SACD ripping using your PS3 (part 2)

[sligolad]

Thank you sir, you are a gent.

[petscan]

This is my first post and I have to thank Ted for the guide. I play the DSD files using windows on an atom machine, via USB 2.0 interface of Mytek. I want to switch to Linux but i am not sure whether the Linux ALSA can recognize the Mytek. Can anybody help? Thanks

[ted_b]

The Mytek USB 1.0 port is Linux friendly, but only to 24/96, therefore can't carry DoP (24/176k required). It's USB 2.0 port is not Linux-friendly. A solution is to use a Linux-friendly USB converter from Mytek's S/PDIF, etc.

[Miska]

For Mytek + Linux DSD playback there are two options I recommend:

 

1) Use Firewire (requires some extra hassle)

2) Use MuFi V-Link192 and AES cable to the Mytek

 

I've found both of these to give good results.

[ted_b]

Miska, Thanks. I specifically did not mention firewire cuz the OP of the question mentioned an Atom machine with USB. Mytek's AES input is very nice so the V-Link192 is a great call (and adds only a $399 list price to the mix).

[petscan]

Thanks Miska and Ted for the FireWire suggestion. I can install a FireWire expansion card in the atom machine. Which FireWire chipset and which Linux build would you recommend? Thanks.

[Miska]

Thanks Miska and Ted for the FireWire suggestion. I can install a FireWire expansion card in the atom machine. Which FireWire chipset and which Linux build would you recommend? Thanks.

 

TI chipset is usually most recommended. Although seems to work for me with "NEC Corporation uPD72874 IEEE1394 OHCI" too..

 

You'll need a custom Linux kernel build to make it work, unless some distro has included the driver (?).

[petscan]

TI chipset is usually most recommended. Although seems to work for me with "NEC Corporation uPD72874 IEEE1394 OHCI" too..

 

You'll need a custom Linux kernel build to make it work, unless some distro has included the driver (?).

 

Thanks Miska. Is there any web link with instructions on how to customize the Linux kernel build to make Firewire work? Many thanks.

[Miska]

Thanks Miska. Is there any web link with instructions on how to customize the Linux kernel build to make Firewire work? Many thanks.

 

No, not that I know of. So if you are not entirely familiar with configuring and building custom Linux kernels, I'd recommend you either find someone to do it for you, or alternatively take the USB -> V-Link192 -> AES route.

[astrotoy]

Thanks to Ted for his primer on SACD ripping. I'm starting to look for an old PS3 on ebay. Three newbie questions. They may be answered in the 32 pages of this thread, but I haven't looked through every posting. First, are the Channel Classic DSD downloads multichannel or only stereo. Second, is the DSD rip that comes off the PS3 multichannel if the SACD is multichannel? Finally, I have an Oppo BDP-95 which I think should do multichannel decodes of DSD files. Am I correct that the Mytek 192 and Playback Designs only do stereo decodes. Are there other good sounding DAC's that decode DSD in multichannel? I have about 150 SACD's, a fair number (not like my 15,000 records) which I bought for multichannel capabilities.

 

Thanks for all help, Larry

[mlknez]

Hi Larry,

 

Good luck with your new adventure. Generally, to keep wear and tear down on the non-robust PS3, people first rip the entire SACD to an image file (.iso). If the original disc contained both 2-channel and multi-channel versions of the songs, you will see both and be able to play both. The oppo 95 can either covert the DSD tracks to analog using it's own digital to analog converters (DACs) then send the sound to a reciever/prepro or it can bitstream out DSD to a reciever/prepro that has the ability to convert DSD using the receiver/prepros DACs or it can convert to PCM and then bitstream the PCM to a receiver/prepro for conversion on the receiver/prepros DACs.

 

All external DACs (like the Mytek) are currently only 2-channel products and the DACs on the Oppo are as good as any. I personally find that you will get more bang for your buck with room correction than with picking and choosing individual DACs anyway.

