Let's start with the basics...

[Paul R]

Amen brother!

 

 

While a person may 'want' to go the all in one HTPC route and use the 7.1 analog outs to a power amplifier, anyone and I do mean anyone who has gone down the HTPC route knows that these system are buggy...and I don't mean a tweek here and there....I'm talking all out swarming with bugs. Commercial enterprises have long abandoned HTPC a long time ago with some favoring the stand alone media players. The DIY community still chases the HTPC Holy Grail but not unlike Tom Hanks and Indiana Jones........you get the idea.

 

Don't know what else I can say to the OP to distract him from his all in one vision of the future..........don't do it! Seek an affordable prepro instead I wish I could express in words the condition of my scalp from pulling clumps of hair trying to get to a reliable HTPC experience......it just doesn't exist, even for those that can write their own code and lock down the machine against updates.....which are the equivalent of HTPC cancer.

[Paul R]

I could not resist tweaking you just a bit Forrest... These instructions? And this is before you start playing music...

 

 

Paul:

 

If you would have read the directions it would have only taken an hour. It is only complex by virtue that you can adjust almost everything, an a lot of it is the sort of stuff that makes most Mac players sound different, plus some of Peter's special sauces. Jud is right in that Peter has tons of labor into it and it appears to be a labor of love, not profit. He has some trick stuff going on in it. I wasn't happy about switching to windows, but did it because it sounded better than ANYTHING I had had on Mac. That was on a Mac btw...

[PeterSt]

I could not resist tweaking you just a bit Forrest... These instructions? And this is before you start playing music...

 

Hahaha Paul. I made that for those who run into problems which should not happen in the first place. So, if we look at this like a teaser, then I better remove it. Normally only two of those screens appear; one to confirm that OCX install and one which tells "click here when no other windows are present".

 

But what did I miss that this thread is so much about audio-alone ? I mean, I really don't see my software anywhere close to playing movies ? (unless we would think that the tweaked Operating System by XXHE improves movie playback, which it will - but that would be a new one :-)).

[PeterSt]

Hey Paul,

 

I must have written a few things in the dark (as usual) or there must be some unintentional misunderstandings. So allow me to come back on a few of your remarks.

 

Nice thinking Peter.

(1) Blu-ray sound can be - and often is - astoundingly good. Quite good enough to listen to without the video. Same is true of some (though certainly not all!) DVDs.

 

Not a misunderstanding really, but in my (long) experience any "MP3" sound from any (good) DVD sounds better already because of the good movie. I think Roch said something similar a long time ago ? This is a brain thing. Still, this only works with the good audio DAC and e.g. not with something like a Fireface I mentioned (but OK for the back channels). With this -again in my view- comes along that uncompressed audio is not a necessity.

Btw, because this "MP3" can sound so good with movies, I fairly explicitly tried to let that work for normal audio but *that* does not work. :-)

On the other note, of course Blu Ray can just contain uncompressed audio. But for me, and you know what/how/who I am, I really don't see the need. If I did, I would use it, obviously (having all the gear around).

 

(2) With video, you are much more liable to want multiple sources than with audio

 

Can you eleborate ? I call myself the pioneer in movie playback 100% through the computer and for example back at the time I was the only one in these circles who decoded DTS in software. Not important, but "pioneer" should tell I am doing this somewhat longer by now. Never ever I was in lack of a connection anywhere, because no connection ever is needed. Do notice that we incorporate more than just audio or movie, and also TV, sat TV etc. and that latter too just goes through software (but with hardware decoders).

Btw, you don't hear me say this is for everyone and actually I woudn't advise it. But movie playback combined with audio playback ? I really don't see it working (only) like you suggest. And hey, there just *is* no preamp ("input switcher") in my rack.

And so, please enlighten ?

 

(5) DACs like the Phasure are world class no doubt, but software to drive them to the full potential is absurdly complex for most folks.

 

No comprendo. Somehow, still, you (not only you as it seems) see a relation with audio-alone playback. There is no "software to drive" any DAC other than a driver which comes into play most often these days. So when I have the movie playback software I select a sound device, which indeed in my case by pure coincidence is named "Phasure NOS1 WDM Renderer" (as a WASAPI device). You'd encounter the same for your HiFace device or what it is you use here. So ?

