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Poll Question: Power Conditioning


greg788

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System so far as per the picture.

 

The furman sequencer provides a way to switch on and off the components, so there's no loud pops at start or end, plus it senses high or low volts. If such a problem existed, it shuts off all the relays until a restart. The audio components therefore don't see the filtering on the Furman. Relays btw are Idec RH4, rated for about 6A inductive loads.

The pairing of the isolation transformer to the Equitech is to provide slowing of pulses on the primary of the Equitech. Since much of the asymmetric noise is absorbed by the balanced supply, there's not much need in the way of RLC devices in front of the audio components, so these aren't fitted.

The Mac Mini is also on the same supply, it's benign as far as introducing noise to the other components as far as harmonics go. RF noise out of the mini is quite good, the backgrounds are dark, with great low level detail, can't ask for much more. Being totally passive, the reliability versus an inverter output are night and day.

 

There will be comments about earthing, and RCBO, these are all fitted to rules where I live and need to abide by them. All earths are bonded together.

 

Audio Power.jpg

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Great thread revival ! Can we also have some European recommendations too ?

 

Also some commentary on dedicated spur, and separate external earth with metal spike in driven into the ground ?

 

A separate metal spike in the ground for a protective earth is often illegal in many countries. The danger is, should a fault current occur, the fault travels to the wrong earth and bypasses the protective devices, so that's not a good thing at all. There is nothing to stop you to put 500 (exaggeration) or more spikes in the ground, and bond them together to form one complete earth. Or sheets of reinforced gal steel bonded together buried in the ground, so long as ONE connection to all the other earth connections in the house are made.

 

I prefer to roll my own, there is a UK manufacturer of power conditioning gear, the prices receive a lot of resistance so to speak. This mob seem a bit more realistic.

 

Dedicated spurs will give you control and protection for your audio components. A spur line on its own will and can be susceptible to conducted noise, so is best treated close the source with an isolation/balanced transformer.

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Stereo:

PS Audio Power Plant Premier AC regenerator on analog components

Power Inspired AG 1500 AC regenerator on digital components

 

Home Theater:

PS Audio P300 AC regenerator on source components

Accuphase P500 conditioner on projector

 

Related accessories:

Entreq grounding boxes

PS Audio Noise Harvesters

50 cm outdoor copper spike ground

Al J.

Modem/router + Keces DC-116 12V LPS - SGC Sonic Transporter + Sonore 12V LPS/Edwards Audio ISO-1 mains isolation transformer - Meicord Opal LAN cables - Aqvox Switch + Sbooster 9V LPS/Uptone LPS-1 - Etalon Isolator - Sonore Signature Rendu Special Edition + Mad Scientist Heretical USB data-only cable - Sonore Ultradigital + Uptone LPS-1 - PS Audio I2S-12 cable - HQ Player - Holo Spring Level 3 DAC -  iPeng on iPad 2 - MK Sound 300 monitors - Mad Audio Scientist Tungsten Carbide footers - Niels Larsen NLE speaker cables - Walker Audio Reference Plus HIGH Definition Links - 2 MK Sound MX350 subs - Shakti Stones - Herbie's Super Sonic Stabilizers - Herbie's Tenderfeet - Stillpoints ERS EMI/RFI sheets - Gutwire Ultimate Ground + Entreq Minimus + Silver Minimus grounding boxes - Symposium Rollerblocks - Symposium Ultra platform - Akiko Tuning Sticks

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Baahh, live life on the wild side and skip the power conditioner!

 

I fell into the trap long ago of needing one and spent thousands of dollars on some of the best ones out there. After comparing the sound of my system with and without the conditioner I ended up selling off the colorful sound the conditioner was adding to my playback chain and now am much happier with the results.

 

Just don't forget to unplug your gear when the weather man predicts lightning storms to roll in :)

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To 'One and a half' so the Furman Sequencer only provides control functions put does not power any of your components?

 

To repeat and emphasis, all the connections to Mother Earth should be bonded together at one main point and then enter the building service entrance as one conductor.

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What power conditioner are you using?

 

 

None, I have no need.

 

 

- I live in Europe where power is stable and relatively clean.

- I exclusively use professional equipment that naturally has all needed power filtering.

 

 

I did work for APC as a Technology Strategist, and yes we made tons of money off Americans who often lives with a power quality usually only found in poor undeveloped countries.