[ted_b]

Thanks to Ted for his primer on SACD ripping. I'm starting to look for an old PS3 on ebay. Three newbie questions. They may be answered in the 32 pages of this thread, but I haven't looked through every posting. First, are the Channel Classic DSD downloads multichannel or only stereo. Second, is the DSD rip that comes off the PS3 multichannel if the SACD is multichannel? Finally, I have an Oppo BDP-95 which I think should do multichannel decodes of DSD files. Am I correct that the Mytek 192 and Playback Designs only do stereo decodes. Are there other good sounding DAC's that decode DSD in multichannel? I have about 150 SACD's, a fair number (not like my 15,000 records) which I bought for multichannel capabilities.

 

Thanks for all help, Larry

 

Larry, as mlknez said, the PS3 ripping process (not to be confused with extraction process) rips the entire disc to an ISO image. That is a duplicate image of the entire disc, and if the disc had both a stereo SACD and multichannel SACD layer, then so will the ISO image. There are basically 3 things you can do with an ISO image (aside from simply archiving it):

1) burn it to a DVD-R for playback in Oppos and other SACD players that are compatible with (what we now call what you created) SACD-R's.

2) extract the ISO to either stereo tracks or multichannel tracks (assuming they exist on the disc) using sacd-etxract.exe, a pc or Mac -based extraction tool. yes it is true that earlier versions of the sacd-ripper allowed both ISO ripping and DSF/DIFF extraction, the latest v36 of the ripper does only ISO ripping; the idea being that you would want to save any addtl precious life out of your old PS3 spinner for ripping only...and offload the extraction to a Windows or Mac machine.

3) play as an SACD ISO in several software players like J River, Foobar, Audirvana, etc.

 

Channel Classics has almost,if not all, of their native DSD catalog available for stereo DSD download. Only a couple of selections are available for multichannel download, so far.....and for good reason..there is a paucity of solutions to playback file-based multichannel DSD. Most multichannel DACs that we discuss here (Metric Halo, Prism, Steinberg, etc) are PCM-based DACS. You could go pro and get a Sonoma DSD mastering workstation but it is unlikely, impractical and very expensive for most of us. That leaves us with wanting consumer-oriented multichannel DACs that handle native DSD. I, for one, am going to help Mytek get there by beta testing their multiple Stereo 192 DSD stacked DAC (3) idea here fairly soon (their new firmware is required to synch dacs together, using a firewire hub, etc). but that is still a little ways off. In the meantime, stick with disc-based Oppo multichannel playback for now. It's very good. My 600+ SACD's are being used that way (DSF stereo files to DSD-capable stereo DAC, SACD disc on Oppo for multichannel). And you have the ISO's ready to extract to multichannel DSF files when ready.

[TarnishedEars]

Channel Classics has almost,if not all, of their native DSD catalog available for stereo DSD download. Only a couple of selections are available for multichannel download, so far.....and for good reason..there is a paucity of solutions to playback file-based multichannel DSD. Most multichannel DACs that we discuss here (Metric Halo, Prism, Steinberg, etc) are PCM-based DACS. You could go pro and get a Sonoma DSD mastering workstation but it is unlikely, impractical and very expensive for most of us. That leaves us with wanting consumer-oriented multichannel DACs that handle native DSD. I, for one, am going to help Mytek get there by beta testing their multiple Stereo 192 DSD stacked DAC (3) idea here fairly soon (their new firmware is required to synch dacs together, using a firewire hub, etc). but that is still a little ways off. In the meantime, stick with disc-based Oppo multichannel playback for now. It's very good. My 600+ SACD's are being used that way (DSF stereo files to DSD-capable stereo DAC, SACD disc on Oppo for multichannel). And you have the ISO's ready to extract to multichannel DSF files when ready.

FYI - I don't know if you have read about the new OPPO BDP-105 which is slated to replace the 95. However reliable source have it that this machine features multiple DAC inputs. I know for sure that it has SP-DIF and Toslink, and USB inputs for the DAC. I'm not sure if it has an HDMI DAC input or not. However I am speculating that there is a chance that this unit may well decode DSD streams via the USB input; possibly even multichannel DSD.

