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Article: HARMAN Acquires Roon


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I am not sure how to react. All this merging, while good for companies is not necessarily good for consumers. It means less competition.

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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14 minutes ago, firedog said:

If Harman doesn't interfere much in Roon, it will be a positive development. Roon will be availble on many more devices and be a more important player. It will also give Roon some more power with the streaming services and benefit us. 

 

Maybe drop the price.

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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6 minutes ago, Shadorne said:

I am worried. I already feel that Roon has lost direction in the last 3 years. I find I am frustrated waiting for updates/database re-scans etc. I find myself fighting the user interface to know where tracks are and their provenance. Searches now take far too long - it is becoming painful to use (even on the fastest machines money can buy).

 

I am lifetime user since it started. I am finding user interface is worse than when I started. I am finding bugs when playing two DACs simultaneously. I am finding audible processing problems in several situations - for example turning on parallel/core processing causes audible sound quality degradation on my Mac M2 Max Studio.

 

Sadly Roon suffers the curse of all software. Initially it is developed by people that use it (like Steve Jobs) and they keep it functional. Finally, at the end stage, the software team is full of people who don’t actually use most features of the software and they are just dumping new features into the application until the point that it does everything with mediocrity and no longer excels at anything.

 

I have seen this in my engineering career countless times - it seems to be an inevitable unavoidable cycle and Roon is on it’s last legs.

 

Folks, I am ready to look for alternatives - what are your suggestions?
 

 

 

 

I would ask in a separate thread.

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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Just saying, if wanting different - that may help is all. Cheers!

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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33 minutes ago, LarryMagoo said:

If there was something as good or better than Roon, we would know about it...currently there is not....Roon is currently the finest way to listen to music from a stockpile of digital files... IMO.....

 

I think it is too bloated for use really. I understand why people like it, just NOT at the asking price. 

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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I can't see what it will gain me. My wife thinks what I am using now is hard. At AXPONA my wife tried ROON and she told she hopes I would never buy it. She said she wasn't interested in all the fluff ( her words). She just wasn't what she is interested in it.

 

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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People complain about Apple, Google, MS, etc. being snoopy. but Roon, nah. I am sorry, I want to know what it is doing on my network so much. I had two HD's become corrupt because of lax attitude on my part, when I was doing my MS and PhD. I had backups of everything, so I was fine. 

 

Why does the software need to the constant connection?

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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16 minutes ago, LarryMagoo said:

ARC is the reason for a network connection.  Roon never required a network connection before ARC.   I got suspended for 90 days from their forum when I made an accusation about having ARC just to gather data on people’s listening habits and the contents of their album collection.    Data has always had a market….but then I got ARC working and appreciated having my entire collection available to me on the road…

 

My wife used to have her own business and some of her competitors would have done anything to get her customers. They were very loyal to her. So, it is protection of that information that stops us. Just not willing.

 

I have seen and dealt with some unsavory characters, in my professional career, so I have that also. 

 

Just me. Ask @DuckToller - we met this summer. It was such an amazing trip. 

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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26 minutes ago, PYP said:

Makes sense to me that she doesn't want to do the same stuff she does for work.  My wife does not like/trust computers in general (shopping is the exception 🙃 ), but she uses Roon to listen to her favorite music and make playlists.  People complain about the search function, but she is able to find what she wants.  Once I showed her how to find higher resolution versions, she uses that feature too.  

 

She still prefers her Logitech Touch as an interface (who wouldn't?), but the "big rig" that is powered by Roon sounds very nice and can play loud when needed.  Different strokes and all that.  

 

I bought the lifetime subscription long ago, so it is free now.  To me, Roon has always been very good, but it boosted into the stratosphere when it integrated Qobuz.  Those two together have changed how I listen to music.  

I don't use streaming...

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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14 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Roon had to connect to the mothership to verify your license long before ARC. This was done over the network. 

 

So does JRiver but once that is done, it never goes back unless you choose auto update, which I don't. 

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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8 minutes ago, bbosler said:

 

So you don't use streaming because you think your wife's competitors might be able to hack your network and access your customer  database? 

 

You are waaaaaaay  past the point of being "paranoid enough"

 

image.thumb.png.a8542814f660c61ef954b988eb7857b9.png

 

 

I don't use streaming because artists get almost no money for it as only the top artists get money and it is pennies, but that was discussed in another thread. I would rather pay the artist, like on Bandcamp, than pay for streaming.

 

If you like streaming by all means use it but, paying money like that - no for me.  This is from 2023.

