Anyone using Thunderbolt 3 interface in their setup?

[cjf]

Hello,

 

Was curious to see if anyone is using Thunderbolt 3 with their music server configuration and if so what has been your experience with it compared to USB? I'm thinking of moving to this instead of USB and it appears many of the newer Pro Audio focused DAC's have this option available to use.

 

Does it work/behave the same with music server App's like ROON/JRiver as USB does? If you use it, have you noticed better/worse reliability and does a change in Sample Rate/Bit Rate occur seamlessly? Do you think it sounds better/worse? Do you use Windows/MAC and how have you found driver support to be?

 

Thanks

[DonaldM]

For years I used a dedicated (old) MacPro from 2006 with OSX on a SSD and the music on HDDs as my music server. As software I use Audirvana (in several iterations during the years). Since half a year I use a dedicated Macmini with an external OWC DAS connected via Thunderbolt 3. I noticed a huge improvement between the two setups. I cannot tell if the difference was the result of Thunderbolt 3, and/or the new Macmini and/or the OWC. 

In the beginning I had some problems with Audirvana, but after a tweak it is exemplary stable and enjoyable! I reused the HDD’s from the MacPro in the OWC configured as JBOD. Audirvana did not experience any problems with different sample rates. BTW I always use Audirvana natively, so not with iTunes. 

My music installation consists out of an all tube Aitos (pre-) preamplifier and two Aitos 90W OTL tube power amplifiers, together with Quad ESL. 

[cjf]

Thanks DonaldM for posting your experience with the Thunderbolt interface. If I am reading correctly you are or at least were using it as a means to connect your storage device to your MacMini. Did you by chance try it as a connection between your MM and your DAC either directly or via the use of an adapter to USB assuming such an adapter exists?

 

In my potential use case I would be going straight Thunderbolt3 to the DAC via its own Thunderbolt3 interface. One of my DAC's somewhat recently released a Thunderbolt3 card that can be installed into it VS the current USB card I use now (Lynx Hilo) and given some of the challenges I've had with USB drivers and such with Windows this Thunderbolt3 card has sparked my interest. I would probably use a Windows system at first but am considering switching to either an iMAC or MACMini as a phase 2 option.

 

Thanks again

[DonaldM]

No, I am sorry, I don’t have that experience: my DAC does not have a direct Thunderbolt interface, nor did I try an adapter to one of the other interfaces of the DAC. As said the DAC-MM(Audirvana)-Thunderbolt-OWC combination sounds much better than the DAC-USB3-MacPro(Audirvana) combination.

 

Donald 

[dubby]

Hi Donald M,
Can you tell me what model of  
OWC DAS Thunderbolt 3 do you have ?

Thanks a lot.

 

[DonaldM]

Hi Dubby,

this one: https://www.owcdigital.com/products/thunderbay-6

I silenced the fan, while in jbod the hdd‘s hardly warm up at all. This way it is completely silent. 

The OWC is a sturdy metal design, in contrast with many cheap plastic products. 

 

Donald

[dubby]

Hi Donald M,
Thanks for your response. I understand that you can perform better by setting up jbod disks, but isn't it safer to configure in RAID? Do you think if it is configured in RAID the noise is too big? Thanks a lot for the help again. 😊🎅🎄

 

[DonaldM]

Hi Dubby,

there is no easy simple answer there... read speed will be higher in raid mode. In jbod mode it is the speed of the used hdd. Raid, especially raid5 will also be safer as one of the discs dies. In raid5 you will loose 1 hdd for this extra safety. Always a good backup schedule is necessary be it raid or jbod. Deleting a file in both setups will delete it without much ado. Only a backup can save you from an accidental delete or worse. For me the extra speed nor the added safety of raid justifies a raid setup. 

When using raid the disks have more r/w action to perform, and as a consequence become warmer. I guess you then will need the fan of the OWC to cool the hdd’s and then the OWC will be too noisy in a living room. I placed my headless Macmini plus OWC in the hall and drilled a hole in the wall for the USB cable from the Macmini to the DAC in the living room, even though both Macmini and OWC are nearly silent. What you only hear is the r/w noise of the hdd’s. Remember I used a noisy MacPro before the current setup!

 

hope this helps to clarify.

Merry Christmas!

Donald 

[dubby]

Thanks a lot for the help.

Merry Christmas for you too !!!

 

[Rexp]

On 12/21/2019 at 9:17 AM, cjf said:

Thanks DonaldM for posting your experience with the Thunderbolt interface. If I am reading correctly you are or at least were using it as a means to connect your storage device to your MacMini. Did you by chance try it as a connection between your MM and your DAC either directly or via the use of an adapter to USB assuming such an adapter exists?

 

In my potential use case I would be going straight Thunderbolt3 to the DAC via its own Thunderbolt3 interface. One of my DAC's somewhat recently released a Thunderbolt3 card that can be installed into it VS the current USB card I use now (Lynx Hilo) and given some of the challenges I've had with USB drivers and such with Windows this Thunderbolt3 card has sparked my interest. I would probably use a Windows system at first but am considering switching to either an iMAC or MACMini as a phase 2 option.

 

Thanks again

Did you end up using Thunderbolt, was it preferable to USB? Thanks! 

[DonaldM]

Hi Rexp,

I still (and only) use thunderbolt as the connection between my Mac mini and my Dac. Compared to my earlier setup (Mac Pro - usb -Dac) there was a considerable improvement in sound. If it was thunderbolt and or the Mac mini I cannot say. What I read elsewhere is that thunderbolt has less noise than usb, this is the reason I went directly for thunderbolt. 

[cjf]

On 4/10/2021 at 4:45 AM, Rexp said:

Did you end up using Thunderbolt, was it preferable to USB? Thanks! 

Hello,

 

It appears I forgot about this thread at some point.

 

I ended up going a different route instead switching DAC's for one that uses multi-channel Ethernet instead of Thunderbolt (Merging Hapi). In the end I'm very glad I waited until I could better stomach the cost to switch to Ethernet than I was willing to at the time of my original post.

 

Now with Ethernet my USB/Thunderbolt driver concerns are no longer a thing at all but in their place now I have to worry about Ethernet/ASIO drivers instead but they are far less problematic...so far 😀