... So, totally unrelated Paul.

 

But - regardless, you still need something to mix the multi-channel inputs down to two channels,

 

No. regardless nothing. But shall we say you never used a video playback program ? Ok, wait :

 

So can products like JRMC - especially if you feed that 2 channel audio out via WASPI to a really decent USB DAC.

 

I don't know whether JRMC can do just that, but if you say so ... you are the most confusing the least. And thus :

 

But - regardless, you still need something to mix the multi-channel inputs down to two channels, and a Prepro does that just fine.

 

A PrePro does that just fine. True. So, get yourself one while it is totally unnecessary ??

Like I said - a strange thread.

 

Yeah, I am probably a little grumpy and don't mean to come off that way, but it got under my skin a bit how dismissive you are of video. It has a lot of attractions.

 

I'm under the table here. Why don't you start writing some decent English so I can understand you ? Bwahahaha

IOW, where, ever, did you get it from my perfect Dutch that I am dismissive of video ? At first I thought your were kidding, but that last sentence makes you serious, right ? How on earth did I get you there ??

I'll sneak in that I regard myself more a "video king" back at the DVD time and which was all about stutter free upscaling in software than I do today with audio. Ok, sort of (pick what I mean :-). But when HD movies came about I didn't see the usecase of it anymore. I started "upsampling" then (2005). Haha.

 

Regards,

Peter

[PeterSt]

While a person may 'want' to go the all in one HTPC route and use the 7.1 analog outs to a power amplifier, anyone and I do mean anyone who has gone down the HTPC route knows that these system are buggy...and I don't mean a tweek here and there....I'm talking all out swarming with bugs. Commercial enterprises have long abandoned HTPC a long time ago with some favoring the stand alone media players. The DIY community still chases the HTPC Holy Grail but not unlike Tom Hanks and Indiana Jones........you get the idea.

 

True within itself. So, looking at my previous posts, this for 100% sure -back at the time- was true. It needed me to start a movie, and I always started out with having a "stress drink" in advance, which up to date is a known phenomenon in the house here. But with something like Media Player Classic this is not true anymore. All it requires is a setup for all you want to play (which can be a lot more than any processor will do) and which in our case includes sub titles which can be that other dimension of pain. Do notice that since I don't want to be involved in starting movies anymore (I've a trauma leftover of it :-) I left this all to my wife now, including the whole setup of things. It still isn't for everybody, but for those into "HTPCs", it should be okay.

 

Don't know what else I can say to the OP to distract him from his all in one vision of the future..........don't do it! Seek an affordable prepro instead I wish I could express in words the condition of my scalp from pulling clumps of hair trying to get to a reliable HTPC experience......it just doesn't exist, even for those that can write their own code and lock down the machine against updates.....which are the equivalent of HTPC cancer.

 

Contrary me ...

True. Well, almost, because I would get me a decent movie hardware player. Again almost true, because I have a few of them but no one does it all (well, not the ones I own). But anyway, here too, don't get yourself something in the middle or half-way. Get that hardware player or use the PC all the way. I really don't see the combination work for the better.

 

To summarize it all from my view (but which is not exactly what the OP asked for I think) : HTPC is out. History.

But careful here, because the HTPC from today would be just that random modern PC onto which you should load Media Player Classic, and that's it. It actually doesn't need a thing different from the PC you already own. This makes it an easy trial.

 

I'd have to add (before someone comes up with it) that my HTPC from back then consisted of 3 hardware cards with maybe 20 outputs or so on it. It contained everything, BUT, now this is about the output to the "beamer". This can be all sorts of interfaces, including what we'd call i2s on the audio side (a real low level protocol). All these outputs by itself have vanished *if* you regard analogue as history (which is not true for everybody). So, beamers or other display means are digital, and this is DVI or HDMI - and that's all. But don't skip the analogue Barco's because then you need more, and you won't get that for a PC anymore. Now you'd need the PrePro for *that*.

Upscaling the same. This could be in hardware too (Faroudja). By itself it is important to understand that no modern in-PC upscaling hardware will exist, and this relates to DVD playback. So, what all 50$ DVD players contain for upscaling, is not available in hardware for in-PC. But this is how the software comes along again, and it is done in-software. Maybe not as good as the dedicated software from back at the time (which was only one : TheaterTek) but also not worse than a DVD player will do. When this is to be outbettered from what the software solutions can do (and with a lot of tweaking which will not be for your wife you still can get there) then again it needs outboard upscaling devices. And again it gets more complicated.

