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Article: Streaming & Local Content Through HQPlayer - A Nice Alternative With The sonicTransporter


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As long as we are discussing UPnP, I don't know how others feel about this, but I would love to use JRiver as my control application and library manager because I find it much more flexible than the HQPlayer client.  (I am aware there is an experimental workaround that is supposed to allow this but I never got anything to play even after following directions explicitly.)   Frankly, while it is fashionable to bash JRiver, if it sounded as good as HQPlayer does on most material and had better DSP streaming skills, I wouldn't need anything else.

 

It doesn't sound as though UPnP integration is something we can expect from HQPlayer, but, if it were to be implemented and work reliably, I would upgrade from Desktop Embedded to have access to it.

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7 > HQP Embedded > xfinity Xfi Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > Sonore Optical Module Deluxe > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Optical Tier 2 > Okto DAC 8 Stereo > Topping Pre90 Preamp > Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Computer Desk System: Synology DS-218+ NAS > Dell XPS 8930/NUC 10 i7  > HQP Desktop > xfinity Xfi Router > EtherRegen > ultraRendu > Topping D90 DAC > Audioengine A5+'s

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6 minutes ago, Mike Rubin said:

As long as we are discussing UPnP, I don't know how others feel about this, but I would love to use JRiver as my control application and library manager because I find it much more flexible than the HQPlayer client.  (I am aware there is an experimental workaround that is supposed to allow this but I never got anything to play even after following directions explicitly.)   Frankly, while it is fashionable to bash JRiver, if it sounded as good as HQPlayer does on most material and had better DSP streaming skills, I wouldn't need anything else.

 

It doesn't sound as though UPnP integration is something we can expect from HQPlayer, but, if it were to be implemented and work reliably, I would upgrade from Desktop Embedded to have access to it.

I tested using JRiver with HQP embedded. It works, but has the same issues as the other UPnP servers/control points when it comes to gapless. 

Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems AudiophileStyleStickerWhite2.0.png AudiophileStyleStickerWhite7.1.4.png

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The foobar2000 player should work with gapless playback support handled by its playback engine and the resulting continuous audio stream output sent via UPnP to HQPe's Rygel UPnP renderer. So similar to how Roon likely sorts out gapless for its (continuous) audio output to HQPlayer, though of course UPnP isn't used there.

 

The Windows version of fb2k requires you install the foo_out_upnp plugin component to provide the UPnP output support (note: not the similarly named older foo_upnp plugin); the Mac version of fb2k, which doesn't currently support plugins, apparently has UPnP output support built-in (can't test as I don't use Macs) with the feature maintained inline with the foo_out_upnp plugin for the Windows version.

 

Output to the selected UPnP renderer is supposed to be bit perfect but LPCM only and you have a choice of it being sent either as raw LPCM or encoded in FLAC or WAV (presumably the same is true for the Mac version).

We are far more united and have far more in common with each other than things that divide us.

-- Jo Cox

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2 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

I tested using JRiver with HQP embedded. It works, but has the same issues as the other UPnP servers/control points when it comes to gapless. 

Is gapless the only issue?  If so, that might not be a deal breaker. Does HQPe just find the server on JRiver? (I still will need JRiver for mp3's in any event.)

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7 > HQP Embedded > xfinity Xfi Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > Sonore Optical Module Deluxe > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Optical Tier 2 > Okto DAC 8 Stereo > Topping Pre90 Preamp > Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Computer Desk System: Synology DS-218+ NAS > Dell XPS 8930/NUC 10 i7  > HQP Desktop > xfinity Xfi Router > EtherRegen > ultraRendu > Topping D90 DAC > Audioengine A5+'s

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5 hours ago, Mike Rubin said:

Is gapless the only issue?  If so, that might not be a deal breaker. Does HQPe just find the server on JRiver? (I still will need JRiver for mp3's in any event.)

Not knowing exactly how you use JRiver I can’t be sure if you’ll run into issues. 
 

JRiver sees HQPe and can send to it just like it does other UPnP renderers. 
 

I’d say test the trial of HQPe. 

Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems AudiophileStyleStickerWhite2.0.png AudiophileStyleStickerWhite7.1.4.png

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3 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Not knowing exactly how you use JRiver I can’t be sure if you’ll run into issues. 
 

JRiver sees HQPe and can send to it just like it does other UPnP renderers. 
 

I’d say test the trial of HQPe. 

Pardon the newbie dumbass question, but before I head down this path: can I operate HQPe from a thumb drive alone or must I install it to a hard drive on a Linux computer?  (If the latter, I am reluctant to delete my existing Windows installation.  Even when I have a complete image of my Windows discs, I seemingly always have to reinstall OS and apps from scratch and data from backup if I decide to go back to Windows after trying something else.)

