McIntosh D150 DSD DAC

[Priaptor]

What would you suggest listening to, based on your own experience? Thanks in advance.

 

I was really hoping to be blown away by the Mac headamp/DAC/phones.

 

The headamp section is very good but the DAC section wasn't, IMO, good. Pretty lean and limited. I think they tried to be too much by incorporating an integrated amp for headphones and small speakers as well as a DAC. The phones have a pretty high impedance and even though they are rated relatively sensitive the impedance requires some decent juice to power them and once properly powered I will say they were pretty good. More neutral than the Fostex but less engaging.

 

As I have expressed on these threads I love the HUGO and while I really liked the Fostex Th900 absolutely fell in love with the LCD-X. With the HUGO the Macs sound MUCH nicer just not enough juice.

 

The other product I will be evaluating shortly is the Bakoon portable. From several I trust they love it.

 

However for an all in one package with cans like the LCD-X the Hugo is hard to beat. I really love the combo.

 

The HD800s while great are again not a good match with the HUGO. I know there are those who love them and I understand and will surely give them another try with the Bakoon but I am really right now pretty amazed at the Hugo/LCD-X combo. So much so I sold my closed Fostex as I found I just stopped listening to them.

[JorgeGVB]

Any comments or updates from those who already purchased the D150 and/or the MCT450?

[med_designer]

Any comments or updates from those who already purchased the D150 and/or the MCT450?

 

I have had both pieces in my system for about a month or so. The short of it is I like what each of them has brought to my system and my friends who are interested in this stuff also like what they have heard.

 

I do not use headphones so can not comment on the quality of headphone amp.

 

Keep in mind all of this stuff is very subjective. In my system it works well as I am entirely tube based otherwise. I am happy with my purchase and happy to be off the DAC of the year rollercoaster. Also happy to be back on physical media. There is something I like better about interacting with the CD/SACD as opposed to a file on a server somewhere.

 

Finally, it just works. If you like messing with drivers and various optimization methodologies as part of the experience and flexibility of computer audio then it is a good path to follow. I simply decided after several years of messing with it simply pressing play on the MCT450 suited me much better in the big picture.

 

RL

[Topspin70]

There's mention in another forum that something with muting relay causes noise during quiet passages. Any such experience from anyone?

[med_designer]

There's mention in another forum that something with muting relay causes noise during quiet passages. Any such experience from anyone?

 

I have not experienced this issue. In fact, I have not experienced any issues that made me feel I needed to contact the dealer or McIntosh.

 

That said it does mute itself from time to time. My cable provider, the horrible Comcast, can not track down a signal level issue that is causing the image to break up on the screen. If it gets really bad the DAC looses synch and mutes it self. In this case I am taking the optical out of my display to the optical in on the DAC150. The reason for hooking it up this way is the cable box's optical output only sends 5.1 and not stereo. I do not use 5.1 in my setup.

 

I am also primarily using the 5-pin DIN input for the SACD player. I have used the USB as well with my MacBook Pro and Amarra and had no issues. I have used 16/44.1, 24/48, 24/96, DSD64, and DSD64, and DSD128.

 

I am happy with this setup and it is meeting my needs. Another dealer had the Marantz SACD player which seemed OK but they lost the remote to set the layer on hybrid discs so I could not audition SACD. Default layer on the MCT450 is set on the front panel which for me is SACD.

 

Part of me feels this new setup is sort of like a vinyl setup without the drawbacks. It just feels musically and sonically pleasing as opposed to exceedingly accurate. If you like the former then it is worth considering.

[Topspin70]

That's reassuring. I have never had a dac that mutes itself but then again I haven't owned that many to begin with. This definitely stays on my wish list. Now it's just the arduous matter of accumulating funds for it.

[streetsounds]

@med_designer.

 

a question from a fellow owner. Do you got any issues with your D150?

 

I am using a MacMini with Audirvana 2.1x. MacMini connected via USB to the D150. My D150 has Firmware 1.01. It seems due to clock issues the unit mutes the first tone of the songs. So if I play anything which does not have a silent intro the first beat is missing. Example: On Eagles - Hotel California you would miss the first tone of the guitar.

 

Anyone else experienced this problem?

[sweetsdream]

@streetsounds, I signed up to this forum after searching for anybody else that had this problem. My new D150 with firmware 1.01 also skips the first tone. Have you learned anything more about this?

[Solstice380]

I just got the 1.01 firmware a week ago (they had to replace the chip????) and am pretty sure I'm experiencing the same thing. I think I am even hearing it from a CD from the MCT450 transport. I'll be listening more closely over the next few days.

 

Also, the upgrade didn't really change the times that I get clicks when playing from Mac Mini USB. Still always get clicks at start / end of a single song! ... let alone when switching resolutions.

