Uptone Audio Regen

[Superdad]

Never tried Tube rolling in Digital?

 

Sure, like Nixie tube rolling?

[Superdad]

Is regen available?

If yes where can I buy one?

 

Hi George, check your PM.

 

Just a reminder: Anyone that wishes to receive availability info (just a couple more weeks) and be notified of the ordering web site, needs to send me a PM with your private e-mail address. Don't worry, I guard that list and won't share your e-mail with anyone. It is just that it is neither easy nor appropriate for me to use the CA messaging system for commercial announcements.

 

If you have ever ordered anything from me, had any e-mail correspondence with me, or received any of my 2014 e-mail "newsletters", then you are already on the e-mail list to receive information about ordering the USB REGEN.

 

By the way, first article samples of the finished REGEN boards arrive for testing tomorrow! Won't have the milled/printed little cases for the boards until about April 7th. So still on track to begin shipments mid-April.

 

Thanks everyone!

--Alex C.

[Superdad]

Bonjour Francois-Paul:

 

I don't mind if you want to order more than one. The first run is 100 units and I have now idea how quickly they will go (maybe pretty fast based on the informal e-mail list of those who expressed interest to obtain notice of ordering). What I will do for you--and anyone else that wants more than REGEN--once we open up ordering if the first 100 get spoken for right away, is to offer free shipping on the second unit if we have to back-order you until the second run.

 

I'm honestly a little puzzled--but pleased nonetheless--at all this breathless anticipation for this device which nobody except John Swenson and I have heard. It is exciting (and I personally believe it will delight people), but all the attention makes me nervous.

 

 

Hello Alex,

will it be possible to order two?

or are you limited with quantities for this first round?

 

Pol

[Superdad]

As a Mini FW to Mytek user, wonder if FW (faster at moving data than USB) is a victim of packet and PS noise?

 

Realize that not many consumer DACs offer FW...heck Apple has ditched the format, but I guess Thunderbolt is compatible.

 

Well I would imagine that Firewire might benefit from some form of signal conditioning or reclocking to improve integrity, or from some filtering, but I have never seen that attempted, and I wonder if the market is large enough to justify the development. But I'll keep it in mind and chat with John about it sometime. Firewire chipsets and the protocol are quite different from USB, so it will be interesting to investigate what can be done.

[Superdad]

Hi Alex, I've a wonderful ( and unused ) homemade LPS built with Belleson regulator in it ...

What's the expected current requirement of the REGEN when feed by DC 12V ?

Belleson is rated at 2A maximum, I hope to have enough horsepower to run it.

 

Hi Massimiliano:

 

The REGEN has two ultra-low noise regulators (the wonderful TI TPS7A4700), one for 3.3V for the USB hub chip, and one for 5V for forwarding clean VBUS to the DAC for those that require it.

 

As you know we will be including a 7.5V/2.93A/22W SMPS that I selected as best "sounding" for the price. The REGEN could actually take as much as 20VDC but we advise against that. Even 12V is high for our goals. Please refer to this post where I explain the range and heat dissipation issues: http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-music-servers/uptone-audio-regen-22803/index6.html#post401661

 

So if you chose to use a 7V supply with the REGEN and an entirely bus-powered DAC (500mA max., just as you say), that's a 2V drop to 5V for the USBVBUS, so 1w of heat to dissipate which is no problem at all. We are trying to keep the regulator for the 5VBUS from having to dissipate much more than 2.5W since it does not have a heatsink and is in a sealed enclosure.

 

On the other hand, if you have a bus-powered DAC drawing the full 0.5A allowed by the USB spec and you use a 12V PS, then the drop to get to 5V is 7V; 7V*0.5A=3.5 watts--perhaps a bit more than I would feel comfortable with. Probably okay, but I'd rather go to 9V or below.

 

If you don't need any bus power at all--or for sure only just for initial handshake--then you really don't have to worry. I think our USB hub chip draws less than 50mA at 3.3V, so it would be pretty hard to overheat that second regulator. (even 15V dropped to 3.3V will, at 50mA be only about 0.6w)

 

As you can see, current capability for the REGEN's PS is really not the issue. The only reason I chose such a high wattage PS to include is that I found that size to be the sweet spot quality and output capacitance for current delivery--bass was better than on the little cheap ones, and MUCH better, and with clearer highs than on any of the available inexpensive linears (only wall warts; all the factory tabletop linears are unregulated units). Go figure…

[Superdad]

Interesting explanation.

