iFi Audio iGalvanic3.0 - The Holy Grail of Computer Audio

[PPk]

6 hours ago, Bullitt5094 said:

So my feedback on the Galv isn't what you're going to want to hear. It arrived today and I installed it prior to the USB3 as instructed. I left the switch in the center. It played 3-4 songs and suddenly put out a blast of what I would call white noise at, what I'm sure was max level. I shut everything down as quickly as possible and pulled the Galv out. But the outburst seems to have damaged the USB3. My PC will not see my Lyngdorf amp through the USB3. I've had the USB3 less than 30 days purchased through Amazon, but not from your Amazon store iFI. What should I do @AMR/iFi audio ?

looking forward to the issues resolution.. i myself is holding back because of worries of compatibility issues. 

 

are you able to see the hub in the device manager? usually USB3 itself will show new usb3 device in the windows device manger or mac hardware if you are using apple

[Bullitt5094]

8 hours ago, thuandb said:

Bullitt5094,

 

I appreciate you voiced your opinions and shared your unique findings.  Like many, I thought (still do) those devices you A/B-ed are superior to the least expensive Micro iUSB3.0.  That's why I was pondering on which to upgrade to, Mutec or SOtM or ISO Regen or Nano iUSB3's bigger sibling.  Your spending time and efforts to listen to, compare them, and post your findings has help me off the fence and give the Micro iUSB3 a chance.  Can you please elaborate on how specifically you liked/disliked those USB "enhancers" in the test?  I think that woul help those who are still on the fence (like earlier me) and/or those who don't have enough determination or commitment to finding the truth (like me) to have a broader view of what choices available.

 

Thanks again enjoy the music, whenever it comes back after the iG3 gets fixed.

First, let me state that I realize my findings go totally against the grain of the majority of the Audiophile community. Especially on the SOtM 200ultra and the Mutec devices. I stated I have some audiophile friends that are enamored with the 200. Even the guy that produces AO thinks the Mutec is the best thing since sliced bread. So don't sell those short. They all have return policies that will cost you minimal investments to run them through your system as I did. I encourage you to do so.

I am totally surprised at the results of my testing. But I went through the same process with the Lyngdorf vs amps from LTA and Odyssey. I was actually rooting for the LTA because those are just absolute works of art and the company was awesome to deal with. And they did sound very, very good. But the Lyngdorf was noticeably better. So I'm "stuck" with an integrated amp in my rack. Bummer... lol.

OK, what we heard is clarity top to bottom. Especially the high-highs. The run-out of the cymbal sounds. The resolution of the strings. The natural sound of the piano. The SOtM did a pretty good job in comparison, but the Mutec seem to have the very high end MIA altogether. Please note... I have Tekton Ulfberhts. They include 15 tweeter elements! Their high end extension is pretty darn good. Plus the Lyngdorf resolves high end very well against very dark noise floor. That was the most striking difference. But the imaging was better with the iFI. Certainly more depth to the stage. A 3D effect. This is a result of good mid range in my book. And also on the low end. The Bass in Diana Krall type Jazz is much tighter and more defined. Some of this I attribute to the better mid/highs though. There is high end resolution even in the rattle of a plucked bass. But the speed of the kick drum on Bleacher/Chain Smoker albums was noticeably better too. Almost startling. Again, the Tektons have two 12" woofers in each tower and a 99dB efficiency. So thing like this are pretty up-front with them.

So there are all the usual flowery adjectives. I find it really hard to describe sound. I highly recommend listening in your own system, in your own room and not being tainted by the crowd. Internet sales have opened the door to in-home auditions. Something that didn't happen too often even a few years ago. I encourage everyone to take advantage of it.  I use to feel guilty sending things back, but I realize now, the lack of cost of brick/mortar stores or sub distribution are a cost savings for manufactures. That certainly offsets the cost of their return policy. So take advantage of it.

[thuandb]

What you said about the Micro iUSB3.0 made my day.  But I'm still curious how you would describe the others.  Particularly, I'm interested to hear your takes on the Mutec and the ISO Regen.  Thank you.

