The true experimental tweak thread

[austinpop]

2 hours ago, Cornan said:

With that said it is important to understand where the music bits are coming from and how noisy that connection might be. If you are living in an appartment in the center of a big town and listening to cloud content like me anything from the source to the player will probably matter. If you are living in a house outside the center and listening to local content anything from the local storage to the player will matter, including what is used to control the music and the paths are carrying the music bits. Anything else might not be as important.  

 

Agreed. I live in a standalone house in the suburbs, so perhaps am less prone to interference.

 

Here are my latest topology pictures. First the audio chain. This will change soon when I receive the tX-USBultra, but it is current as of now.

 

 

Now, here is my network topolgy, which also shows isolators and any LPSes.

 

 

So far, I have hear zero improvement from: the DC blocker, the Baaske isolator, the HDPlex LPS, and most recently the Aucharm grounding box.

 

I am thinking of moving the Baaske from its current spot to immediately prior to the W10 box.

[austinpop]

7 minutes ago, mozes said:

Did you try grounding your C7 router?

 

Yes that's where I used the grounding, by attaching a USB cable and clipping to the exposed end.

[austinpop]

46 minutes ago, mozes said:

It seems you are unlucky with grounding or your system is near perfection

 

The latter - of course!

 

[austinpop]

20 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

So far this is just something that I am considering to make the best possible use of the coming AQVOX switch-8. I want both of my systems to gain from the improved reclocking and SI. My thinking is to buy another router and connect it via WDS, so the new router is the passive WDS and the old router is the active WDS. AFAIK this will create two different subnets. My two wireless adapters are connected to different channels (channel 48 & channel 60) with separate control points/devices which actually improved the sq a bit on both places.

 

The main router is a Netgear router supplied by the service provider (ie. Not chosen by me. I am not at home and cannot remember the name of it right now) and I want to use the same brand (Netgear) if possible for the passive WDS. Most likely a Nighthawk or a C7. However, I am still looking for other brands like ASUS and TP-Link and will do so for a while before I pull the plug. 

 

Yes, the devices are in three different locations: 1. main router/2. main setup/3. low budget setup.

 

It might look over-complicated, but it is really the friuts of what I have dicouvered to be beneficial to SQ for me with Tidal as the only source. Both setups have similar thinking. I have actually also another D-Link network switch that I will throw in after the OTG power devider+TP-Link TL-UE300 to make it more or less identical to my main setup. Always fun to find out if a second switch can improve it! 

 

 

 

 

Hi Micael,

 

One way to achieve this without getting into multiple subnets, is to partition your wireless space. 

1. Let your "FIRST ROUTER" be the primary in the system. It does DHCP, NAT, and Wireless, BUT - configure it to only use one of the wireless bands - either 2.4 or 5 GHz.
2. Configure your 2nd Router (post Aqvox) as a Wireless Access Point (WAP) only. AND - configure it to use the other wireless band from the primary.

One other thing I would suggest is to revisit the need for the wireless bridge on the primary path to the Aries Mini. I understand the rationale at the time - to provide isolation. But since then, you have done a lot of isolation tweaks with floating power supplies etc. You may find that the wireless bridge does not help isolation further, but removing it may improve signal integrity overall.

 

If the above does work, then you can still do what you want with the 2nd router connected to the Aqvox, but now you would disable wireless completely on the 1st router, and enable both bands on the WAP (2nd router).

 

Something to think about! Good luck with the Aqvox. Great to see you guys sharing gear. 

[austinpop]

Oh I forgot to add a best practice that I find very useful:

• Assign easily-remembered static IPs to all your network gear that have web UIs to control them.
• Bookmark these in your browser of choice
• Then - it's easy to control them from one location without running discovery utilities to find their dynamic IPs when you need them.

[austinpop]

3 hours ago, Cornan said:

The way I see it adding another wireless adapter post AQVOX with a separate SSID + channel and connect the DAP-1620 exclusively to that will do the same thing right, or am I missing something?

 

Yes, that should work.

 

But guys - let me reiterate - after all the care you've taken to isolate power, please double check whether your wireless bridges are still buying you anything. Perhaps that bought you an SQ bump in the past, but it may be moot now.

 

If you're operating on the theory that your Aqvox switch improves signal integrity, then adding a wifi bridge after it may negate that benefit.

[austinpop]

I have RCA and XLR noise stopper caps in my system. I cannot honestly say they made a difference in the SQ at all, but I like the idea and the price was modest, because Audioquest RCA caps come in packs of 10.

 

I have never tried RJ45 or USB caps. It would be interesting to see if these help. The price point is rather steep, though. compared to the RCA caps.

[austinpop]

1 hour ago, Cornan said:

After reading a little bit about the Audioquest RJ45 noise stoppers I found out that they are actually not shorting plugs but grounding plugs.

