creating an archive of all my CDs

[ghanwani]

I want to create an archive of all my CDs and then discard the CDs. I then want to put all of the music on an iPod.

 

For the archive I want the maintain the original CD quality. I then want to convert to a sampled, lossy version that would use less space on the iPod. I have about 150 CDs tops.

 

For the original CD quality I decided on WAV (rather than FLAC or Apple Lossless) since it seems to be universally used. I figure I'll need about 100 - 120 G of hard disk space, and that shouldn't be a problem. I'll get a couple of USB disks to keep redundant copies.

 

I downloaded iTunes and tried it for a few CDs but some folks on the iTunes forum suggested using dbpoweramp with accuraterip for better results. I bought dbpoweramp and the file sizes for the WAV files of the same songs are indeed different (they are smaller with iTunes). Does this mean that I was losing some information with iTunes, or is there some metadata that dbpoweramp stores within the WAV file that makes it slightly larger?

 

Finally, if anyone has achieve Nirvana with respect to creating a digital archive, I would like to hear to your story so I can get there too.

 

Many thanks.

Anoop

 

[Audio_ELF]

You may want to take a look at the article Chris wrote on ripping CDs a while back. In it he discuessed the various thinking behind his choice of CD ripping method.

 

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content/Computer-Audiophile-CD-Ripping-Strategy-and-Methodology

 

Given a good quality original, there should be no sound quality difference between an iTunes rip and a dbPowerAmp rip, however I would still suggest using dbPowerAmp (alternatives exist) as you get more confidence with ripping with dbPowerAmp.

 

Personally I would store your CD originals. Firstly without them you have no proof that you have legally obtained the music (you can't sell them on and legally keep the rips you made). Secondly if you have a total catastrophe then you can return to the original discs. You may want to loose the original CD Jewel Cases - check out the Jazz Loft Space Saving CD Sleeves though other options exist.

 

Eloise

 

[ghanwani]

Thanks for the response. The article looks like exactly

the kind of thing that I am looking for. Will have to

print it and spend some quality time reading and

digesting it.

 

As to keeping the original CDs -- don't CDs deteriorate

with time? Assuming they do (which is my understanding),

they are no longer useful in case of a catastrophe.

That is actually my primary reason for wanting to create

a digital archive that is an exact replica of the CD.

Otherwise, just ripping into iTunes in compressed format

would have served my purpose.

 

The sleeves look like a good idea except that they

probably won't protect the CD from scratches as well

as the jewel cases, especially if one is keeping the

CDs around for the purpose of recovery from catastrophe.

If the primary goal is proof of purchase, then I can

value in using the CD sleeves.

 

[Audio_ELF]

I know people say CDs deteriorate, but I've been buying CDs since the Mid-80s and with the exception of some CD signgles have never had a problem with reading from even my earliest, fairly mistreated, CDs.

 

Keeping the originals, or not, is something only you can decide if it's worth doing based on your housing situation, etc. If I was looking at sleaves I would use ones that store each disc individually even if I had an overall sleeve for the discs and "paperwork".

 

Eloise

 

[Bob Harvie]

Why on earth would you want to rip your CD's to WAV? Sure it's lossless, but apart from that you will lose all ability to conveniently find your music again. If you're going to go to the hassle of ripping all of your CD's then please do so with a format which can retain all of the track/album data - trust me it will be well worthwhile. If you still want to use wav, then you can transcode any lossless format into 'lossless' wav and play those files to your hearts content. My guess is that your looking for convenience, but all the while wishing to maintain the original quality? If so go for an established lossless format.

 

I use wma lossless and have done so for a number of years (yes I can hear the anti Microsoft scoffs, but I don't give two hoots about that) and it has worked very well for me. I have used both dbPoweramp and Windows Media Player to rip my files and can find very little difference other than that dbPoweramp seems better able to look up the correct metadata (tags).

 

WAV? With the plethora of lossless formats about, I can see no benefit at all in using that as a format.

 

Other software to consider:

 

MP3Tag

XMPlayer

MP3Toys (with XMPlayer set as an external player),

oh, and you must use Windows 7 with WASAPI

 

[wgscott]

I bought my first CDs in 1986 and they are still perfectly fine.

 

The one thing that DOES cause problems is storing them in plastic sleeves rather than in CD boxes. In my experience, the labels would start to come off, and eventually the residue found its way onto playing surfaces. It was very difficult, and sometimes impossible, to restore.

 

I keep my CDs in their original boxes now in the garage.

