iFi's Pro iDSD (official) - NEW Firmware - MQA and more.

[AMR/iFi audio]

4 hours ago, Em2016 said:

Anyway things can change over time. With enough requests it might happen.

 

It's a fair bit more complicated than requests from people, though these surely motivate us to take needed actions. 

[AMR/iFi audio]

On 6/2/2018 at 7:13 PM, applesnowleo said:

Hello, I have one question on the ifi iDSD Pro, Can the balanced output be used at the same time of the single ended output, for example using the balanced output to an amplified speakers and the normal output to a subwoofer?

 

I already ordered mine, but probably could take a white to arrive to my country.

 

Yes, both outputs can be used at the same time.

[AMR/iFi audio]

17 hours ago, Em2016 said:

Hi @AMR/iFi audio

 

The iDSD BL headphone amp output measurements are available. Can you kindly share the same measurements for the PRO for both headphone amp output and DAC analogue outputs?

 

Dynamic Range (HP) >115dB(A) (Eco Mode, 2V Out) 

THD &N (HP 500mW/16R) < 0.008% 

Output Voltage (HP) >8V (Turbo Mode) 

Output Impedance (Zout) <1Ω (iEMatch not engaged) 

Maximum Output Power 4,000mW @ 16 Ohm 

Continuous Output Power 1,000mW @ 64 Ohm Load

 

IMD ?

 

 

All details we want to share are published at our official site. As for tech related material, please take a look at this thread:

 

 

 

[AMR/iFi audio]

24 minutes ago, applesnowleo said:

 

Thanks for your reply, this will make me very happy.

 

You're welcome.

[AMR/iFi audio]

11 hours ago, Em2016 said:

 Can you please ask The Boss.

 

Once (and if) our R&D team has something ready to be shared, they will through us here.  

[AMR/iFi audio]

1 hour ago, Em2016 said:

 

Appreciated. I'm not asking for measurements that haven't been shared for other iDSD's before....

 

Just asking for all the same comparitive figures, for the PRO.... hopefully that's not asking too much....

 

We understand that people are interested in measurements and we provide them when possible. But for now it is what it is.

[AMR/iFi audio]

On 6/9/2018 at 11:42 PM, Em2016 said:

 

Same here.

 

While the wo/man hours to get this supported aren’t free, I do believe the Roon Ready certification itself is free...

 

 

It goes FAR beyond certification. We won't go into specifics, but you wouldn't believe how many other things have to connect in order for Roon to happen in a product as complex and multi-functional as Pro iDSD.  

[AMR/iFi audio]

On 6/18/2018 at 8:44 AM, Em2016 said:

Hi @AMR/iFi audio

 

Is the new iPower Plus that comes with the PRO iDSD grounded? i.e. the AC earth is continuous with the DC plug ground?

 

 

Yes. However as the iDSD Pro is galvanically isolated on all digital inputs this is less of an issue with regards to earth loops.

[AMR/iFi audio]

Pro iDSD

The PCB Tour - part 1/2

 

 

 

1.      Quad stack – interleaved Burr-Brown DACs

 

The iDSD Pro uses a Quad ‘stack’ of iFi’s Bit-Perfect DSD and DXD DACs by Burr-Brown in a custom ‘interleaved’ configuration. This enables a total of eight pairs of differential signals to be used and mixed – four pairs of signals per channel.   All signals to the DACs are re-clocked with the low-jitter Global Master Timing® master clock derived from the AMR DP-777 DAC.     The DACs operate ‘Voltage Output Mode,’ giving >119dB dynamic range. All filtering is passive, using a fully-balanced third order capacitor/inductor/capacitor filter, rather than active, feedback-based circuits, to remove ultrasonic noise. (Active filters struggle with the amount of ultrasonic noise and RFI they have to handle and at a few 100kHz they can lose the ability to filter noise at all, which is precisely where a lot of noise is present.)   Using passive CLC filtering directly after the DAC means that the following analogue stage is not required to handle ultrasonic noise and RFI originating from the DAC process.