[Bullitt5094]

The Iso Regen may have come in second if not for compatibility problems. It sounded very good when it worked in the full ISO mode. But I had the same problem with it I just had with the iFI Galvanic. It would only work for a short period of time in ISO mode before crashing the stream. But when it crashed it never went into max white noise mode. It would either go into a weird low level distortion or just stop the stream. I worked with Alex on a work-around for this problem "stick a wire into the output USB connector and ground it to the receptacle in the wall". But that made no change. I wasn't going to live with that anyway. And in the non-iso mode it didn't sound much better than a direct connection to the Lyngdorf. But if your DAC will let it stay in ISO mode, it could sound very good.

The Mutec was just flat missing high end extension and clarity across the board. The wife described it as distorted vs even a direct feed from the server. It couldn't even keep up with the CD input from my Oppo, which sounds pretty good in it's own right. I tried different things with it, but the shortcomings were obvious from square one. In fact the only time it sounded good was when I put the iFI USB in front of it. For some reason it helped the Mutec produce some of the missing range. Even then the stream sounded better with just the iFI. But AGAIN, don't take my results as what you'll hear. Try them!

[PPk]

Are u using a laptop? Could it be grounding issue on the input side of the iso/igalvanic? 

[thuandb]

I'm guessing your DAC is sensitive to the galvanic isolation offered by iFi and Uptone. In case you haven't tried or noticed, there're 3 positions of isolation on the iGalvanic: center that you've tried, upper and lower.  I hope you try the other two and see what will happen.  It's also very possible you've got a defective unit.

 

Thanks so much for your invaluable insights into the sounds of those devices.  I can't wait to hear the Micro iUSB connected to DAC without iPurifier2.  Hope you solve the iG3 issue soon.

 

Another thought:  if an iDefender wasn't in the loop, you might want to give it a try.  Also, placing the iG3 after iUSB3, while not recommended by iFi, would not be a too bad alternative.  I tried and it didn't sound too bad.  Again, you might want to play with the ground switch on Micro iUSB and isolation switch in iG3.  The "right" and optimal position should be somewhere among the combo.

[Bullitt5094]

Not a laptop. It's a PC I built that includes all SSD drives, a linear PS and Audiophile Optomizer. I'm reasonably sure the Lyngdorf doesn't like the broken chain. And the Lyngdorf isn't going to get replaced for any reason, unless I upgrade to the new 3400. Think "cold dead hands".

And I'm one of these weird people that read the instruction. I know there are multiple positions/modes on the iFI Galv. But the only thing it adds vs the iFI USB to my signal chain is the Galvanic Isolation. At least as far as I can tell. So defeating that defeats any reason to have it in-line. I'm generally a simpler is better kind of guy anyway. Plus, I'm not going to put it back in-line and risk anything else stupid happening at this point. I'm still waiting for iFI's reaction to my situation. I realize they can't test vs every piece of hardware/driver out there, but this is a really bad failure mode. I'm not a happy camper right now. I'm really glad it didn't damage the amp. Anxious moments yesterday, for sure.

[thuandb]

"And in the non-iso mode it didn't sound much better than a direct connection to the Lyngdorf. But if your DAC will let it stay in ISO mode, it could sound very good. "

 

I have to agree.  At some point due to incompatibility or lack of proper cable connector, the iG3 has to stay out, only Nano is in the circuit (like now), and the SQ is already pretty good.  Okay, let us know how it goes.  On my part, I'll report back on the proper Mercury connection and the Micro iUSB3.

[PPk]

12 minutes ago, thuandb said:

"And in the non-iso mode it didn't sound much better than a direct connection to the Lyngdorf. But if your DAC will let it stay in ISO mode, it could sound very good. "

 

I have to agree.  At some point due to incompatibility or lack of proper cable connector, the iG3 has to stay out, only Nano is in the circuit (like now), and the SQ is already pretty good.  Okay, let us know how it goes.  On my part, I'll report back on the proper Mercury connection and the Micro iUSB3.

