Design a PC/Server for ROON and HQ Player

[elan120]

50 minutes ago, Miska said:

This is what I use in the latest build:

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/Z390-AORUS-MASTER-rev-10#kf

 

It had everything I need plus some extra.

Hi Miska,

 

Could you comment on Gigabyte Z390 DESIGNARE compare to Gigabyte Aorus Master?  It has one more LAN port but one less M.2, and with 12+1VRM vs 12 on the Aorus Master.  I am not sure if one is better than the other when looking strictly from a HQPlayer server point of view.

[elan120]

51 minutes ago, Miska said:

 

That should be good too. Very similar, but more work/professional oriented (rather than gaming/overclocking), so it has slightly different feature set due to that. And IIRC a little bit more expensive. Maybe less LED-bling too...   For HQPlayer and graphics use cases, if the on-board audio is not going to be used, it should be perfectly fine. It was on my list for motherboard, but I ended up with the AORUS MASTER due to price and availability. But for another build with 9900KS I may very well opt for that board too.

 

Thank you for your input.  This is the board I have on my very short list to get for my next HQPlayer server build with i9-9900KS.

[elan120]

19 minutes ago, ericuco said:

Note that I am not looking for the holy grail, just a decently configured server running HQP Desktop 4 and Roon Core.

If running DSD256 using EC modulators is the goal, then go for 9700K instead.  i7-9700 might only do up to DSD128 with EC modulators.

[elan120]

19 minutes ago, ChrisVH said:

I am going to marinate on the Aorus Master vs Designare for a few days.

Here is the Gigabyte spec comparison between Aorus Master vs Designare

[elan120]

32 minutes ago, ChrisVH said:

 

Thank you, Elan - yes, I also saw that. Just looks like I am giving up an m.2 AND PCIe slot, but gaining Thunderbolt 3 and USB-C. Given that I don't anticipate a need for 3rd M.2, I think that Designare might fit my need a little better, since I won't need to buy an additional Tbolt card...

I am leaning more towards Designare at the moment for its dual GbE LAN ports and perhaps a bit better VRM section since I am not certain how much OC I will be running on this build.

 

On the cooler side, my current plan is to go with liquid cooler, but if I was to go with Noctua on Designare, I will look at NH-D15S closer instead of NH-D15 so it will clear the first PCIe slot.

 

[elan120]

4 minutes ago, ChrisVH said:

 

Have you confirmed that the D15 will be an issue clearing the PCIe slot (vs D15S), or are you just wanting the little extra 'wiggle-room'. Looks like the 15 is a little bit better for cooling, which is why I chose that one, but if I am compromising that cooling if I use the PCIe slot, then you're right and the 15S would make more sense...

My understanding of Designaire is 71.6mm center CPU to near side of PCIe socket, where NH-D15 is 150mm wide with centered base, which is 75mm center CPU to sides of cooler.

 

NH-D15S will fit as it has base offset, so it's fins are 67.5mm center CPU toward PCIe socket.

 

[elan120]

2 minutes ago, Miska said:

 

You've noticed there's the Aorus Xtreme Waterforce? That has the Thunderbolt too. And the Aorus Xtreme Waterforce 5G that they advertise for 9900K. Both of these also feature 10 Gbps Ethernet.

 

Yes, I am also looking into that one as well.  Look to be a very nice one.

[elan120]

42 minutes ago, ChrisVH said:

Do you happen to know if that larger fan (140mm) will fit in the case I'm looking at (assume Elan is looking at same case?)?

It should.  Based on Noctua's spec., NH-D15S has a total height of 160mm, and since max cooler height for Fractal Design Define R6 is 185mm, there is more than enough room to fit NH-D15S inside the case.

 

 

 

 

[elan120]

2 hours ago, ChrisVH said:

the additional horizontal footprint with the 2nd fan (and vertical board clearance), and whether that might be an issue?

With the second fan installed, the memory you specified in your build BOM would be too high at 42.2mm to clear the reduced clearance at 32mm to fit 4 sticks (64G) of RAM.  If this is the RAM you would like to use and can live with 32G instead, then look at HX426C13PB3K2/32 and use the outer two RAM slots away from CPU socket.

 

 

 

[elan120]

15 minutes ago, ChrisVH said:

I'll probably still with the original fan selection of NH-D15, because I'd rather have that extra RAM than extra PCIe slot.

4 sticks of HyperX Predator RAM and either NH-D15 or NH-D15S don't go too well together, as NH-D15 is having the same clearance at 32mm.

[elan120]

43 minutes ago, ChrisVH said:

My i9-9900KS will be here tomorrow, so I'll be locking-down my parts list in the next day or two, and start making my purchases. I'll try the 15S Noctua first, and if it looks like I can get the extra A15 in there without an issue, I'll pick that up. I have the Asus 2080Ti Strix in the build just to see where that put me for power needed, but will likely hold-off on that until next year, and just use my Quadro K4000 from other PC in the interim.

