ECdesigns

[Khronos]

Hello. Due to monetary reasons I won't be able to meaningfully contribute to this thread with real experiences. But I've spent this last hour comparing samples of the KDTB and the ECDPB with the original song. At first, I thought the Khadas and the PD were closely matched with a slight nod to the PD due to the lack of "stepping" (a transition between sounds, as if the sound was climbing some stairs between transients) and the fact it wasn't as forward, less harsh. Though I wouldn't have blamed anybody for not hearing differences.

 

But there was something that kept at it in my brain. I can't tell what it was. So I jumped over to YouTube and mentally compared the tonality of the PowerDAC to several other dacs through Youtube. Call it insanity, but I can archive the way something sounds due to strange brain DSP (I am not sure what it is or whether I belong in a mental hospital). MSB Select II: Midrange Bump. Aries Cerat Kassandra Ref: One of the most tone Deaf DACs I've heard. PD Dream DAC: Stepping is like an upwards slide (Something I understand people would love) but lacks some Gestalt in its tone. I turned over to this shootout (

)

 

And checked my usual boxes. In my opinion the LAB12 actually sounds best, and was hereto my reference due to perfectly natural timbre coupled with spacious sound and non-existent stepping (it starts and stops!). I can easily hear how the amp actually holds back the rest of the system. I kept comparing. Turned back to the WAVs, turned back to YouTube, to the original. Something told me "This lacks palpability, flow" and some other words that don't have meaning outside of my brain. Then in a whim I turned over to recording 18.

 

There was absolutely no difference between recording and original.

 

Everything was there, just slightly quieter. I could wax lyrically about the sound but the best way I could describe it is "this breaks the dogma of digital versus analog". It unfettered the recording. How could this be possible? I am not an engineer, but I have a small understanding of ECD Technology  based on Mr. Brown's post. If memory serves, this has 6800uF or so of buffer capacity, similar to the famed Bakoon International AMP-13R. Yet to my knowledge the latter sounds effortless albeit lacking tone weight. At the beginning of writing this post I thought it could be an issue with the actual capacity of the buffer until I remembered the AMP-13R. Thus came in the second suspect: Slew Rate. How quickly can the caps inject juice into the sound? The Power Supply is at least as important as the signal path so chances are this buffer could be holding things back due to mismatched slew rate or something (mind that this runs at a maximum speed of 192khz) thus summoning weird electrical shenanigans that could not particularly be foreseen and creating this problem. I've seen film capacitors being used in parallel so perhaps this could be a fixture for the problem, something worth considering for the more heavy-weight Powerdac-S (the beast I am saving up for). Though for most, just running it one or two notches lower and adding a bit of extra gain at preamp would work. This sounds like a hassle, but let me explain. The Powerdac-R is €1500. People spend ten times as much in a single USB cable. If the DAC actually sounds like sample 18 I think the PD may have the rights to be called the best DAC in the world. Unmatched. Capable of going against the MSB Select II, the Chord DAVE, the Lampizator Pacific, and possibly better them. A true case of David versus Goliath. And even against the LAB12, i think they are both more complementary than anything. I truly hope ECD follows the steps of Soekris and begins OEMing the board. Even at the same cost of the PowerDAC with everything included it's relatively speaking almost highway robbery.

 

It is 1:30 AM. I admit I just made an account to say this.

 

Therefore I think the inner PSU lacks some sort of slew rate. I can't hear the usual signs of the recorder clipping (death of DR coupled with a heaviness of midrange) so I can't think that was the problem. Unless the universe is pulling a Lejonklou (look up the Lejonklou SINgularity story) and there's two resistor values that surpass the rest I truly can't think of another reason.

 

Do you have any comments on this? Opinions? I am not a golden ears (more like insane teenager) but I thought this could be a worthy attempt to shed light on the conundrum. 

 

PostData: Hello, I'm new to audiophilestyle. I hope I don't annoy people too much.

[Khronos]

I am sorry for derailing the thread, but now that people are talking about widebanders I feel obligated to become the devil and tempt men's hearts.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/363299600125?hash=item549657f6fd:g:E~IAAOSwdQRgjZqN

[Khronos]

First: I apologize. It seems my previous theories were incorrect. Mr. Brown has seemingly chosen his caps well and I think the recordings may have clipped. Sorry for unknowingly misleading.