 

But when we regard DVD as a now and then means for video playback this all isn't needed because Blu Ray movies don't need a thing for processing (yea, some decoding).

 

To be clear (because of all my exceptions and stuff) and again : HTPC is out.

 

Anything else ? one small thing :

The best audio (but don't let this be a discussion here) comes from no preamp (this will exclude some options). Now, when you go the route of a hardware video player you'd need a volume control on that, and it most probably won't be there. So, or search for one when you agree that any "pre" like thing will kill your audio, or exclude it as an option. But also : these devices won't allow any good audio DAC to connect, assumed that your DAC does not take SPDIF for input (but USB etc.). And so it is this as the main reason I use the HTPC, outside of the sheer fact that I can play all the formats this way.

Maybe I can't reason out myself in what "PrePro" situations this applies to more, but think about your audio DAC connection and whether this will ever connect to that device which decodes.

 

Confused ?

[mayhem13]

Good summation Pete!

 

True, i purposely left out up scaling as most displays do a fine job of it or at least as good as generic DVD and BD players ( sans Oppo, DVDo, etc)

 

I've often thought of trying again, maybe with MPC and some of the custom skins.....but my scalp hasn't healed yet and I'm a little thin on top. Lol. The new 3G intel ivy ridge chips with HD4000 graphics are pretty impressive.

[Paul R]

Hi Peter -

 

Difficult to reply to that. Basically, I think you have your ideas about audio and video, and they are pretty good.

 

Talk about unclear though, I have no idea what you are trying to say. So let's make it easy.

 

1. Bluray players can put out very high quality uncompressed audio.

 

2. Bluray discs often contain very high quality uncompressed audio.

 

3. Transmitting that over an HDMI connection, with or without video, does not seem to do much if any harm to the audio.

 

4. I see no reason why HDMI is not at least as good as media to transmit signal over as is S/PDIF or USB.

 

1 & 2 are facts. 3 is at least in part, opinion. 4 is pure opinion.

 

Video is rather irrelevant I think.

[tgthree]

I'd look at this from the standpoint of sound quality for money rather than "I'm paying for DSP capability I don't need.

 

I understand your point here, and I thank you for your patience with me as I try to explain what I'm looking for. In addition to the possible extra cost of paying for unnecessary DSP capability, I also worry about "double processing." If I get my PC processing the sound the way I want it processed, I don't then want it running through another device's processor where it might get re-processed or otherwise messed with. That's not to say that a MH or other device doesn't do good work with DSP, just that having a PC DSP solution and an external DSP might get to be too many cooks in the kitchen, if you take my meaning.

 

If it is like most, your sound card likely has both analog and digital outputs.

 

Ah, I do see now that I'm looking in more detail that the four minijack outputs are analog coming out of the sound card. So how then would those analog outputs (already run through Burr-Brown DACs on the particular sound card that I'm looking at) best be connected to amplifiers? Would a cable with a minijack on one end and an RCA jack on the other suffice? How then do the four signals coming out of the sound card get split left and right for the amp?

 

It sounds like you want to take a multichannel format, like TrueHD, break out the individual PCM streams, and send those to a DAC.

 

I want to take any sound format that you can possibly imagine that comes out of a PC (crappy stereo sound from YouTube, multichannel sound from high-end music downloads, gaming sound, online whoopie cushions, Blu-Ray movie audio, you name it) and funnel it into an amplifier for playback through a 7.1 surround sound system. And I want to get the most sound quality for my money, given my willingness to fiddle around with settings and codecs, etc. Now I'm realizing that the "multichannel" sound cards do have DACs built in, so perhaps it's just a connectivity question (see above).

 

Rather than asking people to prove that to you, go and listen to a $39 sound card, and a decent USB DAC. If you don't hear a differene, or like the $30 soundcard better, there you go. You can connect the analog outputs from the soundcard to whatever you are using to drive your speakers with inexpensive minijack to RCA cables.

