Streamer ( A digital music player for your music from HD, NAS and Internet) - LUMIN U1 or equivalent (i.e. you'll find them in the sonore product portfolio) with Hegel-DAC or Yggy 
- An all in one unit (DAC/TRANSPORT/STREAMER), because the Yggy won't arrive befor xmas 2021 and the Hegel Dac sucks - AURALIC G1or LUMIN D2 or equivalent (as noted)

I think, this were all option that accured in this thread.
In my opinion, it doesn't make sense to get another product with a dac, if you are sure to get the Yggy sooner or later. You already have one in the HEGEL.
The comfort / differences may finally come also from the apps to be used with your digital music chain, you may look into that as well. Lightning DS for Auralic for IOS, Lumin app for IOS and Android or the Aurender Conductor on IOS and Android
You can always spend more money in hardware ... imho it helps to get a clear view on your own demand ...
You may have as well not all the products available, depending where you live.
Have a nice weekend, Tom

[Flyman]

Well once again.i never tell for all in one machine.

 

What you say about xmas 2021....explain pls.

 

So auralic works only with apple?with windows?

 

Thanx a lot tom

[DuckToller]

Xmas 2021 was an Expression of the Need to save money for 36 month (more or less) to buy an Yggy ... because that item is also expensive,  but you may feel the need a solution for the time in between ....

I had seen a notice of Auralic conductor beta for android, but my playstore does not offer. So you might be correct.

I was thinking as well if an intermediate solution: the Aries mini was very popular in 2016, but at it's price point it cannibalized the market for the other Auralic products , now it's discontinued.

You may find a used one under 400 Euros and buy an interim/final DAC of your choice, and update to a better/ more comfortable/more expensive transport/streamer later.

Imho,  at that price point the quality of the DAC may be more important than the quality of the streamer/transport.

At 2400 Euros, the difference of 2000 Euros to a 400 Euro DAC, may be audible,  I doubt that this assumption is valid for streamer.

But that is a personal decision to make.

Cheers, Tom