Sonore ultraDigital v2.0

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1 hour ago, vortecjr said:

 

DESCRIPTION

The Sonore ultraDigital project is a USB digital converter with SPDIF output via BNC and a LVDS i2s output via HDMI. The LVDS i2s output supports various format for compatibility with various digital to analog converters.

 

SPECIFICATIONS

TBD

 

AVAILABLITY

Coming soon

Great, thanks for posting! Finally a device with SPDIF output from Sonore! I' m looking forward to see how it compares to Eitr, MC3+ USB, etc.

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1 hour ago, George Hincapie said:

 

They should make a network renderer with SPDIF. Perfect.

Both a renderer with SPDIF outputs and a USB to SPDIF (and USB to I2S) bridge are useful options. I do not need a renderer in my system but I would be happy to order a Sonore ultraDigital if it performs better than the Schiit Eitr and the Mutec MC3+ USB. I guess that the upcoming ultraDigital can be powered with an UpTone Audio UltraCap LPS-1. I am happy that Sonore comes out with a device with SPDIF outputs but announcing a new device without providing specs seems a little bit pointless to me. Hopefully the OP will soon provide some more informations ...       

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4 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

That is easy...the ultraDigital is the only one with LVDS i2s output via HDMI output:) 

I understand, but I need an SPDIF output, not i2s. Thus, what matters to me is how the ultraDigital compares to Eitr, MC3+ USB, etc. in terms of SPDIF output quality! Does the device provide galvanic isolation? Does it require device specific drivers for Linux? Thanks, nbpf  

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38 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

Like the micro/ultraRendu line it has external DC input so you can tweak the sound with the power supply you use. We will offer a iFi iPower supply or you could use your own uber expensive power supply with it. So the sounds is going to vary from great to whatevery your needs are. How it compares to other gear I'll leave that up to you. Yes it has galvanic isolation and reclocking to deal with the jitter it induces as a result of it. Nothing special needed for Linux and native DSD is supported via the LVDS i2s output. 

Thanks for the feedback, that sounds like a perfect replacement for my oldish M2Tech HiFace Evo! Any chance to get one shipped to Germany before Christmas? Best, nbpf

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2 hours ago, vortecjr said:

Sign up for the mailing list on our website and we will keep you posted;)

Done, thanks!

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1 hour ago, mikey8811 said:

So if one were to use it, there wouldn't be a need for an ISO Regen?

 

ie. the chain would be Streamer -> USB cable or USPCB -> Ultra Digital -> HDMI cable -> DAC .

 

Correct?

 

Have you guys tested it and done a comparison in sonics vs an ISO Regen cleaned USB connection to a DAC?

I might be missing something of course but it seems to me that the ultraDigital is a USB -> SPDIF and a USB -> i2s convertor.

 

Thus, meaningful comparisons would be against devices like the Schiit Eitr, the Audiobyte Hydra Z, the Mutec MC3+ USB, etc.

 

In such comparisons the same DAC input (SPDIF or i2s) would have to be used for all tests. In order to assess the capability of the devices to deal with noisy USB inputs, it would be meaningful to compare each device pair first on a clean source (for instance, the output of an Iso Regen) and then with a source that is not so clean like the USB output of a Raspberry Pi.

 

This is quite a lot of work but, considering that many alternatives to the ultraDigital only have SPDIF outputs, certainly doable if the devices are available.  

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45 minutes ago, kboung said:

Interesting, is the galvanic isolation before (like ISO-regen) or after the USB receive? and does the USB input need power?

Good points! It would also be interesting to know whether the device is based on a XMOS U8, XU208 or on a different approach.

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10 minutes ago, George Hincapie said:

 

The point is that Roon will see it and it'll work; I don't mind what it is seen as.

 

...

