DIY DC power cables

[BigGuy]

19 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

Not sure why you want to add a polyethylene foam tube before (inside) the shielding? IMO if you want to add a shock absorber you probably want it after (around) the shielding. I would have the JSSG as close to the wires as possible for best results. Remember that JSSG acts like a Faraday cage for cables. You want to keep all the electromagnetic fields close to and inside the JSSG. Adding too much space inbetween might give it an escape route through the air spacer. I think you want to avoid it as much as possible. My two cents ofcourse.

 

My Ghent DC cables have copper braid and my ATL have tinned braid. I have'nt detected any difference, but copper braid looks nicer! ? With that said silver plated braid sounds noticable better on coaxial cables IME. Not sure if it will matter much on JSSG though.

Based on post by JohnS indicating that in the case of DC (as well as ethernet & usb), the grounded shield is to keep crap in rather than letting it radiate, it does make sense that the shield should be as close as possible to the cable/conductors.

 

I have seen the use of teflon tubes, foamed polyethylene tubes, or cotton sleeves mentioned in other cable DIY threads.  Where would the use of these dielectrics be best used...interconnects?  other?

 

Secondly, I have some "aircraft grade" 26(?)ga 2-conductor, teflon coated, silver-plated copper wire which has a braided shield and teflon jacket.

I was thinking I could DIY a quasi-quad-core DC cable by taking 2 lengths, twisting them together,  and then using 1 conductor from each as the plus and the other 2 as minus.  I could connect an insulated wire to each end of the existing shields (x2)...OR just add a JSSG to the outside of the bundle.

Thoughts?

[BigGuy]

2 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

I would say that telefon tubes are great, if not one of the best wire insulation materials around. Works great IME. 

 

Using Teflon tubes as a dielectric for DIY is good but getting wire centered within a (presumably) oversized tube to optimize the air (dielectric) distribution around the wire would definitely be a challenge.   I am pretty sure that is why foamed polyethylene tubes are a suggested alternative.

 

Would I be correct in assuming that use of a dielectric around the + and - conductors is best suited for interconnects?

 

2 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

Not sure what a quasi-quad-core DC cable is, but it sound like starquad with dual braids. Here is a picture of my 8 conductor USB cable with dual shields JSSG style which sounds truly great.

 

 

It makes sense to use dual shields when you want to separate data+ & Data- from GND & 5v, but doing the same thing with a single DC cable does'nt sound like a good idea to me. You want to run the positive and negative wires from the same source together in a starquad configuration. If you have two DC cables running side by side a dual shield JSSG would make more sense, since you want to avoid coupling/interfearences between the two sources.

What I am suggesting for my "quasi-star-quad" construction would be having 2 parallel runs of my twisted conductor wire and then joining the 2 "black" conductors for + at each end and then doing the same with the 2 "white" conductors for the -.  Then I would use a single JSSG around the whole assembly.

 

Or, I could buy some star quad wire and use one quad for the D+ and D- and the other quad for 5V and GND like in your cable as pictured.

 

I was just trying to get close to a star quad using wire that I already have.

[BigGuy]

2 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

Usually you want to use solid wires for Teflon tubes since it is much easier. Otherwise there are ready made wires with thin teflon sleeves that is quite easy to find on eBay. Polyethylene tubes might be a good insulator as well.

 

 

Yes!

 

 

This sounds more like a proper starquad with JSSG. It is basically two twisted pair cables. In a starquad all wires are twisted in the same direction.

Here you can see how a starquad is made. Note that the wires are U-shaped when twisted and cut in two pcs afterwards.

 

 

 

Yes, if you want to make your own USB cables it will work, but only if you can find USB plugs that fits. USB A male screw terminal plug fits thick wires, but you'll run into problems finding USB B male screw terminal plugs. Soldering even 8 pcs 22awg wires to a USB plugs requires a very steady hand! ? 

 

 

I think you would be best off butchering the cables by removing the inner wires, twist them in a U-shape in the same direction, add a JSSG and a braid sleeve on top. 

Thanks for the pic, Cornan.

 

There may be more than one version, but when I look up star quad, I find pics that look like this...

 

If you change the yellow to black and the red to blue, same colored conductors are not adjacent to each other as in your pic.   The twisted bundle would look like this...

