A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

[romaz]

It would be nice if someone made an audio spec switch/router that would do similar.

I agree. I'm waiting for someone to develop an internet modem/router/switch with linear regulators, a really good clock and built-in optical isolation.

[romaz]

Let's hope SOtM, Sonore, small green computer are interested.

This is what I am hoping to accomplish with this thread. This area of audio over ethernet seems to be rapidly evolving and ripe for more significant improvements.

[romaz]

This is very exciting. Let me suggest the steps for those of us who are not experts on networking

 

1) connect pc to router with 1 of 2 Ethernet ports on pc

2) connect pc to microRendu with other Ethernet port

3) assign a manual static set of descriptors for both networks

4) go to instructions for bridging these 2 separate networks

 

I googled how to set manual addresses etc and still don't understand. Anybody that can help on this would be greatly appreciated. I know where to get my microRendu isp address but what about my regular router isp. Where is that?

Yes on all points.

 

As for manually assigning an IP address to your newly created bridge, the first thing you will want to know is the current IPv4 address and subnet of your machine and the following describes how you do this in Windows:

 

4 Ways to find your computer's IP address in Windows | Digital Citizen

 

Take note of your subnet as you will want to use the exact same subnet for your bridge. If you analyze your IPv4 address, you will see that it is broken up into 4 octets with each octet separated by a period. As you arbitrarily assign your bridge some static IP address, make sure the first three octets are identical to your current machine's IP address and select a different number (from 0-255) for your last octet. For example, if your DHCP router has assigned your machine an address of 192.168.1.25, you could arbitrarily select an IP address of 192.168.1.250 for your bridge. As you can see, it is only the last group of numbers that is different. If a conflict arises because that address has already been assigned to another device by your DHCP router, if you can figure out which device is currently occupying that address, rebooting that device should resolve the conflict. Alternatively, you could always select a different address and this would probably be the easiest thing to do.

 

Sounds like a hassle but you should only have to do this once. I believe you will find the payoff to be worthwhile.

 

For OSX, you can use DHCP for the bridge and everything works fine.

[romaz]

I don't see any benefit in that.

At surface value, I would agree with you but here are 4 reasons why I believe such a device could prove beneficial or at least very convenient:

 

1) With my current modem/router, powering it with my Paul Hynes SR7 has resulted in a very noticeable improvement in terms of dynamics in the same way that I am noticing that a good PSU benefits the microRendu. Clearly, the modem/router/switch that we all use has some impact.

2) With the exception of a Melco N1A or N1Z which incorporates its own internal router and functions as its own DHCP server, all other routers I am aware of utilize noisy switching regulators and so if you are streaming from a NAS or streaming from Tidal, it would make sense to me to believe that the stream would be adversely impacted as those streams have to go through this router/switch.

3) I currently employ a Paul Pang switch with TXCO clock in my system and it is connected between my FMC (receiving end) and my Mac Mini. It is connected to the Mac Mini with a short 1 meter BJC Cat6A cable and you can look at it as an "ethernet Regen." This device is a native 5V device and uses no regulators and so powered directly by my LPS-1 set at 5V, its output is very clean. While the improvement is small it is very meaningful. It has not only improved SQ but because it serves as a buffer, I have noticed significantly fewer dropouts with it in the chain. Regardless, reclocking the ethernet stream shortly before it arrives to the server seems to provide benefits in the same way that a USB Regen can benefit a DAC. All routers have clocks and so it would make sense to replace this clock with a much more stable clock if someone was out to design an audiophile class router. In fact, SOtM's newest clock, the sCLK-EX has exactly such an application in mind.

4) There has been plenty said about the benefits of optical isolation in a network. It would also make sense to me to incorporate this option in an audiophile-class router/switch to make life easier.

 

At the end of the day, an internet modem/router/switch is a streaming device just like an Auralic Aries and if you believe the femto clock/LPS upgrade for the Aries resulted in an improvement, there should be no reason to believe a router would be any different.

[romaz]

Jplay has been a long time advocate for using a separate Ethernet card to connect their Audio PC and Control PC.

