Raspberry Pi 3B+; anyone using it yet?

[davide256]

Wondering if anyone has tried this yet with DietPi/Roon?  I've ordered one, if it works  with my Hifiberry DIgi+  I'll move on to ordering a Digione.

[davide256]

7 hours ago, mjb said:

It works fine with the latest version of Volumio, though I’ve no experience with Roon. Very nice board. 

Thanks for responding!  What intrigues me about it is the wifi 5G support, as I understand the earlier Pi2 version has compromised USB when physical Ethernet is used, definitely prefer the Digi+ coax to USB output feeding DAC.

[davide256]

Got it today, up and running in 30 minutes with Roon/ Digi+. Also received some DC to micro USB adaptors, so now able to run this off an HDPlex. So far better than the Pi2 but the built in wifi is nothing to write home about, worked ok on the strongest 2.4G SSID but link wouldn't stay connected on its 5G counterpart, about 20 feet from wifi router with no wall/ metal in between. Time to order the Digione w/ case.

[davide256]

No joy on the USB audio front with the Pi 3B+.  Compared the Hifiberry Digi+ coax vs ISO Regen-Schiit Eitr USB conversion to coax combo, USB  was brash, irritating vs a fairly enjoyable sound with the Digi+

[davide256]

3 hours ago, Ralf11 said:

Never Upgrade

ahh the bleeding edge... a good reason to wait until software has been out long enough to hear if it has defects.

[davide256]

hmm, had lost enthusiasm about buying a Digione because I really wasn't getting much joy out of the Pi 3b+ with  Hifiberry Digi+ run off HDPlex/iFi 5v PS. Decided to play around with it today using the recently acquired Uptone Audio LPS 1.2 to power it... makes it a very different beast. The highs and massed voices still have short comings but one of mys complaints about the Allo USBridge has been remedied... decay time of notes is now natural. WIth the LPS 1.2 powering the Pi you get a more relaxed sound where low volume detail in bass /midrange comes through cleanly against louder signals. Also finding that wifi is better than wired, assuming you use no special router... the clarity immediately went down hill with a wired connection.

Have ordered a Digione+ case;  will see how that stacks up in about 10 days against USBridge-ISO Regen-Eitr chain.

[davide256]

received the Digione, initial impressions are that its harmonically purer/ easier on the ear than USBridge but it struggles for coherency with loud passages and lacks clarity on low level transients. Will let it break in,  see if it improves and if there are any tweaks possible

[davide256]

49 minutes ago, davide256 said:

received the Digione, initial impressions are that its harmonically purer/ easier on the ear than USBridge but it struggles for coherency with loud passages and lacks clarity on low level transients. Will let it break in,  see if it improves and if there are any tweaks possible

Ok, (1) SPS500 was still set at 7 volts for ISO Regen vs 12 required for powering Microzotl, (2) as with the Hifiberry Digi+  Wifi sounds clearer than wired Ethernet. Sigh of relief,

will keep going with these corrections.

[davide256]

On 7/13/2018 at 2:09 AM, hopkins said:

What is your system? 

As in signature, using Microzotl  2 for headphone amplifier with Hifiman HE-400, Audeze Sine for headphones. HE400 is good for judging high frequency air, but has some distortion in its harmonic signature. The Sine are harmonically pure, decent bass but a tad laid back in the high frequencies. I've found this setup allows me to hear more critically than main system due to low level dynamic contrast limitations of the Prima Luna amp section with Magnepan 1.7/KEF LS50

[davide256]

8 minutes ago, davide256 said:

As in signature, using Microzotl  2 for headphone amplifier with Hifiman HE-400, Audeze Sine for headphones. HE400 is good for judging high frequency air, but has some distortion in its harmonic signature. The Sine are harmonically pure, decent bass but a tad laid back in the high frequencies. I've found this setup allows me to hear more critically than main system due to low level dynamic contrast limitations of the Prima Luna amp section with Magnepan 1.7/KEF LS50

For comparing, I'm trying to keep things as equal as possible

 

Digione    powered by LPS 1.2, connected by coax AQ Eagle eye to Metrum Octave

USBridge powered by LPS 1.2, USPCB to Schitt Eitr, connected by coax AQ Eagle Eye to Metrum Octave

 

which does require me to swap back and forth for comparison. I like to test with "bad" recordings, recordings that can sound bad. My experience is that most bad recordings

are exciting bad behavior in the source solution which better source solution resolves as was heard/intended by the recording engineer.

[davide256]

48 minutes ago, zacho said:

 

 

Doesn't the Digione require 1.8A power supply? Are you powering the Digione board separately from the RPI? or does the LPS 1.2 actually provide enough juice for the Digione Player?

