Audirvana Studio

[Jud]

Damien on the Audirvana forums about what the analysis does:

 

"No data is shared, all we do is analyzing your track to have the Accoustic ID of the track and then with Musicbrainz we are displaying the missing metadata in Audirvana (we are not adding them in your track)."

[Jud]

1 minute ago, wolft said:

Hello, again, is it possible to use a DAC witch is connected via USB to a Signalist NAA (Windows)? If yes, how?

Wolft

 

 

Audirvana uses UPnP/DLNA, which is a standard way to remotely connect audio, while NAA is Miska's own creation, not the same thing.  So on whatever component is running NAA, you would have to install or activate UPnP/DLNA. What are you running as your NAA?

[Jud]

The result of the analysis is to append a MusicBrainz ID to the file so additional metadata MusicBrainz has can be shown when you look at the album - *without* overwriting any of your own metadata or other file information.

 

I can easily understand @Musicophile's reluctance to have additional information cluttering the carefully curated metadata for his 100k+ tracks, a good chunk of them classical.

 

For my own part, I would like to see whether this would be recognized as a difference by my backup program and result in new uploads of those files. I haven't tested yet. (If so, I wonder if there's a way to tell various backup apps to ignore these changes?)

[Jud]

2 minutes ago, Torq said:

 

It will.

 

If you're lucky, and your backup solution is smart enough, it may only backup the changed blocks rather than the entire file, but it'll be backing up something for every touched file.  File backup systems generally aren't built to be conditional on what has changed, beyond block-level change-detection and deduplication.

 

Would you happen to know if there are ways to ignore this particular change in rclone and Chronosync, the two backup apps I use most often? Otherwise I can ask on forums or customer support.

[Jud]

Just now, Musicophile said:

I'm just running my regular backup with CCC. And every single file that Studio modified is being backed up.

 

Because I don't have the number of files you do, I'm not concerned about local backup. If a TB of my files are backed up to the cloud, that means an extra charge from my ISP, unless I hold off to the end of a month so about half goes in one month and about half in the next.

[Jud]

1 minute ago, matthias said:

 

Is it possible that the tag imposes a sonic signature on the file as well?

 

Matt

 

Change the spelling of an artist's name in your metadata: from "Rolling Stones" to "The Rolling Stones," for example. Think that changes the sound?

 

These files have standard locations for metadata separate from the audio information specifically so that audio is unaffected.

[Jud]

12 minutes ago, Manolo47 said:

So, no user’s manual? At least I did not find any. So 3 simple questions that I would appreciate being answewred.

1. I am a 3.5 user so with that in mind;

Audirvana remote not connecting to my MacBook Pro via my network, no code appears in the Mac…

 

The remote is coming.  A workaround I use for the moment is the free version of RealVNC.

 

12 minutes ago, Manolo47 said:

2. I cannot find anything related or that mentions Library. I have my music in an external drive connected to the Mac.So what am I missing?

 

Your local music is shown in the Local area on the bottom left of the screen (at least it's this way in Windows).

 

12 minutes ago, Manolo47 said:

3. And was able to play Qobuz, but I don’t see how to see the list of tracks in the album.. and pick any of them. It only plays the first track endedsly…

thanks,

 

To the right of the Play, etc., buttons, there's an icon that if you mouse over it says "Show play queue." Click that.  The track repeat is a bug that affects some people at least some of the time (usually using UPnP/DLNA - are you?).

[Jud]

1 hour ago, Gonzbull said:

I have to say I'm loving the new look and the installation went without a hitch except for a whole day of analysing. One problem I do have is the inability to use more than 1 computer. I have AS installed on my listening system as well as in my studio where I use it to reference tracks. AS says I have to disable one to use the other. I never use them at the same time and for close to NZ$100 I hope this changes or its back to 3.5 for me.

 

Yes, it's only using both simultaneously that is prohibited. So a bit of a pain, but not impossible: To switch you go to your account page.

[Jud]

25 minutes ago, bbosler said:

 

I don't know if both have to be on (unlike Roon where you can de-authorize a core from any other core ), but if they do you can easily control one computer from another with screen sharing on a Mac or a  VNC program like TeamViewer on any computer. I know not the seamless solution you are looking for, but you can do it from one machine. 

 

Wouldn't that be a nice function to build into the new remote?

