bk12 Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 Need a little help with getting rolling with Acourate. I looked through a bunch of info, but am a bit confused on setting up the microphone for optimal measurement. I have a CAPS Zuma with onboard USB audio card, which feeds an Antelope Zodiac DAC via USB, which then feeds my amplifiers. I just picked up an Isemcon MP-1r microphone/preamp kit to take measurements with. In the system diagrams I found, I see that the microphone is supposed to feed an ADC/DAC card, with the PC file also feeding in. Can someone help me figure out how to optimally hook everything up to take measurements in my system? I am thinking I put the mic into the motherboard mic input on backplate, but not sure where to take the output from to keep everything in-sync. I understand that you can use a USB mic and make adjustments for having the signal routed through "the system", but would like to avoid doing anything less than optimal for this measurement phase. Any suggestions/tips would be appreciated. Thanks! Link to comment
Knuck Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 Need a little help with getting rolling with Acourate. I looked through a bunch of info, but am a bit confused on setting up the microphone for optimal measurement. I have a CAPS Zuma with onboard USB audio card, which feeds an Antelope Zodiac DAC via USB, which then feeds my amplifiers. I just picked up an Isemcon MP-1r microphone/preamp kit to take measurements with. In the system diagrams I found, I see that the microphone is supposed to feed an ADC/DAC card, with the PC file also feeding in. Can someone help me figure out how to optimally hook everything up to take measurements in my system? I am thinking I put the mic into the motherboard mic input on backplate, but not sure where to take the output from to keep everything in-sync. I understand that you can use a USB mic and make adjustments for having the signal routed through "the system", but would like to avoid doing anything less than optimal for this measurement phase. Any suggestions/tips would be appreciated. Thanks! I suggest you contact Uli at Acourate. He is very helpful. Link to comment
dallasjustice Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 What ADC are you trying to use? THINK OUTSIDE THE BOX Link to comment
bk12 Posted March 21, 2015 Author Share Posted March 21, 2015 What ADC are you trying to use? I guess I would say I don't have one...which is source of confusion. My mic has a preamp with an analog out, not sure if that helps. My Antelope Zodiac DAC has an ADC built in, but I am really trying to figure out exactly how I am to be playing source tones through my signal chain will simultaneously bringing the analog mic input through the same box..... I was thinking of using the PC MOBO analog mic in, and going with that...but I am not sure where to feed the source of signal tones through then. Bascially confused about this entire aspect (ADC box tied into feedback/source loop). Link to comment
dallasjustice Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 Your zodiac does not have an ADC. You need an ADC, preferably one which can be synchronous with the DAC with which you measure. I guess I would say I don't have one...which is source of confusion. My mic has a preamp with an analog out, not sure if that helps. My Antelope Zodiac DAC has an ADC built in, but I am really trying to figure out exactly how I am to be playing source tones through my signal chain will simultaneously bringing the analog mic input through the same box..... I was thinking of using the PC MOBO analog mic in, and going with that...but I am not sure where to feed the source of signal tones through then. Bascially confused about this entire aspect (ADC box tied into feedback/source loop). THINK OUTSIDE THE BOX Link to comment
bk12 Posted March 21, 2015 Author Share Posted March 21, 2015 Hi Michael, Thanks for weighing in on this, talks with you on another forum and your posts there got me decding to jump into a PC system and Acourate. I guess my Zodiac has analog inputs, but to your point, they may not be converting to digital, I have never used them and info from Antelope generally has no detail. Do you have some recommended ADC sync setups you would recommend? I believe you are using the Lynx? I am not sure how the synchronous mic and source tones feeding through really work together...I guess I am fundamentally missing the basic understanding of this series of in/outs. Link to comment
dallasjustice Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 If you are wanting to only use 2CH, I would suggest you find an ADC with a low latency ASIO driver and can send out a synchronous spdif signal to your Zodiac's spdif input. This way you can use the zodiac synchronously with the ADC for your sweeps. 1. TASCAM US-366. (Cheap but very good) 2. Sound Devices USB pre2. (Very versatile and higher performance.) You wouldn't need a seperate mic pre with either of these. Hi Michael, Thanks for weighing in on this, talks with you on another forum and your posts there got me decding to jump into a PC system and Acourate. I guess my Zodiac has analog inputs, but to your point, they may not be converting to digital, I have never used them and info from Antelope generally has no detail. Do you have some recommended ADC sync setups you would recommend? I believe you are using the Lynx? I am not sure how the synchronous mic and source tones feeding through really work together...I guess I am fundamentally missing the basic understanding of this series of in/outs. THINK OUTSIDE THE BOX Link to comment
bk12 Posted March 21, 2015 Author Share Posted March 21, 2015 If you are wanting to only use 2CH, I would suggest you find an ADC with a low latency ASIO driver and can send out a synchronous spdif signal to your Zodiac's spdif input. This way you can use the zodiac synchronously with the ADC for your sweeps. 1. TASCAM US-366. (Cheap but very good) 2. Sound Devices USB pre2. (Very versatile and higher performance.) You wouldn't need a seperate mic pre with either of these. Ok, I think I am getting closer. The TASCAM looks like it may be for me. So if I understand correctly, I will bring the mic into one of the XLR inputs, and then feed my PC output into another input? I plan on using a USB card for the system output, which I don't see a way to feed into the Tascam. In this case, would I take either the toslink optical out from my MOBO and feed that into the TASCAM for the PC based signal? The finally, feed the USB out from the Tascam into the Zodiac? Link to comment
bk12 Posted March 21, 2015 Author Share Posted March 21, 2015 Actually, as I read my own last response, I realize I am embarrassingly confused. A simpler way to ask the question....if you would be willing-can you tell me how I should configure the ins/outs assuming I am using my MP-1r kit mic/preamp (preamp needed for calibration), a TASCAM 366, my Zuma PC server with USB output card and my Zodiac dac? Link to comment