 

BTW, speaking of improving microRendu and SOtM sMS-200 performance - try putting Jcat isolator (Intona) and Wyred Recovery inseries after the microRendu (uR > Intona > Wyred Recovery, with uR powered by LPS-1). HUGE gain in dynamic contrast, soundstage dimensionality and clarity. My jaw literally hit the floor yesterday, when I first tried this combination (and that was after trying all sorts of PSUs on those gizmos, which also brought some improvement).

Yes, you're absolutely right. A dual box JPlay system operates under (and benefits from) the same principles but I will say that my friend's dual box system with WinServer 2012R2 + AO + JPlay doesn't sound as good as what I have now. With that said, I do believe the control PC absolutely matters and so I am in the process of installing WinServer 2012R2 + AO + Roon on my Mac Mini and am hoping that this optimization will result in further improvement.

 

With regards to the impact of the Intona, that tweak will be system dependent. My Chord DAVE already incorporates very effective galvanic isolation on its USB input. Good enough that when I connected an Intona Industrial USB isolater and W4S Recovery powered by an LPS-1 between my mR and DAC, I could detect no difference at all.

[romaz]

Would there still be a good reason to use optical isolation (FMCs and a run of fiber) in this new implementation?

I have optical isolation with FMCs between my router and my server but I have not tried it between my server and the sMS-200. I suppose it might help but I am loving the simplicity of what I have and enjoying the huge improvement as is. I suppose I will want to try it at some point but I am in no hurry to do so.

[romaz]

There is an important distinction with the Uptone Audio LPS-1 which you are missing, which is also in the Vinnie Rossi ultracap power supply, but not in either the HD Plex or the Teradak or any other usual Linear Regulated PSU, so you cannot realistically compare these without taking this into account. Actually, more than that, these are two different classes of PSUs completely.

 

That feature is the breakage of Leakage loops because the LPS-1 works in 'disconnected-from-the-mains' mode when the load is being powered by its powering ultracaps (not the ones being charged as these are charged though the mains connection).

 

NB: I am not saying that low impedance isn't important, just that by comparing these two classes of PSUs, you aren't able to conclude where the SQ changes come from because there are at least these two variables changed there (actually many more than that). So the comparison doesn't stand.

 

Secondly, the microRendu is designed to work as an NAA among other types of endpoints - that means it was already designed to connect directly to your computer.

 

Don't underestimate the issues that can be cause by ground loops and leakage currents, these can wreak havoc on a system's ability.

 

Otherwise, good on you for the improved SQ, it's always worthwhile.

I agree with you about the importance of leakage current but even John Swenson admits that the impact of this is very system dependent. In my system, it seems to have very little bearing and this could be because my Chord DAVE's USB input is already galvanically isolated. While galvanic isolation seems to be a feature thrown out loosely by a lot of DAC makers, the quality of its implementation seems to vary greatly. With the Chord DAVE, as I stated in a previous post, an Intona Industrial made no difference at all. In fact, by itself (when not coupled with a W4S Recovery), SQ actually worsened. Moreover, when I compare my LPS-1 directly against the Paul Pang SR7, there is only improvement with the SR7 (although this doesn't take away from just how exceptional the LPS-1 one is and how there is no better value).

 

Regarding the mR being designed to directly connect to a computer, this is not how Sonore (or SOtM) sees it. At least, not yet.

[romaz]

Remember I am not knowledgeable on this stuff so the questions may seem naïve but here goes

 

1) When I use my Sonicorbiter link (which as set up now in my system) I currently see an isp for the microRendu. Is the address I use when I hook up the micro Rendu directly to the pc separate Ethernet port?

 

2) or do connect the microRendu to the pc , let the pc assign a new isp, then insert that into the bridging command?

 

Right now I connect my pc to my router. Then I run a separate Ethernet cable from the router to the Rendu. Since I use a Vinnie Rossi DHT which by definition has triodes I turn the VR off when not listening. This turns off the Rendu. Then everytime I turn the VR on, load HQP the system goes through discovery of the network connection. Sometimes I have to power cycle the Rendu several times to successfully connect it.

