Amir at ASR claims Uptone won't sell the ISO regen to him...

[Fitzcaraldo215]

16 minutes ago, wgscott said:

They have some really disturbing avatars on that site.

Yes, but they also have some good information, including honest measurements by Amir.

  

But, it is confirmed that Alex is trying to keep the ISO Regen out of Amir's hands for measurement purposes:

 

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?23015-Who-s-buying-the-UpTone-Audio-ISO-REGEN&p=453954&viewfull=1#post453954

 

I think it is clear that Alex and Swenson do not want measurements, period.

 

[Fitzcaraldo215]

26 minutes ago, wgscott said:

What would be of great benefit would be to depersonalize this issue.

 

If folks could agree to do that, then the next step would be to determine what measurement or set of measurements both "sides" of the debate could agree in advance would be decisive either way.

 

The third step would be to find some competent, neutral party that has access to the equipment, to cary out the experiments.

Quite logical and rational.  Except, that is not the issue here.  Is it ever at CA?  Amir wishes to purchase and to make measurements of the ISO, as he did with the original Regen.  Alex says he will not sell to Amir for undisclosed PERSONAL reasons, simultaneously claiming he is OK with measurements of any kind.  

 

So, the disconnect is not a logical one and is seemingly more complex, based on secret inside information, difficult as that may be to fathom.  

 

So, kids, stay close to your radios.  Will Amir snatch an ISO Regen and submit it to his torturous measurements?  Or, will Sir Alex, and his noble Squire Swenson, save the galaxy from the evil bully and troublemaker?

 

[Fitzcaraldo215]

21 minutes ago, Teresa said:

 

 

Firedog is correct, Alex does have the right to refuse to sell his product to anyone, especially someone apparently with an agenda to do Alex's firm harm. Apparently your blind faith in Amir is incorrect.

 

Teresa - true, Alex has the right to refuse the sale.  But, while Alex is entitled to his opinion justifying his action, there is no evidence anywhere that Amir has "an agenda to do Alex's firm harm." None.  Zero. Alex insists and states a lot of things about Amir, but none are independently proven anywhere.  None.  Zero.

 

 But, I can see where the stampede of opinions here and deep sympathies for Alex at CA might lead you and others to assume something negative about Amir, who is not known here, based purely on Alex' say so, which may or may not be truthful.

[Fitzcaraldo215]

9 minutes ago, semente said:

 

Thanks!

Unfortunately, eye patterns are not what we hear, as they are only about an interim communications step in the USB linkage affecting the input to the DAC.  That interim step and the quality of its eye pattern may or may not affect the output of audio signal from the DAC. That output analog signal is also measurable in numerous ways, and those measurements characterize what we hear.

[Fitzcaraldo215]

4 minutes ago, semente said:

 

But it would, I presume, help determine if the regeneration is indeed improving the data transfer?

 

 

Unfortunately, no.  The data gets through just fine and uncorrupted even in cases where eye patters are somewhat distorted.  I don't think the eye pattern, tells inexperienced lay audiophiles like you and me anything at all about the sound. But, that is what Uptone relies on for their published measurements to buyers, not measurements of the analog audio from the DAC.

 

That is a point of contention between Amir and Uptone.  Amir insists on measurements from the analog output if the DAC.  Swenson and Uptone have no such measurement capabilities, and they have chosen not to acquire them. 

[Fitzcaraldo215]

1 minute ago, Jud said:

 

So you measure analog differences and then the next question is, are they audible?  Too bad no one's done objective, unbiased listening tests on the ISO Regen - oh, wait....

Jud - If Swenson wants to be a big boy audio engineer, which he was not in his day job, then he needs to have the proper equipment for audio engineering and measurement, plus an adequate understanding of audio measurement.  That would be before going off on flights of trying to suggest that audio measurements are no good, don't tell you everything, measure inaudible stuff, etc.  Or, that Regen's improvements are so sophisticated they do not show up in traditional audio measurements.

 

You are not implying, I hope, that the two person listening test you were a part of is a statistically significant sample that proves everything?  I think that test is not ideal.  Two test subjects is a good start, but more are needed, hopefully with careful documentation of the protocol. But, even so.  The unbiased listening tests we need are final version of ISO Regen vs. bypass, ideally with instantaneous switching between them.  A 3-way test involving two prototypes plus bypas should be streamlined down.

[Fitzcaraldo215]

5 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

 

How many commercial audio products have you designed?

Zero, and you?  I am not a plumber or a carpenter either, but I think I understand what they need to have in their toolkit.

[Fitzcaraldo215]

22 minutes ago, mmerrill99 said:

Or that they want 'measurements' but don't really understand what this means or what to do with the 'measurements' when they get them - more arguments, I predict 

Hey, John Kenny.  I thought Chris had banned you.  Is that why you need to disguise your ID?

[Fitzcaraldo215]

30 minutes ago, Daudio said:

 

And yet you quoted my entire long post !  Why do I bother... 

 

Why indeed?