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MacBook Pro M1 Pro -> Motu 8D -> AES/EBU ->
Main: Genelec 5 x 8260A + 2 x 8250 + 2 x 8330 + 7271A sub
Boat: Genelec 8010 + 5040 sub

Hifiman Sundara, Sennheiser PXC 550 II
Blog: “Confessions of a DigiPhile”

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To 'One and a half' so the Furman Sequencer only provides control functions put does not power any of your components?

 

Yes, the Furman provides on/off control via the relays only. The Furman has over and undervoltage protection, so the transformer ahead of it will reflect those variations and the protection system will switch off the output, relays in this case.

 

I have tried a Monster Power Center (230V version) ahead of the Equitech, instead of the iso transformer. There was a reaction between the non linear pulses drawn by the load and the caps/filters in the Monster, and the music sounded very thin. The current pulses amplified, perhaps there was some ghastly resonance going on, but not enough to activate the protection system. Reinstating the iso transformer removed the problem of the higher peaks and the music's fullness returned.

 

Using the same Monster on the output of the Equitech was not successful, the device was expecting an earthed neutral, didn't find one, and either tripped right away or waited for several hours, then tripped. I use the Monster now to protect servers, printers, IT type loads on the regular TN system.

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What power conditioner are you using?

None, I have no need.

- I live in Europe where power is stable and relatively clean.

- I exclusively use professional equipment that naturally has all needed power filtering.

I did work for APC as a Technology Strategist, and yes we made tons of money off Americans who often lives with a power quality usually only found in poor undeveloped countries.

 

Wow. You have measured the AC line, and no harmonics or common mode noise enters the internal DC circuits or are coupled to the output?

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- I live in Europe where power is stable and relatively clean.

 

Stable and relatively clean?

 

Here in Denmark, 230V is standard, but variations from 207 - 244V are officially considered "satisfactory". I use AC regenerators to ensure constant 230V.

 

Right now, early on a Saturday afternoon, my Power Plant Premiere measures 2.6% THD in. After AC regeneration, THD on the output drops to 0.6%.

Al J.

Modem/router + Keces DC-116 12V LPS - SGC Sonic Transporter + Sonore 12V LPS/Edwards Audio ISO-1 mains isolation transformer - Meicord Opal LAN cables - Aqvox Switch + Sbooster 9V LPS/Uptone LPS-1 - Etalon Isolator - Sonore Signature Rendu Special Edition + Mad Scientist Heretical USB data-only cable - Sonore Ultradigital + Uptone LPS-1 - PS Audio I2S-12 cable - HQ Player - Holo Spring Level 3 DAC -  iPeng on iPad 2 - MK Sound 300 monitors - Mad Audio Scientist Tungsten Carbide footers - Niels Larsen NLE speaker cables - Walker Audio Reference Plus HIGH Definition Links - 2 MK Sound MX350 subs - Shakti Stones - Herbie's Super Sonic Stabilizers - Herbie's Tenderfeet - Stillpoints ERS EMI/RFI sheets - Gutwire Ultimate Ground + Entreq Minimus + Silver Minimus grounding boxes - Symposium Rollerblocks - Symposium Ultra platform - Akiko Tuning Sticks

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Not considered possibly to be super audiophile... But, the audio benefit was obvious and pleasing. Got rid of my APC Back-UPS for my PC. APC Back-UPS are known to produce a ragged, pseudo - sine wave.

 

My solution was quite cheap and simple. I now use in its place an APC Line-R 1200VA Line Conditioner/Voltage Regulator. I got interested the 1200VA when I read a review by someone who measured it. He saw that it produces a clean sine wave. Needless to say, I really like the improvement in sound it gives. Why not try it? Still holding on to my XP PC for another week.

 

MY XP PC is about to be replaced with a fanless PC having a SSD. PC is designed for good audio. Having very little internal electronic noise compared to a PC with fans and a spinning hard drive. And, no audible noise coming from the box.

 

May go to an audiophile line conditioner later down the road with the new PC.

It all depends upon in what dimension of life one finds themselves living in.  For, one man's music is another man's noise. 

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Stable and relatively clean?

 

Here in Denmark, 230V is standard, but variations from 207 - 244V are officially considered "satisfactory". I use AC regenerators to ensure constant 230V.