 

I'm curious, what would make a Taiko Extreme a better source than, say, a Soundaware D300REF fed with an audiophile grade SSD? (Yes, it does in fact exist: https://www.zzyzxphile.com/)

 

In the end the Taiko is still a Windows machine fed with a fancy power supply and some BIOS modifications on an Asus motherboard... and non-buffered ECC Ram. Anyways! Not something out of the ordinary for a consumer (even the film cap PSU can be custom built somewhere). Wouldn't directly feeding the PD natively from the FPGA work better than having the information go through the this-that

of native OS filters plus converters?

 

Regardless of method used, the only way to completely erode any way for the source to sound different is, in my opinion, by having a chip being the master of a FPGA that directly servos the power supply with the binary of the storage (something I think ECD may be working towards). Though this brings out several hurdles related to how storage is partitioned and what that means for the metadata of the song (imagine a rewritable digital vinyl, there's only the ability to choose where to drop the needle but otherwise no way to know what's where.). Because otherwise there will be always processing on the raw data. I'm thinking that perhaps there could be two partitions: One holds only the metadata (song length, etc) and the other only the raw data (the song itself) and they are both driven in parallel. The interface works with the main chip in order to "drop the needle there" and the FPGA pulls out the information from where the chip is telling it to and regulates the PSU. Let's go all the way in and actually have it use two memories: A small one for the metadata, and a large one for the file stream. The first can be even a micro SD card, while the second a m.2 that is directly put on the main board.

 

Otherwise all data will go through one form or another of processing that will modify it as it goes through. Bitperfect and jitterless, yes, but also loaded with other crap, or cut-up much. Maybe I'm wrong again, and if that's the case, I apologize. I'm not an engineer, nor the person anybody should come to ask for advice when it comes to building anything analog or digital; rather I'm a teenager who loves music to a fault and whose favorite method to waste time is to research everything except what's useful through real life.

 

Post-data: If this is what ECD-follows, then I'll be beyond excited. This method could allow for modularity and future-proofing. PCM1536? You've probably got it. DSD1028? Got it too. Some other method we haven't thought of yet? Connect a jumper, plug the DAC to a laptop, flash the FPGA and you got it too. ECD found a better algorithm? Same thing. It would become an absolute swiss knife of a DAC, probably with the ability to even process DSP and Room correction parallel to the Data (so that it is externally processed before getting plugged straight into the FPGA). Maybe even the ability to drive speakers, RCA, XLR, etc? Sky's the limit. We are seeing almost everything here through other companies. Programable DSP through Analog Precision, on-the-fly updates from almost everyone, LTA and their MZ3 with the Preamp/speaker. ECD is on the knife's edge of a Pandora box that'll objectively end the necessity of separates for good, minimizing the variables to Speakers and Speaker cable (and perhaps, with added external inputs, down to flavoring (what PC program to flavor this with? Should I use XYZ DSP profile? What turntable and cartridge and ADC should I buy to play my vinyl with? Etc)). Possibilities are truly ridiculous.

[Khronos]

On 12/9/2023 at 6:49 AM, M_audio said:

Here is a system as simple as possible. Sometimes less is more.

Just connected my MacBook Pro TOSLINK to PowerDAC B optical in.
PowerDAC B feeds - a Fosi V3 integrated little f***r which i got just for fun.
It is a provisoric system, while am i waiting for pre/amp.
 
But tell you what - i was amazed from the 1st sound of this little system! A minute before Chord Mojo fed by Innous Phoenix via Curious Evolved shortest cable possible was playing here. And this - much better! Worlds.
And suddenly the need for DDCs disappeared. Even the optical cable is cheapo Amazon optical!

Ok Fosi V3 has these discrete op amps Class A called Sparkos added which costed more than than the little f***r Fosi. Otherwise it sounds a bit mechanical.

Now what with the pre/amp on the way? I like Less is More. Learned it in my home-office system that the more elements you have the more sound you loose.
Here also the red John Blue JB3 speaker - no x-over, no magnetic shielding no nothing. With 2-way system you need an x-over, but every x-over has its disadvantages. Also a widebander has it. But it does not lose anything on x-over caps and so on. Yeah bass will not shatter you. But i had my days in the clubs with shattering bas. Now i wanna listen to where the most music happens and this little John Blue is amazing at it.