I understand that whether an USB interface is seen or not is a feature of the operating system, not of application-level software. I thought that Linux and OS X support most USB class 2 devices via kernel modules. At least, I never had a problem with devices like the Meridian Explorer on Debian, Raspbian, etc. Old interfaces like the M2Tech HiFace Evo need special drivers though. If a Roon endpoint runs on a Linux device, I would expect it to see any modern external USB interface as soon as this is plugged in. 

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5 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

Its mean to be connected directly to a micro/ultra/signatureRendu and then to your DAC.  

Hmm ... this is a bit disappointing. I thought the device was a generic USB interface like Hydra Z, Eitr, MC3+ USB, etc.   

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25 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

Most of customers just want to listen to music:) 

Right, thus you cannot expect them to buy no matter what comes to the market and start running systematic tests by themselves. Most customers need to rely on careful and honest comparisons to make up their choices.

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10 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

It is. You can connect those devices to a micro/ultra/signatureRendu as well. 

Well then, thanks for the clarification!

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59 minutes ago, Em2016 said:

 

To be fair to JR here, those comparisons generally come from customers in due time.

 

I think Sonore have a 30 day returns policy (correct me if I'm wrong) so you can always try, risk free.

 

Sure, I'm not arguing that manufacturers should provide comparisons of their product, of course! These will come from users and reviewers. My post was answering the specific question posted by mikey8811 of whether the device had been compared to the Iso Regen. The point that I was trying to make is that the upcoming device will have to be compared to other USB to SPDIF and USB to i2s interfaces, not to the Regen which is a USB to USB interface.

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16 minutes ago, mikey8811 said:

 

Actually I disagree. I am only interested in the device if it provides an improvement sonically to what I am currently using (safe to say that is the case for most of us).

 

I am currently using an Aries via the USB output via a LPS 1 powered  ISO Regen to my DAC.  My DAC has an I2S input which I understand is better than USB. So I am only interested in the device if it is sonically better than what I currently have via a ISO Regen'd USB. I am not interested in SPDIF nor AES/EBU which the Aries already has as outputs. If comparisons unequivocally point to a better sound then I can jettison the ISO Regen and replace it with the Ultra Digital and a HDMI cable.

 

I hope this clarifies where I am coming from. I'm not really interested in academic comparisons to other USB to SPDIF converters. I had considered the Singxer F1 but was told I would have to defeat the inbuilt linear power supply for it to sound at its best (which I think is silly).

I understand your point but I am afraid that your question can only be answered by yourself once the device will become available.

 

Each of us obviously has very specific interests and expectations. For instance, I am interested in the device's SPDIF output. You are interested in its i2s output. The question of whether the ultraDigital (or, in fact, any other similar device) does improve my/your specific current system can finally only be decided by me/you.

 

However, the question of how a device compares to its competitors can be answered by systematic comparisons. And for such comparisons to be meaningful, certain conditions have to be met which is what I was trying to spell out. 

 

It goes without saying that these comparisons, even when carefully done, can only be taken as guidelines for specific choices. But they can be very useful. Thus, for instance, if you knew that the ultraDigital performs better than any other USB to i2s interface, all you would have to do is to test it in your system. By contrast, if you do not know how the ultraDigital compares to other i2s interfaces, finding out that it improves your system would not tell you very much: another device could bring even better improvements, perhaps at lower costs.

 

Thus, it seems to me that careful and systematic comparisons between similar devices is more or less the best information that we can hope to get to guide our specific choices.

 

By the way, the Hydra Z also seems to have i2s outputs over HDMI. Will the ultraDigital be better, worse or as good as the Z? 

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Talking about specs: how much will it cost roughly?

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On 10/31/2017 at 12:24 PM, vortecjr said:

...

AVAILABLITY

Coming soon

What does this roughly means? Are we going to be able to get the ultraDigital before the end of the year? Thanks, nbpf

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18 hours ago, vortecjr said:

Unfortunately, no.

But  http://www.sonore.us/ultraDigital.html says yes :-) !

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3 minutes ago, oneguy said:

He may have meant no Black Friday deals. I really hope I’m wrong though as that would be a great offer for early adopters. 