 

2.      Femto Precision GMT Clock & Reclocker

 

For all inputs data is sent to the aforementioned Memory Buffer, which iFi describes as ‘large’ and ‘elastic’. Here it is de-jittered to eliminate any transmission of source jitter to the DAC output. The data from the Memory Buffer is further re-clocked by with the low-jitter Global Master Timing® clock, which also drives the X-Core 200 & FPGA.

 

 

Click on this more information on iFi’s jitter solution:

http://www.amr-audio.co.uk/html/dp777_tech-papers_jitter.html

 

External Clock options and  Synchronisation

For synchronization in recording studios the iDSD Pro supports AES3id based DARS (Digital Audio Reference Signal) as recommended in the Audio Egineering Society’s published AES11 standard. And if you happen to have a really good atomic clock (at least a Sanford Research Systems PERF10 should be used) this can be used as to further elevate the iDSD Pro over the internal clock system.

 

3.      Tube/Solid-State

 

Compared to high-end headphone amplifiers, the tube stage of the Pro iDSD is different in two-ways. First, we don’t use good-quality 6922s or similar. Instead we use the very best; General Electric 5670 which is the premium variant with a different pinout.     Second and just as important is the circuit design. Unlike other amplifiers that have the same circuit and just switch in/out the tube section, the Pro iDSD is the very first of its kind that has two individual input circuits – one tube and one Solid-State. This results in the best sonics of both worlds because the signal path is the shortest and there is no compromise to ‘shoe horn’ the tubes into an already existing solid-state circuit.   For the first time, one can enjoy both the sound of Solid-State and Tubes in a single package (rather than as an ‘Effect Type’ add-on within an otherwise conventional solid-state design) and be able to switch in real-time. For some recordings and headphones/loudspeakers, Solid-State may sound ‘more lively.’ For others, Tube and Tube+ (especially Tube+) will sound more ‘luxurious.’ Select the one that sounds best for that particular moment, be it the recording, the mood or even the weather. After all, enjoying music is an experience to be savoured and not a scientific research exercise.       We haven’t stopped there. We are tube lovers and we appreciate sometimes there is a need for even more tube-like sound, there are two tube settings – Tube and Tube+. The Tube+ position reduces overall loop-gain and thus negative feedback to the minimum. This gives a different trade-off between the tube’s natural harmonics and the transient performance.   Western Electric with their own premium version of 6922 First introduced by Western Electric in 1946 with the WE396A, from the 1950s onwards (and for the next 30 years thereafter) General Electric (and several other tube/valve manufacturers) followed Western Electric with their own premium version of 6922. This range had controlled warm-up and tight specifications on grid-current, noise and microphony. The result, significantly smoother and more organic sound qualities.

 

 

4.      Class A Solid-State, J-FETs and Fully-Discrete

 

The Solid-State amplification section of the Pro iDSD is just as seriously executed as the Tube amplification section. It is the on the lines of the Pro iCAN.

 

 

The amplifer audio circuit is a development of iFi’s revolutionary ‘TubeState’ design. It is fully discrete, fully-balanced with either tube or J-FET input switchable, bipolar second stage and MOSFET-buffered bipolar class A Power stage. The resulting circuit may be best described as a ‘tri-brid’ where each device is used to greatest sonic advantage while minimising any drawbacks. Furthermore, the circuit is pure DC coupled to avoid using any sonically-degrading coupling capacitors. All of these are far from ‘run of the mill.’

 

5.      Alps 6-Track fully balanced  motorised Volume control with servo system

 

The Pro iDSD has a premium Japan Alps motorised rotary volume potentiometer. This is the ‘6-Track’ version with 4 tracks used for a true balanced volume control. This is the litmus test for any amplifier to see if it is truly balanced or operates internally in single-ended mode. Those using ‘2-Track’ volume controls may offer balanced in and out but are not true balanced designs. The Pro iDSD however is fully-balanced from beginning to end. Just like its sibling the Pro iCAN. 

 

 

6.      Elna Silmic Capacitors

 

To maximise dynamic performance, especially with bass, the analogue stage is backed by audio-grade ELNA Silmic Capacitors located within a few millimetres of the audio circuitry supplied. Elna Silmics are used in the final stages of the main DC bus which is filtered using multiple stages of inductor/capacitor filters.

