Onnto*/**, Mac mini, Weiss DAC2 & FireWire

[Erwin S]

* Decided in favour of the Onnto and not the Drobo for storage, see further down.

** Onnto to noisy so it will do the backup. Working HD is Iomega MiniMax 2TB

 

In the quest for a music server, I have narrowed the choice of the desired Mac (iMac G5 used / PowerMac used / mini 2009 model) to the - headless - mini because the technical limitations of the older machines (FireWire 400, Wifi...). Also, my wife would not be very happy if I "dumped" a big computer on top of the cupboard in the dining space. The mini can be "stealth", haha!

 

I also digged in the reviews (CA and others) of the Weiss DAC's and how they compare to others. I think it is safe to say that the DacMagic I have is inferior to the Benchmark DAC1 HDR. The Weiss DAC2/Minerva is superior to the Benchmark. The new Weiss 202 is the crème de la crème. This all reflects the price hierarchy of the respective peaces. The 202 can be purchased in package with Amarra for 5,000€ here in EU. Which is way more than I can justify to spend. But a DAC2 can be bought new for 2,350 €. Which is not that much more than the Benchmark which I almost bought before Emotiva anounced their 299$ XDA-1. This XDA-1 is now delayed - again - towards October. I will get the bargain XDA-1 since this blends in nicely with the other Emo stuff. But I would like to preserve the possibility to get for example a Weiss DAC2 (and Amarra) whenever a used/demo/sale occasion is presenting itself. FireWire is the prefered connection with the mini here.

 

As storage, I would go for the Drobo 4-Bay with 2 x 2TB disks. Now, this is also connected with FireWire. But the mini has only one FireWire! Is it just as good to use USB-2 for this connection?

 

I would control the mini with my iMac. Hope this works like a treat. All my current music is on this iMac, but obviously would be copied to the Drobo. It's all CD's ripped in Apple Lossless. I want to be able to use the high res formats - probably for Jazz mostly. Do you agree that my choices are correct?

 

About cover art: these days, I use mostly Discogs or Amazon to find the cover art. I use album info and drag the pic in the illustration field for the whole album. This the way to make sure the art is embedded, correct? This way the art is not lost when I copy the music to the Drobo, yes? What about the art that iTunes provided before I ? Will it be lost?

 

Another thing: it used to be possible to drag 2 pics into the illustration field, where the last dragged pic would be shown and both could be seen in the illustration field of the info of each separate song. This way, the back of the CD that has usefull info, could be inserted. This easy way is not longer supported in iTunes it seems. Correct?

 

 

 

[Erwin S]

I have just secured me a Mac mini 2009 demo model (2.26 Ghz) for 500€ (2010 model starts for a thieving 799€ her in Belgium). That's strike 1! I pick it up next Wednesday.

 

Ok, now for storage: I have read this really bad review on the Drobo 4-Bay:

http://macperformanceguide.com/Reviews-Drobo.html

A bit disturbing as this is in the C.A.S.H. list!

Can anyone suggest what to do? I would like at least 2TB secured (mirrored or so) storage, but more would be welcome, up to 4TB. Connected via FireWire 800 to the mini.

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

Hi Erwin - Drobo is on the C.A.S.H. List because it works great for many people including audiophiles who don't want to become IT technicians. There are many Drobo models. Some are better than others. There are quite a few happy CA readers using Drobos right now. LIke all products Drobos are not for everyone.

 

[weyskipper]

Dear Erwin,

 

We seem to have a very similar computer setup. I think the review of the Drobo is correct in so far as saying it is slow... but you do not need anything faster for our requirements. For the purpose of our use it is more than perfectly adequate. I run the Drobo through USB to the MacMini. I have already lost a hard drive in the Drobo and it is really simple to recover from.

 

I liked the original Drobo so much that I have recently bought a DroboPro for my iMac. It is fast enough to support applications like Aperture and Final Cut express. Neither Drobos have let me down yet.

 

The Weiss 202 is the best DAC I have ever heard. I have now had mine for a month and I just like it more and more every day.

 

 

 

[Erwin S]

Weyskipper,

 

Impressive setup with the 202/Krell/Wilsons you have there! Never heard the Wilsons, but they pop up in many favourable reviews. Do you use USB2 for Drobo/mini? See you use the recommended FW for the Weiss.

 

Unfortunally, the 202 is way over budget for me now. I found a demo Minerva on a UK-website for 900£, but I don't trust the seller. I am still confused about the DAC/Minerva: does it have volume control or not? Can it do without a pre-amp, straight in to the amps? If so, it could be great step up, the DAC2 can be found for 2,500€, almost in reach.

 

I will do some more research, but the fact that you and Chris are OK with the Drobo is nice to know.

 

[4est]

The DAC2 can and should imho go direct into your amps. It has the same output set up as the 202 without the remote control. I use mine in conjunction with an inline attenuator in so that I can be near max on the digital attenuation.

 

[Purite Audio]

Forrest Hi, doesn't your DacII have variable output,check around the back!

Keith.

 

[Erwin S]

Can you enlighten me? Is this a RCA or XLR plugin on the output of the DAC2, or is it a device with it's own volume control? I see al sorts of stuff when I google this.