dallasjustice Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 The TASCAM's ASIO via USB would be controlling everything in your setup. Make sure you connect the TASCAM's spdif out to the zodiac spdif input. You need to select the output and input in the log sweep recorder. You select TASCAM spdif for out and TASCAM input for your mic input. Make sure the TASCAM's spdif is connected to zodiac. You are good with this setup. it really helps to use a quality calibrated mic too. I use an earthworks. There are many others which are excellent too. Ok, I think I am getting closer. The TASCAM looks like it may be for me. So if I understand correctly, I will bring the mic into one of the XLR inputs, and then feed my PC output into another input? I plan on using a USB card for the system output, which I don't see a way to feed into the Tascam. In this case, would I take either the toslink optical out from my MOBO and feed that into the TASCAM for the PC based signal? The finally, feed the USB out from the Tascam into the Zodiac? THINK OUTSIDE THE BOX Link to comment
bk12 Posted March 21, 2015 Author Share Posted March 21, 2015 Thanks! Once I generate the filters in Acourate, can I remove the TASCAM from my system and just go back to USB out from PC direct to Zodiac without messing up the Acourate magic? Link to comment
dallasjustice Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 Thanks! Once I generate the filters in Acourate, can I remove the TASCAM from my system and just go back to USB out from PC direct to Zodiac without messing up the Acourate magic? Yes THINK OUTSIDE THE BOX Link to comment
bk12 Posted March 21, 2015 Author Share Posted March 21, 2015 Thank you so much Michael!! Really appreciate it. Link to comment
satbox Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 If you are wanting to only use 2CH, I would suggest you find an ADC with a low latency ASIO driver and can send out a synchronous spdif signal to your Zodiac's spdif input. This way you can use the zodiac synchronously with the ADC for your sweeps. 1. TASCAM US-366. (Cheap but very good) 2. Sound Devices USB pre2. (Very versatile and higher performance.) You wouldn't need a seperate mic pre with either of these. Hello, I want to try Acourate and my config is the following: CAPS V3 Carbon-->Ayre QB-9-->Integrated Amp.-->Loudspeakers (2.0) The QB-9 is an USB only DAC (asynchronous USB). So, if I understand, I have to use a device like the TASCAM US-366 or the Sound Devices USB pre2 but with an USB out. Do you know a device like that? Link to comment
dallasjustice Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 Since the qb9 only has a usb input, your options are limited in this context. You wouldn't be able to use the qb9 to take synchronous measurements. You would need another ADC/DAC to do the job. Either of the units I previously mentioned can do that. It's not necessary that you measure with the the normal playback device. Hello,I want to try Acourate and my config is the following: CAPS V3 Carbon-->Ayre QB-9-->Integrated Amp.-->Loudspeakers (2.0) The QB-9 is an USB only DAC (asynchronous USB). So, if I understand, I have to use a device like the TASCAM US-366 or the Sound Devices USB pre2 but with an USB out. Do you know a device like that? THINK OUTSIDE THE BOX Link to comment
satbox Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 Since the qb9 only has a usb input, your options are limited in this context. You wouldn't be able to use the qb9 to take synchronous measurements. You would need another ADC/DAC to do the job. Either of the units I previously mentioned can do that. It's not necessary that you measure with the the normal playback device. Crystal clear, thank you for your help! Link to comment
kjbii Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 My chain of understanding of Acourate is clearly missing a few links, and it will be helpful to reduce the basic calibration and playback setup options to the simplest possible 2-channel system, with passive crossovers in the speakers. In this system the Klipschorn bass driver has a delay of about 13 ms compared with the mid-range driver. This is my primary reason for considering Acourate. As I understand from the discussion above, the Tascam USB-66 has a microphone preamp, and connects by USB to a PC, and to the DAC by SPDIF. Acourate generates test tones/sweeps that are sent to the speakers, and the speaker output is sent back to Acourate through the microphone. Acourate then generates FIR filters that are used by JRMedia for convolution that corrects the output. Once the Acourate filters are installed in JRM, the Tascam can be removed from the system - it is used in the calibration step only. Will this calibration time-align the output that is sent through the DAC to the speakers? This may be the same question that you asked earlier, "Would I be able to set a partial (low frequency) target curve along with the crossover/delay in acourate?" (6/22/13). I didn't find an answer to your question, but understand that Acourate can provide "time domain" correction. Uli's 2006 "Thoughts about crossovers" seems to contemplate this correction. files.computeraudiophile.com/2013/1202/XOWhitePaper.pdf Any comment or advice you have would be most helpful, since you seem to have started with the same questions and goals. Ken Yes Link to comment
Keith_W Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 Will this calibration time-align the output that is sent through the DAC to the speakers? No, it won't. If you want to time align your drivers, you will need individual control of each driver. This means, each driver needs its own channel of DAC and amplification. Link to comment
kjbii Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 Thanks again, Keith, for your instant response. Considering the complexity of Acourate, I will start with the simple 2-channel system described above, using speakers that do not have a time alignment problem. I'm at the beginning of a long learning curve, and am happy to benefit from your experience. If you started with a Marchand, you have been there before me. No, it won't. If you want to time align your drivers, you will need individual control of each driver. This means, each driver needs its own channel of DAC and amplification. Link to comment
kilroy Posted December 7, 2016 Share Posted December 7, 2016 Some info on mics and soundcards for Acourate in this post. http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f23-dsp-room-correction-and-multi-channel-audio/microphone-acourate-29778/ Link to comment
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