Rhino Records Downloads

No physical media, no booklet, no notes, no extras...for $4.00 <i>more</i> than buying the corresponding CD version from the site. Thanks, but no thanks.<br />

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This could be "exhibit A" of the music industry Not Getting It.<br />

They’re really heading in the right direction though. If they can work out the bugs, then this will be a great service. I went ahead and downloaded some "nuggets" from days-gone-by (Commander Cody & His Lost Planet Airmen, Henry Paul - Grey Ghost, some early Seals & Crofts and even Purple Rain). I can't say that these sounded that great (to me, they actually sounded compressed - even though I downloaded the "high def" versions in Flack). It very well could be that the "compressed" sound I thought I heard is due to the actual recordings rather than being a result of the file formats – although I have ripped many CDs from that era and genre that sound so much better. All in all, it's nice to be able to go to a website and instantly download some old favorite’s right from the comfort of your home. Once they start to include true high def files and tune up their website (i.e.: fix their download manager, and work on getting the meta data right) then they will truly have something special.

I hope this post continues with current updates. I would like to know more about the files that are being sold as 16/44 lossless. Has anyone yet determined that these files are anything other than 16/44? The description of said files in one of the aforementioned posts as being "thin" is exactly how I would describe what I am hearing in the (few) files that I have downloaded. Has anyone compared any of these lossless downloads with any other lossy files??

Chris - did I miss something or is their 'hidef' file just lossless Redbook (16/44.1)? Seems kind of foolish to pony up $1.50 per track when you can jut buy the CD for $10 and rip it yourself?<br />

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Thanks for clarifying<br />

bernard

Hi breagan - The HiDef files are 16/44.1. Your comments about price are not apples to apples.<br />

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It's $1.49 per track, but the complete album is cheaper than the sum of all tracks. For example the Emmylou Harris Wrecking Ball album in FLAC is $14.99 for twelve tracks. The Amazon price for the album is $10.99 with the cheapest shipping cost of $2.98 for a total of $13.97. The Rhino download here is $1.02 more expensive in quantitative terms. But factor in the drive to the store (time and transportation expense) v. getting it immediately, and not having to rip the CD thus saving a small bit of time, and I willing to go for the download every time.<br />

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That's just me of course. Thanks for your post breagan. I'm sure many more readers are thinking the same thing as you but they just don't post it :~)

I still have not received a call back on some tracks not received due to a File Not Found error. I've called their help desk twice. Both times the rep could not correct my problem, would not credit my purchase and said I'd receive a call back after speaking with management. No calls, no follow up. Pricing issues, download issues, bad service: who needs it.

I left a voicemail at Rhino two weeks ago and no call back yet either. Time for more calls to different people.

How about we all give them a call to voice out concerns and encourage them to improve things a bit. I'd love to help Rhino improve things so I can download much more content. Here is the regular Customer Service number with regular business hours (888) 440-4232. Maybe we can get through :~)

It's a sham(e) they do that. And Chris, since when do you have to drive somewhere to get Amazon deliveries? <br />

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Rhino needs to step it up; the " you never get a second chance to make a first impression" adage is so relevant in retail, especially in this getting-competitive techy niche (downloads). I guess, though, it;s not yet competitive enough.

<i>"And Chris, since when do you have to drive somewhere to get Amazon deliveries? :)"</i><br />

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I love it! I was totally multi-tasking and side tracked thus the major screw-up :~)

I really don't think the slight additional cost for the 16/44 downloads has anything to do with the other more relevant issues at hand. If you're not willing to pony up for the additional cost to get immediate access to new music, then you can always order through Amazon and wait four days....The whole point of downloading is the convenience - the immediacy of the transaction. You’d have to pay a substantial increase to have Amazon overnight your order and even then, you’d still have to wait a day. I'm surprised the downloads don’t cost more…

more, but of questionable ripping quality, without any metadata (a FLAC benefit, typically) and use a troublesome download manager?? Hardly worth the convenience. And this coming from someone who has 1.5+TB of FLAC, etc . I'm not against it, but I'm beginning to think that many in the industry don't understand what the FLAC-savvy customer is used to. Some get it (Linn, Naim, HDTracks) but charge a premium too.

I started the questions about the quality of the flac files, but haven't followed up with any rigorous testing - not that I'm really capable of doing it anyway.<br />

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I can tell you this: the Ellington set sounds much better than the MJQ set, which is what made me question the quality of what I was hearing in the first place.<br />

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I <em>still</em> think there's something amiss, or at least there was in the case of the MJQ download and what Chris reported on a test track shortly thereafter. But based on the Ellington, I'm wondering if we're gonna find out the downloads aren't all bad, or all good, but spotty, which would be terrible news.<br />

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Scott A.

