Pro-Ject Pre Box S2 Digital: MQA HW decoding at reasonable cost

[wushuliu]

14 hours ago, beerandmusic said:

At price point i expected.....good job Pro-ject !

...sets a new bar in price for a dual es9038 mono/mono architecture,  w/galvanic isolation, DSD & MQA.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Pro-Ject-Pre-Box-S2-Digital/dp/B073WCRZ79

 

This is why I tell people not to spend big on DACs. The turnaround cycle gets faster and faster every day. Less than a year ago a dual Es9038 would set you back what...a $1000? And Pro-ject is not exactly a cutting edge company. If this unit costs 399 you can bet it can be sold for a lot less. 

[wushuliu]

5 hours ago, Norton said:

I'm not knocking this DAC, it looks to be terrific VFM and I quite fancy one myself.  But if chips matter, then it's worth pointing out that, according to spec sheet and despite being marketed as having ESS's "flagship DAC-chip", the 9038 chips are the Q2Ms intended for mobile applications -  not the 9038 Pro used in some much more expensive desktop DACs, which comes from ESS's Sabre audiophile line and is described by them as their flagship chip.  9038Pros look to retail at $75+ a piece alone.

 

Ah that explains it. Knew something was up. Then it's definitely overpriced for what it does. You can get es9038q2m dac boards on ebay of similar size for $40. Inferior design to the project? Probably, but it gives an idea of value. In other words give it a few months and there will be an even cheaper option. Pro-ject is just the first to hit the retail market.

[wushuliu]

16 minutes ago, GUTB said:

I know there’s no way this little baby box is going to compete with a real DAC. But MQA, 5v power allowing the use of battery, and DSD512 for the price of $400...I just had to do it.

 

It could definitely compete. I've read some really great things about the ES9038Q2M boards off ebay, once they've been modified a little. Overall feedback is these chips blow away the older ones. I'm just saying in about six months I bet other companies will $200 units. In a year it will fit in a thumb drive.

 

I'm still shocked by the performance I get from my tiny thumb Sabaj DA3 with dual eS9018Q2m/XMOS Xu208 for $90. a few years ago that would have been $500 easy.

[wushuliu]

As a fan of ifi I say approach the iPower with caution. The first one I had squealed like a pig when plugged in - an issue that is/was well known, don't know if they solved that. The iDefender is worth every penny. I say get any of a number of better external options and plug into the iDefender.

[wushuliu]

Clock's already ticking for Pro-ject. Now you can get a decent looking mid-grade ES9038 Q2M portable PLUS an xmos208 for $200. That was even faster than my earlier projection. Topping isn't going to titillate this crowd but they make decent budget gear and have for some years now. So that $399 is already starting to look a little much.

 

Not saying the Pro-ject isn't better. Would certainly hope so for the price. Just providing perspective at just how quickly the dac market turns around now.

[wushuliu]

7 minutes ago, left channel said:

 

That link didn't work. Happens sometimes, somehow we get linked back to current CA page. Can you still edit that post, or reply with the link?

 

Edited the post but I'll add the Topping link here as well

[wushuliu]

Hm the unmentioned important bit here is that it does indeed have the xmos chip, hopefully the 208 or 216, in which it should definitely be 512 capable. The xmos improvement to sq can't be overstated for usb. The pic also shows wima caps, organic polymer caps, and coilcraft inductors. Well, well. This is looking pretty good after all...

[wushuliu]

3 hours ago, left channel said:

 

 

Why am I no longer using it? Because I want to listen to music without constantly debugging this poorly-tested, poorly-supported little box of surprises.

 

I don't really like the sound either, although the many features of this device more than made up for that for a while. And yes I enjoy helping people, but Pro-Ject's so-called support has made this a very difficult. I've had it.

 

 

Uh huh. This is what I pointed out in the early discussions of this dac as it relates to Pro-ject's business model. They sell mediocre/'meh' products at an audiophile pricepoint and coast on their brand name. Interestingly, in other realms of audiophiledom I'm noticing companies promising ES9038Q2M dacs experiencing significant delays, as if they are having a hard time tackling this chip for some reason. 

[wushuliu]

17 hours ago, Miska said:

 

I think mistake many hardware companies make is that they think bringing products like this to market is just like bringing yet another analog device to the market. But of course it is not like that... Any modern thing will have bit of firmware/software that will need maintenance and they need to be prepared for that. It is not one-shot thing one contracts at bulk price. It is an ongoing effort.

 

Quite a lot of companies will need to realize doing software (firmware) involves quite a bit of constant effort. Audio is not anymore plain hardware. Software is not like hardware component you just drop-in and forget.

 

This is a very good product, but obviously nobody thought about maintenance.

 

It's not a mistake when it comes to components like these. It's a deliberate business decision: do you hire more people to develop and support the software for these products or do you contract out that support maybe with follow up fixes for major bugs and move on to the next product cycle? Of course you're going to pick the latter. You'll save a lot of money and the ratio of complaints outside of niche forums won't be enough to really affect sales.