 

I'm not asking anyone to "prove" anything to me. I'm curious what the actual differences are so that I can make educated decisions about what to buy. I'm an engineer by trade (not an electrical or acoustic one, though, unfortunately), so while I love going out and listening to all different kinds of equipment to see what sounds best to me, I also like to know what exactly I'm paying for. Furthermore, a lot of the setups I'm thinking about are unusual or "experimental," so it's not like I can go to Best Buy or even your more dedicated HT stores and find demo setups of $2500 custom-built HTPCs running through $2500 8-channel DACs.

 

However, unless I am mistaken, the OP is using something other than a Mac. A Mac is required, at the very least for initial setup of the Metric Halo units and is further required to get all these wonderful devices are capable of.

 

Thank you for your response, Mr. Diament, but I do have to say I'm a Windows guy through and through. As a guy that likes to dabble in swapping out software and hardware (and even building/writing some of his own sometimes), Mac just isn't an option.

 

So, there comes along someone with questions about a HTPC. Shall I dig up some WikiPedia description of that, or are we at Computer Audiophile too much into the audio part and skip the computer ??

 

I have to say that while I didn't understand a lot of this rant, I am surprised how many people on a "computer audiophile" forum are saying that a computer-based solution won't work. I don't mean that as a criticism, and I recognize that what I'm trying to do isn't especially conventional. But that's why I came to this forum for help.

 

I am still not sure if I understand where the difficulties for the OP are about this however...

 

The difficulties are still in figuring out the best way to get sound (whatever that may be) from my computer to a 7.1 audio system. Not the easiest way, but the best sounding way. I'm about to build a PC that will be the only PC in my household, and I want it to handle everything that I do on a day-to-day basis through one display and speaker system. That means web browsing, movies, music, a little gaming, and anything else I or you can think to do on a computer

 

I'm still very open to a standard PC HDMI output to A/V receiver setup, but I can get that recommendation from the guy at Best Buy where most of the customers don't care about much of anything except that they can open the box and be watching movies perfectly 15 minutes later. I came to the forum to see what innovative or unusual designs might be out there for people willing to trade ease of use for sound quality. My initial theory was that this trade-off would come by eliminating the cost of giant stacks of dedicated audio equipment for an in-PC solution where simple software upgrades can help maximize future-proofing and customization. Maybe I'm wrong, and I admit that. But I'm interested in reading the discussion among posters that have tried different solutions using a PC as a home theater's nerve center.

 

Don't know what else I can say to the OP to distract him from his all in one vision of the future..........don't do it!

 

Unfortunately, not much. This is my vision of the future. I think that the future of the home theater lies in the computer, especially as more and more of our A/V content comes off the Web, and not necessarily only through "cookie cutter" services like Netflix that are easily handled by media center software. The HTPC I'm planning to build will be the only computer in my household. If I want to shop on Amazon, listen to my iTunes collection, or watch a Blu-Ray movie, it's all going to be done on the same PC and display. I do think that this is the future. Perhaps the technology isn't mature yet, but I've always been an early adopter willing to put up with a few headaches to have the latest and greatest.

[Paul R]

Well, other than a few people, like Peter, most of us have not had great success with putting together HTPCs. And yes, before you ask, most of the people I am talking about, like myself, have built dozens if not hundreds of computers, starting back in the day when a 286 processor was hot stuff. The lack of success isn't from a lack of skill or knowledge.

 

As pointed out, a PC running Windows and JRMC puts you about 95% of the way to where you want to be. But it isn't perfect. Things will still conflict, crash, and in general, be dratted annoying.

 

As for the technical differences between a $39 sound card and a $1000 DAC, well, it's arguable. Digital data is digital data and should all sound the same, right? Actually, that is not right, but the reasons why are decidely unclear at this time.

 

You can certainly go into any reputable HT shop and they will have multi-thousand dollar systems you can listen to and see. Most shops will let you audition a system configured just the way you want, and often they will even do that in your home. A lot of shops will even let you listen to the gear in their shop knowing you are going to build a HTPC.

 

At least part of that reason is simple - the gear they sell is much simpler and more reliable, at least in their experience.

 

I keep hearing you say you don't want to double the DSP, you want to do all that in your PC. That's fine, something like JRMC will do exactly that. In the digital domain, well before it ever gets translated to analog signals.