In the presence of a galvanically isolated USB interface like JLSound where clocks are on the isolated side and there are two separate ps (one for xmos chip and one for oscillators), can that "fair amount of noise on the supply planes" still be relevant? If yes, how?

The two separate PS share ground.

If we measure noise on both PS, what kind of measured value should we aim for in order to leave DAC unaffected?

 

Hi Gianluca:

 

I am sure John will chime in with a proper technical explanation, but allow me to point out a few things--

a) The purpose of the REGEN is create a USB signal with better signal integrity and impedance than what is at the end of your USB cable from your computer or streamer;

b) Galvanic isolator chips (some of which are much better than others--all of which generate their own jitter and should be reclocked afterwards), as used on many USB>I2S boards and in the last couple of years in decent DACs, all come AFTER both the USB PHY and the USB processor;

c) The "packet noise", "logic induced modulation", whatever you want to call it--is still happening on the USB input board, and despite the presence of isolator chips, the extra voltage spikes, activity, and noise generated will still have an effect on the sound. That's because those galvanic isolators are good at galvanic isolation, but the signal itself gets embedded with tiny stuff (John will have to expound and correct here). Also, I seem to recall that the isolators are good at some frequencies and not others.

 

In addition, to use the JLSounds board as an example (I have one myself, uninstalled as of yet), they have the audio clocks on the board, and as you say, some sharing of PS planes may occur. (And if one does the better thing and feeds a better DAC master clock back into the board, it appears that he ran out of isolator channels and the clock would not go through the isolators. He also chose to use the RF transmitter/receiver type of isolator. Not only do those Silicon Labs isolators have about 3.5 times the jitter of the ones John likes, but there may be some RFI emitted.)

 

As a separate example, John when to great lengths in the design of the USB input of the recently releases BottleHead DAC to insure isolation, immunity, etc. He used all the right tricks with regards to PHY, processor, multiple isolated regulators, clocking, and the best galvanic isolators and reclock flops--all placed and ordered for optimal results.

And guess what? USB cables, computer stuff, and the REGEN all still make a difference!

 

So sorry, when Chord just announced that its newest two DACs--the about-to-ship 2Qute and Hugo TT--have galvanic isolators in their USB input path that make choice of USB cables and power supplies irrelevant, forgive me if I don't act surprised if users discover otherwise.

[Superdad]

Hm would this be another potential power source for the Regen?

 

Accessory – iPower

 

Hey, I love the idea of an SMPS wall-wart designed to perform better. Would be fine with the REGEN if you set it for 9V. The regulators we use are quite exceptional, so it remains to be seen if a difference will be heard just due to lower SMPS ripple. We should not get wildly excited about their 1uV noise spec though--they are honest and show in a footnote that is an average measured in the audio band. That's not the range where SMPS are noisy.

 

Rich B.: please find out the price for this from iFi. I am hoping they will retail for about $30 +/-.

 

Cheers,

ALEX C.

[Superdad]

So for those of us with. JS-2 that do not need bus power what voltage is really recommended?

 

Jason: Anything from 6-12V is fine. If you use your new JS-2 (shipping to you ahead of schedule BTW; my ex-areospace assembly lady I hired is a fast learner!), then set one of its outputs to 7V. Higher voltages are a waste as it just gets dropped to 5V and 3.3V and wasted as heat (though there are often good things to be said for having warm devices; John thinks people like the effect of putting putty on clock oscillators because it gets them a bit warmer--not because of the vibration damping effect it may or may not have).

[Superdad]

Alex... will the second cable that came with my JS-2 fit the Regen?

 

oh... and don't waste your time sending me a "news" email: just send me straight away a PP invoice

 

Francois-Paul: Both of the cables you got were my custom, large gauge, Oyaide/Belden pieces with 5.5mm x 2.5mm plugs at both ends. The REGEN's jack is a 5.5mm x 2.1mm, but plugs with 2.5mm holes generally work fine with 2.1mm jacks (0.4mm is not a very big difference). I do also stock the nice Oyaide plugs in the 2.1mm size, or you can get a 2.5mm>2.1mm adaptor plug (Bix Power sells a lot of such items: C Series Connectors , but I am sure you can find a source closer to France.)

