(not so golden) Ears

[The Computer Audiophile]

I was unaware of the occlusion effect. Very interesting.

 

A related question -> If protection keeps much of the noise out if the ear canal how does occlusion manifest itself?

 

Is it correct to assume a protection device that attenuates by 20 db may be similar to no device at all because the occlusion effect can increase low frequency sounds by 20 db? I'm over simplifying I know.

 

As a user of Ultimate Ears customs the occlusion effect has me very intrigued.

[esldude]

Yeah, I can see in some cases the occlusion effect with over the ear muff type protectors. I think the noise can transmit from them inside. For instance, when mowing the lawn, they keep out mower noise, but if you bump into a tree limb the noise inside is pretty loud. In turbulent air, like an open car, some of that same effect gets inside at times.

 

For open air motoring that lasts very long at highway speeds, I use the foam ear plug inserts. Though technically illegal, no one will know you have them on. They make me much less tired out at the end of a long drive. They aren't uncomfortable. The main issue is putting them in takes a minute and unlike over the ear protectors you cannot pull them off/putt them back on in two seconds. I don't get any occlusion effect from the foam inserts.

 

"but the much better solution is to simply have a quiet, closed cabin car."

 

I think someone misses the point of open air motoring.

[sandyk]

"I think someone misses the point of open air motoring. "

 

You like the sound of the wind whistling through your ears ? (grin.)

[esldude]

"I think someone misses the point of open air motoring. "

 

You like the sound of the wind whistling through your ears ? (grin.)

 

 

Well, a bit of the sound, sound of things around, smells, and mainly the experience of movement with the feel of the moving air that goes with it. A closed, quiet cabin is about isolation. An open cockpit is about experience of movement in your immediate environment rather than isolation from it.

[JonP]

I was unaware of the occlusion effect. Very interesting.

 

A related question -> If protection keeps much of the noise out if the ear canal how does occlusion manifest itself?

 

Is it correct to assume a protection device that attenuates by 20 db may be similar to no device at all because the occlusion effect can increase low frequency sounds by 20 db? I'm over simplifying I know.

 

As a user of Ultimate Ears customs the occlusion effect has me very intrigued.

 

Hi Chris,

 

Two good examples of how occlusion can make things worse are wearing musician's ear plugs in windy conditions when the external sound pressure levels don't technically require them, and when cleaning your teeth with any sort of hearing protection.

 

In the first case, the wind sound resonates against the plug which in turn resonates the ear canal. The wind noise becomes extremely loud - far worse than not wearing anything at all.

 

In the second case, the sound is mainly via bone conduction and again the ear canal acts as an echo / amplification chamber.

 

My audiologist was rather vague on the technical aspects of occlusion but she said it is a big problem she has to deal with when it comes to hearing aids (which might describe as turbocharged musicians ear plugs).

 

The ultimate occlusion torture would be to wear any sort of ear protection whilst your dentist cleans your teeth with a scaler device or drilling for a filling. The noise will become overwhelmingly loud and one is better off keeping the ear canal open.

[The Computer Audiophile]

Thanks JonP.

[Brian A]

Well, a bit of the sound, sound of things around, smells, and mainly the experience of movement with the feel of the moving air that goes with it. A closed, quiet cabin is about isolation. An open cockpit is about experience of movement in your immediate environment rather than isolation from it.

Exactly!!! (and if we have to explain it, they just won’t understand.)

 

For open air motoring that lasts very long at highway speeds, I use the foam ear plug inserts… I don't get any occlusion effect from the foam inserts.

I do exactly the same as you do. Actually, the foam ear plugs are good too for just preventing ear aches from wind on cold days.

 

1987? That's positively modern! … Whereas the aerodynamics probably are much better in the BMW, so that you get less noise at equivalent speed, it is probably also capable of much higher speeds than my Morgan, so you probably reach similar noise levels. But I bet you do less driving in rain in California than I do here in The Netherlands...

The BMW has interesting aerodynamics: the car gets wind noise up to about 75 mph, but above that it goes silent as the windshield eddy seems to stretch behind the rear seat and can’t swirl back. Must be designed for the Autobahn, which is fine in California since if you are not going 80 mph on the Interstates, you are passed by old ladies driving Priuses.

[JonP]

Well, I do understand the car thing. I am a motor racing nut who loves F1 and touring cars and have been all of my adult life. On the road I earned a licence that enabled me to drive tourist coaches and in between jobs I used to drive large, noisy 20 tonne diesel trucks through city streets. I also qualified for a CAMS motor racing licence but did not bother to actually get it because of health issues and the fact that I would never have been able to afford racing anyway. But unlike years gone by, I no longer attend race meetings (only watch whatever is on TV) because I am conscious these days about what noise does to one's hearing. I don't like wearing ear plugs of any sort if it is avoidable because the skin in my ear canal is sensitive to the materials used to make ear plugs. I have to use a steroid cream after use in order to avoid a skin reaction which results in itching and peeling.