I must say i didn't see that coming. I had the original Mosaic T16 which was amazing but sometimes smoothed out some background details (in my pretty warmish system).

But this - a breeze of fresh air!

 

 

Currently my PowerDAC BX rests in its box while a proper DDC arrives from Japan, but I must disagree with you that Bass is not thunderous. Assuming your amplifier is capable of passing square waves in both the voltage and current domain (Satri Circuit Laboratories in my personal experience), you will be rewarded with the driest, tautest, most hard-hitting bass you could wish for. I connected it to a Blusound Node X I use for Home Theater duties, and other than the mild "glare" from the nyquist noise up top (I'm 21 years old, so my ears are not quite as rolled off yet) I can say the sound is too perfect. You can heard the small changes the engineers do throughout songs. You could probably even reverse engineer the settings on their tables with some practice. And the stage is atmospheric to say the least. I cannot wait to fully assemble this system. It's endgame for sure (Dac-wise at least).

[Khronos]

4 hours ago, Superdad said:

 

May I ask what DDC model from Japan you will be using?

Satri Circuit Laboratories USC-1001, I like the brand.

[Khronos]

1 hour ago, M_audio said:

That's hilarious, your younger than i have experience with HiFi. But don't worry, i started early like you so i'm still not over 50. While it is true that hearing is of course better in younger age and it generally declines with progressing age, it is also very often individual. Some of the factors that can make it or brake it are among other the diet! There are studies that show typical pro-inflammatory diet will affect you hearing negatively and even contribute to tinitus. On the other side holistic diet will help you keep your hearing intact well into mature age. So no beers at audiophile meetings.

While it is true that the amp is mostly responsible for good bass, there is a number of other factors. I will state only few:

1. speakers and synergy with amp. 
2. your room.
3. Source

In your chain i already see the weak link . Bluesound Node. Get rid of that and get a decent source.

Satri this, Satri that. I have experience with Satri circuits as i owned a Bakoon amp and while it was a special amp, it had also serious flaws. So Satri circuit does not mean anything and can even be bad in specific settings.

Anyhows, you dont disagree with me, i never said bass were thunderous. It just depends on too many factors. For now i love the double basses in jazz bands. With PowerDAC B music has a high groove factor when it has to have it, and is highly relaxed when it is supposed to be. Not looking for measurements, although my background are exact sciences. In the end, music is a feeling.

 

I understand. Currently I'm a fair bit of a Tool fan so I doubt I'll have perfect hearing by the time I'm 30.

 

My main listening is on a set of LSA HP-2s modified by JM Audio supported by an Audio Envy Tonekraft cable. To my ears, they lack ultimate detail and they are definitely not neutral, but back in May, when I went to Pacific Audio Fest and tried several Summit-Fi Headphones and Amps, I can say the only one that could match it or surpass it where it is important to me are the ZMF Caldera. In the words of the guy at a certain headphone amp table: "These are... very holographic." The PowerDAC BX takes this to the next level. I'm reading on speaker building and eventually hope to make my own custom loudspeakers with the ESS AMT, a clone of the Altec 755, and series first order filters.

 

I'm not much of a basshead. I say Bass as I've found dry, fast bass is a good measure to listen for transient quality. I understand why you say "Satri This, Satri that". I haven't plunged deeper into SCL's offerings and I only own a CAP-1003. Personally where it is important it to me it is a near-perfect amp. I can understand why you would say it is flawed, since it has a sound that can hardly synergize with anything less than perfect. At least with my Hiby RS2 and Audio Envy Wiring and LSA HP-2s I found excellent synergy, though the DAC was definitely holding  everything back. Which is why I plunged on the POWERDAC-BX. It's a dry sound, but it is excellent, there's a holistic way everything comes together. My Audio Envy RCAs are on their way,  so I only used some Anticables which definitely colored the sound a fair bit. Many would call these wires fairly uncolored and given how immediate their flaws came through I think this means the system's fairly transparent.

 

As a side note, I preferred the SCL to several well-regarded, mid to high four figure amplifiers. Pride of ownership? Bias? Maybe. All I know is that I dislike the high frequency ringing from negative feedback.