 

Before I start ordering the rest of the parts, does anyone have any other suggestions, or words of caution for my FIRST DIY PC build ever? 🙂  https://pcpartpicker.com/user/chrisvh/saved/XDnf99

 

Miska's note about thermal paste application noted...

 

Thanks for everyone's help!

Just curious, what is purpose of having one each of these two drives?

[elan120]

8 hours ago, dctom said:

Thanks for the replies.

Have gone for a different board now to avoid the issue, an Asrock Z390 phantom ITX/ac it only has the one connector. It uses less power than the Aorus and runs a bit cooler, I want to use passive fanless cooling.

 

27 minutes ago, dctom said:

 

I get your point, it's just that I want to use my Paul Hynes 12v psu to connect directly to the cpu ATX.

FWIW...the typically one 8-pin EPS connection with 18AWG is capable to supply more than 235W of power, so the limiting factor is PHD SR7 at 12V/10A, and not the motherboard.  Either ITX or ATX motherboard will work fine with one 8-pin EPS connected with HQPlayer running DSD256/EC7 upsampling.  Having two 8-pin EPS connected will help lower the overall impedance, which should contribute to better performance/SQ.

[elan120]

4 minutes ago, dctom said:

Thanks for the clarification. I am going to use an i7 9700T 35w  and the MB is pretty efficient power wise so hopefully amperage draw will not be too high and system will run at a lowish temperature. Will use a separate power supply for the 24 pin ATX.

Do you plan on using HQPlayer to run any upsampling with this setup?

[elan120]

Just now, dctom said:

 

yes will use HQP upsampling 

Sounds good.  This setup should be able to run less stressful modulators, but in case you want to run any of the EC modulators from PCM to DSD256, it could be a challenge with this CPU.

[elan120]

9 minutes ago, ChrisVH said:

maybe something new out there for RAM or drives that might make more sense?

I just put together my server with i9900KS few weeks ago, but since my build is only used as a server, the RAMs used may not be applicable to you, but since these Apacer WT ECC UDIMM offer excellent SQ, it is well worth to consider.

[elan120]

4 minutes ago, Miska said:

Just that 9900K(S) doesn't support ECC RAM...

Yes, they do work, but will operate in non-ECC mode - see below "4" under memory section of specification.

[elan120]

6 minutes ago, Miska said:

There is no point in buying RAM with ECC bit when it is being left unused...

Fully agree from ECC functionality standpoint, but from SQ standpoint, it is very much worth considering.

[elan120]

15 minutes ago, mikicasellas said:

I think i will try connecting the CPU thru the HDPLEX 800w DCATX with the INPUT 2

Just curious, what would you be powering group-2 of the HDPlex 800W DC-ATX with?

[elan120]

2 minutes ago, mikicasellas said:

I never thought about that, so i could not 😬

 

Even though i connected to the same INPUT 1 where the MOBO is connected and even with the stock Eps cable, i feel so far, that the job that the 800W DCATX does is better than connecting the HDPLEX 200w direct from its 12v output to the CPU even with the Ghent cable...

I recently done some experiments by first using one Keces P8 to power HDPlex 800W DC-ATX converter, and power the EPS on the motherboard, but still using the original Seasonic power supply for ATX with better result.  Later I added a second Keces P8 to power both group1 and group2 on HDPlex 800W DC-ATX converter, where group1 is powering ATX and group2 is powering EPS, and this brought even better result.  I could stop here, but decided to push the experiment a bit further, so I am now in a process to build a pair of power supplies to power both ATX and EPS directly without going through HDPlex 800W DC-ATX converter to see how well this is going work.  So far, based on what I have done, good quality power to EPS make more improvement than ATX, and this seems to be consistent with few other people I talked to.  If you can have top quality power supplies on both ATX and EPS, then this is a non-issue, but if you can only have one top quality power supply, then put that on EPS.

[elan120]

6 hours ago, StreamFidelity said:

1. Is it better for CPU Power to bypass the HDPLEX DC / ATX converter to avoid ripple noise (10mV) or
2. Is it better to give the CPU as much power as possible, for example to improve support the computing-intensive EC modulators of the HQPlayer?

Regarding 1., Assuming power supply quality is better than what HDPlex DC/ATX converter can provide, yes, it would be more beneficial to go direct.  This is the direction I am heading with the power supply build project.

 

2.  I would use just one best quality power supply with enough headroom on EPS.  My average EPS consumption for 44.1 to DSD256/EC7 is around 50W with i9-9900KS, around 15W higher from hi-res PCM to DSD256/EC7, and will spike up close to a bit shy of 100W (using tools I have).  The EPS supply I am working on is capable up to 14A of current, but will be derated to a 12.5A of output fuse, so by calculation, headroom should be sufficient.  Using two supplies does have other benefits such as redundancy and extra headroom, but as long as the single supply has enough headroom, and no concern over power redundancy, it will be far simpler to go with single supply.