 

3) So will this complicate my use of a bridging connection?

Regarding question #1, yes, you could choose to use the IP address you see listed. As that address has already been assigned to your mR, then you know it isn't being used by any other device.

 

It sounds like your setup is more complicated than it has to be if you are having to turn off your mR each time you shut down your LIO but of course, if you are using your LIO battery bank to power your mR, then I understand. Does this complicate a bridging connection? I don't think it would since the static IP address you assign the mR will always be reserved for it even when the mR is shut off.

[romaz]

Ok, sorry for not completely understanding all of this which leads me to a few questions...

 

1) how many LPS-1 units do you have in place? You make it sound like ONE unit can power multiple devices? sorry i don't own an LPS-1 nor know that much about it yet, I have a TeraDak now powering my uRendu.

 

2) Is the SR7 powering the mac mini or your modem/router or both? where does one purchase an SR7?

 

3) I'm still somewhat confused about the chain of components here, are you still using FMC's and fiber before the uRendu or have you ditched the FMC's?

 

4) Right now i'm using the TeraDak PSU (30W DC9V2.5A) to power my uRendu, it'd be nice still get use out of it for another component, any suggestions?

My SR7 is a multi-transformer, multi-rail PSU. Paul can build supplies that can incorporate up to 4 transformers and 4 independent outputs in a chassis. Mine has both 12V/5A and 9V/3A outputs. Its voltages can be set to +/- 3V to allow for flexibility although the transformer windings are optimized for 12V and 9V. It is a very flexible device but also very expensive although I can assure you that you get what you pay for. No expense was spared with this PSU and it was ordered with Paul's finest annealed silver DC cabling and utilizes his mil spec ultra low impedance connectors (<1 milliohm) between the PSU and DC leads. I requested that Paul install Furutech's best NCF IEC inlet and also specified the Oyaide barrel connectors. I have upgraded my fuse to the new Audio Magic Beeswax SHD fuse with favorable impact. For the price I paid, I expected it to be better than anything else I have previously owned and I have not been disappointed.

 

Should you wish to contact Paul to order your own custom SR7 (he also makes a lower model and less expensive SR5 and SR3), you can reach him directly at [email protected]. He is based in Scotland and I believe he is presently away on holiday but he is generally very responsive and very helpful. He now has help and he is claiming a lead time of about 2 months from design to completion but it depends on how long his queue is at any given moment.

[romaz]

There's a very handy feature of CA, which members who always provide a reference to which they allude to when posting ensure they fill in, and that is using their signature to include what their current system is.

 

You can read mine below each post, below a gray line...

I am not a frequent poster on CA and so I have not taken the time to update my signature yet but I will do so. I am generally found on Head-Fi. Please note that because of all the testing that I do, my reference setup changes often. You can look up my complete equipment list by clicking on my profile but my setup is as follows. Above all else, the qualities I value most are transparency, resolution and balance:

 

TP-Link Cable Modem/Router powered by Paul Hynes SR7 > BJC CAT6A ethernet cable > FMC 100Mbit isolators with receiving end powered by LPS-1 > BJC CAT6A ethernet cable > Paul Pang TCXO 100Mbit switch powered by LPS-1 > BJC CAT6A ethernet cable > Mac Mini modified with Uptone Audio MMK and powered with Paul Hynes SR7 > direct connection using SOtM dCBL6 ethernet cable with SOtM iSO-CAT6 isolator > sMS-200 (and microRendu) powered either by SR7 or LPS-1> Clarity Cables Natural USB cable > Chord DAVE DAC (which also functions as my headphone and speaker amp) > High Fidelity Cables Pro Series RCA interconnects > connected to custom junction box that inputs RCA and outputs to speaker binding posts > High Fidelity Cables CT-1 Ultimate Speaker Cables (soon to be upgraded to HFC Pro Series Speaker Cables) > Omega Custom Alnico monitors + JL Audio Fathom F110V2 subwoofer. For headphones, I connect directly from Chord DAVE's headphone output directly to High Fidelity Cables new Trinity Helix (a passive device that magnetizes my headphone signal) > DHC Silver Spore4 headphone cable > various headphones which include the Focal Utopias, Abyss 1266, HE-1000 and TH-900. This signature will change again soon with Chord's release of Davina.