 

Translating it to analog can be done on a sound card. Or it can be done with an external DAC. You can use the digital output from your sound card to drive the external DAC.

 

If you want external multi-channel output, then HDMI driving a Prepro is a very good way to go indeed. Just don't use the DSP on the PrePro if you don't want to, something like JRMC can do most of that on the PC processor anyway. Or you can use a multi-channel DAC, almost all of which are *also* capable of DSP processing.

 

It's really that simple. You can make it as much more complex than that as you wish, but please note that the more complex it is, the more likely it is to crash, malfunction, exhibit inane behavior, and frustrate you.

 

If you choose to go down the path of putting the majority of the DSP on an external device, then something like a Raspberry PI is a really interesting platform to look at. It has enough memory and CPU to play 1080p video with multi-channel sound, and has some interesting options. Especially if you break out of a "Windows" mindset and use one of the Linux distributions on it.

 

-Paul

 

 

I'm not asking anyone to "prove" anything to me. I'm curious what the actual differences are so that I can make educated decisions about what to buy. I'm an engineer by trade (not an electrical or acoustic one, though, unfortunately), so while I love going out and listening to all different kinds of equipment to see what sounds best to me, I also like to know what exactly I'm paying for. Furthermore, a lot of the setups I'm thinking about are unusual or "experimental," so it's not like I can go to Best Buy or even your more dedicated HT stores and find demo setups of $2500 custom-built HTPCs running through $2500 8-channel DACs.

[mitchco]

Aloha tgthree,

 

I custom built a Windows PC almost 18 months ago for a similar purpose that you are asking about. I use it everyday and have had 0 issues. The build is nothing special other than an over rated power supply.

 

 

I highly recommend JMRC 18. I use my computer to play/burn Blu-Ray, DVD, CDROM, stream MOG, Netflix, and others (love Groove Salad). I can listen to downloads of 24/192 HDTracks,(while using DSP Convolution in JRMC for speaker/room correction) at the same time browsing the internet, downloading from my Zune Pass, while JRMC indexes the download in the background, all at the same time without a hiccup in sound quality.

 

Others have had excellent success as well. Check out Brad’s multi-channel 7.3 tri-amplified home theatre system. Brad uses the Lynx Aurora converters. I believe you can request a demo Aurora unit to try yourself. Lynx makes good sounding products (I use a Lynx Hilo). I would be surprised if you were dissapointed.

 

Cheers,

 

Mitch

[mayhem13]

So are you passing multichannel analog OR digital from the PC?

[4est]

The mini jacks are stereo, just get cords with 2 RCAs

[Jud]

I understand your point here, and I thank you for your patience with me as I try to explain what I'm looking for. In addition to the possible extra cost of paying for unnecessary DSP capability, I also worry about "double processing." If I get my PC processing the sound the way I want it processed, I don't then want it running through another device's processor where it might get re-processed or otherwise messed with. That's not to say that a MH or other device doesn't do good work with DSP, just that having a PC DSP solution and an external DSP might get to be too many cooks in the kitchen, if you take my meaning.

 

Well, it's kind of a moot point, since you're sticking with Windows, but the DSP functions in the Metric Halo are defeatable, so you wouldn't be stuck with "double DSP."

 

I thought that Mitchco's comment outlined a path that's worth thinking about - seemed a bit less complicated than some of the other alternatives, and my strong supposition is it would sound better than using the analog outputs from your card.

 

Oh, and - I heartily recommend trying PeterSt's software for the audio portion of your program(s).

[tgthree]

Things will still conflict, crash, and in general, be dratted annoying.

 

Well, you know what they say about needing to learn the hard way sometimes.

 

You can certainly go into any reputable HT shop and they will have multi-thousand dollar systems you can listen to and see. Most shops will let you audition a system configured just the way you want, and often they will even do that in your home. A lot of shops will even let you listen to the gear in their shop knowing you are going to build a HTPC.

 

Oh, I know they'll let you listen to any darned thing they carry any way you can imagine it, but that wasn't my point. I've never been to any shop that has bunches of custom HTPCs lying around for you to try out any of the zillion different ways you could configure a system like this (internal sound card vs. external sound card vs. using a standalone DAC vs. not using a standalone DAC vs. HDMI vs. digital out vs. analog...you get my point). At least some of this decision process is going to have to be made just from reading and a good bit of guessing. Hence my call for help.