 

Right now, early on a Saturday afternoon, my Power Plant Premiere measures 2.6% THD in. After AC regeneration, THD on the output drops to 0.6%.

 

I have seen the 2.6% or thereabouts THD in quoted a few times by people independently. This I believe is the distortion generated by the Power Plant itself. It's not much a big deal, since the output is cleaned up. Would be interesting to see a fourier of that distortion.

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What power conditioner are you using?

 

I've never had much success with power conditioning. However, now that I'm using a computer frond end, the switching power supply noise (computer and external hard drive) has me wondering and willing to try some things out again.

 

I am not using power conditioning, and am not thinking of doing it, but I would like to find a power plug that filters electrical noise and protects against power surges.

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Baahh, live life on the wild side and skip the power conditioner!

 

I fell into the trap long ago of needing one and spent thousands of dollars on some of the best ones out there. After comparing the sound of my system with and without the conditioner I ended up selling off the colorful sound the conditioner was adding to my playback chain and now am much happier with the results.

 

Just don't forget to unplug your gear when the weather man predicts lightning storms to roll in :)

 

Thanks for sharing your very interesting, money-saving experience.

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I have seen the 2.6% or thereabouts THD in quoted a few times by people independently. This I believe is the distortion generated by the Power Plant itself. It's not much a big deal, since the output is cleaned up. Would be interesting to see a fourier of that distortion.

 

It is interesting to learn that the Power Plant is good at cleaning the electrical noise it generates itself. Sounds like worth buying :)

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What power conditioner are you using?

 

 

None, I have no need.

 

 

- I live in Europe where power is stable and relatively clean.

- I exclusively use professional equipment that naturally has all needed power filtering.

 

 

I did work for APC as a Technology Strategist, and yes we made tons of money off Americans who often lives with a power quality usually only found in poor undeveloped countries.

 

 

Well, at the risk of seeming somewhat jingoistic, I will say that if the US "lives with a power quality usually only found in poor undeveloped countries." (which I don't believe), then it's only because our infrastructure wasn't completely destroyed by bombs about 70 years ago, and didn't have to be completely rebuilt from scratch in the post-war years. I guess we Americans were so busy helping you Europeans rebuild after the war via the Marshall Plan that we didn't have the time to update our own.

 

But, for my own edification, are you saying that your 50 Hz (?!!) 220 Volt mains grid is so good and so quiet that noise generated by refrigerators, air conditioners, computers, vacuum cleaners, and other appliances doesn't get into your mains supply? Permit me to doubt....

 

I'm not going to even bring-up that flimsy two-prong mains connector that most mainland European countries use. In fact, the only European country (of which I'm aware) that has a truly adequate mains plug is Great Britain (and that one is overkill for a lot of applications, but better overkill than underkill in this case):)

George

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I am not using power conditioning, and am not thinking of doing it, but I would like to find a power plug that filters electrical noise and protects against power surges.

 

Hi Boris75,

 

These were as close and as cheap an option I could find that do actually work. The filters have to be housed somewhere, but these boxes are small and thin.

 

1. Furman AC-215a at $120 with 2 outlets

 

2. APC C-2 at $60 with 2 outlets

 

Cheers

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Well, at the risk of seeming somewhat jingoistic, I will say that if the US "lives with a power quality usually only found in poor undeveloped countries." (which I don't believe), then it's only because our infrastructure wasn't completely destroyed by bombs about 70 years ago, and didn't have to be completely rebuilt from scratch in the post-war years. I guess we Americans were so busy helping you Europeans rebuild after the war via the Marshall Plan that we didn't have the time to update our own.

 

But, for my own edification, are you saying that your 50 Hz (?!!) 220 Volt mains grid is so good and so quiet that noise generated by refrigerators, air conditioners, computers, vacuum cleaners, and other appliances doesn't get into your mains supply? Permit me to doubt....

 

I'm not going to even bring-up that flimsy two-prong mains connector that most mainland European countries use. In fact, the only European country (of which I'm aware) that has a truly adequate mains plug is Great Britain (and that one is overkill for a lot of applications, but better overkill than underkill in this case):)

 

Our infrastructure was destroyed by the same short-sightedness that dismantled the California public school system.

 

How long have you lived in California? Long enough to remember the Enron/brown-outs?

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