 

In case you're wondering, the Chord DAVE was never meant to drive speakers directly but I am using it to do so, nonetheless. Because of its very low output impedance of 0.055 ohms (damping factor 145) and because it can output 2 watts at 8 ohms through its single ended outputs (the cleanest and most transparent 2 watts a pair of speakers will ever see), the DAVE very effectively drives my high efficiency single-driver Omega monitors and it is the most transparent speaker setup I have yet to hear.

[romaz]

Hi @romaz

 

• 
  
• What are physical distances involved here?
  
  • Between your Mac Mini and the switch?
    
  • Between the Mac Mini and the mR/SMS-200? Did you change this for your experiment, i.e. move the Mini closer to your mR/SMS-200?
    

From my Paul Pang switch to my Mac Mini is a 1 meter BJC CAT6A cable. From my Mac Mini to the SOtM (or microRendu), I have a 1 meter SOtM dCBL-CAT6 cable + iSO-CAT6 isolator. I suspect these cable lengths could be much longer without detriment but it just so happens these pieces are in close proximity to each other.

 

• What is on which AC circuit?
  
  • Of the following: Mini, NAS, and switch, which of these, if any, is in the same room, or on the same AC circuit as your audio gear - i.e. mR/SMS-200 and downstream devices?
    

 

I have one dedicated 20A circuit for the things that matter and an adjacent non-dedicated 15A circuit where I plug in items that I don't want polluting my setup including the switching PSU that powers the transmitting FMC, the Meanwell feeder supply for my LPS-1, etc. I have a NAS in another room on a separate circuit but I use it mainly for backup and comparison testing. I am finding better SQ (smoother with less edge) from a single 4TB Samsung SSD connected to a Thunderbolt hub that also houses a DVD-ROM that I use to rip my CDs. The hub is connected directly to my Mac Mini using a Synergistic Research Active SE Thunderbolt cable and it is this cable that is responsible for the smoother and less edgy SQ. I have compared several Thunderbolt cables including Corning's optical Thunderbolt cable which I was sure would sound best but interestingly, while it sounds very detailed, there is an unpleasant grain. This Thunderbolt hub (12V) is currently being powered independently by my now repurposed HDPlex. I am afraid to try the SR7 on this hub because I am afraid there will be an improvement and I will be forced to consider the purchase of another Paul Hynes supply. Thus far, anything I have connected my SR7 to has been improved by it.

 

• Did cabling stay the same? So before, you had the Mini, the NAS, and the mR/SMS-200 connected to your switch. It sounds like the big epiphany (and audible improvement) for you was moving the cable from the mR/SMS from the router to the Mini (with bridging enabled, of course)
  
  • So other than that port change, were the cables unchanged in type, or length?
    

   

  [*]

 

My cabling has not changed. Instead of connecting the sMS-200 directly to my Paul Pang switch, I now connect it directly to the native ethernet port on my Mac Mini. This is the only variable I have altered.

 

Also, I wanted to comment on the following quote:

[/b]If you read that from the perspective of someone who's familiar with OS kernel internals, he could be talking about some kind of local optimization, where if Core and Ready processes are running on the same OS instance, with the same IP address, they could detect that and bypass TCP/IP "comms" (for example, AF_INET sockets) and use a different form of IPC (inter-process communication), like UNIX domain sockets, pipes, or even shared memory.

I apologize if the above sounds very mumbo-jumbo, but the key point for the lay person is that when using Ethernet bridging, your endpoint (i.e. mR/SMS) still has a distinct IP address from your Mini, so I'm afraid the "not so good comms layer" is still in effect, as the Core and Ready processes are not "local" to each other.

 

I have to admit that what is actually happening with this direct connection is not something I understand well and so someone smarter than I am will have to explain it. While my router is responsible for assigning the sMS-200 its own IP address, there is still obviously some disconnect that has occurred and I have a hard time believing that removal of the intermediary Paul Pang switch was all that was responsible. In fact, I tried removing the switch and directly connecting my sMS-200 to the FMC and then directly connecting it to my modem/router to see if these devices might be contributing to veils and they were not. Removal of the switch and FMCs and directly connecting to the modem/router actually sounded a bit worse.