 

The reason everyone will be getting an e-mail is not for the news, but for the web ordering page. I am really trying to avoid doing REGEN orders via individual e-mail--too time consuming and I am already buried in e-mail!

[Superdad]

Woo-hoo!! Five first article production samples just in from our USA board house! Below is a pic. The fifth one is playing in my system and sounds dynamite--slightly better than the prototypes, probably because the 4-layer board stack up of the production matches what John did the impedance matching too (versus his proto-board house's layer stack).

 

Cranking the SHM-SACD of the Pentagle's first album, al long time favorite. Oh this sounds sooo good.. Oh shoot--I have to call the board house to approve them running the rest.

 

Ciao,

--Alex C.

 

[Superdad]

No $hit!

 

Chill guys. The rest ship Tuesday but the cases don't ship from Japan until April 3rd. I have plenty to prepare before then.

 

Very happy to report that my first assembler hire (she did assembly for a small local aerospace contractor for 14 years) has been super easy to train on JS-2 assembly this week. Even better is that our musical tastes in the shop are reasonably compatible (I'll stretch her range over time).

[Superdad]

Someone here asked to see a pic of the REGEN powering a GeekOut DAC/headphone amp. As promised, I borrowed my daughter's GO450 and took a pic. Was a good test since the Geek Out draws a claimed 350mW continuos (I suspect maybe a bit closer to the 500mA USB spec max.) from the VBUS, so the regulator got nice and warm (this with the 7.5V PS that will ship with the REGEN). But John used proper practices and put 9 thermal vias under the chip, so all was good.

Still, as explained before, I would not recommend using a 12V supply when powering a current hungry device like a headphone amp.

 

[Superdad]

Hi Gang:

Spent all day working on the web site. Will take it live in a couple of days and will start accepting REGEN orders (the site will take orders for the other products too ).

 

Just a reminder, I HAVE NOT BEEN KEEPING TRACK of who has said they want one from the first hundred. THERE IS NO LIST YET! The only list is a mailing list. That is how everyone will get the announcement of the ordering site simultaneously. You will each have go to the site and enter your order, address, and payment (credit card or PayPal).

 

You guys are all great and I appreciate your patience. All the boards and other goodies are in house now. The only thing missing are the milled/printed aluminum cases from Japan. Those will arrive next week. So I think we are on track to start shipping about the April 15th--right on schedule.

 

Ciao,

--Alex

[Superdad]

Should be soon now!

 

Yup. Cases arrive Monday or Tuesday. Will be having Tina (my very productive first hire) unwrapping and testing boards early in the week--while I wrestle a mountain of other details.

 

Oh Jason, your JS-2 shipped yesterday. Postal tracking system says it will be delivered on Saturday (Priority Mail is an amazing bargain). I'll e-mail you the tracking number.

 

Is you plan still to use the JS-2 to power your Auralic Aries? And then the REGEN from the other output later?

I noticed that your Bent Audio TAP-X preamp has a 9V input--but that's not for any audio circuitry right? Otherwise that would be an interesting application for one of the JS-2 outputs.

Did you see that Miguel (miguelito) is using his JS-2 on his Aries to goo effect? I don't know if he is sticking with the Aries or his Mac mini.

 

I am still envious of your pair of Rythmik subs. John Swenson brought his F12G over last year and it did wonderful things for my system. But my room is small, and it really needs to sit right between my speakers (where my amp now sits). Off to either side and becomes unbalanced due to wall boundary reinforcement. But a PAIR of them (one in front of each speaker) would take care of that!

Will have to see how the next couple of months go. If this first batch of REGENs sells as fast as you think they will….

[Superdad]

Quick update:

 

Cases are here. Assembling and testing units now! Web site is half done with goal to be live by Sunday. Will begin shipping on schedule, Wednesday, April 15.

 

It's dark and rainy here today. Will take pictures in a couple of days when the sun comes out, but might just save those to put on the web site.

 

Thanks everyone!

 

ALEX C.

