Which one to buy: UpTone USB REGEN or Intona USB Isolator?

[lmitche]

Well blankdisc, I couldn't quite match the price of the Monoprice cables, so opted for something four times the price, the wallet really hurt at $4 a piece, did the gamble pay off?

 

For the record, used an i5 500GB spinning drive, mac mini with Yosemite, Lindy P/N 31643 USB A to USB B 0.5m, Intona Isolator, Lindy P/N 31643 USB A to USB B 0.5m, Mutec MC-1.2 USB in. Output of the MC-1.2 is AES3 to an RME ADI-2 DAC. HqPlayer (trial), with poly short upsampled to 192.

 

Either way, connecting the Intona online or cold from a restart,several times, nary a glitch or messing about with no sound, played 100% with *complete* reliability. Listened to music with greater realism than ever before and restored my appraisal/faith in USB Audio, the Intona is that good. I would never have thought such a simple looking box could make that much of a difference in clarity and presentation.

 

Galvanic isolation is a big deal, for USB it's essential.

 

It's good, well, great actually, with very modest cabling de rigeur and expensive USB cables relegated to the market, and no additional power supplies to add either.

 

Worth persisting with despite the drama from last week. On Windows though it's a different story. The Mutec won't install at all, the Intona is not used so will work with Mutec to find a solution. I prefer Windows with ASIO and I have a license for HQPlayer, so really keen to get this moving, but in the meantime, OSX is doing very well indeed.

 

Which Intona box do you own, plain or industrial?

[lmitche]

Thanks

[lmitche]

With the industrial version of the Intona, use of a VBUS isolator on the output side yields a very noticable SQ improvement with the Auralic Vega DAC. Despite the fact that the Vega does not need +5 volts, this behavior is consistent, with just a straight cable or with a generic hub, REGEN and now the Intona device.

[lmitche]

I just tried this just a few hours ago with a Playback Designs MPD-3, it was a disaster, HQPlayer couldn't see the DAC. Removed the 5V power and all was good. The Intona takes power from the 5V bus and according to Windows is drawing 0mA, well that's Windows.

 

Funny, I had no problem injecting 5+ volts power with the AQVOX connector into the Intona. It works fine.

 

I tried using the REGEN to do the same, and that failed to sync.

[lmitche]

Hi lmitche,

 

From my experience with my PC and the Phasure NOS1, all I have tried in the USB chain was always removed, due to degradation in SQ. And I could list what I have tried, starting from the PCIe USB card up to the NOS1.

 

What works for one may not work for someone else. It is with this in mind that I made a suggestion. It's not a rule, but from my experience (and apart from the Intona (industrial version)) it always sounded better without other components on the path.

 

So, maybe different components, different results ?

 

Regards,

 

Hi Alain, LOL - yes of course, but it is a bit tough for me to label the Sbooster VBUS isolator a component. It's more like an very short USB extension cable with one lead (pin 1) disconnected.

 

I can't opine on the benefits, if any, of the Intona "industrial" device yet. I haven't had the time for proper testing. The system does sound different with, then without. My vote is still out. I made a change in my system earlier this week that yielded the largest step change improvement in my system, ever. Because of this, I am having difficulty separating the benefits of this prior change from any benefits coming from the addition of the Intona box. Time will tell.

 

Anyway, in my one man audio universe as a rule the Vega ALWAYS sounds better WITHOUT the VBUS connector delivering power. YUMV.

[lmitche]

FWIW, after conducting several experiments injecting power into the Intona, I find that it sounds best powered from the audioPCs motherboard. I should mention that my PC is powered by the highest quality linear power supply in the house, a custom built Sigma 11.

 

I look forward to trying this again when the new Uptone audio galvanically isolated power supply is available.

 

In the end, a straight four wire USB Supra cable into the Intona with shield intact, followed by a second Supra cable with 5 volts lifted with the Sbooster VBUS eliminator sounds best with the Vega DAC. Any other power combination results in a very noticeable diminishment in deep bass extension. Of course YMMV.

[lmitche]

Or you could send it the signal from an LPSU-powered Regen you might have hanging around.

 

I tried this, with and without an sbooster REGEN. Batteries as well. Motherboard power sounds best here.

[lmitche]

The past "snowy" weekend in New England gave me some time to listen to my "PeterSt of Phasure" version of the Intona in combination with the Green and Amber REGEN powered by various sources into the Auralic Vega DAC. Three Supra cables were used to test. There have been zero connectivity issues with the Supras and the Intona. VBUS +5volts was eliminated on the DAC sides of both the Intona and REGEN.

 

First an "el cheapo" /Sbooster REGEN LPS combo was tested as power source for the REGEN. This resulted in a tradeoff. While the sound was less grainy and more natural, the prodigious bass was reduced. Hmmm...

 

I realized that a ground loop was possible with this configuration. Isn't the point of the Intona to provide isolation?

 

So the LPS was replaced with a 5volt mobile phone auxiliary battery. Wowser! The bass was now restored along with the benefit of the natural sound provided by the REGEN. The surprise was an increase in depth. The result was the best sound ever achieved in my system!

 

Swapping the Green and Amber REGEN had little, if any impact on SQ.

 

Batteries are not my favorite long term solution, but I accept the compromise until a better isolated power source can be found.

 

If anyone has ideas for a better isolated power solution then batteries, I'm all ears .