Its possible that if I were using DSP's and/or upsampling that the Pi3B+ compute activity would exceed the current supply of an  LPS 1.2 (1.2A)  but  for straight PCM operation I have seen/heard no issues. The Pi3B bare board consumption of 400 ma  is well within spec, allowing plenty of reserve for DD converter boards and Wifi. The processor board of the RPI is where most of the current draw originates.

I can find nothing that speaks to power supply requirements for the Digione board but doubt its much more than that for the USBridge which is quoted at 0.1 A in discussions of powering Sparky/USBridge separately.

https://www.raspberrypi.org/help/faqs/#powerReqs

 

Have not seen a practical way to independently power the Digione without voided warranty issues, am tempted to buy a Hifiberry Digi+ Pro which can have an independent power connection added as a mod

[davide256]

15 hours ago, jabbr said:

 

I'm having trouble powering the RPi3B+ with the LPS1.2 -- the RPi log complains of undervoltages ... note that the RPi wants 5.1V and I set the LPS1.2 to output 5V...

hmm where would I find the log? I will plug the Eitr back into the RPI and check if the poorer SQ I heard with USB was actually undervoltages.

[davide256]

checked log, no voltage errors with Hifiberry Digi+ . Reading the github thread, it appears that what one connects to the RPI is more likely to be the cause of undervoltage,

that the alarm only goes off if the supplied voltage drops below 4.63 v due to current draw. Will hook the Eitr up later today and see if I get any under voltage alarms.

 

[davide256]

 When @Superdad    tested an iDSD Micro that was charging through an ISO Regen from LPS 1.2, he saw a 540ma current draw.  By my math thats close to a full 1A

of continuous current draw  which leaves little room for current spikes from the RPI (400ma steady state). Do you get the same under voltage errors after boot when running off the Micro's internal battery?

 

I"m using the RPI right now, USB connected to Schitt Eitr. I see two under voltages during bootup, each when wifi begins IPV6 link initialization at 6 seconds and 16 seconds, no errors after startup completion/during play. IPv6 is enabled but I don't find where an IPv6 address has been assigned.

 

 

[davide256]

So, I've tried to like the Digione as much as USBridge but its just not happening. The two are reasonably close in sound  if powered by the LPS 1.2 with no additional tweaks,

but powering the USBridge separately and using ISO Regen pulls the USBridge far ahead with backup/lower volume instrument details much more clearly articulated.

In the Allo forum I have read that the Digione board does have a DC converter chip that can be unsoldered to allow powering it separately.

 

https://github.com/sparkysbc/sparky_linux_images/blob/master/%2B5V external connection_DigiOne.pdf

 

Ive ordered a  pig tailed DC power socket to use, when that arrives next week, some soldering pencil work, then will see if powering the Digione with LPS 1.2 and  RPI 3 with Ifi

brings it closer to my preferred USBridge setup

 

http://www.cnaweb.com/2-1mm-dc-female-power-connector-lead-1.aspx

[davide256]

3 hours ago, nbpf said:

Thanks for the report davide256, please keep on posting your findings about the DigiOne vs. USBridge! Since you also have connected the Eitr to the RPi, how does the Eitr compare to the DigiOne? I have tried Eitr, DigiOne and M2Tech hiFace Evo (the latter connected to a fitPC3, however) and I have convinced myself that tend to prefer the DigiOne to the other transports. No day and night differences, however. Wasn't Allo supposed to come out with an improved version of the DigiOne this summer?

Its not really comparing the same thing, Eitr to Digione. The Eitr is a very natural sounding asynch USB converter, much better than the Gustard U12/XMOS based converters I used before. Whereas the Digione is a source component, like the USBridge

 

I did receive the DC power socket Saturday and removed the DC to DC converter on the Digione board. The holes drilled for the converter component are very fine,

I was not able to remove the converter by using an unsoldering tool, ending up rocking the converter back and forth until the leads stress fractured. I was then

able to crimp the DC socket leads around the projecting remaining 1/4" of the old DC converter leads and solder in place. Easy at that point to feed

the lead between  the USB ports and out the open square opening. I then used the iFi 5v PS for the RPI and the LPS 1.2 for the Digione board.

 

              This did improve Digione  SQ with greater tone color intensity but it didn't change my overall impression. The Digione is the better bet if you want to stay inexpensive, don't have a highly resolving system for transients and background detail. But its limited. The USBridge on the other hand can resolve transients well but without a serious investment in power supply and a USB reclocker like the ISO Regen you are likely to have a love/hate affair with it... you will hear more low volume detail (soft bass thumps, soft drum taps, cymbal whisks, etc) but you will also hear more irritants and you won't equal the tone color purity of the Digione.