 

And it does not degrade the SQ?

 

BTW, it was a local retailer for pro audio gear that misinformed me about the DAC2/Minerva's (lack of) volume control! I asked for the DAC2, but pointed me to the 202 and the demo Minerva they have on sale...

 

[Purite Audio]

Recent models of the DACII have variable output selectable from the rear panel, they also have an inbuilt properly dithered digital attenuator, so you can use the unit as a preamp, they don't have the option of a remote though.

Keith.

 

[4est]

But I use an inline attenuator as well. The present set up only requires a .5 volt for full output and I have efficient speakers. The digital volume is great, but you are supposed to be at near full/max output. I use the attenuator (rothwell, but they are easy to make) in order to keep the digital near maximum with this arrangement. It does not degrade the sonics ime here.

 

The DAC2 has independent rca and xlr out. It also accepts toslink, spdif in/out and aes/ebu xlr in/out. It will also take word clock/sync on any of the standard digital ins when using Firewire as source. I think that it is a fantastic unit, it beat out the Berkley Alpha DAC here fwiw.

 

[weyskipper]

Erwin,

 

I have recently upgraded to the new MacMini, which has a big enough hard-disk. I have copied all my music to the internal disk. I disconnect the USB of the Drobo when I am not using it.

 

I have not been able to tell a difference in sound between the two options, but some people might.

 

I suspect I will have to go back to the Drobo as main source at some point. I used to rip in ALAC, but now ripping AIFF and also starting to use hi-res files, so the 500GB will be running out soon.

 

If I go back to this option I will locate the Drobo in a different room as I prefer not to hear the fan on the Drobo.

 

 

 

 

[Erwin S]

Would it be possible to use two of these with the mini? Looks beautiful ofcourse, visual twins to the mini. One would be the external HD, second MiniMax as the backup (maybe with time machine). Good idea or not?

 

[Erwin S]

I have read about running Windows 7 instead of OSX on Apple. Are many here doing this? Seems akward to me. OTOH, it hurts to have to pay 550 euro to conveniently play the hi res formats and 16/44.1 with amarra on iTunes/OSX. Does Windows 7 avoid this?

 

For the storage I was looking at the Onnto DataTale. These look good, better than the Drobo I reckon, and they are supposed to be silent. Problem is these are not sold in EU. But I could get the enclosure from Amazon.com and get the disks here.

EDIT: they are avalable here afterall! Maybe a 2-Bay (2 x 2TB) will do the trick for now. But the 4-Bay looks like the one to have: with 4 x 1.5TB disks (4TB secured with RAID5), it's cheaper than the Drobo and much better looking at the same time. Am I missing something?

 

The downside with the good looking MiniMax is that I think they are not meant to receive another disk if one is kaputt?

 

Another thing on storage capacity: I downloaded the RR hi res AIFF tracks for test. Neat, but: 225MB for less than 4 minutes is 10x more than Apple Lossless! Beginning to think 2TB wont do for more more than 2 years... These hi res are about 4GB per album/hour? This comes to 250 albums for 1 TB. For now, I don't see 250 albums for my musical taste (anything but classical), but hopefully this changes fast?

 

[Erwin S]

I have been reading the manuals of Amarra & Weiss DAC2. Both have a possibility to control volume. The DAC2 does not have a remote. This can later become a pain when I would use the setup with a high end stereo + zone 2 video projector for watching TV (don't ask, but I like good sound when watching sport or music - think Later... with Jools Holland on BBC). I can live without the remote for the volume, because I like it loud and clear. The other half is something different...

 

OTOH, Amarra has the possibility for volume control with dithering and all, with an iTouch or the likes. Is this a good idea?

 

[4est]

The digital volume in Amarra, iTunes and Pure Music will be fine for video sports. The iPhone/iTouch will work great for it. I find mute to be the most important for video. I do not know about your neck of the woods, but here in the US the commercials are very loud/compressed.

 

[Erwin S]

Well, we recently almost completely stopped to view commercial stations from the moment our satellite tuner was extra updated with the newest HD channels that lucky enough were NOT commercial. Why watch movies that are interrupted every ten minutes AND are in 576i in stead of 720p or 1080i? Yes, with a 3-satellite dish here in Belgium, one can watch the official Belgian, Dutch, German and last but not least, BBC HD channel with on them only the trailers to anounce their own programs! What a luxury...

 

I am planning a semi-dedicated HT with 10.2 DSX surround and a projector. In addition to this, I will likely spend almost 75% of the rest of my life in our day-room with the Jamo stereo for work and music simultaneausly. I want quality sound! The zone 2 projector & screen for TV is supposed to be motorized and only used for casual viewing.

 

Thought of a sollution for the remote volume control: the DAC2 itself! Install the Weiss close to the seating. I am using XLR anyway to connect to the power amps and these are fine with 10 meters or more...

 

Anyone with the Minerva/DAC2, please comment on it!! Convince me!

 

[Erwin S]

I am dreaming of the DAC2! If I can live without a remote for volume control, what about the relative scarcity of inputs?

