SGC - sonicTransporter Series and Signalyst HQPlayer 4 Embedded

[Miska]

Auto + DSD is same case as SDM + DSD. Auto just switches output between PCM and DSD depending on source type.

 

[Miska]

7 hours ago, vortecjr said:

That seems to coincide with #1 and #3 above. #4 I don't get playback and for # 6 I get resampling? 

 

You should be getting same result for #4 and #6...

 

[Miska]

6 hours ago, vortecjr said:

I just checked them again and the results were the same as my initial test. #4 does not play and #6 resamples per DSD Settings. 

 

OK, strange, I just tested and it is working for me as expected. Can you send me log file and settings file over email?

[Miska]

4 hours ago, Em2016 said:

Just to double check, there is no session time limit with trying HQP embedded on the sonicT?

 

We can listen and trial for as long as we like, for up to 30 days, even running 24 hours if we want? Paging @Miska

 

It has the normal trial limitations... So restart needed every 30 minutes.

 

[Miska]

15 minutes ago, Kilauea50 said:

@Miska @agillisI just upgraded my STi7 to 2.6 without any issue, waited about 20 mins and installed HQP embedded.  It sounds absolutely wonderful.  I have a license for my Mac but how do I purchase and input license for this?  Thank you

 

HQPlayer Embedded has web management GUI - usually http://ip:8088/ where "ip" is IP address or name of the device). From About-page (see links at the bottom of the said page) you can find hardware fingerprint string; the one that ends with "==". This fingerprint needs to be copy-pasted to the order form.

 

From here you can find a button for going to the web shop, last item on the page.

 

You get similar .xml key file as the Mac version has, from key-page of the web management GUI you can upload this key to the HQPlayer Embedded. Once successfully installed, restart the system.

 

[Miska]

9 minutes ago, diecaster said:

So, does using HQPlayer 4 Embedded in a sonicTransporter along with an endpoint that supports NAA output mode allow you to use Roon but bypasses it's network stack (RAAT) in favor of what HQPlayer provides?

 

Yes...

 

[Miska]

22 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

Miska:

Please consider a different way yo do trail. Or consider at least a introduction offer. The price you're asking is way to high i think. And more than double the original HQPlayer. (Adding 25% VAT as well). I'm close to pay 3000 NOK.

Or maybe remove the DSD for those, like me, that don't need it. I guess the DSD is limited anyway with the i5 hardware. Correct ?

 

I think it is still too cheap. Or actually HQPlayer Desktop is way too cheap, no inflation adjustments in a long time. Or paid upgrades either.

 

23 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

It must be better to sell 5000 copies for $150 as an example than 1000 at $336.

 

Not necessarily...

 

27 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

It's getting close to purchase another LPS-1 or the new Uptone switch.

 

Ahh! So the HQPlayer is certainly too cheap! How many work hours did designing LPS-1 or Uptone switch take?

 

HQPlayer has taken me 20 years to get to the point where it is now, and in October this year my company has 10th anniversary. If you look this from business investment perspective, the project should break even at least before I die. But I have some doubts if it will ever happen... This is constant ongoing work, but it didn't happen all by itself in the past either.

 

I personally wouldn't have any mental problems to slam high-end'ish 20k€ price tag on the software, I think it would be much more justified than the price tags for lot of high-end hardware.

 

[Miska]

19 hours ago, Kilauea50 said:

@Miska I have a Mytek Liberty Dac and have stuttering converting to DSD. The server is a STi7. Can you recommend playback settings? I just got this Dac and am still figuring it out. Thank you 

 

This is a good starting point, you can also try with other -2s filters too:

[Miska]

1 hour ago, R1200CL said:

Also knowing that a HW failure makes the license totally useless doesn't make the  purchase more attempting. And I can tell you I already had one.

 

By the way, if the hardware gets broken and fixed, Andrew can just tell me he fixed something and if the fingerprint changed due to that I will just issue new key file for the fixed hardware. So in such case your license certainly doesn't become useless.

[Miska]

For trial, simplest way to think about it is time HQPlayer process is running. Assuming the "App Switching" you are talking about here involves stopping and starting HQPlayer process, you get another 30 minutes when it is started again. So in this sense it behaves practically same way as the Desktop version.

 

So far, this has been best way of doing trial.

 

[Miska]

5 hours ago, vortecjr said:

Some clarifications are needed because SonicOrbiter on the Rendu series is different than SonicOrbiter on the Transporter series. 