 

What's a good digital source on your opinion?

 

But let me disgress, I've definitely hijacked the thread a good bit at this point.😣

[Khronos]

45 minutes ago, yogibear said:

Very true, I have a DHT preamp before the amp with B. 

Resurrected my Potpourri OB LA and change is quite exhilarating with some tracks compared to the Bookshelves…

 

 

I've always looked at those speakers and wondered if covering the center of the middle two drivers may help with the highs (because of the whizzer). It's a very nice setup, though.

[Khronos]

15 minutes ago, yogibear said:

It took a while to garner all those drivers except the bottom one. The top two drivers are Matsushita / Technics / National 8PW1 with phase plugs and extend to 17k, measured at my listening position. Third from the top is another un-ubiquitous Calrad from Japan with a whizzer cone and bottom one is discontinued Lii Audio F8 with excellent chassis. Top two have extended HF response and bottom two have better LF extension. The total sensitivity stands at 100dB plus @8 ohms. Top and bottom drivers are new and need break in time. Yes, the top most driver been sitting in its box for the last 50 years as I bought it. Bottom most had been in the box for last 7 years.

 

DHT Preamp is DIY by me including the Tube amp, which is SE and plays 6L6 tubes and also 807 / EF12N with an adapter. 
 

Dell Alienware is optimized for audio on windows 10. 
 

Perfectly happy with ECDesigns DAC, won’t look at any other ever. No need to. But curious to try one of their latest models too. 
 

 

You seem like someone who reads Glow in the Dark Audio as well. 😄

 

I admit I don't have experience with vintage drivers (I have some Coral Holey baskets awaiting for when I buy a soldering iron, though), but based off from your YouTube videos, the sound is very nice! The high efficiency must also make it so realistic sound levels are breezy on the amp, how good are they with large scale orchestra?

 

Regardless, it's nice to see somebody finally starting to achieve their nirvana (Guess all there's left is fiddling with the electronics' circuits and driver combination).

 

Are you by any chance acquainted with the work of J.C Morrison? The technicalities go over my head, but his circuits are masterful.

https://www.labjc.com/

[Khronos]

11 hours ago, Perri said:

I think the PowerDAC sounds better with a pre/power setup more dynamic .

A shot in the dark, but I wonder if it's because the Powerdac SX is more regulating the signal as is without taking into consideration any extra electrical draw the speaker might have? In the end it's by design a bunch of switches and resistors between a load and a linear power supply, meaning it's regulating rather than supplying. It lacks the voltage to support bass trasients if you listen closely to Stephane Ls videos on Youtube (the PowerDAC S also seemed to suffer from this, though at a lesser level.)

 

Though that also makes me wonder why it wouldn't be drawing extra power from the PSU (keyword: regulator,  maybe?) as it would with something that has active devices in it. The PowerDAC BX definitely does not soften the transients after all.

 

I'm not an electrical engineer, though, so feel free to tar and feather me.

[Khronos]

9 hours ago, M_audio said:

Yea Satri circutit seems to be at its best with headphones, but even then underpowered for some!
 
I used Bakoon amp with with Mosaic T16 DAC and while the sound was special and later when i got 1st Watt F7 it reminded me a bit of Bakoon, with the difference that Bakoon was just too fast. It didnt let me live in the moment. When i perceived the musical intention, it already was on its way to other tune, and other and other. Never contemplated on the moment.
So there was something with Satri transients, probly decay was shortened. Also very special highs, but in the long term a bit too much energy. I noticed this pattern also with other owners and different speakers.

 

 

Let's agree to disagree on this topic, perception of audio is subjective after all (as you've mentioned before).

 

Considering your preferences, and assuming you are not upgrading to the PowerDAC-SX or variant if the audio bug hits again, I think you should have both Lejonklou and Sparkler audio on your short list. Especially the former given your enjoyment of the Sparkos. Again, though, whether you can audition either is location dependent.

[Khronos]

7 hours ago, tapatrick said:

The SX gives up to max 14W at 4ohms.  I’d recommend considering it, but only if that would be enough power for you.  

The IQs are said to love power, though. So it's a case of think less PowerDAC SX and more Schiit Tyr levels of power.