 

 

[BigGuy]

OK, I have the makings for a starquad DC cable.  Since it looks like the 4 conductors are merely twisted like a candy cane rather than an actual braid, how have people kept the twisted wires from unraveling while adding connectors, ground shielding, etc.  IF solid/stiff, I guess it will hold the twist but finer wire may not.

 

Suggestions...?

[BigGuy]

16 minutes ago, Superdad said:

 

Shrink tubing.  Either short bands every few years inches or over the whole length.

Easy enough!  Since it will be covered with shield and TechFlex braid then shrinked at ends, maybe I will try short band of electricians tape.

 

Hopefully not 10lbs in a 5lbs but also going to try to assemble with GND wire internal to barrel connector to eliminate screwdowns.

[BigGuy]

25 minutes ago, tboooe said:

Sorry if I am late to the game on this..but I thought that if using a starquad cable like the 4S6 for DC applications, that the grounding technique was not necessary??

Opposite for me!  Regardless of starquad or parallel construction, my understanding is that BOTH JSSG and JSGT are recommended tho' the latter less so with LPSs.

[BigGuy]

I  am getting the sense that 18-20 awg is about where one wants to for DIY starquad.

 

Other than improved flexibility, any other benefits in using stranded vs solid wire at any given awg? 

Solid would certainly will hold star configuration better than stranded when twisting.

[BigGuy]

41 minutes ago, 57gold said:

Recently acquired a Ghent 1m Oyaide 2.1mm/2.5mm terminated Canare 4S6 cable.  

 

Anyone else find the 2.5mm (red) Oyaide difficult/impossible to fit on pin in DAC?  

 

Afraid to jam it on Brooklyn+ and break the input.  

 

Was thinking about using some ProGold CAIG contact stuff to lubricate the pin.

Just checked both the Brooklyn and + manuals which do not indicate size of barrel connector for external power.

 

IIRC, it is a 5.5mm/2.1mm, not 5.5mm/2.5mm barrel, but Oyaide sells both.

 

Do have a 2.1mm barrel on something just for size?

[BigGuy]

Looking for a North America source for 12 gage (2mm) solid core copper wire, preferably Oxygen Free tho' not sure that is necessarily better than garden variety.

 

Did order some Temco has 12 gage "magnet" wire to play with but wondered if there was a source for something more upscale?!

[BigGuy]

1 hour ago, WuNgUn said:

Why solid core? 

'Cuz I want to see what it sounds like vs stranded.  I figured one of you might know.

[BigGuy]

2 hours ago, WuNgUn said:

I recall reading about a blind test on speaker wire...and one of the examples was coat hanger wire...

Most couldnt tell coat hanger from Kimber Kable...

But its worth testing!

I have read similar reports as well as smoke generators from numerous sources.

 

Just need to locate a source.  Maybe George Cardas will sell me a few meters of what he supplies to Pangea?!  ;-)

[BigGuy]

15 hours ago, SuperRu said:

I prefer the sound of hot forged solid copper cables. I then have them cryogenically frozen for added stability.

OK, I get it!    This is NOT the OFC fan club and, by extension, probably not the single crystal club either.  Apologies to the advocates but I have not drunk the purple Kool Aid, so to speak, just yet myself but thought I might give it a shot.  A recent article tho' DID indicate that the differences, at least in terms of % purity, between regular and OFC copper are trivial.

[BigGuy]

5 hours ago, mansr said:

Standard commercial copper wire is plenty pure for normal use. Special oxygen free copper is needed to prevent corrosion in some industrial applications. Unless your audio cables run through a blast furnace, it doesn't matter.

OK, putting aside commercial vs OFC copper, I was thinking about running 2 twisted pairs to each speaker.  Would I be better off keeping the runs separated or making a starquad configuration?

[BigGuy]

14 hours ago, SuperRu said:

Sorry for trying to be a little bit too clever there.

Blue Jeans Cable has a nice star quad cable that might be worth giving a try.

https://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/speaker/index.htm

 

 

14 hours ago, lmitche said:

Amazon too:

 

https://www.amazon.com/Canare-Speaker-Cable-Premium-Bananas/dp/B00SPVIIZA/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1517012699&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=canare%2B4s11&th=1

So...is the recommendation for a starquad configuration vs 2 parallel runs of 2 twisted conductors to each speaker for best SQ?