 

 

To boot, Elna Silmics are usually only found in components that cost far more as they considered ‘boutique’ components yet we consider them a ‘must have’ to achieve the best sound quality. We hope that it is apparent that the Pro DSD has the best parts in the right sections to carry out the best job possible. 

 

7.      Elna Dynacap Low Impedance Super Capacitors

 

The digital section is powered by a bank of Elna Dynacaps ‘Super Capacitors’ totaling 6.6 Farad (6,600,000uF). iFi uses Elna Dynacap DZ (TM) Super capacitors because they have 400 times lower internal impedance than common grades of super capacitors. This exceptional low impedance means they release energy much faster than other super capacitors.

 

 

8.      Power Supplies 

 

Using classic tube design, brought up-to-date with 21st Century technology, all incoming DC is converted to a high-frequency waveform then rectified and filtered by a choke input capacitor filter. This produces a first-level DC bus from which all further voltages are derived. The circuit also generates a galvanically-isolated power supply voltage for the USB input circuitry.   The digital section is powered by a bank of Super Capacitors totaling 6.6 Farad (6,600,000uF). iFi uses Elna Dynacap DZ (TM) Super capacitors because they have a 400 times lower internal impedance than common grades of super capacitors.     Individual low-noise TI LDO Regulators with local LC filtering provide the final low-noise power for all individual digital sections, a total of six individual regulators cover Clock, SPDIF Input and the DAC’s digital section.   For the analogue stage (especially the tubes) higher voltages are needed. The whole stage effectively operates on a 60V rail offering massive potential dynamic range.

 

 

STAY TUNED, THERE'S MORE!

 

 

 

[AMR/iFi audio]

On 7/1/2018 at 5:20 PM, applesnowleo said:

I brought Roon two days ago, but I use the iDSD Pro directly connected to my computer by USB, the network option of Roon is not important to me, do you recommend a specific config in Roon to have the best sound from the iDSD Pro when connected in the same computer via USB?

 

As for iDSD Pro and Roon, we don't have any specific recommendation.

 

On 7/1/2018 at 5:20 PM, applesnowleo said:

Also does justify using the iDSD Pro in conjunction with the micro iUSB 3.0, I have one without use at the moment, is there any benefit of using it, or que galvanic isolation of que iDSD pro is superior or equivalent to the micro iUSB 3.0 or is this an unnecessary add-on with no benefit to the ifi iDSD Pro?

 

iUSB3.0 won't do any harm to Pro iDSD, that's a given. Still, we do not expect significant improvements as the latter already has full galvanic isolation between that actual DAC and digital processing, thus is impervious to USB tweaks in a way which goes beyond 'just' having iUSB3.0 circuitry on-board. 

 

We would suggest to shift focus to here instead:

 

It's important to know that iUSB3.0 was designed to combat USB related issues on several fronts. It's not meant to improve a USB input in a DAC only, but in general  was developed to elevate performance of a PC/a laptop and an external HDD. What we want to say here is that if one takes care of externals, Pro iDSD will be essentially fed with a better signal and that's beneficial.

 

Software is yet another matter burdened with its own issues, please take a look at this document we wrote with Damien Plisson of Audirvana: http://www.amr-audio.co.uk/html/dp777_tech-papers_cmpDataBit4dummies.html

 

Our point is that it's good to not try to improve Pro iDSD alone as it can handle itself nicely but everything that comes before it. 

[AMR/iFi audio]

On 7/6/2018 at 3:56 AM, Em2016 said:

Hi @AMR/iFi audio

 

Does iDSD Pro support Chromecast? Or in the plans?

 

Roon now does support Chromecast so that would kill 2 birds with 1 stone, if possible.

 

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/roon-1-5-build-333-is-live-with-chromecast-support/45611/3

 

We roll with Muzo app and everything in this package.

[AMR/iFi audio]

Folks, below you'll find the review of our Pro iDSD written by Andrej Turok, a musician. This publication originally appeared in Finnish High and Style mag. Enjoy!
 