 

Streaming Platform Average Payout per Stream
Tidal $0.01284
Apple Music $0.008
Amazon Music $0.00402
Spotify $0.00318
YouTube Music $0.002
Pandora $0.00133
Deezer $0.0011

 

Tidal pays 1.2 cents per stream and that is the highest average. meaning artists who get more streams get a little more. Streaming lines the pockets of the labels, not the artists.

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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6 minutes ago, bbosler said:

 

on the other hand I've discovered a lot of new artists and albums I've never heard by artists I know. That has led to a lot of physical media being purchased that they would never have sold without streaming. On another other hand, some of that is used vinyl records for out of print titles so the artist got nothing from that. 

 

It is a complicated topic, but I don't think the fact that you refuse to stream has any bearing on anything other than making you feel good about it. If you want to help the artists get a streaming service and leave it on 24/7 so some artist  is always getting a little bit

 

 

 

I can't possibly listen to the amount of music I have currently (includes about 3500 vinyl lps, about the same in CD's, and say 6 TB of high res music (not all duplicates or triplicates). That is what I use bandcamp and various music magazines for. I tend to be the curious type so I will listen to anything once. I don't need streaming to help me with that. 

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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Just now, The Computer Audiophile said:

They all pay the same. It's just that Tidal listeners don't stream as much music. It's all percentage based. 

 

I understand that. As I said above - I don't need streaming to point me to new music, I find too much on my own. 😁

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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11 hours ago, playtron said:

Harman bough them for car integration... if Harman fails (jury still out) Samsung may divest..... could kill ROON. Future less clear. The ROON team wanted to cash out. 

It would be ashame, Harman has some great brands.

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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I could see some powered Revel M126Be's with Roon as the front end. If they could come in at a decent price point and also sound as good as the Revels do, they would have a huge seller.

 

My opinion :D

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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1 hour ago, Josh Mound said:


Are they transferable? If so, put me in line behind Ray! Haha.

 

1 hour ago, Josh Mound said:

I think how good or bad this is really depends on how you weigh the likelihood of Roon failing on its own versus the likelihood of Harman killing it. As someone who’s recently adopted Roon and loves it, I really want Roon to stay around. I also want it to get licensing to integrate Apple Music and other services. I have no idea if the former is more likely under Harman, but I think the latter is. And I say this as someone who’s pretty “meh” on Harman’s target curve and products. (I briefly owned the M126be mentioned by @botrytis and sold them pretty quickly.)

😁 no accounting for taste... 🤣

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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10 hours ago, seeteeyou said:

https://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/tech/2023/12/419_319900.html

 

Well, do we even know what "cockpit" is supposed to mean?

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/sep/06/cars-collect-extensive-personal-data-on-drivers-study-warns

 

Samsung disables customer phones remotely, holds data hostage until Mexican government stepped in

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38050381

https://nomadscrolls.net/2023/10/23/samsung-and-other-manufacturers-disable-phones-bought-on-gray-markets-a-consumer-nightmare/

 

It's pretty much like they could actually do anything they want, do we still wanna have a piece of that Samsung "goodness" for real?

 

Jeep does this already with the McIntosh amps in the Jeep Grand Wagoneer

 

McIntosh Automotive: The Vehicles (mcintoshlabs.com)

 

 

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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Who knows these days. Information is money, these days.

 

Just because I am paranoid, doesn't mean people don't want my information.

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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41 minutes ago, DuckToller said:

sensors & mics ?

There is a camera on the rear view mirror, I think.

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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  • 3 weeks later...
28 minutes ago, Markus8 said:


That actually sums it up perfectly why there is no deeper discussion going on or even possible in their online forum. 
Very sad and strange behavior to silence users when they come up with opinions that don‘t fit into Roon‘s views. 

 

They own their forum and can do what they want but I agree it is a bad look.

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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  • 2 weeks later...
7 minutes ago, Markus8 said:

So far even the feedback on the Roon forum and thus their own community is very underwhelming to say. 
They also seemed not to take care what the first public sign or message they convey with the Roon/Harman fusion is. Other than providing value based on bugfixing or new features to their Software etc. they come up with an overpriced luxury hardware.
So if that is the direction the new Roon/Harman is heading too than the worry of users will further increase.

 

Everyone wants to catch the whales out there.

Current:  Daphile on an AMD A10-9500 with 16 GB RAM

DAC - TEAC UD-501 DAC 

Pre-amp - Rotel RC-1590

Amplification - Benchmark AHB2 amplifier

Speakers - Revel M126Be with 2 REL 7/ti subwoofers

Cables - Tara Labs RSC Reference and Blue Jean Cable Balanced Interconnects

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