[BigGuy]

10 minutes ago, JohnSwenson said:

The starquad geometry has about 1/3 the inductance of a twisted pair and low inductance has frequently been stated to be a good quality for speaker cables, so yes going with the starquad is probably better than the twisted pairs.

 

John S.

 

 

Thanks, John.  Have a nice weekend.

[BigGuy]

Questions re DIY USB...

 

Planning on doing starquad for the 5+/GND with JSSG.

 

Does it make sense to use starquad for the D+/D- or is twisted pair with JSSG more than adequate?

 

Planning on bundling signal and power separately.

 

Has the issue of cable lengths <1/2m or >1m been resolved to any extent?  I have read that 1m is really not a good choice.

[BigGuy]

On 4/11/2018 at 8:24 PM, JohnSwenson said:

DIY USB cables are probably the least likely to be done right (ie if you don't know what you are doing it may not work at all). You can't hurt anything if it is not done right, it just doesn't work right. The probability of getting the basics right is pretty low, so it is a useless enterprise to make your own with expensive wire etc and find out it doesn't sound very good, you have no idea if it is the materials or the basic properties of the cable such impedance etc.

 

If you really want to DIY USB cables I recommend you have a TDR and know how to use it to get impedance right.

 

You are certainly free to play around with DIY USB cables, you MAY get something that sounds really good, but making sweeping general statements about materials, geometry etc would seem to not be a good thing to do.

 

John S.

Thanks for the sanity check, John.  Read some of the USB spec til my eyes glazed over.  As confirmation, heard from one USB cable fabricator that he is no longer producing them due to the complexity.  Obviously it is more than just connecting 4 wires to the USB connectors!  Begs the question as to how many available cables actually meet the 90ohms, etc. of the spec!?

 

Since I have now freed up some wire ;-)  , I am again moving back to DC power cables.   Have done a couple with JSSG and JSGT but in retrospect have a couple of questions that came to mind during modification of a battery-powered DC supply...

 

Does it matter if the insulated ground wire of the JSSG is inside or outside of the shield?  I thought I would kill one bird with many stones and use a solid strand wire as both the wire soldered to the shield and also to hold the starquad twist of the multistrand conductors during construction...i.e., by wrapping the insulated ground wire around the twist.

 

Also, wondered if the JSSG and/or JSGT are relevant to battery supplies?

 

Thanks as always.

[BigGuy]

8 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

Don´t let sanity let you down or spoil the fun!  My ATL starquad USB cable beats the USPCB in my setup between Aries Mini and ISO Regen. If I would have listen to pure sanity I would have missed a good chunk of the fun. The experimenting bit is 50% or more of the fun for me though. Win or loose.

 

Sanity is intact and still having fun but I would hate to spend time fabricating a DIY USB when only by chance would it meet specs.  Plus I do not have a bottomless wallet to support mission quests without at least some basic knowledge.  I'll stick to DC cables and speaker cables for now. 

 

7 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

I have tried it on a TP-Link Vivid powerbank feeding the Spdif GI output of my BluWave USB to Spdif bord (Board powered by IR) with great results. If this is due to the same reasons or not I do not know, but it definately made a noticable difference for the better when I tried. Now the same spot is powered by Gophert csp-3205II>HDPULN (3A/LT3045)>HDPULN (3A/LT3045)>LPS-1.2 that clearly sounds better than the TP-Link Vivid with JSGT.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have a custom built 12v battery supply powering my 2 pairs of Harmonic Technologies "Photon" interconnects.  Based on positive reports on using starquad configuration, I have braided the four conductors of each pair of DC cables into a starquad.  My thought was to shield each quad with a JSSG but use a solid insulated ground wire to also secure the braid of the bundle.  Hence my question re acceptability of having qround wire between the braided shield and the conductor starquad.

 

IF JSGT is an added enhancement, my plan would be to create a 4-head "hydra" with each being a "home run" to the AC connector rather than having a 5-wire connection closer to the DC plugs and only one wire to the AC plug., if that makes sense.