 

This gave me the idea to maybe order these ones instead http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ubiquiti-TC-GND-ToughCable-Connectors-w-ground-cable-RJ45-CAT6-CAT5E-STP-20pcs-/172523674098?hash=item282b3659f2:g:qxsAAOxyIYhSZBLH and attach the o-rings to the grounding screw in the back of the AQVOX switch which will be connected to my Entreq Minimus grounding box.

 

 

This is much more like my kind of tweak!

 

 

Classic @Cornan tweak! Should be fun to see what this does.

[austinpop]

Now your GF can buy you jewelry too.

 

Here you go, honey - a set of 6 pure silver RJ45 ground cables - happy birthday/anniversary/whatever!

 

[austinpop]

@Cornan

 

That's very exciting news about the Aqvox!

 

Quick question - remind me again what is good about the TP-Link Vivid battery pack, compared to something like the Tecknet (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00FAU7ZB2) ?

 

I don't see the Vivid on sale here in the US...

[austinpop]

Whatever floats your boat! 

[austinpop]

2 hours ago, Cornan said:

The sad part is that I will most likely only get to experiment with it, and not use it for long. I have 100% descided to order a Auralic Altair (probably) or Brooklyn DAC+SOtM200 (plausible).

 

That's great news. Both will be a step up from the Aries Mini.

 

It's interesting that with your love of tweaking, you're even drawn to an all-in-1 component like the Altair! I respect Auralic gear immensely, and have really loved the Aries line. Their G2 line looks very intriguing, and probably quite expensive. However, I was never very impressed with the Vega as a DAC. Of course, I did not listen extensively. And the Altair is based on the Vega DAC.

 

Since I'm spending your money  - here's what my dream system for you would be:

 

AO-optimized box for BubbleDS (maybe Roon in the future?) > Aqvox switch (LPS-1 or floating PSU) > sMS-200 Ultra (LPS-1) > Brooklyn (VR Mini)

 

Not only will it sound amazing out of the gate, it's a tweaker's paradise! Future upgrades could include the tX-USBultra, ISO-Regen, and eventually an even better DAC if MQA really takes off.

 

Take all this with a healthy dose of humor, please! I am only throwing out my own opinion.

[austinpop]

25 minutes ago, mozes said:

Rajiv, this is like taking no prisoners and also includes taking all of@Cornan's savings if he still has anything left

 

Budget - what budget?

 

When I'm spending @Cornan's savings, the sky is the limit!

[austinpop]

31 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

Thanks Moussa!

I have found a Brooklyn in silver new for EUR1933.- which is quite interesting, although I wanted a black one initially. I am more and more leaning against a Brooklyn + sms-200. No pc or server for me though. Hmm? ?

 

Do you or anyone else know how to play Tidal MQA via SMS-200+Brooklyn if you do not want Roon?

 

Put this question front and center - where is the optimal place to run the Tidal "client" code?  And it needs to support full pass through of MQA. This does limit choices because until Bubble DS supports 24bit pass through, it is not a good option. So then your choices for where Tidal can run are:

1. On your Aries Mini, via the Lightning server on-box. I must say, Auralic's Tidal support on Lightning is very slick!
2. NOT on the sMS-200 - there is no on-box Tidal client!
3. microRendu supports on-box Bubble DS, but then you run into the lack of MQA pass through support
4. On a PC. One overarching advantage here is that you can get better signal integrity due to AO. But you are still limited.
   1. The only streaming server supporting Tidal pass through is Roon Core.
   2. The other option is to run the Tidal app and use the USB of the PC. Yuck!!

So at this point, if you think about it - your only 2 choices are Roon or Lightning. I have not been following Bubble - have those guys said anything about supporting MQA pass thorough?

 

My suggestion would actually be - keep the Aries Mini as your streamer for now. Take an incremental approach:

1. Get the Brooklyn, and drive it via USB from the Mini (through existing Regen)
2. Add VR Mini
3. Swap Regen with ISO-Regen+LPS-1
4. Then see which way the Tidal MQA winds are blowing. If Bubble support for MQA comes, then you have many choices to replace the Aries Mini:
   1. sMS-200 (with or without Ultra) + LPS-1
   2. microRendu + LPS-1
   3. Keep an eye on the new Auralic Aries 2 streamer.
5. If no Bubble DS support is imminent, consider Roon

But honestly, you may be happy for a long time with:

• Aries Mini (Kingrex battery supply) > ISO-Regen (LPS-1) > Brooklyn (VR Mini).

 

Especially since your primary use case for music is Tidal streaming.

[austinpop]

29 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

Thanks a lot Rajiv! ?