High and Style - Pro iDSD Review

In a compact package, we have an audiophiliac bomb that explodes with dazzling quality, versatility and technology. From the other Prague exhibition (see the report in this issue) we have taken away, apart from impressions and hearing experiences, a small box with something surprisingly different. EXaudio has borrowed a premium amplifier with high-end transducers for the test, proud of the Professional Tube / Solid-State DAC / Headphone-amp prediction. Well, then.

 

 

It is not a shame to claim that iFi once again shuddered the digital world. Setting up the revolutionary QUAD core Burr Brown chip introduces an entirely new quality to the upcoming generation of their products. The unfamiliar compact displays  benefits such as, complete galvanic isolation of all inputs, four DAC sections, a variety of digital- including Bit-Perfect Direct-to-Print mode, USB 3.0 Type B and USB 3.1 Type C self-powered, the newly developed SDIF AMR, including the implementation of the new HD-VDi (HD Electronic Digital Input) solid state, cache, and the Global Master Timing® timer. The entire X-Core 200 processor is the X-Core 200. The all-new XMOS XU216 X-Core generation with a maximum of 2000 MIPS (two billion instructions per second) can work in dual mode as a USB interface and can decode all signals until sampling 768 kHz / 32 bits and DSD512 as well as streaming resources from the wi-fi network.

 

Construction

The sympathetic silver brick has asymmetrically placed rotary vents with the eye of the lamp in the epicenter at the top of the carriage. The front panel has two dimensional potentiometers on the edges - the left-hand selector, the volume selector on the right. In addition, the first is a smaller "sweep" to set the selected digital filter. At the very center of the Nautilus submarine is a circular OLED display. Here is a large jack on the headphone jack, a small three-position "

 

"sensitivity (gain) bounded by SE and BAL inputs. The rectangle of the angular "lady" provides rich connectivity. From left to right symmetrical as well as asymmetrical (XLR and RCA) outputs plus aluminum adjusting screws with Pro (Var), Pro (Fixed), HiFi (HFI) and Hifi (Fixed) positions. Upstream to the center is the LAN connector, then Host and Device inputs, coaxial and optic, XLR, SDC shaft above, BNC Sync in and Sync out down, sync mode screw, and finally power up from external power and DC loop out. Inside the intestines, the sections are separated by two massive compartments, the red printed circuit boards are precisely embedded in the top components. The main "volume" potentiometer (Balanced Analogue Volume) is from ALPS.

 

 

Practice + Listening First, I took the machine into the studio and attached it to my "brand new" rack with 64-bit architecture. I caught up with something from my current work, but also from the archive of record varieties of all sorts of genres and origins in resolution 96/24 and 192/24. Sennheiser HD 650 classics are used as headphones. The machine works with the top Burr-Brown DSD and DXD DAC in a special configuration that lets you use and mix up to eight different signals, which in practice means four pairs of signals per channel. Wow! The FPGA (Integrated Circuit for Post-Production Configuration) provides excellent digital remastering. Four-element 64-element transducers feature 256 element per channel. I was hoping for the noble sculpture of the sound sculpture. The outstanding performance relied on an unprecedented frequency range with heavier heights than the toad of a toddler, a medium filled with informative aliquots and basses tighter than the Cumbulka Doñana. I have also tried to connect with my active Dynaudio DBM50 studio monitors. Their sound I have in my ear deeper than punker piercing. My EMU 1820m sounds are also 192/24, but here I thought fine texture even more precise - it's just a machine of a new generation and you will not make progress. Then I picked up some high-definition DVD-A discs and compared the work of the modified converter on the Panasonic RA 71 to the way the things the test machine is. The difference is obvious. Again stems from the finer miniature, smoother heights, more opulent space and vibrant dynamics. I used the ability to listen to music from an external HD (through the optics) through the headphones and Stark Jane speakers. Christmas came in early May.

 

iFi PRO iDSD

I'm a pacifist, but I would kill for this connection (mosquitoes). Wi-Fi network streaming of the most essential services is also cool. MQA decoding (Master Quality Authenti- cated) approximates the sound of the air to the contact with the cable or optical fiber. Supporting many relevant protocols, including Airplay, along with the already mentioned fixed memory and SD card, gives you so many options that you can be put to death while not having one and the same title for years. If there is a flicker (for any reason) frosted or unstable, there are digital filters, sampling or jitter reduction thanks to accurate clocks, so you can adjust any starter in a desirable form. Voila!