[lmitche]

 

So Larry, are you saying that you prefer the combo of the Intona feeding the REGEN over just the Intona alone? Given that the title of this thread sets up what I have contended is a false dichotomy between two devices which serve different functions, it would be good to read a bit more about what you hear with and without them paired.

 

Hi Alex,

 

Yes, my listening tests concur with your contention that there is a false dichotomy here.

 

As I wrote before, powering the REGEN from a LPS (sbooster regen + el-cheapo) placed behind the Intona is a trade-off, better SQ in some dimensions, worse in others, with the result of slightly diminished overall SQ, most noticeably in bass extension.

 

However the Intona + REGEN + Battery yields the best SQ ever. Clearly adding the benefits of the REGEN, and preserving the improvements brought by the Intona isolation results in a great combination. The impact is most noticeable in better timber/harmonics and depth, which both hit new levels. And the bass improvement from the Intona is still there.

 

The increased timber and depth is very noticeable on acoustic guitar recordings. For example, on Fleetwood Mac's Rumors album 96khz, the two guitars on "Never Going Back Again", just sparkle, and pop into the room with a much improved 3 dimensional image and incredible clarity.

 

Way cool. Now if I can just find a substitute for that damn battery!

 

Larry

[lmitche]

Thanks ElviaCaprice, I look forward to learning if your experience matches or exceeds mine here.

[lmitche]

I also got some Audioquest Jitterbugs and put them on my Auralic Aries.

 

Are the Jitterbugs serially connected from the Aries to the Intona or in unused usb ports? or both?

[lmitche]

How did you power the REGEN in last nights test?

[lmitche]

Interesting, thanks genjamon. You may want to try powering the REGEN behind the Intona with a battery to preserve Galvanic Isolation.

[lmitche]

If you want the benefits of galvanically isolated power, there is really no other way.

[lmitche]

Has anyone compared the industrial version against the standard version of Intona USB Isolator?

 

Yes, first I had the standard version and found little improvement from the Intona with the Auralic Vega. Daniel kindly took it back and it was upgraded with the industrial version. Now the improvement with the Vega was very immediate and obvious. Better in everyway.

 

Then I sold the Vega, and bought a Mytek Brooklyn DAC. With the proprietary USB input on the Brooklyn there was little difference with the Intona, so it was sold.

[lmitche]

I purchased one and I love it - for my system it provided a lot more depth/improved soundstage overall, and seems to have lower distortion. This is even compared to the Regen.

 

I wonder if it's a clone of the Intona, but it seems to be a different chip (Silanna CEUSBC2 1511CJ e3) they specify for the Cool Gear isolator.

 

Out of curiousity, did you try the Coolgear isolator with a REGEN between the DAC and isolator?

[lmitche]

While I haven't used all these devices and cables together, I've owned most and here is what I would try.

 

First off replace the Cardas cable with a usb adapter from the PC to Intona. For some reason the Intona seems to benefit from a short cable. This may be an awkward placement, but the benefits should be worth it.

 

Next run the LHLABS cable from the Intona to RUR. If you don't need power, keep the power leg unplugged.

 

Lastly use the Curious REGEN link between the RUR and DAC. I had a Curious cable here between the Intona and REGEN with a Supra between REGEN and DAC. It didn't add much. But after swapping positions with the Supra cable the sound quality unopened up.

[lmitche]

Yep! Curious indeed!

[lmitche]

All this chaining prompts me to ask: where are we in the progress of making the USB interfaces within DACs more robust?

Is that the question, or is the question where are we in the progress of making USB sources more robust?

 

My belief is that the damage is already done when the signal leaves the source device. There is only so much that can be remediated downstream.

[lmitche]

All the fixes inside the computer are relatively benign when the USB cable is isolated from the DAC.

 

Hi One and a Half,

 

With my DAC isolated from the PC, I expected this was true. However after upgrading my PC by powering the SSD with an LPS1, sound quality greatly improved. I'm afraid this theory is not true.

 

Sorry,

 

Larry

[lmitche]

Point taken, no problems with your experience. A computer then is forever doomed to spew rubbish on the USB differential which is a bad thing and deserved the reputation it has, AES3 has some bright hope yet.

 

As to how much tweaking is required for a PC to clam up the noise is a matter of patience and expense, which I don't have, so I don't bother, hence the theory

 

For the Aurender, Aries, Lumin, Azur 851N, SGM have a bright future after all, small signal paths, nice.

Thanks for your note. I don't know why the SSD powered by the LPS1 has such an impact on SQ. Looking at the operation of an SSD, they are huge noise makers in the gigahertz band and never seem to idle, hence always processing in an effort to retain data.

 

Given that, why would the delivery of a very clean fast five volt power matter. Perhaps it's the speed of the lps1? I don't know.

 

Ideas?

[lmitche]

I don't have both, just the industrial version. I have read from Intona on CA and in the Intona review on Audiostream, that people have reported better results with the industrial version with audio.

I had both, first standard then industrial. I returned the first as the SQ impact was minimal. The industrial was a keeper, at least for a while.

[lmitche]

Orange sounds better here.

[lmitche]

25 minutes ago, topofdaworldma said:

Not actually correct. Although Alex does have age related ailments the reason for not posting is that he has moved to a very rural area where there is currently insufficient adsl/optic nodes to provide usable internet for all residents. New infrastructure is on the way but it's a waiting game.

That's good to hear, thanks.