Mutec REF 10 Masterclock

[Savolax]

2 hours ago, Confused said:

A very interesting post.  A while ago I was looking at changing my MC3+USB.  This was for a similar reason to yourself, as I was looking for something that could output DSD64.

 

I was put off the Audio GD, having seen some very poor measurements for some of their other products, plus I had seen some issues with reliability.  I also looked at the SU-2.  This was very tempting, but I found someone who had compared the MC3+USB to the SU-2, and based on his observations I decided to stick with the Mutec.  To be clear, I only found one person, and one post on anther forum comparing the SU-2 the MC3+USB, so hardly a representative sample.  In addition, this was a comparison without an external clock.

 

Your post above has brought all of this back to me, and makes me wonder if the SU-2, mindful that I would be feeding it with my REF10, might actually be a step up from the MC3+USB?

 

I know these things are difficult, but would you be able to describe the difference in sound / presentation between a REF10 fed MC3+USB versus the SU-2?

Also one option to consider if you have interest to "max out": SU-2 modded with sCLK-EX board and DC-input jack for external LPS.

 

I have SU-1 with such mods. It did not have master clock input originally like the SU-2 now has, but after the mods. I have not heard SU-2 (neither DI20/HE nor MC3+USB) myself but at least the company where I had my SU-1 being modified, MagnaHifi, offers modification now for SU-2. Of course they are the source of service and business but maybe you could ask them an opinion. I have had fulfilling correspondence with them and never felt being charged for nonsense.

 

As for sound impressions, I use it sourcing from PC with JCAT USB XE with Farad3 and power the SU-1 with Farad3 also. Cheapo BG7TBL Master Clock is attached to SU-1.

The output is via I2S to Audio GD R7HE. I have also tried Schiit Bifrost 2 (from SU-1 with AES vs USB-in), Burl B2 Bomber DAC (from SU-1 with AES) and Holo May. Obviously this is just my opinion and not a absolute fact but I felt this SU-1 with sCLK-EX+external DC mod has improved every DAC I tried, even with the May albeit it's theoretical superior engineering and measurements.

I preferred having modded SU-1 in the setup with it's larger imaging and overall cleaner and punchier sound.

Some more technically and theoretically savvy users on forum have said here there is some fundamental problem with those I2S gimmicks making the clock going wrong direction or something. I have no idea how that stands out when listening. I seem to prefer such setup though.

 

As for more general impressions, I think you could say there is consensus with subjective (and experimental) part of users here that power supply quality and better timing (or lower phase noise) matters and that is something I believe matters much in my case too.

There is a topic on forum where people have tried bypassing internal SMPS even on a Chord DAVE with Uptone JS-2 and such with good outcome. Based on the theories by John Swenson, vastly reported experimental experience and my personal experiments I am not surprised if it would yield to improvement even on such high priced DAC.

[Savolax]

56 minutes ago, Confused said:

I think the SU-2 already includes a linear power supply?  I guess what you are saying is that better spec external LPSU would offer an improvement?  Also, if the SU-2 has a 10MhZ clock input, I am thinking that  an sCLK-EX is surplus to requirements if you simply want to run it with an existing Mutec REF10.

 

Anyway, many thanks for the pointer to Magna Hifi.  Here in the UK I could just buy a SU-2 from Amazon, but interestingly the Magna Hifi price is considerably lower.

Yes, the best spec psu you can afford. I have had good experience with "even" LPS-1.2 and Farad3. Haven't tried else, yet 😉. It was not possible to A/B due to nature of mods and I did not have surplus stock unit so I cant say for sure how much each mod mattered relatively but it was a different beast, so to say.

 

sCLK-EX is not required since the clock input is available in SU-2 and infact I noticed you have tX-USBultra so I don't how much, if any, would one do favors installed into SU-2.

And at least you have a good master clock already. Dreaming of having one in future..

 

edit: forgot to mention that they probably could do DC jack mod only and some capacitor/regulator also if preferred.