[Superdad]

Not sure which I'm more excited to hear ... Your soon to be up and selling regens or you getting rain? A big congrats on both accounts!

 

Yes, thanks Dave. We got a good soaking from a full downpour most of the day, but it could rain for forty days and nights and still not get California out of this terrible drought. It is going to be a rough summer here in the mountains. Fire season is likely to be very bad this year.

[Superdad]

how could I get on the mailing list?

thanks,

drmike

 

Hi DrMike: Check your PM for the password.

[Superdad]

WOW, WOW, WOW. I am speechless gentleman. The response in the first 15 hours was unbelievable.

Thank you all for your orders and your kind words!

 

About 75 of the first 100 units are sold as of this moment Saturday evening. I discovered that my initial mailing of the password left a few folks out. They have now been notified and I'm going to give it one more day until I open the site up entirely.

I almost did not do it this way, but I am so glad I did as I recognized all the names and if felt good for you all to be able to get on board first.

 

I did receive all your order notes, private e-mails, extra requests, etc. I will send another message to everyone on Sunday. It will take much of Monday to sort everything out. Boy am I glad I got the web site up to automate the orders. It has been tough enough handling JS-2 and MMK orders by e-mail. Still a lot to work out such as getting all the new addresses into my accounting s/w and up to the US Postal site, but I've found some s/w tools to help with that too.

 

Be advised that those requesting to order one of my hand-made, shielded 15awg, Oyaide/Belden DC cables (typically 5.5mm x 2.5mm PS end, 5.5mm x 2.1mm REGEN end) will have a few days delay in billing/shipping since these take time to make (I usually chain myself to the solder station for a few hours at night to knock out a batch; working that thick wire is hard on the fingers.)

 

Due to time constraints, the Oyaide/Belden custom cable is only available for purchase by JS-2 owners (one comes "free" with the JS-2; it is the second one that I charge for). Also, the price for that cable went (from $45 as Jason mentioned) to $60 at the first of April. The plugs are not cheap and each cable takes 37 minutes to build and test (when done in batches of 10 with no distractions). thanks for understanding. I have one assembler increasing her hours now, but I can't put her on cables. If/when I bring another person on board (not anytime soon AFAIK), I will try to train them to make these cables. I actually asked Oyaide in Japan to bid on making them for me, but they looked at the wire and declined due to difficulty.

 

Once again, thank you all. We will work hard to get all your orders shipped in a timely fashion. No shipments will begin until Wednesday, but once the system runs smoothly I'm sure we can get everyone taken care of.

 

The next round of excitement--for me, John Swenson, and everyone--will be when a bunch of you start hooking up the REGENs up to your DACs. I can't wait!

 

All the best,

ALEX

[Superdad]

Hi can I get on the list too? Thanks

 

Yes, check your PM.

[Superdad]

Hello again everyone:

 

Once again, thank you for all the new orders and interest! Am now down to about 18 units left from the first 100 units we have in-house--and will be working hard to ship all those in the coming days.

 

I have already sent an urgent PO to Japan for another 100 of the milled/printed aluminum cases, but they are about to go on "Golden-week" holiday there and delivery will likely be mid-May. More PCBs can certainly be ready before then.

 

So it looks like by the time I take the password off the web site and open it to the wider world on Tuesday, I may have to put a late-May delivery date on the REGEN page. Wow.

 

----------------------------

 

I have an explanation and a big favor to ask everyone:

 

a) The ONLY list that exists for REGEN orders is YOUR ORDER ON THE WEB SITE!

 

b) The only mailing list I maintain for past and future communications is based on regular ([email protected]) e-mail addresses. It is neither practical nor allowed for me to conduct mailings or business via the CA messaging system.

 

b) Asking here in the thread or sending me a message to get "on the list" does nothing--especially if you do not include your private e-mail address. (Don't worry, I keep those private and don't share them, and I use s/w that does show other recipients your address either.)

 

I just finished spending 2 hours sending replies (including the early access password) to everyone above that asked--via the CA messaging system, but that really needs to stop if I am to keep up with everything.

 

My own e-mail address is pretty darn easy to find on the web, and anyone is still welcome to use the CA message system to send me their e-mail address to be included right away on mailings. And at least for one more day I will respond to those with the web site password.