[Khronos]

7 hours ago, Muzikmann said:

I would if it wasn't for the IQ speakers I am considering - I think 14W would be anemic for the IQ's which I have read loves lots of power.  If I change my mind on speakers, I wouldn't hesitate to try the SX.

This one's going to be a doozy, especially since there's a to of options for high power Solid State. Good luck!

[Khronos]

Pics or it didn't happen (Pardon the terrible stand, I'm still planning around the furniture and this is what I had laying around).

 

Currently having issues with a high-end USB cable I ordered, so I'm making do with a Walmart Brand printer cable.

 

Needless to say the UAPP -> USC-1001 -> ECDesigns PowerDAC BX -> CAP-1003 -> LSA HP-2 JMs is ruthless about an el cheapo printer cable in the chain. (My poor PRAT 😟)

 

From there on, I am happy to report that, once I get a proper cable (and maybe a Ultrasonic Filter for the ECD, wonder how much will Burn-in help with the nyquist) it's Digital Endgame. Thick as a Brick has never sound this good!

 

Edit: High-Frequency noise may be source dependent. Experimenting.

 

[Khronos]

30 hours or so after.

Either it's placebo, or placing the Herbie's Supersonic Stabilizer (round gray disk on top of the Amp) on top of the output is somehow taking out the noise.

Weird...

[Khronos]

8 hours ago, matthias said:

Interesting thoughts,

I am wondering how stable the PS of the Powerdac SX is when the output is 10W at 8 Ohms and 16W at 2 Ohms.

It sounds plenty stable, not strained as if it was clipping. More like it does not want to give more volume (somehow) since clipping is like a hard stop at the dynamics.

 

It could also be Stephane's speakers, since they are drivers meant to go in a vented box driven open baffle. Tapatrick has way better optimized speakers, perhaps he could fill us in regarding dynamics? (I know for a fact Omegas are extremely dynamic by nature, almost on the level of horn speakers. So if he feels they are lacking in the dynamics then it's probably the way the PowerDAC is designed, which might prompt ECDesigns to make an external buffer for it).

 

On 12/21/2023 at 2:04 AM, tapatrick said:

My speakers only need 2 watts to sing. And that choice would likely also depend on the kind of music you prefer to listen to. 

How good is the Combo with dynamic music? (1812, Thick as a Brick, Akira OST, etc)

[Khronos]

5 hours ago, tapatrick said:

The Dynamics are super. I don't tend to focus on one aspect of the SQ as the SX has a holistic quality that is very satisfying but I did try those pieces of music for you guys... :). I tried with 1812 and Jethro Tull and there is no problem with dynamics. The cannons in 1812 are a real shock!

 

As mentioned I think the pairing of speakers with the SX is of utmost importance. You really need a sensitive speaker to benefit from the power rating and the distortion free sound from the SX - mine are 94.5db. Would love to try 100db versions - ie Finale Audio’s Kensington Speakers, but that is a whole world of experimentation I'm not going down...

 

What I notice most is the quality of recordings and how different they can be in. The bass (if it is in the recording) is enough with the super alnicos and I have also tried 2 Rel subwoofers that I plug in sometimes. This extends the low end nicely when set properly, making the sound more immersive.

 

That's great to hear! Then we can scratch my theory and chalk that down to the ECDesigns recommended speakers (I cannot blame them at all, speaker design can be a doozy). I'm sure then the sound must be crazy good, my instinct tells me the weight of the Hemp Cone must really blend well with the sheer immediacy of the PowerDAC.

 

I have heard speakers up to the half-a-million Euro mark, and I find the Omegas more immersive than them. The horn speakers I've heard were nice, but one-party trickers as well. The dynamics might be better than single drivers, but they were nowhere near as holistic and there's definitely discontinuity under the horn (at least the sets I've heard, which had direct radiators underneath). I personally think that Omega Loudspeakers are amongst the best speakers commercially available out there regardless of price. They will not impress at first, but you've known for years by now that they are special.

[Khronos]

10 hours ago, Varinder said:

Could you share the link for buying Altec 755 clone .. And have you compared it with original Altec 755A and if so what’s your take please 

I haven't bought the 755A clones. Though they're near the top of the list for 2024.