[BigGuy]

On 4/19/2018 at 11:40 AM, Cornan said:

 

Fair enough, but in any case which ever USB cable you will DIY you will have difficulties to biuld them according to specs unless you have equipment to measure it. IME the impedance match is not the most crucial thing for SQ with USB.

 

It is possible to make a JSSG with shielded wires in the way that you describe. However, it is slightly better to have the JSSG as close as possible to the surface of the cable. Remember that a JSSG protects the cable from the harsh inviroment in the outside world, not to the things that are going on inside the cable. The latter is the work of the starquad. 

 

If you want to make a JSGT hydra I would think it is safe to say that you could just as well add as many wires as you can fit. You’ll never know when you’ll need them in the future. IME 28awg silver plated wires is great...and they are cheap as well. One more point though. A JSGT could possibly transport high impedance noise to other equipments as well if the safety ground is isolated with a floating IT. That’s atleast my personal assumption since JSGT is never beneficial when connected post my IT. Only pre. My JSGTs is all connected to grounding boxes where they are most effective in my setup.

 

 

All good points.  Thanks, Cornan. 

 

Bought a quantity of 5.5/2.1 mm barrel connectors for constructing JSGTs.  Has anyone found a good way to improve tightness of fit between female and male connectors?  Apparently size DOES matter!  ;-)

 

Hope your trip to China is both prcductive and safe.

[BigGuy]

Construction question...

 

Have a DC supply powered by batteries.  There are 4 DC power cables coming of the supply...all supplied by the same +/- taps so same voltage on each.

I created a 4-headed JSGT with screw terminal CCTV connectors...one for each lead.  All four barrel assemblies have "home runs" to a 3 pin AC plug which shares the other outlet of duplex into which the power supply is plugged.

 

Unless I crossed polarities somewhere (which I will recheck) is there any reason why this approach would present a problem?

 

Reason being that with the hydra installed on my powered interconnects I do not sound from my system?!

[BigGuy]

22 hours ago, Speedskater said:

You have low voltage DC using the same type of connectors as line voltage AC?

There are special rules about having other types of cables in AC line voltage outlet or junction boxes.

Unless I misunderstood the construction of the JSGT, I have jumpered male and female CCTV screw terminal connectors plus-plus

and minus-minus with one end of a wire connected to the minus terminals of the CCTV and the other to the GND pin of a 3-prong AC plug which is then connected to the same duplex as the power supply.

 

Am I not correct?

 

To Cornan's point, I did not let any smoke or flames get out of the power supply.  :-D

[BigGuy]

I am subscribed to a number of CA threads but have not received any notifications in days?!

 

I know that this thread is fairly quiet but I also subscribe to..."A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming" and yet have not gotten any notifications since I last posted on 04/28 tho' the posters are quite prolific!

Anyone else having this issue?

[BigGuy]

15 hours ago, lmitche said:

Yes, that's it. You may also have a grounding point on one of your boxes and could use that. I have one on my balanced power transformer and ac distribution box so use that instead of an AC plug.

Thanks.  Thought I had missed something.

 

Need to reject the screw terminal CCTV connectors but may have one that is shorted internally.  :-(

16 hours ago, Speedskater said:

Do you have a link that shows:

I have jumpered male and female CCTV screw terminal connectors

 

DC supply common is normally only connected to the chassis of the unit that they are powering. And then only at one point.

Male and female CCTV connectors are jumpered plus-to-plus and minus-to-minus with a GND wire connected to one of the minuses with the other end going to GND pin of 3-prong AC plug = JSGT

[BigGuy]

Rechecked my JSGT 4-headed hydra today...both the individual connectors and the JSGT assemblies.  I found a number of CCTV connectors, both male and female, that did not have continuity from plus-to-plus or minus-to-minus.  I am pretty sure that they were OK before putting shrink tubing on the junction of the male to female assemblies.

 

Not sure about the internal construction but is it possible that heating the shrink compromised the internals of the CCTV connector?

I will split open 1 or 2 of the connectors which failed to see what the guts look like.

[BigGuy]

23 hours ago, lmitche said:

I have had some that were flaky. Some came in a darker color green. Beware of those.

Thanks.  Will keep eye out since I just ordered 10 more pairs and WILL be checking for continuity on all before anything else.