Larry Moore of Ultra Fi

[ejlif]

using my paypal account balance. Any recourse there?

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

I received a response from Larry about this and I've asked him to comment in this thread.

 

[davidR]

ejlif, if it comes down to it Paypal allows you to dispute a purchase through their Resolution Center. I believe after 60 days from payment you can no longer dispute it.

 

[serengetiplains]

Ryan, looks to me you voluntarily kept the unit beyond the one week Larry said you had for evaluation. Your Mar 7 email says:

 

"I have been running the DAC for a week now ... You said I could have a week with it for evaluation ... Anyway I will opt to return this for my money back less shipping as agreed, unless you think further play time will improve things, I am willing to try that."

 

You then requested on Mar 14 to return the unit.

 

Unless some communication is missing from this thread, the above suggests you decided to give the machine further time to break in beyond the agreed evaluation period. If my read is right, I don't see what you have to complain about against Larry.

 

[catastrofe]

I would disagree. Ryan clearly kept the unit based on Larry's assurances that the sound would improve. He in no way expected to forfeit his return priveleges based on Larry's implied expectations.

 

[Lars]

It appears that Larry Esquire did all that he could to make the sale and to keep Ryan from returning the unit. Quite frankly, Larry Esquire would have been better off just accepting the unit back early in the game instead of leading Ryan on.

 

Say what you will sergenteiplains, Larry Esquire should do the right thing and take the unit back in spite of your legal opinion.

 

[ejlif]

Larry's "brother" even confirmed this in Larry's notes when I called to talk to him about it. I had 15 days and within 14 days I requested a return. Come on Sergenteiplains you've got to be kidding if you think I did anything wrong here. Plus who gives a crap about a couple of days anyway? What is your angle here?

 

[serengetiplains]

Your email says you had one week for the fixed unit.

 

[ejlif]

when I got the unit back from being fixed. The time I originally spent (1 day) with the unit when it first arrived broken did not count. I had the unit from 2/28 to 3/7 and then I suggested the return. I followed Larry's instructions and kept it another week and on 3/14 requested the return. This is 14 days and we agreed upon 15. What don't you understand about that?

 

[ejlif]

Larry did originally discuss a one week evaluation period. I negotiated 15 days since I thought that was to short and he agreed to that as part of our deal. When he offered me the cheaper price I said OK if I can have 15 days. I decided to send it back in one week just to be safe since that is what he originally said. I figured at this point that the trial period was not so crucial since he was the one suggesting I try other things rather than return it. I still requested the return by day 14 well within the 15 days agreed on. This is ludicrous that we are worrying about a few days. If I had to guess I would say I would not have gotten a return if I had tried it on day one.

 

Come on Larry where are you? What do you have to say about this?

 

[wots]

If you think you've been wronged, contact your local police and they will discuss your legal options...free.

 

You either have a civil action (lawsuit) or criminal action (crime) here...let the police decide. If it seen as a criminal action, the police will handle things; Larry will be charged with a crime.

 

The police however may be reluctant to get involved because they have their own priorities. If you believe a crime has been committed, you must clearly communicate your reasoning to the police...the grounds for your belief that a fraud or other crime has been committed. Show the police the printed emails with dates. I would also say that the use of trial periods is common practice in the high-end audio business because many manufacturers and their products are virtually unknown and that a 14-day trial period is of modest duration. Don't let the police brush the matter aside by saying things like 'It seems like a private matter'. Appear in need of their assistance and appreciative for it. Suggest a letter with your complaint, recommending a friendly conclusion to the matter, be sent by the police force, since your correspondence has been ignored.

 

If the police refuse to get involved, file a lawsuit. Retain your emails and back them up...they're your whole case.

 

A criminal mind is all I've ever known...Gowan

 

[ejlif]

get a reply from Larry if he is willing to post here? Sounds like you were able to contact him, just wondering what he said and what his excuse is for ignoring me.

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

He did return my email and said he'd be happy to give me a ring to discuss it if I'd like. However, he's out of town right now and did not have my number with him.

 

I asked him to comment on the site.

 

[jb8312]

Ryan has, and the posted emails support, a good "reliance" argument. That is to say that Ryan relied, to his detriment, on the assurances made by Larry. In fact, he altered his position (keeping the unit beyond the agreed trial period) based by the ambiguous direction from Larry. While it would cost a lot of legal fees to get this point across to a trier of fact, it is a point that Larry should well understand.

 

Certainly, considering the colorable argument, the professional response would be to take back the unit and refund the buyer, less shipping and perhaps a restocking fee, his payment. The goodwill Larry has lost in this transaction far out-weights the funds retained.

 

I know I would not risk doing business with him knowing his predilections do not favor the customer.

 

John

 

[ejlif]

I bought one of his DACs and I can't even get a return phone call or email. Very interesting, so this confirms that he absolutely is ignoring me. I guess I'm going to have to take legal action.

 

[ejlif]

Larry is to much of a chicken to defend himself on here? I still have not heard from him, but I know he does communicate about this with Chris from this site, Robert at Ridge Street Audio as well as Eric Heider who he is partners with and Eric now refuses to answer my emails as well. I have emailed Positive Feedback and asked them to pull the review of the Musicstream DAC that is upcoming. They should not be given any good press if this is how they operate.

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

Hi Guys - I think everyone has said what they are going to say on this one. I think it's also best to lock it up and move on with the main purpose of Computer Audiophile.