You are using only nano in your setup now? What happend with the igalvanic? 

[Bullitt5094]

The iFI USB and the Galvanic are both out of the system currently. The Galvanic because it scares me to death right now, and the USB because it doesn't work after the Galvanic incident. I am directly connected between my SOtM USBexp card in the Music Server PC and the Lyngdorf. Which still sounds pretty good. SOtM makes some good stuff. That's why I remain surprised the 200 Ultra didn't make the grade.

[thuandb]

The iG3 has been sitting aside waiting for proper Mercury cable and Micro iUSB.

 

It's very likely Bullitt5094's iFi USB was killed after the iG3 incident.

[AMR/iFi audio]

21 hours ago, Bullitt5094 said:

So my feedback on the Galv isn't what you're going to want to hear. It arrived today and I installed it prior to the USB3 as instructed. I left the switch in the center. It played 3-4 songs and suddenly put out a blast of what I would call white noise at, what I'm sure was max level. I shut everything down as quickly as possible and pulled the Galv out. But the outburst seems to have damaged the USB3. My PC will not see my Lyngdorf amp through the USB3. I've had the USB3 less than 30 days purchased through Amazon, but not from your Amazon store iFI. What should I do @AMR/iFi audio ?

 

We're sorry to hear this, but we will do our best to help you out. The shortest and fastest route from here is via our Support Platform System, to be found here: http://support.ifi-audio.com/index.php

[Bullitt5094]

If all you're going to do is shuffle me into the system, I'm just going to return everything through Amazon and look for something else. That's going to be easier for me. You'll be getting your USB cable back too. But thanks anyway.

[thuandb]

8 hours ago, PPk said:

You are using only nano in your setup now? What happend with the igalvanic? 

The current setup, even though still below optimal condition due to unwanted use of iPurifier2 and lack of arriving Micro USB, is sounding so good it touches my heart.  Jplay settings include Kernel Streaming, DAC Link 700Hz, buffer 0.01 secs, clock 15.6ms, UltraStream engine.

[PPk]

9 hours ago, Bullitt5094 said:

The iFI USB and the Galvanic are both out of the system currently. The Galvanic because it scares me to death right now, and the USB because it doesn't work after the Galvanic incident. I am directly connected between my SOtM USBexp card in the Music Server PC and the Lyngdorf. Which still sounds pretty good. SOtM makes some good stuff. That's why I remain surprised the 200 Ultra didn't make the grade.

Try testing the Iusb with a thumb drive? That should be safe I think. Which usb cables are u using for interconnect between the ifi devices and PC? There's report of faulty stock cable in this forum. Maybe u can grab some usb3 cables from elsewhere just for troubleshooting purpose. 

[Bullitt5094]

Those are all great suggestions, and I certainly appreciate all the input from the community. But I've decided to return all things iFI through Amazon and experiment with non-iFI products. Happy listening folks!

[PPk]

2 hours ago, Bullitt5094 said:

Those are all great suggestions, and I certainly appreciate all the input from the community. But I've decided to return all things iFI through Amazon and experiment with non-iFI products. Happy listening folks!

Bullitt5094,

 

looks like you are not alone with this problem. another user experiencing the same thing

 

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/ifi-audio-igalvanic3-0-the-holy-grail-of-audio.839638/page-26#post-14114798

 

@AMR/iFi audio

can help to comment on this issue here? as it also impact other customers and also potential buyers including me..

[asdf1000]

3 minutes ago, PPk said:

Bullitt5094,

 

looks like you are not alone with this problem. another user experiencing the same thing

 

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/ifi-audio-igalvanic3-0-the-holy-grail-of-audio.839638/page-26#post-14114798

 

 

This is a known problem with the Silanna Isolator chip used in both the Uptone ISO REGEN and the iGalvanic3.0. 

 

I believe this was known which is why they both included a switch to disable isolation.

 

I had issues with both sadly (even using an iFi Groundhog to ground before and/or after the isolation in the chain).