 

So for me, as much as I appreciate and understand the pleasure people get from cars, for me I want that particular experience to be as quiet and relaxing as possible. Even Alan Jones, the ex-World F1 Champion siad years ago that when motoring on the actual road, he wanted luxury, comfort and quietness (he owned a Toyota Cressida at the time I think). My current car is a 2006 model Mazda 2 and boy it it noisy. My mother's car is a Toyota Yaris and it is noisy too. Don't even ask about the 1957 Himan Minx I used to drive. But I drove a friend's Ford Focus turbo some time back and was astonished that despite how powerful and sporty it was, it was relatively quiet and civilised inside - much quieter than a Ford Fiesta I drove which is supposed to be the little brother to the Focus. I could have driven that focus Turbo all day flat out without feeling any auditory fatique, yet driving the Mazda 2 to the shops and back is an assault on my ears. I also drove a friend's Porsche 911 and it too was much nicer on the ears than even the average small hatchback (but it is true that some engines and exhausts are music to my ears - I never got tired of the sound of the Nissan Skyline 6 cylinder turbo group A cars or the Ford Cosworth Sierras).

 

My next car is going to have to be small but sophisticated. I would like to get a VW Golf but my service man has warned about the not-so-good spare parts problems with them in Australia. I would love to wait until electric cars are mainstream because they ought to be really quiet, but my car will be due for replacement when it is 10 years old and I doubt electric cars will even be remotely mainstream by then.

 

All I can say is that the older I have gotten, the more I enjoy silence (or at least relative quiet). I am glad to be semi-retired and living in a home where apart from the music of my choice (at the volume level of my choice), about the loudest noises I hear are the washing machine and the compressor in my refrigerator (and the motor racing on TV, but limited to around 51 dBA maximum if my SPL meter is accurate).

[The Computer Audiophile]

Speaking of racing, I tuned in the last 30 minutes of the Indy 500 over the weekend. Good stuff.

[JonP]

Speaking of racing, I tuned in the last 30 minutes of the Indy 500 over the weekend. Good stuff.

 

Here in Australia there is a great deal of annoyance that we are no longer getting Formula 1 live. It is broadcast around 24 or 25 hours later. It is, however broadcast in fuzzy, artefact ridden standard definition live. But try to watch F1 in standard definition and it's hopeless. You can barely make out the different cars.

 

Whilst there will always be controversy of high res versus standard audio, anyone with normal eyesight can easily see the difference between SD and HD sports on TV!

[mitchco]

Love F1! If you get 2 minutes to watch and listen in HD. Btw, if you have a PS3 and Gran Turismo 5, you can race the same car on the same beautiful Monaco circuit. GT5 has amazing graphics - looks just like this video. Sounds incredible in 5.1... While my best time is 1:18, I can only make it around a couple of laps before crashing... Maybe I should take the earplugs out ;-)

 

[video=youtube_share;U6H9HtL-AzA]http://youtu.be/U6H9HtL-AzA?hd=1

[thesurfingalien]

Hi Julf & All,

 

Maybe not applicable for driving motorized vehicles of some kind, but perhaps a tip for home-made ear protection to provide protection while attending (amplified) concerts etc...

 

Take two little pieces of cotton-wool (you will have to experiment with the size for a bit) and acid-free Vaseline. Any pharmacy will have it.

 

Rub the cotton with a (tiny) bit of Vaseline, sort of mixing it. The resulting balls will have to become sticky. Use those to put in your ears, but be careful not to put them deep in your ear canal. Keep it superficial and easy to remove!

 

I do have professional ear-protection, but these become quite uncomfortable after half an hour. The cotton-vaseline does the same job but is way more comfortable.

 

Peter

[Julf]

I do have professional ear-protection, but these become quite uncomfortable after half an hour. The cotton-vaseline does the same job but is way more comfortable.

 

That is a great tip, Peter - will definitely try it this weekend - will spend it driving an old electronic warfare truck, with a V8 in the cab and not much sound insulation.

[Julf]

Love F1!

 

I used to follow F1, but then I discovered classic road racing. Much more exciting, with people actually passing each other, doing tail slides, and in cars that don't all look the same! My favourite event is definitely the Goodwood Revival - Historic Motorsport & Aviation Event

[thesurfingalien]

Hi Julf,

 

It works well for me... I once went to a Joe Satriani concert in Ahoy, and some guys saw me put in the cotton before the show started. They were making fun of me "Ohhhh... the wussy can not stand loud music" .

 

After the first song, 2 of those guys came up to me asking me if I had more cotton, which I did, and I gave it to them. I obviously could not resist the remark "Who is the wussy now :-)". Later on, they brought me a beer as a "thank you & apology", and asked me what the greasy stuff was. They planned on using my "receipt" for future concerts.

 

If the trade-off for not having ringing ears after a concert (or other loud event) is being called a wussy, well... I happily be a wussy :-)

 

Peter

[Julf]

Peter,

 

If the trade-off for not having ringing ears after a concert (or other loud event) is being called a wussy, well... I happily be a wussy :-)

 

WHAT? SAY AGAIN!

[thesurfingalien]

Wussy!!! :-)

[Julf]

Wussy!!! :-)

 

Not a word I would use very loudly in the neighbourhood of the Ahoy, but that might be my Amsterdam prejudices...

[thesurfingalien]

Not a word I would use very loudly in the neighbourhood of the Ahoy, but that might be my Amsterdam prejudices...

 

I would not anywhere :-)

 

Not sure why Ahoy would be an especially bad place for that though :-)

 

Peter

[Julf]

Not sure why Ahoy would be an especially bad place for that though :-)

 

Too close to Rotterdam