HQPlayer's Network Audio Adapter

[tboooe]

I will try the same without DoP.

 

DoP is used, because I think there is no other way to also activate the convolution engine in HQPlayer and to also control the volume via roon / tablet.

 

BTW, it definitely looks like something is wrong with your DAC driver. The networkaudio.exe window should show something like ASIO DSD Format available.

 

Looks like your DAC only support DoP?

 

I am also running NAA on Server R2 in Core mode with Audiophile Optimizer and Fidelizer. I am able to upsample to DSD256.

[tboooe]

@sfox7076, is the NAA machine running WIN10 by any chance? If so I was having similar issues. When I first upgraded from WIN7 to 10, everything worked fine with the NAA then overnight I started having the same kind of errors you are seeing. I tried removing all WIN10 updates but could still not get NAA working properly again. I then went back to Server R2 and NAA has been working flawlessly since then.

[tboooe]

It is a Win 10 computer. I have no access to Win 7 as I bought this as it was bought new. So, back to the drawing board I guess. LattePanda would be a cool choice to do this in the future. If W10 works.

 

I know other people have had success with NAA on Win10. Hopefully they can chime in too. Have tried uninstalling all updates?

[tboooe]

Yes, many of us AO users are also HQPlayer users. They are a very nice combination. Phil has even worked with Jussi to create a nice HQPlayer shell option within the setup.

I also use AO with HQP. What's interesting is that Phil highly recommends Server R2 but based on some comments Jussi has made, it seems he is not convinced that Server is best for audio.

[tboooe]

Thanks! I just discovered HQPlayer this week-end (been using JRiver and Audirvana+) and quite frankly I am amazed so far how good it sound! On my PC it sound better then JRiver and on my Mac mini it sound as good or even better then Audirvana with my DAC... So obviously I will continue to experiment with it. Just dont find library management very user friendly but I probably dont know how to do it properly. Right now just dragging each song one at a time!!!!

 

And this is precisely why so many people use Roon with HQP. I hated spending all that money Roon but HQP sounds so good that it was worth it to have a much nice user interface.

[tboooe]

Super easy. Install Roon. Select HQP as the output device in Roon settings. Sit back and enjoy!

[tboooe]

Miska, just a curiosity question about the data transmitted from HQP to NAA. i have a managed switch that connect HQP (port 9), NAA (port 10), and NAS (port 1). I was looking at the TX and RX data for each port and there is a very big difference between the amount of data received on the HQP port (received from the HQP pc) and the amount of data transmitted from the NAA port (sent to NAA pc). Over a listening session, the amount of data sent from HQP was 4gb while the amount of data sent to NAA was 18gb! For comparison, the amount of data received on the NAS port(data sent from NAS) is very close the amount of data transmitted on the HPQ port (data sent to HQP pc).

 

I was wondering if you could help explain why there is such as big difference in the amount of data sent by HQP and the amount of data received by NAA. See attached.

 

[tboooe]

It is quite hard to interpret the table without knowing which port is connected where. Note that the statistics is usually counter since start of the switch, so the figures also largely depend on what is counted as traffic, what else the particular device has running (including the OS) and uptimes of the particular device vs others.

 

The total number of all the ports should add up...

 

Thank you. Port 1 is NAS, port 9 is HQP and port 10 is NAA.

 

I agree all the data numbers should roughly add up which is why I was so surprised to see port 9 RX (from HQP) is so much less than port 10 TX ( to NAA).

[tboooe]

Alright thanks! I will start there. My NAA machine already has a linear supply but I will check my Ethernet cable...

It may be interesting for you if you are so inclined to check out fiber optic between the router and NAA. Doing so will theoretically remove any noise traveling down the ethernet cable. I recently added fiber and was pleased with the results, especially considering it cost me less than $75. I have since added a fiber switch and fiber to my pc running HQ Player as well. YMMV.

[tboooe]

Great idea! Would you be able to point me to what I would need to buy and where could I source this? What sort of improvement did you get feeding NAA computer? Now you got me excited!

Ha ha! My nerdy side got excited to try this tweak too even if it didnt result in any audio benefit. The result I got was a more relaxed sound, without necessarily losing dynamics. It is really hard to explain to but I found myself listening at higher volumes. Music just sounded more pleasing.