 

I rip mine to Apple Lossless or AAC (depending on how much I care). For purposes of universality, FLAC might be better, but it is easy enough to interconvert. Just choose a format that preserves your metadata.

 

I think the concern about CD deterioration is data storage on CDs you burn yourself, especially the re-writable ones. (I've never had one go bad, but I only have ones going back about 10 years.)

 

[ghanwani]

Thanks to all for the responses.

 

Can anyone tell why the WAV files from dbpoweramp

and iTunes are different for a very a good quality

CD that I recently ripped? Is there any additional

data that dbpoweramp encodes into the WAV files?

Or is it just some extra silence...???

 

Also, am I overdoing it by using dbpoweramp?

Can I rip using iTunes to Apple Lossless (since

everyone seems to think that a format that supports

tagging would be much better)?

 

Is it possible to use dbpoweramp to verify the

rips made by iTunes?

 

Thanks,

Anoop

 

 

 

[vortecjr]

DBPowerAmp stores the coverart in the resulting file and pretty sure iTunes stores the coverart in a some folder or special file. Use either one and you should be fine!

 

Jesus R

www.sonore.us

 

[ghanwani]

Jesus,

 

Do you know if it is possible to get DBPowerAmp to store the coverart in a special folder/file just as iTunes?

 

Also, if I rip using DBPowerAmp, can I just point iTunes to that directory and expect it to be able to use those files?

 

Anoop

 

[Audio_ELF]

Jesus is actually slight wrong here ...

 

iTunes stores album art in two different locations depending on how the art is added to the music file. First, any art that it retrieves automatically (from iTunes Store) is sotred in a special folder. This folder is extremely difficult to modify manually (and pretty pointless to try to do so). Secondly, art added manually to a track is embedded within the music file - due to limitations this is not possible to do with .WAV files (generally using WAV with iTunes is a frustrating task and not one I would recommend - use AIFF instead).

 

Eloise

 

[Al Jones]

CD Survival

 

I bought my first discs and player in April 1983. I ripped everything three years ago with no disc failures.

 

I had decided on WAV, not because I could hear any difference compared to FLAC, but in the end I went with FLAC for its tagging compatibility.

 

Trust me, you will come to appreciate a well-organized, easily searchable collection and that requires extensive, correct tagging and that is simply not possible with WAV.

 

I use FLAC with Level 0 compression, i.e. minimal compression. It makes no audible difference, takes up a little more space, but storage is cheap, so why not?

 

I definitely second recommendations for dbpoweramp with AccurateRip.

 

[ghanwani]

Apologies for revisiting an old topic after such a long time.

 

I still haven't started working on this. I've been doing research and I think I know what I want, but I need to find out how to get it.

 

So, here's what I want. I want to make a copy of my CDs in a format that is not going to change anytime soon (i.e. no versioning and the like) and preserve _all_ of the information from the CDs in such a way that I can burn a CD that is an exact replica of that in the future. I had previously (incorrectly) thought that ripping to wav would do this for me.

 

Now when I first came here, some folks pointed out that wav is not the way to go because it doesn't support tagging. I thought tags were always manual, but it looks like when ripping CDs to something that supports tagging, for example, Apple Lossless, then tags are created automatically. In other words, if I rip a CD to a bunch of wavs, I have actually lost some information that was on the CD. It sounds like some rippers can get all of this auxiliary information and place it in a separate text file called a cue sheet.

I would assume there would be converters that would read the cue file and the wav files and create any other format that I like with tags (e.g. iTunes store type quality of music).

 

I recently made the switch to a mac, and some folks pointed me to Max (http://sbooth.org/Max/), a free ripper/converter.

 

So now for the questions:

- Is my information above correct?

- Between the wavs and the cue sheet, would I have all of the information on the CD, or is there something yet that is will have been lost?

- If nothing is lost, will I be able to do as I have explained -- rip to wav + cue sheet, and then convert to a tagged format with automatic tagging?

- Has anyone here tried Max? Would you recommend it? (I tried to sign up for access to their forums to ask some of these questions, but I didn't get the promised authorization email, so I'm assuming there's something messed up on that website.)

 

One thing that really concerned me was the difference in the wav file size between iTunes and dbpoweramp (done on my old PC). Based on a previous response, it looks like Apple wasn't storing the track name in the wav file. I had always thought that rips to wav would be consistent across different programs (assuming no errors). On the CD, is the track name stored with every track? If so, why would Apple choose to not store the track name in the wav file given that it is permitted?

 

Thanks for any help,

Anoop