 

Watch your display... when a track starts in the player on my Mac (I use HQPlayer) the display shows the USB input, then goes off it, then goes back on it when it starts playing music. Weird.

 

I put a call into the tech at my dealer this afternoon and he is going to question Chuck (Hinton, I think) at McIntosh.

[streetsounds]

@streetsounds, I signed up to this forum after searching for anybody else that had this problem. My new D150 with firmware 1.01 also skips the first tone. Have you learned anything more about this?

 

Unfortunately problem still exists. I spoke with McIntosh tech support and they had no solution and said they can not replicate the issue. I also spoke with the regional manager for McIntosh and he said he will escalate it.

 

The regional Manager came back advising me to follow the step by step guide on the website to configure my PC since they cannot replicate the problem. He said that there are so many software applications to playback media and they could not be compatible with all. I said fair enough but there are only about 3 major players used and since its a fully digital solution it should not be that difficult.

 

When I was send back to follow the instructions on the website I told him as per our initial conversation that I have a Apple Mac mini and not a Windows PC. So there is no instructions on the website and also it seemed they not payed attention to my problem/setup. I was told they will send me instructions for a Apple setup but hat never happened. At that point I gave up bugging them and just start living with the problem.

 

I think if there are instructions for a Apple Mac they should post them on the McIntosh website. Also as far I heard they had a similar issue before with the C48 and could not fix it and then upgraded to the C50 and had someone else write the Firmware for them. But now they did not wanna pay someone else to write the software with the D150 and again and we got the problems.

 

I hope they can fix it with a future Firmware update

[streetsounds]

I just got the 1.01 firmware a week ago (they had to replace the chip????) and am pretty sure I'm experiencing the same thing.

 

I also find it strange that in this day and age you have to sent a unit back for a Firmware update. I would think on a fully digital unit it should be software upgradable.

[Solstice380]

I also find it strange that in this day and age you have to sent a unit back for a Firmware update. I would think on a fully digital unit it should be software upgradable.

 

At least they sent the chip to my dealer, and we installed it. I'm going to put my 1.00 chip back in. This is BS. My dealer's tech is in contact with McIntosh again. Maybe we can get somewhere. Unfortunately, from personal experience I know that some people there don't listen to customers very well. If I meet Ron C. in a dark alley some day I'm going to kick the shit out of him for the way he treated me at show last year. I own >$20K of their gear and, luckily, this is the only issue.

 

I'll let you know what I hear back. I'm in Michigan, where are you at?

[YashN]

I'd be thoroughly pissed as well. Then again, there are a lot of brands I would look into for a DAC, and this isn't one of them.

[sweetsdream]

I've got emails out to Ron and Chuck to see if they address the issue. I have a Sonos (Wyred hotrod) connected on the COAX and It doesn't have the issue so it seems to be USB only. I will also reply with anything they answer back to me.

[Solstice380]

I just got a reply from my dealer's tech after he talked to Binghamton. Their "tip" is, "if your player can do it, set it to play 1/2 - 1 sec of silence before / between tracks".

 

The new firmware didn't fix ANY clicks on ANY software I have from iTunes / bitperfect, jriver or HQPlayer. It's not a player issue its a McIntosh issue. And it hosed the start of the first track. I'm getting my v1.00 chip back. Maybe they will figure it out some day.

 

Yash, thanks for the sympathies of the first part of your response but do you feel the need to comment on every CA thread and throw your sometimes foolish opinions around?

[streetsounds]

 

I'll let you know what I hear back. I'm in Michigan, where are you at?

 

I'm in San Francisco

[streetsounds]

Watch your display... when a track starts in the player on my Mac (I use HQPlayer) the display shows the USB input, then goes off it, then goes back on it when it starts playing music. Weird.

 

I watched the display but in my case something else happens

 

I played the album from America - America in 24bit/192kHz and the DSD version.

 

The Display shows USB and then ...... When I start playing the 24bit version it shows 192kHz and the song starts as it should be.

 

When I do the same with the DSD album I get DSD64 on the display and it disappears and then it comes back and the song starts playing with a slight delay on the first bar off the song.

 

Doing it a view times back and forth and it seems to get the hang of it and it works.

 

I think somewhere there is a timing issue. The should ask CEntrance to rewrite the software on the D150 as they did with some of the other products. At least those do not have any issue

[YashN]

Yash, thanks for the sympathies of the first part of your response but do you feel the need to comment on every CA thread and throw your sometimes foolish opinions around?

 

McIntosh are known for their amps... not at all for their DACs, nor their ability to build equipment with upgradeable firmware (in which I would put someone like PS Audio with the FPGA-based DirecStream).

 

My opinions aren't foolish to people who are informed. Maybe you need not to be sympathised with but instead laughed at.