[Jud]

16 minutes ago, Martini said:

So, when it is "analyzing" and updating data, does it return data to an albums official data? The way I sort my music is by genre, the by Artist (Last Name/First Name) and then by Release Year, not by reissue year. With classical it is by Composer and Title, year had to be deleted. So, if Studio is going to revert to First Name/Last name and change date info, then I won't be adopting Studio.

 

It doesn't overwrite user metadata. It adds a MusicBrainz ID to the metadata, which allows MusicBrainz to display additional information to the user when the album is played.

[Jud]

34 minutes ago, fourstrings1891 said:

The new MusicBrainz functionality is also very glitchy. Suddenly AS shows metadata on my tracks that I have not asked for. See artist here, this is not how I have tagged them:

 

 

But then with some reloading of the view and opening the folder in Finder, all tracks are suddenly displayed again how I tagged them:

 

 

I don't want AS to override my own tagging. But maybe that's just a bug.

 

To be precise about what's happening: It isn't overriding or overwriting your information in the file. It's adding a tag, a MusicBrainz ID, that causes additional information about that track to be displayed to you. All of your own data is still there, and the only thing added is the MusicBrainz ID. But it's correct this isn't something people have asked for in advance.

[Jud]

2 hours ago, Musicophile said:

I’m totally happy with Audirvana changing tags when I change or edit information, and adding the soloists etc to artist makes sense to me. 
 

What I’m not happy with when Audirvana accesses all of my files en masse without asking me first.

 

Though iTunes does far more/worse (writes metadata into files, overwrites user metadata, uses non-standard tags, even changes user directory structure to match its own tagging - when I was still using iTunes, for example, a couple of my early Beatles albums were "disappeared" until I found them in a "Compilations" sub-directory iTunes had made).  It's just that you are accustomed to using iTunes and whatever it did was Incorporated as part of your 'baseline' tagging long ago. (It's also quite possible iTunes doesn't muck around with classical and jazz like it does with popular music.)

[Jud]

5 minutes ago, aaron8489 said:

Overriding user entered display info from another source is one of my biggest problems with Roon.  However, Roon allows this to be somewhat mitigated (but not completely) by allowing a user to override the data that Roon displays with the user's own data.  If AS is going to go tho Roon route with displaying Musicbrainz info, they should at least have the same option that Roon has.  

 

I don't really know what they are trying to accomplish with using Musicbrainz data.  I believe most people that have music files learned long ago how to edit and maintain their own metadata.

 

To the contrary, I think adding and editing metadata for dozens of tracks at a time is something most audio and music lovers would rather be listening to music instead of. 🙂 It's really one of the primary reasons for the existence of Roon, isn't it?

 

The intent here, to provide additional information without user effort, I think is quite laudable. It's the particular implementation that has obviously bothered many users, to an extent I'm quite certain was unanticipated.

[Jud]

44 minutes ago, aaron8489 said:

I think Roon exists nowadays primarily for Qobuz and Tidal users, to tell you the truth.  

 

The reality is that most popular music has become pretty standardized as far as metadata is concerned.  I use Yate when I rip popular stuff and I rarely have to make any changes at all.  The problem is with classical music (which is what I usually rip) and Musicbrainz is subject to the same multitude of metadata "techniques" (composer as artist, incorrect soloist info, inconsistent movement titles, etc) as any other service.  This is why many of us that have classical music files have no choice but to edit dozens of tracks to have any consistency.   For this to be over-ridden (or worse, over-written) is not acceptable to many of us.

 

I find myself making metadata changes (editing or adding) to popular music frequently, and as you say, classical is even more subject to problems.

 

While nothing is being overwritten by what AS is doing, wanting tracks to be displayed as you have taken considerable pains to have them displayed is perfectly understandable.

[Jud]

10 minutes ago, lucretius said:

😀

 

To be fair some MQA tracks do produce "Confirmed HD Recording".

 

Maybe, when Studio decided it was "dubious" it did not bother to graph the HD (above 22 kHz) portion?

 

Looking at the suckout in the 22kHz region in Archimago's data, perhaps the algorithm either isn't set up to keep looking further or has decided whatever's above that range isn't real.

[Jud]

Just now, lucretius said:

At least I can control (to a large extent) what Roon displays.