 

SonicOrbiter on the Rendu series has an App Switcher to switch between output protocols.

 

SonicOrbiter on the Transporter series does not have an App Switcher. When the server software (HQ Player, Roon, etc) is installed it's always running on the unit. So if HQ Player embedded is installed the 30 minute clock starts at boot up. The only way to restart the clock is to reboot the unit. Andrew can add a button to restart the application, but Jussi would need to approve it.

 

Ahh, sorry for the mess-up. I have the Rendu and know how it works, but the SonicOrbiter setup wasn't completely clear to me...

 

Rebooting is probably easiest and best because it can be also done by pressing a physical button press (ACPI shutdown&power-on) and it is likely very quick.

 

[Miska]

6 hours ago, R1200CL said:

In order to use convolution with HQPlayer embedded I have to use convolution inside HQPlayer. This option seems not to be implemented yet. Is the correct ? 

And when to expect convolution to be available ?

 

Yes it is implemented... You can see a link "Convolution" in the web GUI.

 

6 hours ago, R1200CL said:

Do you know if Roon is planning to support, as Roon now sates unsupported

 

What do you mean by that?

 

6 hours ago, R1200CL said:

Can you also confirm HAF filters is expected to work inside HQPlayer embedded ?

 

At least they list HQPlayer, so I would assume so...

https://www.homeaudiofidelity.com/english/requirements/

 

[Miska]

2 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

 

Exactly this:

 

 

You are now looking at Roon DSP engine settings, those have nothing to do with HQPlayer. When using HQPlayer, always turn off the Roon's DSP engine using the switch in top-left corner of that dialog. Unless you for some reason really really want to use Roon's DSP engine instead of HQPlayer's...

 

[Miska]

7 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

It’s not working. Nothing is happening when clicking that link. That’s why I’m asking. 

 

Hmmh, strange...

 

[Miska]

2 hours ago, R1200CL said:

I can add I have difficulty to hear differences between HQPlayer and Roon DSP. 

Maybe I start a new thread as now both SW DSP systems run on same HW, as a fair SQ test can be done for almost the first time. 

 

If you just run convolution engine, all implementations should sound the same. Upsampling algorithms differ though.

 

It has always been possible to run both on same hardware. Lot of people have done it, me too.

 

1 hour ago, R1200CL said:

One fundamentally difference is that HQPlayer Embedded require one file for each speaker. But with Roon I just upload one zip file.

 

Do you have a user guide that explain the settings like

 

These are explained in manual of HQPlayer Desktop. Desktop and Embedded work the same way, Embedded just has some more features. The "Clear unused filters" is Embedded specific, by default you can update single impulse response file without having to re-upload all at once. Checking that option clears the impulse responses for channels where you are not uploading a file. This is just due to the way web interfaces and form submissions work.

 

I'll create a variant of the manual for HQPlayer Embedded at some point, but probably in HTML form so it can be read straight from the web interface.

 

1 hour ago, R1200CL said:

One fundamentally difference is that HQPlayer Embedded require one file for each speaker.

 

Yes, one mono WAV per channel. That is for example what Acourate creates.

 

18 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

Maybe Roon DSP is good enough ? ?

 

I find it a bit odd to complain about pricing of HQPlayer when you don't seem to have a problem with software that costs 100€/year or 500€ single paymant... And I guess they estimate to have higher sales volumes.

 

More fair comparison would be to compare how many percents of your total audio system price is HQPlayer's license. I think something like 20 - 30% would be quite good level.

 

[Miska]

34 minutes ago, soares said:

Thank you. I am some how disappointed  with the explanation that it will be machine dependent. I use for the time being a sonic transporter i5 but I don't exclude to migrate to the i7 in a coming future and after upgrading my DAC. I think that I will have to wait. I am sure this might be implemented by software as Roon did where I had a license for Mac and it was transfers to my sti5. 

Another issue: I consulted the link in your message, but it was not clear if I am entitled to 50% of discount if I already have a licence for Mac, as it is the case.

It would help me a lot if Miska could clarify.

Again, thank you for taking your time to enlight me... 

 

Desktop version is hardware independent and regular software in that sense. Not usually tied to hardware (although there are such products on the market too where it is).

 

Embedded has been designed for hardware products and to be sold together as part of hardware. If you buy a car, you cannot transfer the embedded software from your current car to a new one either.

[Miska]

Just now, R1200CL said:

That manual is very hard to find. Can you supply a link please ?