 

Conclusion - For two-and-a-half thousand euros, there's an incredibly burgeoning knot of technology with which you're in the sound jungle better than Rambo. Nothing will surprise you, the possibilities are practically unrestricted and open to the future. Above all, however, the sound quality will get you (just like me). This apparatus is immensely musical, accurate, does not stain, does not disappoint the body, and if some body painting is needed, then it is ready to allow your hearing the acoustic adaptation you want. The soundtrack makes the iFi Pro iDSD champion almost without competition!

 

Pros

+ universal, timeless component

+ great sound

+ does not have a major competitor

 

Cons

- I just guess the price, which despite all of them

the benefits are not for everyone.

 

[AMR/iFi audio]

Folks...

 

CanJam London 2018!

 

 

...and two of our staff - Sarah and Hannah - will be there! The girls will be located with iFi audio hardware at the Electromod's booth! Please do visit the place, the iFi ladies don't bite!

 

And to all able to visit the event, enjoy!

[AMR/iFi audio]

On 7/27/2018 at 8:28 PM, austinpop said:

 

I did say hello to the iFi ladies at the Electromod booth!

 

Two related questions for you. When you connect a 10 MHz reference clock like the Mutec Ref-10 to the BNC input, is the correct setting to turn the Sync Mode dial to the "square wave" icon, the setting between Standalone and DARS?

 

 

And if so, how do you tell whether the unit is now using the external clock? Is there anything on the front panel display that shows that?

 

Hi,

 

Our policy is to not comment other manufacturers' products, therefore it's up to a user to know what type of a separate clock device he has. The Pro iDSD has several adjustments:

 

The standalone setting is appropriate for any use where the iDSD Pro does not require any external synchronisation to a house clock. Most commercial clocks of lesser quality (regardless of cost) will produce worse results than the internal oscillator of the iDSD Pro.

 

The atomic clock setting enables the input only and is appropriate if a suitably high grade external clock is used. We wrote in the past that our recommendation is Stanford Research System PERF-10 or better, where 'better' means objectively even lower phase-noise.

 

The DARS setting is suitable for studio synchronisation use. Please see the AES Standard - AES11-2003.

 

The 10MHz setting aka. the squarewave icon is intended to be used for example with multiple iDSD Pro machines set up for multi-channel operation. This mode enables both 10MHz input and 10MHz output.

 

It is acceptable not to provide a 10MHz on the input in this mode and instead to apply a BNC terminator and only use to 10MHz output to synchronise other devices with 10MHz clock inputs.

 

So if a 10MHz clock of suitable quality (> SRS PERF-10) is used in a system with only one iDSD Pro, the atomic clock setting is correct, even if the clock used is not an 'atomic clock', but a standard 10MHz one.

 

Clock Sync is handled transparently without any particular details displayed, only if there is a clock error will there be an error message.

[AMR/iFi audio]

5 minutes ago, applesnowleo said:

Solid state is impressive in the iDSD Pro.

 

We can agree with that ?

[AMR/iFi audio]

@applesnowleo Great piece, thank you!

 

1 hour ago, gordec said:

Anyone using the Pro iDSD with an USB conditioner? The iDSD is already galvanic isolated, so I wonder how much would it improve with something like an Iso Regen.

 

Pro iDSD has not only galvanic isolation inside, but tech found in our iUSB3.0 as well and is in general quite immune to USB products. 

 

But if a laptop connected to Pro iDSD can be improved, our machine will benefit from this too. 

[AMR/iFi audio]

3 hours ago, gordec said:

So you guys think, adding an Iso Regen with LPS may not make that big of a difference given already excellent USB implementation? Micro iUSB 3.0 is basically built into Pro iDSD which is similar to the IR based on my understanding.

 

The iUSB3.0 circuitry part is correct. Our proprietary tech we implement wherever we can and Pro iDSD is no exception. This machine is quite immune to USB additionals, though if you can improve quality of what's sent from your PC/laptop/etc., our latest DAC will benefit from this too.