What a pity though! Still considering Altair as my best option, even though many things favours the Brooklyn (sq and looks). The main two advantages with Altair are no USB and no external DC power. Just good old AC power into a floating IT is a very appealing solution for me. I also think that I can lure out some extra sq from the Altair with my existing setup, especially with the grounded Aqvox.

I really appreciate your and Moussa's opinions and suggestions, but other things like bit-perfect group play and upsampling favours the Altair and will most likely make me choose that option. I might get wild & crazy and buy a SonicTransporter and try out Roon when I suddenly have two Roon-Ready devices, but I doubt it. I would rather invest in a Entreq Minimus Silver! ?

 

 

Best of luck! These are not easy choices, and you have to weigh the factors that matter the most to you. 

[austinpop]

5 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

Thanks!

Damn, I did'nt think it would be this hard to spend $2600.-. I normally do it in smaller amounts, and that is a LOT easier!?

 

Looking at the stunning Brooklyn again makes me wonder.

 

Will I not be happier if I buy this? I just hate Altair's remote. I love Brooklyn's apple remote. I will get closer to audio nirvana, but it will be more hassle to just listen to music (battery USB injection & two devices to switch on). I can sell off my Pioneer U-05 and hope to find a Aries femto second hand in the $900 region. &#@*!  ?

 

 

I was going to keep my mouth shut, but since you opened the door... 

 

If it were me, I'd absolutely buy the Brooklyn. I would drive it with the Mini initially, and look for a good deal on an Aries Femto.

 

Thr Altair is a jack of all trades, but to my mind, master of none.

[austinpop]

Just now, Cornan said:

 

I am still in the investigating mode. If I'm lucky I choose a streamer/DAC/HPA that is available at a local dealer. Brooklyn is not! Unfortunately I will have to make the investigation into the crucial part to succeed! As far as I can tell from reviews Brooklyns headphone stage is outstanding and much better than Altair. In terms of DAC it is a close call. ?

 

Yeah I was also going to say I have not looked into the headphone amp section of the Brooklyn, so it's good if the reviews are positive. In any case, you can always upgrade at a later point to a dedicated headphone amp. That is what I did with my Codex. The key is to pick a DAC that punches well above its weight class, because then you can build your chain out from there, and the system will scale up. You can upgrade to the left - with better streamers/endpoints - and to the right - with better amps and headphones!

 

Are you sure that Mytek doesn't give you a 30-day trial?

 

BTW - when it comes to headphones, the Brooklyn supports balanced mode, so that can give you a nice bump in SQ. When you are ready to upgrade your headphones, we should talk. I recently added the Focal Elear to my collection, and I've been highly recommending them to all my friends whose musical tastes are NOT classical - for which I still say the HD800S reigns supreme. And yes, even compared to the Focal Utopia.

 

But that is a whole 'nother topic.

[austinpop]

Now you must both listen to at least one AC/DC album in penance.

 

[austinpop]

4 hours ago, Cornan said:

I have two very knowlegable friends at Head-Fi that both swear by the Stax SR-009 or, very surprisingly, the cheap Beyerdynamics TD-880 Pro 600 ohm. They have both tried just about any headphones in the market. The SR-009 is way out of my league (price wise), but I will surely buy the TD-880 Pro 600 ohm sooner or later. I am personally still over the moon with my Fostex TH900, so I will first of all send them to Poland and gets then rewired into balanced. They suit my kind of music perfectly (indie, electronic, pop, hardcore, sing-a-song-writers etc) and have an authority unmatched by any other headphones that I have tried (incl HD700/HD800). I have never tried SR-009, TD-880 pro 600 ohm or any Audeze headphones though.

 

There are so many good headphones. Like all other gear, the only way to tell is to try as many as you can. I went to CanJam SoCal last year, and it was great to try so many in one place.

 

Given your taste in music, I just don't see the Stax being right for you - not to mention being quite expensive. The Beyers are always reliable. Definitely listen to Audeze's, Focal's, even the Audioquest NightHawk/Owl's.

 

Balanced cables are highly recommended. I bought mine from Moon Audio here in the US. I'm sure there are many other great choices in Europe. The key is to get the terminations right for the specific headphones and the Brooklyn. Heck - you could probably build your own headphone cables.

[austinpop]

2 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

Yes, but I think you refer to Mutec MC-3+USB. This is the one without USB which is cheaper. Maybe it does'nt work? I just see the world clock i/o and take for granted that it will! ? DSD is no need for me. Tidal only! ?

 

1 hour ago, mozes said:

Sorry I have no experience with Mutech but my guess is the IsoRegen is what you may need

 

@mozes - Is there any consensus on which is considered the best SQ input type on the Brooklyn? USB vs. AES/EBU etc? 

 

If USB, then I'd think the Mutec is unnecessary, and money better spent on the tX-USBultra or the ISO-Regen.

[austinpop]

Oh I see now. You're asking whether an external word clock supplied by the Mutec would improve upon the internal femto clock on the Brooklyn?