[astrotoy]

Thanks to mlknez and teb_b for all the valuable information. So far my extensive ripping has been solely in the 2 channel domain. I have downloaded a few of the multichannel files from the Boston Symphony website (BTW, a real bargain at $50 for a year with unlimited downloading of what they have released, including a fair amount of hirez stuff, both 2 channel and some multichannel). I haven't tried to play the multichannel files yet through my Oppo 95. I had written a PM to Ted that my initial workaround for my 150 or so SACD's has been to take the analog 2 channel signal out of the Oppo95 (through the balanced connections) and feed it directly into my PM Model Two at 192/24. Obviously, I don't preserve the digital signal. My main purpose is to make it easier to play the SACD's and maintain the quality of sound - no need to find and load them. So I don't think that burning to an DVD-R will help me. However, ripping on a PS3 to an iso file and then extracting the multichannel part sounds like it is the way to go for my purpose.

 

Finding a suitable PS3 has been a bit of a challenge. I have looked at ebay, but even after reading the thread, I'm not sure of exactly what to look for in the description, since SACD is not mentioned. With a 33 yo daughter and 1 yo granddaughter, I missed the PS3, Nintendo wii, xbox era (we did have a gameboy) so really don't have a clue about the evolution of the PS3 models. If I find a potential PS3, do I just ask whether it plays SACD's or is there some other clue that the seller can tell from the markings on the PS3? Any suggestions about other sources?

 

Thanks again.

 

Larry

[TarnishedEars]

Astroboy,

 

It is difficult to find compatible PS3s anymore. The models which will work are listed here:

PS3SACD.com PlayStation3 Super Audio CD FAQ

 

But you need to find one with early firmware, and that is the real trick, as most of these have long since been updated by Sony, and so will no longer work.

[ted_b]

Here are the eligible PS3's (make damn sure the firmware is 3.55 or less...which is not current firmware by the way)

 

[ted_b]

FYI - I don't know if you have read about the new OPPO BDP-105 which is slated to replace the 95. However reliable source have it that this machine features multiple DAC inputs. I know for sure that it has SP-DIF and Toslink, and USB inputs for the DAC. I'm not sure if it has an HDMI DAC input or not. However I am speculating that there is a chance that this unit may well decode DSD streams via the USB input; possibly even multichannel DSD.

 

Yes,. I know the 105. My understanding is that the DSD decoding is disc only, but that may change. Right now Oppo is saying 24/192.

[rafiosso]

Once again thanks to ted_b. I sucessfully ripped my first 10 SACD (not much time, one disc per evening :-) ). Everything ran smooth, but today SACD-ripper doesn't show the progress bar - after clicking "X to start ripping" the picture freezes (ripping works, as my thumbdrive blinks - eventually afer hour ripping is complete). Any ideas? Can I reinstall the ripper (mine is 0.36)?

[SammyU]

What you described seems to happen on certain discs with version 0.36. It happened to me last night with 'Celluloid Heroes' by the Kinks, and also with 'Tumbleweed Connection' and 'Honky Chateau' by Elton John, and a few others I've run into. I believe it is harmless....the rips always complete sucessfully, just wait until your thumbdrive stops blinking, as you have been doing, then eject the SACD and hold the power button down for a semi-graceful shutdown.

 

I wouldn't worry about it...just realize it's disc-specific, a bit annoying, but ultimately harmless.

[ted_b]

Yes, same response as SammyU. I've only had it happen to the two Elton John's mentioned. Weird, i know.

[uvrmd]

How do I check if the firmware is 3.55 or less?

[ted_b]

Firmware version is in the menu, under settings/system settings/system info

How to check PS3 firmware version - YouTube

[rafiosso]

Yes, same response as SammyU. I've only had it happen to the two Elton John's mentioned. Weird, i know.

Thanks a lot, so nothing to worry about :-)

[scan80269]

Hi Ted, received my PS3 today ready to jump in at the deep end.

Could you could PM me the links/instructions as well please?

I believe I just managed to download ps3_355_kmeaw_cfw so that will be one step in place.

 

Cheers, Pearse.

 

Hi Ted,

I just joined CA and an SACD-capable PS3 arrived today. Can I trouble you to PM me the links/instructions? The piece I'm having a hard time with is sacd-ripper.pkg.

 

Many thanks!

Sam

[ted_b]

Hi Ted,

I just joined CA and an SACD-capable PS3 arrived today. Can I trouble you to PM me the links/instructions? The piece I'm having a hard time with is sacd-ripper.pkg.

 

Many thanks!

Sam

 

PM sent. Welcome to CA.