[romaz]

Adam,

I will ask the bridging/direct-to-uRendu questions once I have them all lined up.

Hi Ted, I would very much appreciate your ears on this. Roy

[romaz]

Well, here is a poor representation of my system, from router to microRendu. I have the mR powered by an LPS-1 and my NAS FMC powered by an Anker battery. The remaining FMC is powered by a cheap Jameco lps. The Trendnet FMC at the mR is alos powered by a cheap wallwart, but will change that to my JPS-2 (which will be the LPS-1 energizer too).

 

Net/net, I want to try the direct-from-HQP server-to-mR approach and my HQP machine has 2 NICS; an ethernet mobo port (unused currently) and a Mellanox fiber card (connected to the fiber switch currently). Should I utilize the Mellanox to uRendu FMC and use another FMC for the wired ethernet port to fiber switch, or visa versa?

[ATTACH=CONFIG]31997[/ATTACH]

We are in uncharted territory here so I can't answer that question for you. Even without fiber between server and mR, the clarity I am hearing is exquisite. I suggest you try both ways and report back.

[romaz]

Another question if you connect the microRendu directly to the pc Ethernet port doesn't that essentially make the risk (from the how to link above) of an unprotected network?

 

Reference from the link : 'You should never create a bridge between an Internet connection and a network connection because it creates an unprotected link between your network and the Internet. This can make your network accessible to anyone on the Internet, which is not good from a security point of view'

 

Still puzzled by all the how to's but still want to try this.

When you bridge 2 networks, you are indeed exposing that 2nd network to whatever risks the 1st network is vulnerable to. But in this case, the only thing on this 2nd network would be your mR/sMS-200.

[romaz]

You can get a small SFP switch that accepts an external Linear or battery supply. The "optical isolation" thread has many specific examples.

Thanks, I've seen some of those examples and I've considered them although it would be great if it was more than a switch but also included a router and internet modem. That way, you have one integrated component powered by a single LPSU.

[romaz]

@romaz

 

I am sure what you are hearing is real and applicable to your system.

 

However, I still have a hard time coming up with any rational explanation for what you are hearing.

 

So, as is always the case with hard-to-explain effects, we wait and see if enough people can replicate this. I will be very curious.

I agree, you should be skeptical by this phenomenon that I have no explanation for. I'm sure Sonore and SOtM are skeptical also but SOtM is interested enough that they are now doing their own internal testing. But what I am suggesting is easy enough and inexpensive enough for many to implement and so I am hoping people will try it and give feedback. I suspect a community effort can only lead to better things. As for me being the only one, actually Jelt2359 has independently tried it in his system (Windows PC > sMS-200) and is hearing the same thing I am hearing.

[romaz]

That's great news. My Aries Mini attaches to my router via a long run to the other side of the house. This is about an 80' run. The NAS/music server is next to the router.

 

Assuming the Synology bridging works, I'll certainly try it. But I don't have any fancy PSes on the NAS or router, just FMC isolation between router and streamer.

Don't let the lack of any other devices stop you. This tweak (if you want to call it that) stands on its own merit. Even when I use my noisy Mac Pro which is not optimized for audio at all, the benefits of doing this are still very very obvious.

[romaz]

Glad to see you bringing up the topic of eliminating the Ethernet switch from your chain. What's old is new again. From a little over 3 years ago:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f27-uptone-audio-sponsored/uh-oh-i-beat-my-sd-card-trick%3B-bypass-your-ethernet-switch-and-make-your-external-drives-sound-close-ram-disk-using-apple-thunderbolt-ethernet-adaptor-and-second-network-connection-18475/

 

I must admit though, I have not yet tried or been successful with bridging (was fussing with ifconfig until you pointed out OS X's "Manage Virtual Interfaces" controls) such that I could directly connect my microRendu to run it as NAA for HQ Player. HQ Player is fussy about the NAA getting a DHCP-assigned IP address. So if I have the time to fidget with this again, that would be my goal.