 

https://reverb.com/item/38883006-altec-755-western-electric-8-speaker-clone-real-altec-american-parts-one-piece-cone-cap-pmr-1st

 

 

Based off that impulse response, though, they definitely have different qualities from the original, though I think they'll mate well with the ESS AMTs I have in storage.

 

 

 

The sound is drier and more tempered with the original, the new one might end up being more "fun" with some extra low end and by quite a bit not as much delicacy in the treble...

 

Which regardless works out better for me (just have to keep in mind to get the paper surround with doping).

[Khronos]

1 hour ago, Michael L said:

PowerDAC-RXV and PowerDAC-RX

 

I'm struggling to find any differences looking at the website. 

 

The IR remote is expensive. Does anyone know the IR code used?

 

 

Powerdac RXV purportedly has a dedicated 3.5mm out for headphone use.

[Khronos]

So taking into account my current use of an audiophile power cable on my PowerDAC-BX, I came across a small fact:

 

If my cat decides to nap on the PowerDAC, either the power cable or the DAC might be damaged. Whether it's the audiophile cable or the stock one, it juts out a fair bit.

 

Has anyone come across a problem like this before? What would be a good solution to mechanically reinforce this joint?

[Khronos]

Adding up everything I have known so far in my 4 or so year journey as an Audiophile, I've come to realize that everything, including my dear SCL amplifier, is colored. Simply. My Amp had been the most uncolored piece of equipment I'd come across, including pieces in the mid-to-high figure range, high six figure range if we include speakers. Now that's been completely shattered by the PowerDAC BX. I am currently considering how to proceed ahead. Should I just start a journey to two PowerDAC SXs? One for speakers and another for headphones. I had complex, long lists of equipment I''d been planning to get my hands on, resulting from years of research into topologies and quiet contemplation.

Now, though? Source -> USB > USC-1001 -> ECD PowerDAC SX. I can probably use my BX for (gasp) Home Theater duties. Mind, the BX is still plenty source sensitive. It might be my DDC, however there's clear differences between UAPP on my mobile devices (Galaxy S23FE, probably the only new smartphone that can USB out without the need for bifurcated cables; and a Galaxy Tab s7+), my Asus OLED Laptop, and my DAP (Hiby RS2 equiped with a Swissbit microSD). My DAP is the best source so far, though currently in my laptop I've gone through a handful of Audiophile software for streaming (Roon and Audirvana), and curiously the best sounding one was the Qobuz app with WASAPI Exclusive. I'm only getting small penalties in saturation, PRAT, timing, blackness, and fluidity in comparison with my DAP's library; with the convenience that now I'm not limited to my downloaded albums and ripped CDs. This is at least in my experience, with my personal qualia and current equipment. Audirvana makes the sound jagged and overtly saturated, Roon is bleached and "audiophile". Qobuz is drug-like in comparison. Details bloom even further and colors and emotion are wonderfully expressed. I wonder what could cause this.

 

[Khronos]

2 hours ago, yogibear said:

Further impressions on the SX:

 

The bass bloomed like a flower with time. What’s baffling is, looks like the bass extension on my bookshelf speakers extended by itself while playing through the SX. Despite the volume at the SX, be it at just 15 on 88dB BS or full throttle 24, the distortion is non-existent and I hear low low end notes from some recordings that never existed before ! 
 

How about a 40 watter DAC in future ????

 

Quite sure it might be because the ECDesigns can probably generate square waves at extremely high frequencies (Mhz?) Meaning the circuit is slinging its current extremely quickly, so bass extension comes to you unfettered.

 

I personally am of the feel that the first watt is the most important, at the point the SX is in it starts to enter diminishing returns with power. So you might have small or minimal improvements with a high-powered version of the SX (even though it might theoretically increase the compatibility with speakers). Most of the power is turning to heat with loudspeakers anyways.

 

You are an experienced DIYer. It might be time to blend the positive qualities of your OBs (Full-range, very high efficiency minimal to no filter) and the Monitors (extremely well-designed baffle geometry, bass extension through properly damped woofer) into an ultimate speaker?

Think Diapason Dynamis or Evolution acoustics MM2, but made to be 95+ db efficient. Series filters, minimal crossover in signal path, an efficient tweeter (Horn? Ribbon? AMT?), maybe your full-rangers as the midrangers and then large, highly efficient woofers for the slam.