 

I've had no issues with an Intona Industrial isolator though which uses a different isolation method (with their own FPGA solution I believe) which has been rock solid reliable for me.

 

[AMR/iFi audio]

5 hours ago, PPk said:

 

@AMR/iFi audio

can help to comment on this issue here? as it also impact other customers and also potential buyers including me..

 

iGalvanic3.0 is a very specific product to use. We've added several features so that it should work in every environment. But if there are any issues regarding any of our devices, the AMR/iFi support page is the place to go. In addition, to solve any iGalvanic3.0 related issue, we always need to know the exact specs of a setup, all its connections etc. Our point here is that each configuration is different, iGalvanic3.0 might be tricky to use at first, but our support team is always there.  

 

Here's the link:

 

http://support.ifi-audio.com

http://support.ifi-audio.com

 

[Bullitt5094]

Apparently the Galv has also damaged my SOtM card and my Motherboard. Folks, I wouldn't risk putting this device in your system. That's my recommendation. I really like the USB, but the Galv can apparently be dangerous. This is turning out to be a very expensive experiment for me.

[thuandb]

Really sorry to hear that.

[AMR/iFi audio]

Folks, Salon Audio Montreal Fest is the place to be this weekend.

 

Over 100 exhibitors, over 300 brands! And yes, iFi audio is there as well. Montreal's Hotel Bonaventure during this weekend is yet another place to witness what our Pro iDSD is capable of. If you're around, please visit us!

 

The show starts on the 23rd of March 2018 at 11:00 local time and ends on the 25th of March 2018 (17:00).

 

[thuandb]

Micro iUSB3.0 is here.  It briefly spent time in the following chain:

 

PC (JCAT FEMTO USB) --> Mercury 3.0 --> Nano iUSB 3.0 --> Mercury 3.0 --> Micro iUSB 3.0 --> Uptone USPCB --> DAC, sounding pretty good, so good I delayed and almost skipped lunch.

 

Then, before lunch, iGalvanic3.0 was carefully inserted to the chain like this:

 

PC (JCAT FEMTO USB) --> Mercury 3.0 --> Nano iUSB 3.0 --> Mercury 3.0 --> iG3 --> Mercury 3.0 --> Micro iUSB 3.0 --> Uptone USPCB --> DAC, both Micro and iG3 are at optimal settings (ground lifted, galvanic isolation enabled).

 

Here're impressions after coming back from lunch (about 1 hour):  Startling dynamics, noticeably more palpable texture, higher wider deeper stage, faster tighter bass, clearer more delicate highs.  Those are evident on both Redbook and DSD, audiophile and non-audiophile materials.  Overall:  a very delicious, chill-runs-down-my-spine (several times) presentation.

 

A Mercury 3.0 (USB B 2.0) will be here Monday, but so far so good.

 

 

[thuandb]

41 minutes ago, AMR/iFi audio said:

Folks, Salon Audio Montreal Fest is the place to be this weekend.

 

Over 100 exhibitors, over 300 brands! And yes, iFi audio is there as well. Montreal's Hotel Bonaventure during this weekend is yet another place to witness what our Pro iDSD is capable of. If you're around, please visit us!

 

The show starts on the 23rd of March 2018 at 11:00 local time and ends on the 25th of March 2018 (17:00).

 

We wish you the best success.  Enjoy the show.

[LoryWiv]

9 hours ago, Bullitt5094 said:

Apparently the Galv has also damaged my SOtM card and my Motherboard. Folks, I wouldn't risk putting this device in your system. That's my recommendation. I really like the USB, but the Galv can apparently be dangerous. This is turning out to be a very expensive experiment for me.

 

I'm sorry it went south for you, but just to provide a different view: I've had the iGalv. in my system for several months w/NO issues except rare dropout readily solved by reconnecting. The upside is a remarkable lowering of noise floor and subjectively, a bit more air, instrument separation and detail... although in part could just be due to the blacker background. Reinforces the importance of component compatibility and synergy in this hobby / passion of ours.