 

[davide256]

5 hours ago, nbpf said:

I understand that the Eitr is a USB to SPDIF interface that can be connected to any audio class 2 device whereas the DigiOne is a I2S to SPDIF interface that can only be connected to a Raspberry Pi. Still, both devices can be connected to a RPi, provide galvanic isolation and deliver a SPDIF stream. Their prices are also not so terribly different, at least not by a factor of ten. Thus, I actually think that it makes a lot of sense to compare Eitr and DigiOne. 

.The answer I can give you is that  a competent USB source solution that includes Eitr will easily best the DigiOne. The RPI3 I don't consider a competent USB source solution

[davide256]

8 hours ago, nbpf said:

Thus, the question is what are competent sources that include the Eitr and that could be meaningfully compared to the RPi3 + DigiOne combo. If I understand your post correctly, you have found the USBrigde + Eitr not to easily best the DigiOne. Thus, it seems that the search for competent sources that include the Eitr and easily best the DigiOne is leading to network players like the sMs-200, the microRendu, etc. Is this what you mean by "competent USB source"?

All sources need good power supply to perform their best. The USBridge apparently has clocking weaknesses because it takes an ISO Regen to power it past the DigiOne, otherwise with good PS only its just a trade off of sound differences between it and the DigiOne.

• By my memory the microRendu with HDPlex PS out of the box/without ISO Regen/ performed at the same level as the USBridge/ISO Regen with the caveat that the microRendu high frequencies seemed to lack airiness... really curious now what microRendu would have sounded like with LPS 1.2 and ISO Regen.
• Aries Mini would easily best DIgione/USBridge w/ LPS 1.2
• SoTM SMS-100 would be on par with the USBridge w/ LPS 1.2.. its better behaved but slow on transients
• Have not auditioned the ultraRendu or SMS-200 but based on published reviews they are better than microRendu.

So the least expensive solution I've had that beat the Digione is a microRendu with an iFi power supply equivalent, about a $300 difference in source investment if

your DAC already has a good asynch USB section.

[davide256]

In the FWIW column, my RPI3b+ is back in service as Roon asynch USB endpoint, running the 32 bit version of Audiolinux with overclocking enabled. Heartily recommended,

better than any of the other options I've played around with. Note that while a 64 bit AL version is also available it has no overclocking config, stuttered playing higher than CD resolution without an overclocking config.

[davide256]

15 hours ago, tims said:

If relevant, what is the maximum you can up-sample with yout 32 bit AL RPI?  Does it play DSD files without stuttering?

 

Thanks

Can't test that since my DAC is PCM only, using DSD to PCM conversion. No issues playing 192/24 resolution if overclocking config is used. Finally got a Pentium NUC

tweaked to sound right as AL headless endpoint last night, it adds smoother high frequencies, probably the better route to go if you want native DSD. But for $70 vs $270 (AL cost included), the RPI3b+ with AL is quite a bargain.

[davide256]

1 hour ago, franz159 said:

@davide256

 

Hi, I have been reading your posts for quite some time and I've seen you have made a lot of experiments with RPI3: DigiOne, USBridge, I guess you will be doing DigiOne Signature now...

 

I'm intrigued by your findings about AudioLinux, and I would like to start playing around with it for a PCM only solution (say up to 24/96) with one of my raspberries.

Functionally wise, I plan using  MPD+Alsa+UPmpdCli for streaming, which is essentially what I currently do with Moode.

 

I'd like to compare the AL solution with the Moode one.

I'm also using MicroZotl 2 as headphone amplifier, but with HiFiMan 400i.

 

Just a quick question: is the initial installation process of AL very complicated or would that be essentially burning an SD card for usage in the raspberry?

I could not really find an initial guide on the AL website.

 

Al as RPI3 32 bit endpoint is quite easy for wired Ethernet/ USB DAC connection, flash the boot card using Etcher or Rufus, edit  the  boot file to  unremark the lines for turbo mode (remove leading #) then enable endpoint option of your choice from "start here" folder. The setup instructions are here

http://www.audio-linux.com/html/rpi3.html

 

Because it's LXQT (GUI), the RPI3 version is a  lot easier to setup/edit config files than the headless PC version... think Windows vs DOS. One quirk I encountered, during boot where the screen gives you a chance to choose LXQT boot options by hitting " tab", that didn't work for my keyboard, it was space bar. just be sure that when you go to edit a file that the path is absolute not virtual... square boxes around directory names for file path vs "/" between them means you have a virtual path and won't be able to save an edit

[davide256]

15 minutes ago, franz159 said:

Thanks for the prompt answer. 

Used to Moode (which is headless) I understand now from your explanation that I need to wait after the holiday when I will have a keyboard and a monitor to be used for booting it.

yes, for initial setup you will want keyboard and monitor attached. Once that's complete you won't need them