Tomorrow we will see ... anyway, good that Sonore managed to bring out the ultraDigital before the end of the year! I am looking forward to see how it compares to the Eitr and to the MC-3+ USB.  

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11 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

This product is for customers looking to connect none USB devices to our gear. I'm not convinced that there is much of a market for external i2s sources these days.   

Good point. But I believe that there would be a market for a modular ultraRendu. One that can be ordered with USB, SPDIF or i2s outputs and that can host a 2.5" HDD. 

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1 minute ago, vortecjr said:

That sounds like stuff we made 5 years ago:)

I do not know what Sonore made 5 years ago but, today, I am not aware of any manufacturer that makes modular dedicated audio servers/players. It is good to have the ultraDigital but, for ultraRendu owners, it would probably be better if they could add a SPDIF output to their device: no need for yet another PSU, shorter signal paths and a more dependable upgrade roadmap. We need more modular solutions, not yet another reincarnation of the same bits and pieces.   

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14 minutes ago, Sonic77 said:

... Also I have the Chord Dave dac with the Chord Blu Mk 2. I wonder if it would work with that? What is the main purpose of this product? To reduce jitter even further?

It seems to me that the main purpose of the device is to convert USB streams into SPDIF and i2s streams. I am not sure that there is a jitter measure associated to a USB stream that can possibly be reduced. But the precision of the clocks on the device will determine the amount of jitter of the outgoing stream, I guess.   

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6 hours ago, R1200CL said:

 

Can you post a picture from inside ?

Good point, a series of pictures with the insides of F-1, SU-1, Eitr, MC-3+ USB and ultraDigital side-by-side would be a great appetizer!

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13 hours ago, R1200CL said:

 

If somone sends me a sample I’m happy to do a test against my modified SU-1 done by @scan80269  ?

(MicroRendu 1.4)

 

Yes, I think several potential buyers would like to know how the the UD performs against the probably best DCC !

Especially if can you save yourself an extra LPS-1 and achieve equal SQ. 

 

Have a look in this thread about SU-1

 

Do you know how the modified Singxer SU-1 performs against the Mutec MC-3+ USB and the Schiit Eitr? I have come across  a report (http://www.basshead.club/spdif-battle-mutec-singxer-lynx-rednet-et-al/#comment-171) suggesting that the Eitr might actually be better than both the unmodified SU-1 and MC-3+ USB. What do you think? 

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2 hours ago, vortecjr said:

Sure...do you want the schematics as well:)

A high resolution picture would be enough for me. Similar to the high resolution picture of the Eitr board posted on the Schiit site. Thanks, nbpf

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9 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

 

No ?

 

I suggest you take the question over to the SU-1 thread I linked to. You most likely get some better opinions.  You should also tell them what your present gear is. Or just google a lot. But that link you gave is probably not to far from the truth. 

 

Though I would in any case advice a DCC that accepts LPS-1 (or the Winni Rossi), with Starquad DC cable and Oyaide plugs.

And you maybe as me prefer AES EBU interface...

 

And most likely price reflect what you get in these cases. 

 

If you are patient, maybe John S and Alex C has something for xmas.

 

Based on the little info we have on the UD, I suspect it will be among the 3 best DCC’s, so if Jesus offer you a return, why not try it ?

Send him a email. 

 

 

 

Thanks, I would not mind trying the UD and the Eitr against my current setup but I am located in Germany and sending stuff back and forth is a bit costly and annoying. Also, the Eitr has been out of stock for meanwhile months. AES EBU is nice but I have a Naim DAC. Thus, the only option is SPDIF, ideally via BNC connector. If the UD will be among the 3 best DCCs, which ones are the other two?

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On 11/28/2017 at 1:09 AM, R1200CL said:

Just bought the uD. Will compare against my modified SU-1. Hopefully this weekend if DHL is fast enough. 

I am looking forward to read your findings!