 

That's consistent with what other people have said (didn't pay attention myself during my Roon trial), and similar ability to control would of course be most welcome in AS.

[Jud]

1 minute ago, jimdukey said:

Huh?

I mean the Original Files in your Computer or Network

aren't used, only copies, ala Drag and Drop.

A copy goes in the Player, Not the Original.

So nothing is change  or damaged.

 

Your idea of how this works is inaccurate.

 

Yes, a MusicBrainz ID metadata tag is added to the original files, so AS "knows" to display the MusicBrainz information to the user, even if the track isn't playing. This doesn't overwrite any user metadata. However, it does change the way the file is displayed in AS in a way some users who have carefully curated their metadata don't want. Adding the tag also may change the file sufficiently to pose some issues for people like myself who pay for cloud backup, because changed files are uploaded to cloud storage, possibly resulting in extra ISP data charges.

[Jud]

No formats or anything to do with music are changed. To repeat: A tag with the track's MusicBrainz ID is added to the metadata area of the file, which allows MusicBrainz information to be displayed to the user regarding the file. No user-entered information is deleted or changed.

 

This isn't to say it's correct, just to let you know exactly what's going on.

[Jud]

3 minutes ago, jtm said:

Jud, I do appreciate your expertise on this topic.

 

IMO, altering the presentation of music information from the way I wanted it to look like, and doing so by adding new content to the metadata area in the music file which I have obtained through a purchase, does mean a modification of my property. 

 

I have not seen an opt-in or opt-out tab or a pop window informing me about this automated editing.

 

I am open to learn more about how to identify the modified files and to revert them back to the original status.

However an information to the customer about this „feature“ is the least I would have expected from a company with this background.

 

 

An opt-in would in my view be a very nice feature, and I would suppose many others consider it essential.

 

Meanwhile, on Audirvana's forums, a poster has advised that bulk selection and deletion of the MusicBrainz ID tag is possible with ID3 Tag Editor (at least - perhaps other metadata software will work also, I don't know).

[Jud]

Mp3tag, Picard, and foobar2000 can also remove the tags if this is to be believed: https://community.metabrainz.org/t/how-can-i-remove-all-musicbrainz-tags-from-a-set-of-files/63938/4

[Jud]

4 minutes ago, Torq said:

 

Just bear in mind that this won't stop Chronosync seeing them as changed, nor BackBlaze wanting to push them up to the cloud again.  Even resetting the file modification date back as to what they last had (as well as the above change) likely won't do it at this point, either.

 

 

I plan on leaving them in at this point. I just need to time my Backblaze backup to overlap my ISP's billing cycle so I don't get charged for overage.

[Jud]

Just now, lucretius said:

That was me.  I used mp3tag!

 

Too late to edit, oh well.

[Jud]

2 minutes ago, lucretius said:

Lots of tag editors can remove the tag.  I can use Picard to remove the tag.  but with mp3tag i can remove a large batch in one step. 

 

Sounds like you can do a bunch at once in Picard too, from the description on the linked page: 

 

"For future reference, you can totally do this in Picard:

• load files on the left side
• select all
• select unwanted tags in the bottom pane
• right click and remove tags
• save"

[Jud]

1 hour ago, robi20064 said:

The problem is, no matter what tag editor you use, unless it can restore the file to its exact state prior to the AS modification (same hash) your sync software will likely flag it as different and schedule it for backup. It might worth a try checking a modified file with a bunch of tag editors to see if any would be able  to restore it to the desired hash. 
 

This is why it is completely unacceptable to face any changes to your data without notification in advance. No matter if its "just" a harmless tag, you might be unable to easily revert the changes and have a binary identical file to the original.

 

If you have a local synced backup as well as a cloud backup, you can revert to the local backup first. (I could have done this, but am choosing to go ahead and let everything be tagged.)

 

This is not to disagree with your point, but to suggest an alternative for anyone with local backup.

[Jud]

56 minutes ago, LowOrbit said:

Good point. Going with the Free version would seem a little pointless.

It would seem. I expected nothing much after looking at the comparison. Yet to me, subjectively, Studio with r8brain upsampling sounds better than 3.5 with SoX did. (Haven't done any A/B at all on my main system.  When I first listened to Studio with r8brain I was very happy with it and haven't bothered changing.  It was just "Damn, that sounds better than ever!", and I left it at that.)