 

Sorry, I've never played with this dimension, because I've never had a DAC that had this option.

 

You might check with @romaz. He's been doing amazing tweaks with clocks using the SOtM sCLK-EX, but he's also had a lot of experience with this stuff.

[austinpop]

Since I was curious, I just looked at the Brooklyn manual. They (Mytek) seem pretty convinced their internal clock is the way to go:

 

Wordclock BNC input. Can be used for professional clock distribution and for syncing multiple units and as DSD reference clock. Can also be used for connecting the Brooklyn to external clock. However, we recommend running Mytek on Internal Clock, using the built in Mytek FemtoClock which is by far superior (<1ps jitter) to any clock source connected from outside.

 

INT (Internal) / USB / Inncoming signal is synced to the converter’s ultra-low jitter internal crystal oscillator. This choice assures the best DAC performance and is superior to any (even Atomic) clock supplied from outside because of its close proximity to DAC clocking chipset. The DAC operates as master device. WordClock OUT transmits master clock signal

[austinpop]

31 minutes ago, lmitche said:

Cornan, I don't know if you pulled the trigger on the Brooklyn yet.  I owned and loved it, but after hearing the IFI microidsd at dsd512, I sold the Brooklyn. The IFI is just at another level powered by an lps-1.  It is single ended.  It has a great headphone amp as well.  The newer Black Label version is a true upgrade and takes things to the next level.

 

Anyway, no one mentioned it here, and I have had both so thought you should consider this option.

 

Larry,

 

That is startling to hear. I did not realize you had preferred the iFi over the Brooklyn! 

 

Still - there may be some factors to consider:

1. I don't believe the iFi does MQA, right?
2. Did I understand right - you found the magic to happen only when upsampling everything to DSD512 with HQPlayer running on a PC?

I suspect both of these are showstoppers for @Cornan.

[austinpop]

In this context, it's also worth keeping in mind that AFAIK, endpoints like the Aries, sMS-200, and mR don't even support native DSD rates beyond 256.

 

This is actually something I hope changes - the sooner the better.

[austinpop]

9 hours ago, lmitche said:

Hi Moussa,

 

Well over a year ago I had a T+A DAC here running dsd512 and was impressed with the difference between dsd 512 and 256.  That listening session was attended by 4 CAers. At dinner we discussed dac options to the T+A that output dsd512.  One of the attendees had a silver IFI microidsd and sent it to me to compare with the T+A and the Brooklyn. Much of this is documented in the start of T+A thread on CA.

 

At that time the T+A sounded best, then the IFI microidsd without the lps-1, and then the Brooklyn.  I was so impressed, I sold the Brooklyn, bought a used IFI, and returned the T+A to my friend.  Since then I have had T+A DACs here on two more occassions, before and after upgrading to the IFI microidsd Black Label.  In the later comparisons, the T+A certainly has qualities using the balanced outputs that are enjoyable, but overall seems colder to the IFI microidsd BL/LPS-1 combo.  Put another way, I am not and have never been crushed when I have to return the T+A to my friend.

 

The session attendee that voluntarily sent the loaner IFI microidsd last spring has since upgraded to the Black Label. He also owns a Brooklyn and an Auralic Vega.  His source PC is a duplicate of mine.  A couple weeks ago, just for grins, he hooked up his Vega and Brooklyn to compare with the IFI microidsd.  He told me his Vega and Brooklyn are now up for sale.

 

I hope to have a T+A DAC here soon to listen to the impact of most recent upgrades I've made to the source PC.

 

Cornan, I would rather see you put your money into an upsampling machine than a DAC, I think you will both get a better result, and it will leave you with more to tweak!

 

Sorry for the wordy post.

 

Larry

 

Hi Larry,

 

I have to say that I found HQPlayer to be an operational nightmare. In fact I consider it unusable without Roon. Even with Roon, the number of filters and modes in HQP is just insane. And the Roon upsampling settings are equally arcane. I found that when I evaluated HQP, I was always worrying if I had the right/best filters and settings. To me, it just ruined my listening experience.

 

I'll admit - I'm a DAC Luddite. I don't even like filter modes built in DACs. I place tremendous value on a DAC that just does it right in the first place, which is why I love my Codex. It showed zero benefit from any upsampling in HQP. It just sounds great with every sample rate you feed it. Natively. I've heard the same about the Chord DACs, as well as the Brooklyn.

 

I hear what you're saying about the SQ you're getting with the iFi iDSD Black upsampled to DSD512, but for me, I'm too far down the road of networked endpoints to ever go back to a monolithic music player PC with a direct-attached USB DAC.

 

But to each his own. I've been very interested to hear about your extreme winnowing of Win10 processes, and your use of Adnaco, It's just not a path for me.