 

Apologies if this sounds pretentious or nosy.

 

 

[Khronos]

6 hours ago, mevdinc said:

Happy New Year to all.

Can anyone comment on the possible combination of PowerDAC SX and PureAudioProject Open Baffle speakers with 96db sensitivity and 8ohm impedance?

Many thanks.

Mev

 

I've listened to PAPs

 

They should mate extremely well with the powerDAC-SX because of their neutral-warm tonality, huge dynamic power (in the bass especially), and precise flow.

 

Which model are you going for? I'd personally go for the horn, since they have the first order xo, are extremely coherent, and plenty room filling (depends on whether you like Horns though).

 

The PAPs I listened to were driven by amps half the rating of the PowerDAC or less. And it felt like the thing still had huge reserves on tap. Those things are really efficient. They work decently in a small room as well, though I think an offering from Bastanis would work better, while following similar sound philosophies (yes, I'm talking about the horn, not the €20k Open baffles)

[Khronos]

33 minutes ago, mevdinc said:

Thanks for the detailed reply, much appreciated. That sounds very encouraging.
I also considering the Qualio IQs  but they are quite a bit less sensitive at 89db.

I was thinking of either the Duet15 Prelude (From €5,970) or the Trio15 Classic (From €7,350) both with the Voxative AC-1.6 driver.
After your informative and encouraging reply I will seriously consider the PAPs with the PowerDAC-SX.
This should be quite a departure for me after having been listening to the active ATCs for the last 25 years!

Qualio IQs are relatively power hungry. They're detailed, delicate, and open, which if it is whay you are after, they'd do well.

 

ATCs on the other hand are more transparent and somewhat muscular (at least from what I remember), aren't they?

 

Try thinking about what exactly you are looking for in speakers, and definitely audition and don't buy blind. Voxativs are extremely delicate, very good for jazz, small ensembles, and vocals; but if you are a Rammstein fan they'll feel polite.

 

If possible, see if anyone near you auditions Lii Audio speakers. You might be surprised by their performance.

 

If you live near Munich, there's a man named Oleg Rullit who makes the best field coils in the world.

Here's his E-bay page.

https://www.ebay.com/str/rullitaudioultrafiandvintage

They're good all-rounders. I highly recommend you at least try to audition them (mind, the €8500 euro there is his flagship. He has options down to €1200)

[Khronos]

3 hours ago, mevdinc said:

I'm not really after anything in particular. I sold my amazing ATC EL 150 actives 2 years ago and instead of simply getting ATCs again I thought why not try something different first. :)
Yes, ATCs sound really lovely with great dynamics and headroom. And that wonderful 3inch midrange ddriver is really something.

I listen to all kinds of music as long as the recording is good quality, from Jazz to Heavy Metal. :) I have been following the PowerDAC topic for sometime and I thought it would be worth trying the SX version with a suitable open baffle design. If I like it then I'll keep it for a while and then move back to ATCs again or perhaps try the new Dutch & Dutch 8C with the BACCH add-on.  I do like active speakers, just adding a nice DAC with a decent pre or volume control is all I need.
PowerDAC-SX + open baffle speakers also seem to offer a very simple solution.

I have recently moved to the lovely little city of Spoleto in Italy. How long I stay here will determine what sort of system I end up with eventually.
Thanks again.

 

Time and time again, I've figured that listening through YouTube is not  as accurate as actually listening to the speakers in real life. However, it does give you an idea as to the general tonality of a piece of equipment, the synergy of the system, and how well it does some things- or doesn't.

 

If you have a decent pair of headphones, you can use YouTube to try to have a decent idea as to what to audition.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Khronos]

22 hours ago, bodiebill said:

As former happy ECdesigns user who since moved on to other brands, my interest is rekindled by reports here about the PowerDAC-SX. Its elegant simplistics plus alledged SQ do appeal to me.

 

I am a little puzzled by the looks of the PD-SX speaker sockets. They resemble RCA ones. Do these accept banana plugs?

 

And any idea whether the PD-SX would be a good combination with my Wolf von Langa SONs (8 ohm 94 dB/1m sensitivity)?

Quite sure Wolf von Langa likes to audition these with Thomas Mayer equipment, AKA real Fleawatt stuff.
https://www.vinylsavor.com/