Exactly....those are the "more relevant issues at hand" that I was referring too. These are the issues that need to be resolved.

In most cases (at least for commercial muzak like these), I buy used CD's from Amazon for $5-$9. Arrives within a day or two (if you pick the shipping from a seller in your state), do your own ripping/format and keep the physical disc. Cheaper and longer lasting than a 16/44 d/load. Exceptions are 24/96 (or higher) or hard to find material.

I recently downloaded 'His Band and the Street Choir' by Van Morrison. Two tracks are less than 10 seconds long. After being on hold for over 30 minutes, a very friendly Indian gentleman answered. He put me on hold two times (making the call over an hour long) then told me I'd receive a call from Rhino customer service. This has yet to happen. I clicked 'email customer service' on the confirmation email only to have it returned as undeliverable. Rhino's supplied email address lacks a correct suffix - .co as opposed to .com After correcting their mistake I still have not received a response. I'm getting the distinct impression that Rhino will not help out after they have received payment - which showed up on my credit card within hours of the partial download. This is a great disappointment - I've got stacks of Rhino CDs and have always been impressed with the quality of the sound.<br />

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So - buyers beware. If you encounter any problems with your download you'll be out of luck. And money.

Quote: Kevin O'Toole...<br />

So - buyers beware. If you encounter any problems with your download you'll be out of luck. And money.<br />

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My experience with Rhino is similar to Kevin's except that I gt my money back. I tried to download 2 Alen Toussaint albums and only got 1 album and 4 songs from the 2nd album. "File not found" was the error message I received. I also tried to email Rhino and my email bounced too. But I called and got hold of 'John' an Indian sounding accented man. He said he would have to talk to upper management and like Kevin they would contact me later. I was contacted on Monday after the Saturday that this happened and my credit card was charged back from Rhino for the full amount that both albums would have cost me. They really need to do some serious upgrading to their system or hire a consultant that knows something about online buyers, online websites, online sales, etc. They look bad coming out of the chute. Hope they get better.<br />

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Chuck

With all the above issues I don't know why anyone would buy anything from them. Incorrect advertising, poor quality tracks, poor customer service, expensive, download problems, incorrect tagging, etc etc. Especially when you can buy a CD, have the artwork etc and a hard copy for much less.

Hi Dan - Sadly I agree with you. After numerous attempts to contact Rhino at all different levels and offering to help any way I can I've received no acknowledgment of from anyone there. I will update the main article, as soon as I have a moment, to warn potential customers.

For what it's worth, I haven't had any problems with the downloads that I've purchased from the site. However, I do the downloads manually since the site's download manager seems to have glitches. My biggest concern was having to provide my credit card number rather than utilize a secure protocol - such as PayPal. <br />

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I still think the site has some real potential. It's a shame that no one at Rhino seems to care....This however, can't be the case. Somewhere within that organization, there must be a person who is concerned about consumer relations, public relations, marketing, etc. That person(s) would likely be very upset to discover that others within the organization are thumbing their noses at the company’s image and reputation by neglecting their responsibilities. <br />

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I might suggest that the “right” person has not been made aware of the situation. Those on the receiving end of Rhino’s posted email and telephone contact numbers are a proverbial conduit to the management that is concerned with image and negative PR. Sounds like someone is acting as the gatekeeper of the conduit. Perhaps they should be fired….Try contacting upper management.<br />

It's not scientific - and I don't know what I'm doing - but FWIW I purchased a copy of Ellington's 1960s Reprise Recordings box set expressly for the purpose of comparing them to the flac files I downloaded.<br />

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(Thus turning, btw, my 'savings' buying the flac files to a net loss of...oh, never mind.)<br />

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Anyway, I'm going to carefully compare an extended portion of the flacs with the cds, and will let y'all know which sounds better on my modest little system.<br />

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Best,<br />

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Scott A.

http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/private/snapshot.asp?privcapId=20939997<br />

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The above link is a short list of Rhino's corporate executives.... Perhaps Rhino's Mark Pinkus (Strategic Marketing) might be interested in this matter....

(Thus turning, btw, my 'savings' buying the flac files to a net loss of...oh, never mind.)<br />

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LOL!!!! I love it.<br />

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Olive<br />

I don't know about it being a remaster but I downloaded a FLAC version of a song that clearly would be stereo and it was mono. I had purchased the CD with the song on it at a J&R in Macy's and it was mono so I was hoping that the FLAC would be from other sources and thus stereo. Looks like they must use the same production files for the online service that they use for the CD's. Maybe they're CD rips for all I know.<br />

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Ironically I was able to buy that same song as a 256kb/sec MP3 at Amazon and it was stereo.

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