[streetsounds]

McIntosh are known for their amps... not at all for their DACs, nor their ability to build equipment with upgradeable firmware (in which I would put someone like PS Audio with the FPGA-based DirecStream).

 

My opinions aren't foolish to people who are informed. Maybe you need not to be sympathised with but instead laughed at.

 

I agree with you. Said that if they like a piece of the DAC business and include DAC's in their amps or build a full digital preamp capable of DSD then they should make sure it's up to par with the build quality of the remaining units. By now they should have enough experience to know what they are doing.

[Solstice380]

McIntosh are known for their amps... not at all for their DACs, nor their ability to build equipment with upgradeable firmware (in which I would put someone like PS Audio with the FPGA-based DirecStream).

 

My opinions aren't foolish to people who are informed. Maybe you need not to be sympathised with but instead laughed at.

 

Bite it Yash , to you everybody is "uninformed". Like you invented audio, or DACs or balanced power or something? Sheesh, get off it and get over yourself. I've watched your childish remarks on every thread on CA. And everybody talks about it.

[Solstice380]

I agree with you. Said that if they like a piece of the DAC business and include DAC's in their amps or build a full digital preamp capable of DSD then they should make sure it's up to par with the build quality of the remaining units. By now they should have enough experience to know what they are doing.

 

Back on topic.

 

Of course they should get it done right. The thing sounds amazing, to anyone who has actually heard one. The DAC in the C50 sounds good too. This is like a lot of issues some equip is having when they don't do a good implementation of the USB.

 

I was a little harsh on Ron from McIntosh in my previous post but he was rather rude and condescending to a couple of U.S. McIntosh owners at a show.... I could've popped him then and this just brought it back to me.

[Solstice380]

My opinions aren't foolish to people who are informed. Maybe you need not to be sympathised with but instead laughed at.

 

Sorry Yash, I meant to include that some of your tech investigations show merit but you throw out an "opinion" on every forum and underhanded, snide remarks on most of 'em. It degrades the credibility of stuff that you have studied and contributed. That's all. Apologies for my previous comments. Please leave threads that don't involve you alone. You'll be better received.

[One and a half]

I watched the display but in my case something else happens

 

I played the album from America - America in 24bit/192kHz and the DSD version.

 

The Display shows USB and then ...... When I start playing the 24bit version it shows 192kHz and the song starts as it should be.

 

When I do the same with the DSD album I get DSD64 on the display and it disappears and then it comes back and the song starts playing with a slight delay on the first bar off the song.

 

Doing it a view times back and forth and it seems to get the hang of it and it works.

 

I think somewhere there is a timing issue. The should ask CEntrance to rewrite the software on the D150 as they did with some of the other products. At least those do not have any issue

 

If on OSX and "driverless" (no extra software required to drive the DAC), I have seen this on my MPD-3 from A+.

DSD is DOP'd on OSX and it takes some time for the DAC to realise what's going on and switches the display b/n 176.4 and DSD, but once it plays, the display is DSD. All the music is there, no lost chords.

 

The advice from the distributor does have some merit.

As a workaround for now, try to set the delay to change sample rates in A+ to say 4s (yeah OK, extreme) and work shorter times until the problem disappears. JRMC has a similar time delay system buried in the Audio options.

 

Another alternative like for HQ Player is to permanently set the output to DSD64/128 and there's no switching at all, apart perhaps from the very first track that's played. That way there's no switching at all, always the same type and speed of signal seen by the DAC and hopefully no lost chords.

[jack64bit]

Hello guys, my name is Danilo, I'm from Italy. I got the D150 a week ago and I'm experiencing the same problems described in this 3d. My D150 has the firmware v1.00 and I use the USB port only at the moment. Damien helped me last weekend providing me a beta version of A+ as a workaround but I still have the statics (clicks, pops... I don't know how to explain in English... ) before the first song being played. At the moment no chord is miss... OSX is up to date (10.0.5). JRiver and iTunes have some behaviour. They are up to date.

What's not clear in my mind is if the FW v. 1.01 solves this kind of issue. Please advice.

Thanks to all!

Danilo

[jack64bit]

Hello guys, my name is Danilo, I'm from Italy. I got the D150 a week ago and I'm experiencing the same problems described in this 3d. My D150 has the firmware v1.00 and I use the USB port only at the moment. Damien helped me last weekend providing me a beta version of A+ as a workaround but I still have the statics (clicks, pops... I don't know how to explain in English... ) before the first song being played. At the moment no chord is miss... OSX is up to date (10.0.5). JRiver and iTunes have some behaviour. They are up to date.

What's not clear in my mind is if the FW v. 1.01 solves this kind of issue. Please advice.

Thanks to all!

Danilo

 

Hi. Can someone help me?

Thank you!

 

Danilo