 

I find my tweaked Mac mini (JS-2, beta-enchanced and galvanically-isolated REGEN powered by LPS-1, slimmed SD-card boot, etc.)--directly wired to my desktop (BJ/Belden CAT6a) for shared drive music access and headless control--sounds so good running HQ Player. I really think the only reason it presently beats my LPS-1-powered microRendu as NAA by just a hair is because I have not yet been able to get the mR/NAA to work with a direct to desktop connection (and I admit that I do not have an LPS on my Cisco switch or any LAN isolators).

 

But now that I see OS X's easy GUI controls for bridging, I may take another pass at this. Can anyone here confirm that they can get a Mac running HQ Player to play to a microRendu as NASS with a direct computer to mR cable? That's my only goal at the moment.

 

Thanks!

 

--Alex C.

 

P.S. My iMac on my desk has an Apple Thunderbolt>Ethernet adapter (with cable to my Cisco switch; DHCP addresses coming from the ADSL modem connected to the switch), and the 25ft. BlueJeans/Belden cable is plugged into the iMac's built-in Ethernet port (EN0) and runs straight to the DAC-connected 2012 i7 Mac mini (where I presently run HQP).

Hi Alex,

 

During my research into this direct connection, I came across your pioneering efforts and was inspired by it. Much credit goes to you.

 

As for HQ Player, I have tried it with Roon and with my sMS-200 in HQP NAA mode, this direct connection works beautifully. I'm afraid my microRendu is out on loan at the moment but I see no reason why it wouldn't work in the same way. Since you are already equipped for direct connection with your setup, please let us know what you find.

[romaz]

Glad to see you bringing up the topic of eliminating the Ethernet switch from your chain. What's old is new again. From a little over 3 years ago:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f27-uptone-audio-sponsored/uh-oh-i-beat-my-sd-card-trick%3B-bypass-your-ethernet-switch-and-make-your-external-drives-sound-close-ram-disk-using-apple-thunderbolt-ethernet-adaptor-and-second-network-connection-18475/

 

" HQ Player is fussy about the NAA getting a DHCP-assigned IP address. So if I have the time to fidget with this again, that would be my goal."

 

This is my only concern about trying this (Romaz) tweak. So as a proof of concept (for me at least) cant I just connect my microRendu/Ethernet cabling directly to my pc's 2nd Ethernet port? I know I wont have access to the internet for microRendu updates and all but if this works I'll know that HQPlayer will find the microRendu. And if it does then taking the next step of bridging will be an easy decision. Since I do not fully understand networking I am concerned about going back to a router connection if this whole thing does not work for me.

Your microRendu needs to be assigned an IP address somehow which is why you would need connection to a router unless you had some other device on board that can provide this function. Now, OSX can serve as a DHCP server and I was able to access my sMS-200 directly this way without my router being in the picture and it sounded just as good when the music I had stored locally was played back but then I could only control it from the computer. Remote control from any other device like my iPad was no longer possible. Furthermore, there were stability issues as this connection would eventually "time out" and the system would need to be rebooted for it work again.

[romaz]

The idea that the switch has deleterious effect on SQ has no basis when optical Ethernet is used, and when LPS or batteries are used to supply the switch. I suppose a faulty piece of equipment could be a problem but generally the optical switch will reclock and clean any signal degradation.

 

I hear you. I have optical ethernet employed in my system with the receiving FMC powered by an LPS-1. I also employ a Paul Pang switch with TCXO clock powered by an LPS-1 within 1 meter of my music server to do just what you describe and yet none of this matters. Direct connection still sounds better. Way better

[romaz]

We have two ethernet ports on our sonicTransporter HQplayer addation just for this purpose.

 

https://www.smallgreencomputer.com/collections/custom-units/products/sonictransporter-roon-server-hqplayer'>https://www.smallgreencomputer.com/collections/custom-units/products/sonictransporter-roon-server-hqplayer

 

 

sonicTransporter for HQplayer has the fastest processor avalible (skylake i7) and the fastest m.2 (Samsung Pro 3.2 GB/s transfer rate) So it's a very good machine for running HQplayer and Roon Server on one quiet fanless box.

