Analogue out of Weiss DAC202 vs. DAC2 direct to power amp.

[AudioExplorations]

Dear community,

 

I have had less than good results in hooking up my DAC2 direct to my power amp. I have tried a few power amps (primare A33.2 and Mcintosh MC402) and always find the sound looses its body and musicality, the sound becomes very 'digital' and schrill.

 

I am wondering however if anyone has experience in the difference between the analogue out of the DAC2 and the DAC202 as I understand it has been completely redesigned. Would I get a different level of performance with this DAC?

 

I would love to eliminate the preamp from my setup as I listen purely to music through my macmini and no other source at all.

 

I will try to home audition the DAC202 and see how it sounds, but in the meantime any experience is greatly appreciated!

 

[Petrosilius]

I used to run the Weiss DAC 202 on the Electrocompaniet EC 4.8 preamp and the AW 400 monoblocks as standard setup. Some weeks ago I connected the Weiss directly to the AW 400 and found that sound improved significantly in terms of resolution, speed and soundstage. This was true both with the streaming clients and the Soulution 540. So I definitely recommend you audition such a setup at your home.

 

[modena]

Can't comment on DAC2 analogue out, but I use the DAC202 direct to McIntosh MC501 power amps. Soundwise, it's a quite nice upgrade over my previous DAC1 HDR. Not a hint of "digital" or lean sound... no fatigue at all.

DAC202 alalogue out is on the same level as my McIntosh C2300 tube pre... There are some differences, but these are up to personal taste and the synergy of your speakers and your listening space.

 

If you can live without the facilities of let's say a Mc pre - tone controls, remote on/off switching of power amp, or another pair of blue eys :-) - you should try to audition it in your system.

 

[AudioExplorations]

Thanks for the comments.

 

Modena, very encouranging that the DAC202 direct to McIntosh power amp is working well for you, I know the 402 and 501 are virtually identical sonically. Were you running it through the C2300 pre and conclude the direct connection was par to this? If so that says ALOT about the 202 analogue output stage!

 

 

 

[modena]

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying.

DAC202 - set to 4.5 output attenuation - driving direct the 501s, and DAC202 - with volume control disabled - to C2300 to MC501s.

 

They do not sound identical, but it's not a "better" or "worst" sound issue here... like I could say that DAC202 is BETTER - to my ears, to my space, on same system - than the Bench HDR.

 

In short, I would live happily with both setups :-)

 

[AudioExplorations]

Modena- Thanks for your comments on this. I have just picked up a DAC202 which I will be able to trail for a week.

 

I definitely prefer the direct connection in terms of simplicity, usability and having the cleanest possible signal path.

 

In terms of sound I am still undecided, its not an instant clear winner for me either as you mentioned you felt also. Some aspects have improved, some lost.

 

What was in your perspective the trade-off in terms of SQ you noticed and why did you ultimately opt to work without the preamp?

 

[modena]

Well, I still have the C2300. I haven't make up my mind yet.

 

C2300, contrary to the perception of what a tube pre should do to the sound, is quiet - and I mean dead quiet - smooth and revealling, without adding any euphonic distrotions or "syrup" to the sound.

 

Well - perhaps is hard to believe - but what I miss with the DAC202 as a pre, is the c2300 superior detail and air around instruments. DAC202 adds slightly more body to the mid-lows, which sometimes, might be quite welcome.

 

BTW, I use the same Oyaide FW cable and I have auditioned 8TC and 12TC as well and I liked them a lot. If you could do with some more detail / air, you might try the dirt cheap Gotham GAC2 XLR ICs.

 

Good luck to your search.

 

George

 

 

[AudioExplorations]

Modena, how did you get on with the DAC202/C2300/MC501 combo? How are you primarly running the setup now?

 

I personally have acquired a C2300 as I found both the DAC2 and DAC202 direct to MC402 without pre to be lacking as discussed. Since adding the C2300 I was shocked at the improvement to soundstage, detail, warmth, body, 'emotion' of the music. Without the C2300 I was finding I spent less time listening to poorly recorded/mastered music (big no no) and with the C2300 the added touch of 'tube warmth' it is providing has completely removed ALL listening fatigue whatsoever. It's been pure enjoyment since. A further significant step in performance was gained by switching out the stock Chinese MC tubes on the line stage with a set of Genalex 12AX7 Gold Lion reissues.

 

Perhaps the above experience is partly due to my speakers which are PMC's - very neutral, uncolored and revealing and hence do not add/mask anything to the sound. I guess with this combo for me the C2300 is simply necessary. Perhaps with more colored speakers this may not be the case.

 

Would be interested to hear how you have gotten on with more of less the same setup.

 

[modena]

Congrats for your purchase :-)

 

As a rule, I am still trying to keep music path as simple as possible, eliminating the pre, one more pair of interconnects and one more power cord.

That lead me to purchase the HDR and now to the DAC202.

Focusing on DAC202 performance as pre, I would say that it's quite remarkable.

For me, it's a major step up from my previous HDR.

 

What you describe in your post, is the unique McIntosh sonic footprint… but don't expect to find it in the DAC202 or nowhere else...

C2300 excels on instrument separation and air, silky smooth highs and total absense of fatigue, even after many hours of listening on really high levels.

DAC202 is a "punchier" version of the same music reality.

Sonically, with both pres, the ingredients of a gourmet dish are all there…

There will always be the ones that would prefer just a bit more salt, or peper or spice. It's called personal taste…

 

Having said that, right now, the C2300 is on my rack, doing it's magic with the MC501s. Next step would be a tube upgrade / rollover, with Gold Lions and / or Telefunkens VS the stock tubes.

Some say that there would be a major sonic upgrade...

 

Can't comment on PMCs as I have never listened to them.

 

Enjoy your music :-)

 

 

[SteveChicago]

... about wanting the preamp in the chain ...

 

I auditioned a Weiss202 and, like you, found it better with than without my preamp.

 

I currently enjoy a modified Esoteric D70 DAC WITH my preamp. Like the Weiss, it's an excellent DAC with volume control that can be linked to the amp without a preamp. However, as with the Weiss it sounds better with than without the preamp.

 

Sometimes less is more. Sometimes it's not.