 

Anyway, check out this thread for more info:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f22-networking-networked-audio-and-streaming/optical-network-configurations-24641/

 

In a nutshell you will need the following:

2 x FMC (I use TP-Link MC-220L)

2 x SFP (I bought some from ebay here)

2 x short ethernet cable (I use 1 ft Blue Jeans Cat6 cables)

1 x fiber cable (I bought some from ebay here)

 

Some people have also purchased Jameco linear wall wart power supplies for the FMC. I use my HDPlex linear.

 

I personally use multi-mode but you can use single-mode as well. For our application and distances multi-mode is fine. Let me know if you have any questions.

[tboooe]

I just installed debian stretch in my Brix Celeron mini PC with NAA and works and sounds great, but i guest if i can install a low latency kernel, but i can't find one for debian stretch, did somebody knows of one??

Not sure if this would work with NAA but what about AudioLinux? Its supposed to be based on a real time kernel. I've been thinking about using this on my main audio pc running HQP. It would be great AudioLinux would also work with NAA.

[tboooe]

HQP discovers my NAA without a problem: the IP address of the NAA machine shows up and I can select NAA in the settings. Both HQP and NAA are on Windows PC's.

 

However, the only option to choose from is JPLAY. MY Combo384 Amanero DAC which is active on the NAA PC is not recognized by HQP.

 

When I connect my DAC directly to the HQP PC, there is no problem: it is recognized.

And when startup my NAA machine with Linux (Ubuntu) instead of Windows, the DAC is recognized also.

 

Any idea why HQP refuses to see my DAC when it is on the Windows NAA PC?

 

I had the same issue. What worked for me was to simply unplug and replug the usb cable. Also, you may want to uninstall JPLAY. BTW, can you select JPLAY in HQP, then in JPLAY select your DAC?

[tboooe]

Thanks Miska (also for your patience): I un- and re-installed the Amanero drivers on the NAA PC and they are now visible in HQP!

GREAT! So how does it sound, especially compared to JPLAY?

 

I used to have a 2 PC JPLAY setup as well but preferred HQP + NAA.

[tboooe]

First impression:

- HQP DSD256 + NAA more analytically detailed, wide and open, slightly more fatiguing

- HQP DSD128 + JPLAY a little warmer, 'together', easier on the ear (I guess they call that 'analogue')

It is a close call and I will experiment with different HQP settings before making a final verdict. Or maybe I will switch depending on the material.

Thank you for the reply. Or you can try HQP >> NAA >> JPLAY? I remember reading another member did this for a while. Could be overkill.

 

What filters are you using? I use polysinc mp and asdm7 modulator. To my ears, DSD modulators is very detailed and dynamics but fatiguing.

[tboooe]

@Miska, I just noticed some strange behavior on my NAA PC. When I run the netstat command see a very high percentage of Received Packets Discarded. On the NAA, its over 88%. For comparison, the pc running HQP discard rate is 0.7%. I did a tracert command from NAA to HQP and I can see my latency is measured as < 1ms. Any ideas why this is happening?

[tboooe]

@Miska, I just noticed some strange behavior on my NAA PC. When I run the netstat command see a very high percentage of Received Packets Discarded. On the NAA, its over 88%. For comparison, the pc running HQP discard rate is 0.7%. I did a tracert command from NAA to HQP and I can see my latency is measured as < 1ms. Any ideas why this is happening?

@Miska, more info on this. I see a lot of discarded transmitted packets from the HQP pc as well. I have increased the Rx and Tx buffers on both the NAA and HQP nics which helped improve things a but I am still losing packets. So in summary, on the HQP pc I see a lot of discarded Tx packets and on the NAA I see a lot of discarded Rx packets. Perhaps there is any issue with the communication between the NAA and HQP? Any ideas?

[tboooe]

I am starting to have issues with NAA on Win10 system with Amanero. If I use DoP everything works correctly but when I try to use it straight with out DoP for 2XDSD NAA crashes. I am going to roll back the version of the NAA (currently running 3.4) and see if the problem goes away. The HQPlayer version is the latest released version available.

Has anything changed with your setup? Seems odd that all of a sudden you would have issues if DSD128 worked before.

[tboooe]

The last time I had used a Win 10 system for naa was couple of months ago, since I was using a Linux NAA system. This weekend I am hoping to connect the NAA to a DAC that will do 4xDSD so wanted to retest straight DSD support. Will try a second system that has Win10 installed with NAA running to see if it makes any difference.