 

You can make it as much more complex than that as you wish, but please note that the more complex it is, the more likely it is to crash, malfunction, exhibit inane behavior, and frustrate you.

 

There's a trade-off here. I don't want complexity just for complexity's sake, but I do believe that some additional complexity and willingness to tolerate frustration can give you extra customization, future-proofing and value. That's the balance I'm trying to strike here.

 

If you choose to go down the path of putting the majority of the DSP on an external device, then something like a Raspberry PI is a really interesting platform to look at. It has enough memory and CPU to play 1080p video with multi-channel sound, and has some interesting options. Especially if you break out of a "Windows" mindset and use one of the Linux distributions on it.

 

Will take a gander. Thanks for the recommendations and patience.

 

 

Aloha tgthree,

 

I custom built a Windows PC almost 18 months ago for a similar purpose that you are asking about. I use it everyday and have had 0 issues. The build is nothing special other than an over rated power supply.

 

Aloha Mitch...it sounds like of all the people that have responded to this thread, you are the closest to what I'm imagining here. So the big question is, how does the audio signal in your setup get from computer to speakers?

 

So are you passing multichannel analog OR digital from the PC?

 

Could be either. Seems most decent sound cards can handle both. So what would give the best sound from the analog, what would give the best from digital...if we assume for a moment that I wouldn't want to do any re-processing after the sound leaves the PC's sound card? And which of those two would you recommend overall?

 

The mini jacks are stereo, just get cords with 2 RCAs

 

Wouldn't that send the same signal to both the left and right channels though?

[PeterSt]

The mini jacks are stereo, just get cords with 2 RCAs

 

...

[PeterSt]

After this all, and reading your original post once again, I would do this (watch out, theoretically, so read through to the end) :

 

Audio part

 

Get yourself whatever you like for the best audio within your budget. But, this means : no soundcard for that in your HTPC. Consider those rubbish for good sound, whether that be analog-out from the sound card or digital out to a good DAC.

More options for this exist than you will like, and say that this forum is all about that part only. Your most fitting and convenient solution will be a USB DAC though (I think).

Notice that with good audio comes a good amplifier for it. So again, make this part consistent within itself.

Also "know" that good sound is produced by dedicated audio playback software. Today this will not be the same software which will play your movies.

 

Movie part

 

Here you can use that internal souncard. That is, multichannel assumed. Your most efficient way would be having the (2) front channels routed through your audio DAC (see above) and have the other channels through cheap means of amplification. BUT, now it gets more tricky and it needs experience to get those other channels routed through other D/A means. Take it you won't succeed on it (I couldn't do it either with my current setup). This means that your "efficient" way won't work, and you will be better off with a dedicated route for the Movie part. Like outputting the 8 channels from the internal soundcard into a dedicated set (Pre-Pro with 8 ch amp). *Here* now the difficulty will be that you can't use the normal (front) stereo speakers because for audio they are already connected to your audio stereo amp. With some tinkering you might find a way without ever changing cables, but it wouldn't be a convenient way.

 

Practical

 

Because the above is somewhat theory only, it leaves you with this I think (notice that this takes audio for prevalence) :

Get yourself a decent multi channel D/A converter. The Metric Halo was mentioned as a fine example, but is Mac. For Windows there are options too, and in my view -for good audio- you may end up at Prism. So, you will end up with Pro stuff always (Pro sounds Pro but is not at all regarding SQ), and Prism will suit you for SQ. Or DAD, better but more expensive. But anyway, think of going out from the PC with Firewire or USB to that one multichannel DAC with those 8 analog outputs you need; Which set of outputs (stereo, 7.1 etc.) is active is determined by the playback software (audio or video). So, selected in the PC.

 

The outputs of the DAC *now* can go to your main stereo amp (with speakers connected to that) and to that other (6ch) amp at the same time; When you play audio the other 6 channels are dead (and the 6ch amp is off) and when you play a movie they are engaged (and the 6ch amp is on). Now you are where you want to be, and all is arranged by this one (HT)PC.

To keep in mind : setting it up like this will not need a preamp, and whether you need a processor is up to you (how "difficult" are you gong to make it for decoding and mixing video playback software) but when you need a processor a preamp will come along with it.