 

1/ I think the AES/EBU is of not much use to me?

2/ FireWire A is for the Mac mini

3/ Digital coax for the CD transport (Emotiva ERC-1)

4/ Digital optical for the Satellite tuner

 

Where do I put the Sonos Zoneplayer ZP90? It has optical and coax out and 2 ethernets, that's it. One of the ethernets is for the Mac mini, to make it's music avalable through the whole house with several ZP's.

 

Those are the inputs I can think of now. Can FireWire B be of any use?

 

[Audio_ELF]

Check with Daniel at Weiss, but the AES input maybe usable as a second SPDIF input with a suitable adapter/converter.

 

Eloise

 

[Erwin S]

I picked up the 2009 demo Mac mini. I want to control it via my iMac. First, the mini showed in the Finder ("SHARED"), but I could not make the connection to work. After this, the mini vanished... Any suggestions? I don't have a monitor for the mini.

 

EDIT:

I suppose screen sharing is not enabled on the mini yet. Have to get back to the shop. Darn! It's not my regular shop (old mini sold out there) and it's located in a no-trafic zone. How stupid is that? I want to park in front! No parking, no business, as a wise American once said. I reckon they are located in a shopping street to atract more female buyers. Don't they know that the average man (I am very average) can't be seen in 10 miles from a shopping street?

 

[Erwin S]

I have another idea for a way to deal with the lack of remote volume control of the Weiss DAC2. Get both the 300$ Emotiva XDA-1 and the DAC2. The Emotiva XPA-1 monoblocks have RCA and XLR inputs. There's a switch on the back to toggle between the two. Use XLR with the DAC2 with the mini as a source for high end listening. Use RCA with the XDA-1 for everything else, have the convenience of the remote and plenty of inputs (Sonos/satellite/CD...)

 

[Erwin S]

Decided to go for the demo Weiss DAC2, hope to get it within the week... And it comes with Amarra MINI included, which I will upgrade to Amarra when I get some more 24/192 or 24/176.4 tracks. Curious how those Kraftwerk electronic basses will sound - I have read that this should sound rather good.

 

I got the Mac mini up and running with screen sharing after all. The guy from the store enabled it with their screen.

 

Just ordered the Onnto 4-Bay for 300€ from them without the disks. Still not sure how to do it, knowing that 1,5TB ecogreen disk cost 76€ each and 2TB cost 114€ each:

1/ RAID-1 with 4 x 2TB disks (mirrored, 4TB secured)

2/ RAID-5 with 4 x 1.5TB disks (4TB secured also) and get a 5th identical spare disk straight away. Still cheaper than 1/

Any idea's? I want to use this as my only storage (copy all music from my iMac and keep most of the tracks on the iMac though)

 

[Erwin S]

Can someone confirm if it would be OK to connect the Weiss Dac2 to the mini via FireWire using the Oyaide cable and - since the mini has only 1 FireWire - the Onnto storage device using USB2?

 

Is a better USB than standard included with the Onnto beneficial?

 

[Erwin S]

On the USB connection from HD to Mac mini: asked Herr Weiss himself: he says a standard USB cable is OK for this since this is not critical. I presume this is because dejittering is performed by the DAC2 anyway if connected via FireWire.

 

Also downloaded the manual from the Onnto 4-Bay where the different RAID options are explaned:

http://oyendigital.com/downloads/manuals/DataTale4Bay_UM.pdf

 

RAID 0: if one disk fails, all data is lost!

RAID 1: mirroring works only for 2 disks! Even if all 4 disks are inserted.

RAID 5: capacity is 3 out of 4 disks and if a disk fails, no data is lost when replaced

RAID 5+HotSpare: last disk is empty and if a disk fails, backup is automatic! Capacity is only 2 out of 4 disks however.

RAID 0+1: this is the proper mirroring for 2+2 disks. It's fast and if a disk fails (2 even depending on which ones), no data is lost. Capacity is 2 out of 4 disks.

 

I will go for RAID 5 with four 1.5 TB disks. And use a mobile 1.5 TB HD for backup, larger whenever it's full. This could be a very effective solution to get my music in both our old and new house. Just take the mobile HD with us. Also very safe in case of fire or something similar...

 

[Erwin S]

So the DAC2 arrived. Since the Mac mini is not yet operational (Onnto HD still not delivered), I have to make due with the AE via optical and the Emotiva ERC-1 CD player via coaxial.

The Weiss DAC2 is linked via XLR to a pair of Emotiva XPA-1 monoblocks. These power a pair of Jamo R909.

 

First: like the previous pre-amp, this set-up is way to loud. Even with the analogue "screw" setting to minimum, I need to turn down iTunes to 50% in order to have normal use of the digital volume control of the DAC2. Not good IMO. I did not risk using the CD player since that cannot be attenuated unlike iTunes. So, get some In-Line Attenuators? The amps have a gain of 32 dB. Need advice on this.

 

Sound? To soon to tell, only got time for 15 minutes. But first impression is that bass is indeed very prominent...

 

[4est]

Use the on board dithered volume built in. I use Rothwell inline attenuators.