 

You could easilly set up bridging between the two ports so you could have a dedicated Ethernet line for your microRendu.

 

Also if anybody is interested I could set up our sonicTranspoter i5 with a USB Ethernet port in bridged mode.

 

If you are interested in any of these solution click the contact us button at the bottom of our home page

 

https://www.smallgreencomputer.com/

Sounds like 2 great options, Andrew!

[romaz]

Today I discovered that even network bridging is not absolutely necessary. The second NIC of the HQ Player PC can be assigned a static IP address belonging to a different subnet than the first NIC, and an app like Tiny PXE Server can act as DHCP server on the second subnet to assign an IP address to the NAA (microRendu in my case). It works beautifully, and the NAA being on a different subnet sees pretty much only the streaming audio traffic sent by HQ Player, and none of the usual networking stuff on the first subnet (with internet access).

 

The above may be old news to some folks here, but is a bit of a new find for me.

 

Next, I plan to experiment with adding Ethernet isolator to this "private" network between HQ Player PC and NAA, as well as forcing networking speed down to 100Mbps, to see how the SQ changes.

Thanks for sharing this. What about your listening experience?

[romaz]

That's not what I mean --

First I guess your TXCO copper Ethernet switch doesn't work well.

Second, my whole house is fiber Ethernet and by direct connection I mean direct fiber connection from PC and NAS and NAA each to fiber switch.

You have a great network setup but unfortunately, we are talking about apples and oranges. As this is about the microRendu and sMS-200, then copper has to be involved in some capacity. It's possible what you have sounds better than this direct connection but there's no way to know without actually listening and comparing. If you are claiming superiority based on theoretical grounds alone, then we get nowhere because there's no good explanation for why this direct connection should sound good at all.

 

Regarding fiber, all it is good for is blocking noise and I'm not convinced this is just about noise. As we know, fiber certainly isn't a panacea for all things that ail high-end audio, otherwise, we would all be using Toslink connections to our DACs and with my Chord DAVE, USB sounds better. Having recently compared an Apple branded Thunderbolt cable against a Synergistic Research Active SE copper Thunderbolt cable against a Corning optical Thunderbolt cable, I had assumed the Corning optical would sound best and it actually sounded the worst of the three.

 

As for my switch not working well, it's possible yours sounds better but as I stated, when I removed my switch from the chain, it actually sounded worse. It is definitely not causing harm as far as I can tell. You should also understand that my internet modem/router sits about 1 meter from my music server. Wifi is not turned on (Wifi duties are being handled by a separate Wifi router in my equipment closet 20 meters away). From internet modem/router to my music server, we are talking about a total of 2 meters of copper wiring total with a short run of optical cable in between to assure galvanic isolation. This is a very short and direct signal path and there is no benefit to me using optical elsewhere within my house since my music is streamed from a local drive. From the receiving FMC up until the music server, all power is provided by my LPS-1 and so nothing is connected to ground that could impact my network beyond the FMC. With respect to these 2 NAAs, I don't know how much better my network can be and yet this direct connection sounds better. Go figure.

[romaz]

Just now I discovered something else again. The network bridging works in Windows 10, but not in Windows Server 2012 R2!

 

Hmm, this is troubling to hear as I am about to install Windows Server 2012 R2 on my Mac Mini via Bootcamp. Hopefully, there's a workaround.

[romaz]

I'm not sure where the problem lies. Network bridging in WS2012 R2 is done in the same way as in Windows 10, and even looks the same, but afterwards HQPlayer repeatedly fails to locate the microRendu NAA. The only way I got the HQPlayer PC running WS2012 R2 to play to my microRendu NAA was to abandon network bridging altogether and connect the microRendu back to the same network as the HQPlayer PC, via a gigabit Ethernet switch.

 

I may test network bridging with Windows Server 2016 next.

 

Please report back if Windows Server 2016 works. I had also been considering it, just wasn't sure I would find all the drivers I need.