Expectation Bias

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On 9/28/2022 at 7:34 PM, pkane2001 said:

 

Is it naive to expect some validity to the claims made about often very expensive pieces of equipment?

 

 

No but how many audiophiles expect that?

Most are willing to have their expectations modelled by the reviews they read, and they're in it for the journey not the destination thus rarely out for a one time buy.

The ASR Church of thought fails on three accounts: audiophiles don't care about budget plastic gear that you buy off Amazon, they enjoy box-swapping (you can call it degustation) and each of us has a particular preference so the idea that we will all enjoy the "sonic presentation" of a pair of all-in-one Genelec or an entry-level DAC is too absurd to take seriously. Cruzades are rarely selfless and the outcome is likely to be a bad one...

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9 hours ago, hopkins said:

 

Listening to delta files recorded with an ADC is not an "objective" way of evaluating DAC accuracy. Period. There is no need to provide "objective" data to understand that something makes no sense... 

 

If you don't see the value of providing expert's information on audio "mechanisms" in this forum, fine. 

 

I was curious to see what another "expert" thought about it, but his comments on those technical aspects were off topic, and the discussion on the deltawave tool is secondary. 

 

Goodnight. 

 

 

 

Any kind of material or listening session can potentially be objective. Perhaps you mean free-of-bias?

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4 hours ago, pkane2001 said:

That's OK with me, what's not OK are the manufacturers making money off of the ignorance of their consumers, sometimes based on their own ignorance. To continue the analogy, I don't have a problem with people living in the Matrix, I have a problem with the Matrix itself and those who maintain it ;)

 

All forums have (or had) a few messias trying to save us from ourselves but they're generally not welcome or their efforts recognised. Why not go fight the Matrix? Go talk to the exploiters, not the exploited.

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4 hours ago, pkane2001 said:

The second part about ASR is a bit of a straw-man argument.  Maybe you can make that argument against Amir and his crusade, but not about ASR as a community. There are plenty who argue for listening, some who argue against measurements, and some that disagree with the measurements as they are and some who are innovators and come up with new ways and new methods.

 

 

I did write ASR Church, but you may have missed that.

ASR as a community is a large crowd of people who happen to believe in the objective approach over the subjective one. They're not any more knowledgeable than subjectivists.

ASR has a handful of experts and a few knowledgeable people but that is far from the gross of what you call the community.

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4 hours ago, pkane2001 said:

What's funny to think about is that the majority of ASR members were subjective audiophiles at some point in their lives and some still are. Many have equipment totalling well over $10k, some over $50k (this is based on a survey). Some enjoy swapping, some enjoy discovering, and others want to tinker. This is no different than any other online community, except, most would like to find out a bit more about what really works and what doesn't and why. Maybe their journey doesn't match yours, but this is no reason to crusade against them. This is really not "us" against "them", although many want it to be positioned that way.

 

I agree with the bit in bold but not the underlined part.

I am willing to bet that many if not most have not learned a thing but follow the panthers and speaker preference ratings with religious fervour.

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3 minutes ago, pkane2001 said:

 

It wouldn't be much of a movie if Neo just decided to enjoy an imaginary steak and didn't go to fight the Matrix, now would it? 😎

 

It's just as fictional as fighting the industry in consumer forums.

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2 minutes ago, pkane2001 said:

There's valuable information and some very knowledgeable individuals if you want to learn, but that's just my opinion.

 

I agree. But it's almost drowned into the noise floor.