 

Oh, one more thing, our new site is up!

 

http://ifi-audio.com

[AMR/iFi audio]

8 minutes ago, applesnowleo said:

 

I have already seen it, I almost visit it daily, I did not find where to download the firmwares in an easy way, but is a welcome and beautiful redesign.

 

All available FW are to be found here:

 

https://ifi-audio.com/downloads/

[AMR/iFi audio]

Just now, applesnowleo said:

 

Thanks, and congratulations for your new look.

 

And we thank you right back! 

 

Cheers!

[AMR/iFi audio]

On 8/8/2018 at 6:55 AM, gordec said:

I'm still confused as if the tubes act only on the amp circuit or also on the DAC only mode. 

 

Tubes work with both headphone circuitry and analog stage. It's essentially the same thing as inside Pro iDSD there's no typical headphone amplifier. We actually use our line driver to handle headphones.

[AMR/iFi audio]

21 hours ago, gordec said:

 

I had the BL, pro ican HD800s all at one point. I can tell you with confidence that Pro iDSD may be the only thing you need if you are keeping HD800 and Elear. Pro iDSD is too weak to drive Susvaras, but for the HD800 you should be just fine. From the DAC standpoint, the Pro iDSD is just so much better than the BL. They are not in the same stratosphere. No real reason to compare the 2. You may be inclined to sell everything in your chain because Pro iDSD is a better DAC, good enough amp, and has micro iUSB3.0 built in.

 

It is our TOTL product after all. We took a lot of effort and time (years!) to make it what it currently is.

[AMR/iFi audio]

Folks, awesome news!

 

EISA (the European Sound and Imaging Association) has awarded the xDSD as the Best Portable DAC/Headphone Amplifier for 2018-2019.

 

The official release is to be found here:

 

 

 HAPPY!

[AMR/iFi audio]

50 minutes ago, applesnowleo said:

I received my Babies today, will have to get a listen to them with some time next week.

 

 

 

Please do write a word or two once you have your fun!

[AMR/iFi audio]

On 8/17/2018 at 4:31 AM, Em2016 said:

1. My current DAC needs an iFi Groundhog for grounding it's PSU (the Groundhog solves a buzzing issue). 

 

With the Pro iDSD a Groundhog will NOT be required right, because you have said the included iPower's DC plug -ve is continuous with it's AC inlet earth?

 

Pro iDSD arrives with a 3-pin PSU, so no Groundhog is required.

 

On 8/17/2018 at 4:31 AM, Em2016 said:

4. I tried the stack (Pro iDSD + Pro iCAN) and really liked it. Except one thing - the iCAN was LOUD at 9 o'clock on the volume knob on 0dB gain, using RCA interconnects. The Pro iDSD ALONE was absolutely fine with usable range over 10 o'clock on 0dB gain. I forgot to try and adjust the Pro iDSD's RCA outputs using variable output. It may have been on fixed HiFi or even fixed Pro levels - I didn't check.

 

Just to double check, the VARIABLE mode applies to both balanced and RCA outputs right? With HiFi Variable selected, what is the output voltage at 12 o'clock?

 

Pro iDSD should have its outputs set to HiFi fixed if it's going to be used as a DAC only. The idea is to bypass its volume control if there's either Pro iCAN or any other headphone amp. There's no need to have two vol. controls along the road after all. All preamplifier modes apply to all analog outputs of Pro iDSD btw. 

 

The operable range should be somewhere in the 9 - 14 o'clock range. If the signal is very loud as early as 9 o'clock, it's for the best to double-check your settings. 

 

Also, you can shoot us a message here if there are any issues: http://support.ifi-audio.com

 

On 8/17/2018 at 4:31 AM, Em2016 said:

And the rear XLR and RCA outputs are ALWAYS in Class A mode right?

 

It's not outputs running in Class A but circuitry inside of our Pro range products. And yes, it's Class A alright.

 

Remaining questions we'll address later on, once our R&D team chas a second to provide more insight.

[AMR/iFi audio]

Double, sorry.