 

There's one thing left in my view : please consider your "audiophile" aspirations and hold that against your budget. So, not wanting to reprocess etc. *is* the best thing to stribe for (and please, this is my life), but it is only a theoretical good thing that implies practical problems or a lot of money needed. So, when you look at Prism or DAD and find yourself against the 10K range for only that multichannel good audio DAC, consider that RME Fireface800. This gives you the same functionality (and more) than those expensive DACs but now for something like 1400 USD. I'm sure Weiss will have things like these as well, but mind the functionality with mixing and proper DTS pass-on or whatever you may want - this is all in the RME (I promise). But listen through it for an Audio DAC, because this is the real Pro stuff, and this is not audiophile. In the mean time though, the RME allows you to pass-through the digital signal of a pair of channels, and that again can go to that audio DAC which you connect behind it. But mind the "theoretical parts" above, because you again will run into the difficulties described.

 

Regards,

Peter

[PeterSt]

This is a bit for fun, but it may make you think better about how you could start out with this all;

 

 

This is the motherboard and some stuff of the audio PC we provide. The video card we provide (under 30 USD) does all what makes it a HTPC. We don't sell it like that, but it just does (any gamer would be jaleous). Now, the motherboard already has 7.1 channels (look at the mini jack outputs) and the video card has another pile of that (plus HDMI output, btw more pictures here : CPU considerations).

 

What I wanted to say is : when you build any PC like this, you will find yourself having those audio outputs right there. So, it doesn't even need that soundcard. This is how it goes today.

This means, and I tried to tell that earlier, that you can just make you a PC and you can start to try for further free;

With some more attention you can do as we do and make it the most powerful *and* silent at the same time, and that in a small housing which will go nicely in your audio rack.

 

I hope this gets you started.

Peter

[4est]

"The mini jacks are stereo, just get cords with 2 RCAs

...

 

Ha ha, those jacks have two signals each as noted by: Ctr/Sbw, but yes of course a mobo with the jacks would work as well!

[mitchco]

Aloha Mitch...it sounds like of all the people that have responded to this thread, you are the closest to what I'm imagining here. So the big question is, how does the audio signal in your setup get from computer to speakers?

 

Aloha tgthree, I use JMRC 18 for everything. In addition to my Zune Pass, I also download from iTunes, which is indexed by JRMC, so when I am in MC, all my songs from any location/service show up in one consistent view where I can play and manage everything, including videos, and streaming services.

 

JRMC also has plugins for Netflix, Hulu, Internet Radio, etc., plus theater view. From an audiophile perspective, JRiver employs a state of the art 64-bit audio engine, which optionally has loopback and ASIO line input modes.

 

For example, the loopback capability allows one to take the output of Netflix (or whatever source) and digitally loop it back into JRiver’s 64 bit audio engine, where any DSP plugin can be inserted into the chain for processing. In my case, I use the 64-bit Convolution engine to insert a linear phase FIR filter for speaker/room correction, others host electronic crossover, etc. With +6600 high resolution DSP plugins available today, anything is possible.

 

JRMC also employs a 64-bit software volume control, that is bit-perfect, plus volume protection to reduce the chance of 0dBFS walking the down the line. Most folks, including myself, use JRiver’s internal and/or system volume control. This approach allows taking the analog line output from the DAC and plugging it directly into the amplifier, times how many channels are required.

 

When I had my Lynx L22, this is how I had it configured. With my Lynx Hilo, I use the onboard analog monitor control, but the analog line output still plugs directly into the amplifiers.

 

Another 8 channel USB DAC is the Exasound e18 (the Lynx Aurora is also USB) and recommends, “the only device needed between a computer and a high-end analogue audio amplifier.” Just like the Aurora, looks like a 30 day trial.

 

You could also ping Brad on the Audiolense forum I linked to earlier if you want his take on the Aurora and his setup and/or post your q on the JRiver forum to get other opinions. No doubt there are other 8 channel DAC’s, I just referenced two. Both DAC’s I mention supply their own ASIO driver’s which I recommend using as it allows JRiver to communicate directly (with low latency) with the DAC and bypass Windows audio subsystem altogether.

 

Merry Xmas

 

Mitch