CLOCKS, what should we look for in next generation

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31 minutes ago, mansr said:

Atomic clocks and extreme temperature stability just don't make sense for audio purposes. Nobody will notice if the clock drifts a few hundred ppm over the course of an hour.

While not important I also haven't found very much drift. 

 

I recently acquired an Antelope Audio interface.  They have their fancy Oven clocks.  One of their trademark features.  I wanted it for other features, but of course don't mind.  They have the hoopla about < 1 ppm aging per year, stability of +/- .02 ppm and calibration of +/- .001 ppm.  None of which tells me anything definitive about short term phase noise. 

 

In a week vs another interface it varied by 4-5 ppb.  Meaning both were at least this stable or the much more unlikely case of them both varying over time almost exactly the same amount.  

 

I have hooked up other interfaces and weeks apart they vary at most by a few ppm usually not that much.  Some of them vary from one another by more than 100 ppm in basic clock speed, but the variance over time is not very large at all.   So I should be smart and start a company to fix this non-issue for audiophiles.  Creativity can be furthered when you are developing gear to fix issues not broken. Success would be guaranteed judging by history. 

 

beerandmusic already believes.  He doesn't know why he believes.  He does believe.  He doesn't understand what this would do for him, but he believes.  Belief is enough.  He doesn't know what bad clocking would sound like, but believes better clocking would sound........better. 

 

To paraphrase John Lennon: All you need is belief. Belief is all you need.

 

Facts???  What can you do with Facts?????????  

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19 minutes ago, beerandmusic said:

 

Probably good marketing is why i believe.....but i have believed before and been wrong...maybe it is all just more hoopla, but right now I do believe....Even the main manufacturers are pushing the importance of clocking....

 

I wonder how this would subjectively compare to a $4K trifecta and $2K dac.

 

http://www.technics.com/us/products/grand-class-g30/network-audio-amplifier-su-g30.html

 

https://www.gramophone.co.uk/feature/product-of-the-month-technics-su-g30

 

The first few words in your first link:

 

Jitter is a major cause of distortion in digital systems......

 

No it is not.  It is such a major distortion it is difficult to measure at all.  What measuring is done shows little of it in evidence.  They push this, and believe this because it has been shown that potential customers believe it. 

 

 

This image, boy must be some bad-a$$ jitter to cause that middle graph.  You think they got that graph from the lab gear they measured it with or maybe someone told a creative guy how to draw it up.  He was happy.  He only needed to draw two different images and label a duplicate as JENO. 

 

It might be a fine piece of gear, but they spent most of the budget on buzz words at the marketing buzz word lab.  This reads like a joke of an ad, only it is real and it works.  You already belief.  They just tapped into that belief.  When are you ordering one?  It even implies it turns compressed audio into hi-rez content.  Wouldn't be possible without the Symmetric Structure.  

 

Accurate Digital Technology

JENO Engine (Jitter Elimination and Noise-shaping Optimisation)
GaN-FET Driver 
LAPC (Load Adaptive Phase Calibration) 
High-speed Silent Hybrid Power Supply 
Battery Driven Clock Generator 
High Rigidity Metal Double Chassis

Noiseless Signal Technology

Digital Noise Isolation Architecture 
Ultra Low Distortion Oversampling Digital Filter 
High Res Re-master - enhanced for compressed audio
Optimally Activated Circuit System

Technics Definitive Design

High Rigidity Aluminium Cabinet 
Symmetric Structure

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2 hours ago, davide256 said:

Don't get caught up in all the tech hoopla.. what matters is what can be heard. 30 years ago tech pundits were claiming we didn't need anything better than a Denon or a Technics direct drive for vinyl turntables, that belt drive, suspension products like Linn or Sota couldn't improve analog playback. The science of audio rarely keeps up with the art of audio.

I'm calling BS on this because that is what it is.  BS, revisionist history.  Your description is not what happened.  

 

If you disagree with the opinion on current streamers fine, don't put out crappy misinformation about the past doing so. 

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8 hours ago, davide256 said:

I lived it... apparently you weren't born, or were outside the audiophile community at the time. Or perhaps worked for one of the businesses selling Denon turntables?

Negative on all counts.  

 

I was alive too, and remember no industry wide campaign to discredit belt drive.  For that matter if you ever had the pleasure of hearing a Micro Seiki (the model with up to three tonearms) you can hear that not all direct drive was inferior to belt.  Plenty of marketing by of course big companies selling direct drive.  Not the same thing as you imply.