 

Thanks for being understanding about this.

 

Kindly,

 

Alex C.

[Superdad]

Hi Alex,

 

just to to confirm that I sent you an email with the shipping address in Monaco. PayPal USA does not accept foreign delivery Addresse.

 

 

Hi Edward: Yes, I did receive your shipping address, thanks.

 

And to everyone else:

 

My apologies for not yet replying to your various special notes and requests.

I assure you that I have been seeing ALL of them--from the Special Order Notes field on the order page, to the messages from the contact page, and also from your direct e-mails to my private e-mail address.

 

I promise that nobody will be overlooked. The process of sorting out and replying will start in the next day or two as there are a few logistical matters I have to work on first (the REGEN "Owner's Booklet" today, the order and address export/import tomorrow, etc.).

 

Please do not use any forum threads for order logistics or requests. That way leads to madness for me () and distraction from general discussion.

 

Thanks again,

 

ALEX

[Superdad]

Hi Alex,

 

Thanks again for your efforts on the Regen! As you know I already placed my order a couple of days ago, but had a couple of questions - I sent you an email but I'm sure it's lost in the many others in your inbox!

 

1. Is the standard wall wart ok with 240V?

 

2. I had asked about adding the Regen-to-JS-2 cable to my order (I'd suggest you add this as a clickable option on your web page as I am sure every JS-2 owner will want one!).

 

Art

 

 

Hi Art:

 

Thank you for your order for a USB REGEN and for an extra one of my custom Oyaide/Belden cables to use it with your JS-2.

I just sent you an invoice via e-mail and it will be included in the box with the REGEN. As mentioned on the forum, the addition of the $60 custom cable will slow shipment of your order by about a week since the cable is hand-made and my helper and I will be VERY busy with first REGEN shipments all week.

 

The reason the custom cables are not a listed option on the web site is that presently I am only willing to make and sell this cable to JS-2 owners--and there is no web programming logic to validate that for me. You may notice that the JS-2 product page on the site does now list cable combinations and changes to package costs, but due to limited production of JS-2 each month (still about dozen per month for now), and my desire to custom quote good freight rates for buyers, ordering JS-2 from the web site is not enabled at this time.

 

And to your first question:

Yes, the 22 watt/7.5 volt/2.93 amp "table-top" SMPS that comes with the REGEN is worldwide voltage compatible. A short, 15cm, 18awg detachable AC cord is also included. It has a USA wall plug, so those in Europe and elsewhere can either cut and reterminate the end with a local plug or use a cord of their own.

 

I really dislike most of the available "wall-warts," and higher wattage supplies (which I sonically liked for the REGEN due to capacitance) are not available as "warts" in the desired voltage with interchangeable wall plugs.

 

Many thanks again--and very best regards,

 

--Alex C.

[Superdad]

Oh man! I've been gone all weekend and the email from Alex got put into my SPAM folder! Are there any Regens left?

 

About 5 left as of this moment. I'll go take a shower and make coffee and they'll all be gone. Just crazy!

Thanks guys.

[Superdad]

Hello Alex,

I sent you a PM, I hope you manage to read it :-)

 

Massimo

 

Check your e-mail Massimo. Only 3 more available from the first batch.

 

Just go word from Japan that soonest they can ship me more cases (due to 4/26-5/10 "Golden-week" holiday) is May 17th. That sucks because on May 20th I leave on a 1-week vacation/high-school marching band field trip with our teenage sons to Washington, D.C.

 

So after this first batch goes out this week and next, folks are going to have to wait until end-of-May. And who knows, if all you early adopters really like the REGEN and post about it, then by late May I could be regretting having made the second batch just another 100 pieces. But for now I have to chalk up the first surge as just pent up demand.

 

Once again. A million thanks. Or at least 100.

 

--Alex C.

[Superdad]

All 100 sold!

Well, 97: I'm keeping one, I promised John Swenson a production unit, and one is going to be raffled off at the May 2nd CA member gathering in Berkeley (with the proceeds going to the charity of the winner's choice).

 

Here is a pic of 50 completed kits waiting to be put in shipping cartons:

 

 

Everyone should be receiving a status e-mail from me shortly.

 

Thanks gang!