 

It is included in the installation packages. On Windows and Linux it can be found from Start-menu. On Mac it is straight in the DMG and one can copy it from there to any suitable location.

 

[Miska]

3 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

 

So can only do one. Really ? Then HQPlayer lack some important options that's available in Roon. But I could be totally wrong. Maybe I only need one of the files shown in the attached picture. The 192 one ?

 

Or may it's about how HAF does the filter.

 

You need only the highest rate ones, 384_HL for left channel and 384_HR for right channel. Assuming those are mono files for left and right channel. I have no idea what the cfg files contain. Since they say on their web page that their stuff works on HQPlayer, you could ask for configuration guidance from them.

 

[Miska]

26 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

I suppose @Miska has to answer wheater to use system or user, but user seems logical, though I don’t mind a explanation what’s  the difference. 

 

In this case, "System" is probably the right one.

 

HQPlayer Embedded can have two configuration scopes; "System" which is global to all users of the system and "User" which applies to the current user. If "User" configuration exists, it takes precedence over the "System" one.

 

sonicTransporter is a single user system so this distinction doesn't make much sense here. Maybe I should add possibility to disable "User" scope for these kind of installations...

 

[Miska]

1 hour ago, Binaural said:

Love the sound quality thru my sonictransport i7-ultrarendu-kitsune SU-1-i2s-PS Audio Directstream DAC. Just purchased a license key from your site. I need instructions for applying the key please. I know HQP embedded must be in unconfigured state to set authentication- how best to do this on the ST i7 as I can't delete config files as it is a closed system?

 

Someone could probably help if there's a default username/password...

 

But as @R1200CL said, on the /key page you can upload the key file you've got.

 

If you have a problem, please contact me over email.

[Miska]

9 hours ago, Em2016 said:

It's very easily reproducible at my end.

 

Hard drive connected music up-sampled to DSD512 by HQP is fine.

 

Tidal stream up-sampled to DSD512 by HQP has pops.

 

Roon up-sampling Tidal to DSD512 has no issues (i.e. only HQP embedded has the pops up-sampling Tidal to DSD512).

 

Will try these things

 

Is there too much network activity inside the sTi7 with Tidal streaming and HQP streaming to the rendu at the same time? Causing these pops with Tidal up-sampling to DSD512?

 

From earlier post I got the picture you had Roon doing upsampling to DSD512? Just check that you have Roon DSP engine disabled for the HQPlayer output (top left corner of Roon's audio setting dialog). Is Roon using "localhost" as HQPlayer address?

 

Just leave "Buffer time" for network endpoint at "0" -> Default. Should work fine in all cases.

 

Anyway, Tidal uses so little network bandwidth that it shouldn't make any difference. Filter settings in your screenshot look fine too.

 

[Miska]

42 minutes ago, Em2016 said:

Yes it's set to localhost as the HQP address, since Roon Core is on the same machine. Does this need to be changed to the IP address or is it ok to leave as 'localhost'?

 

"localhost" is most efficient for this case, as it doesn't need to through bunch of unnecessary stuff due to everything being on the same machine.

 

[Miska]

I also wrote on Roon forum about the same topic, but check the "Limits" counter value on front page. When DirectSDM is enabled, PCM-to-DSD is also fixed -2.5 dB volume. To adjust volume for PCM-to-DSD, you need to disable DirectSDM.

 

If you don't need HQPlayer's volume control, you can then set it to fixed value on the config page under "Fixed volume". This will reject volume change requests from control applications. But it cannot override the fixed value used when DirectSDM is enabled.

 

Whether that -2.5 dBFS setting is enough depends on how compressed the source content is, IOW how much it contains digital clipping and such.

 

It could be just that the Tidal content you tried is more compressed/worse than the content you've tried from HDD.

[Miska]

Here, I have fanless HQPlayer Embedded computer connected to Holo Spring DAC. Roon is running on MacMini under macOS. From Roon I can output any content just fine to HQPlayer which always outputs DSD512 (using any of the -2s filter variants).

 

That fanless computer has i5-7600T CPU and 16 GB of DDR4-2400 RAM.

 

To set clean baseline, I'd suggest to first try without NAA and see how it goes. This simplifies the setup and reduces number of variables in the picture.

 

[Miska]

19 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

How do you control it?

 

Usually straight from MacMini, but sometimes when I'm adventurous, from Android or iPad Pro using Roon app.

 

HQPlayer configuration is done through browser as usual.