I had issues with Win10 after upgrading from Win7. I eventually ditched Win10 and loaded up Server R2 Essentials. Not sure what the issue was with Win10. Did you try re-installing the DAC driver?

[tboooe]

Thanks, but I wanted something to experiment, which allows to install Windows.

 

I ended up buying a cheap i3 based mini pc from Taobao for around $125. I already had an SSD and memory. I've loaded Server R2 essentials on this pc and its has worked great as an NAA. Another option is the Up Board.

[tboooe]

Today something odd that happened and I am not sure if it's an NAA or hardware issue. All of a sudden I noticed I lost my right channel. I could only hear the vocals from my left speaker and a much lower level of music from the right speaker with a lot of echo. When I reversed the inputs to my amp, the sound also reversed so that let me know my amp is fine and for whatever reason I was not getting music from right channel from the source. Long story short, restarting my NAA fixed the issue.

 

So my question is if this could have been caused by the NAA application or was it some hardware issue perhaps with the USB port of the PC?

[tboooe]

I would guess hardware issue either in the DAC, naa pc or preamp or it could be with a loose cable. If I understand NAA correctly all it does is take the stream and leverages alsa to stream that out. It does not have any logic to manipulate the stream.

 

tboooe, when such a thing happens to me I know it is my analog RCA cable.

I would check electrical contacts on signal cables. Not USB, there is no no left/right.

Thanks guys. I figure it wasn't the NAA application. What's strange is that I did check all cables, unplugging then replugging but that didn't fix the problem. Only restarting my NAA pc solved it. This is the first time I've experienced this so hopefully it's just a fluke occurrence.

[tboooe]

@pkane2001 you mentioned that the CPU is at around 50% or less?  When converting PCM to DSD256 (not DoP) my CPU is around 25-30%.  I notice when I convert from higher DSD rates to DSD256 my CPU goes to 70-80% and I get occasional bits of static unless I enable Multicore DSP in settings.  Have you tried enabling Multicore DSP in settings?

[tboooe]

9 minutes ago, pkane2001 said:

 

@tboooe, thank you for your response! I do have Multicore DSP enabled. When I mentioned 50% or less, it was usually quite a bit less. 50% being the peak CPU utilization. My laptop has a 2.6ghz, quad-core I7 processor with hyperthreading.

 

All 4 physical cores don't appear to be overloaded, which is what I was trying to convey. There appears to be enough CPU power to do the work.  I am also running a couple more things over what you are describing: I'm running NAA on the same laptop, and I am converting to DoP since that's the only way my DAC understands DSD. So I would expect the CPU utilization to be a bit higher in my case.

Did you set the option to the checkmark or the filled in box?  I ask because when I set Multicore DSP to the filled in box (auto mode) I would get some static when converting DSD128 to DSD256.  When I set it to the check mark (force on all the time), the static went away.

 

Be careful about just looking at the physical cores loading.  In my experience, even though it seems the cores are not being maxed out, performance with HQP does get impacted when the CPU load reaches a certain point that is far from 100%.

[tboooe]

6 minutes ago, pkane2001 said:

 

Thanks, just found it. I don't normally re-read the manual with each new software release, and this option was not there in HQP v3.1 that I was using until recently. That's my story and I'm sticking to it! 

As a member of the male species, I never ever RTFM!  Maybe thats why I screw so many things up!  LOL!

 

So, did changing the Muticore DSP setting help at all?

[tboooe]

11 minutes ago, arglebargle said:

Greetings. Complete newbie question about linear power supplies and my CuBox i4pro NAA. I bought one of these 5V Breeze Audio "el cheapo" power supplies on eBay. After 12 hrs use I noticed the readout has drifted from 5.5v to 5.9 and then even 6.0v. Verified these numbers with a multimeter so it's not an inaccurate display.  Is this normal / safe?  I'm guessing not! and thinking I should be initiating a return. Or does the CuBox only draw what is needed? In the meantime I've switched to the stock adapter (which on the same outlet measured 5.25v)  Thanks for any info.

The voltage requirements of the CuBox does not change.  What changes is the amperage it draws.  That should not change the voltage output from the Breeze.  I would return it.  That much fluctuation is not acceptable.