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7 > HQP Embedded > xfinity Xfi Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > Sonore Optical Module Deluxe > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Optical Tier 2 > Okto DAC 8 Stereo > Topping Pre90 Preamp > Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Computer Desk System: Synology DS-218+ NAS > Dell XPS 8930/NUC 10 i7  > HQP Desktop > xfinity Xfi Router > EtherRegen > ultraRendu > Topping D90 DAC > Audioengine A5+'s

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13 minutes ago, Mike Rubin said:

can I operate HQPe from a thumb drive

Yes you can.

Go to this page https://www.signalyst.com/embedded-install.html?

and follow the link in the chapter Downloading and configuring bootable image

select the compatible image for your hw and burn it on a usb thumb drive

… it should be this one https://www.signalyst.eu/bins/hqplayerd/images/hqplayer-embedded-4.26.0-x64amd.7z

connect it to your pc and boot from it … done

 

Stefano

 

My audio system

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1 hour ago, stefano_mbp said:

Yes you can.

Go to this page https://www.signalyst.com/embedded-install.html?

and follow the link in the chapter Downloading and configuring bootable image

select the compatible image for your hw and burn it on a usb thumb drive

… it should be this one https://www.signalyst.eu/bins/hqplayerd/images/hqplayer-embedded-4.26.0-x64amd.7z

connect it to your pc and boot from it … done

 

Thank you, Stefano. 

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7 > HQP Embedded > xfinity Xfi Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > Sonore Optical Module Deluxe > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Optical Tier 2 > Okto DAC 8 Stereo > Topping Pre90 Preamp > Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Computer Desk System: Synology DS-218+ NAS > Dell XPS 8930/NUC 10 i7  > HQP Desktop > xfinity Xfi Router > EtherRegen > ultraRendu > Topping D90 DAC > Audioengine A5+'s

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16 hours ago, stefano_mbp said:

Yes you can.

Go to this page https://www.signalyst.com/embedded-install.html?

and follow the link in the chapter Downloading and configuring bootable image

select the compatible image for your hw and burn it on a usb thumb drive

… it should be this one https://www.signalyst.eu/bins/hqplayerd/images/hqplayer-embedded-4.26.0-x64amd.7z

connect it to your pc and boot from it … done

 

EDIT:  I also am not getting any sound output when trying to play to rendu NAA from files dragged and dropped into HQPe, so this may not be a DLNA issue as I assumed.

 

ORIGINAL:  I remain a bit dumbfounded by HQPe. 

 

I downloaded the evaluation version.  I was able to write the image to a USB stick, boot my NUC off the stick once I defeated bootup security, log into HQPlayer, find it in a browser, set it up per the attached screen, and, finally, to find it as a UPnP destination on my JRiver "playing now" menu.  Unfortunately, nothing happens when I try to play anything and I get the attached error message about JRiver being unable to control the DLNA client. 

Am I missing something in my setup?

 

Screenshots of setup and JRiver error message are attached.

HQPe Screen.PNG

JRiver error message.PNG

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7 > HQP Embedded > xfinity Xfi Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > Sonore Optical Module Deluxe > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Optical Tier 2 > Okto DAC 8 Stereo > Topping Pre90 Preamp > Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Computer Desk System: Synology DS-218+ NAS > Dell XPS 8930/NUC 10 i7  > HQP Desktop > xfinity Xfi Router > EtherRegen > ultraRendu > Topping D90 DAC > Audioengine A5+'s

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5 hours ago, Mike Rubin said:

Am I missing something in my setup?

While Audirvana works “as is” with HPQe JRiver needs some more sw to integrate with HQPe.

@Geoffrey Armstrong wrote some time ago the piece of sw needed, as far as I can remember it worked on Windows only, for this reason I didn’t try it as I’m on Mac.

 

I cannot find the thread where he described it but you can try to PM him to obtain some information.

I cannot help you on micro rendu as I don’t have that device, I tried with my SOtM SMS200 Neo and it worked as expected.

Stefano

 

My audio system

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8 minutes ago, stefano_mbp said:

While Audirvana works “as is” with HPQe JRiver needs some more sw to integrate with HQPe.

@Geoffrey Armstrong wrote some time ago the piece of sw needed, as far as I can remember it worked on Windows only, for this reason I didn’t try it as I’m on Mac.

 

I cannot find the thread where he described it but you can try to PM him to obtain some information.

I cannot help you on micro rendu as I don’t have that device, I tried with my SOtM SMS200 Neo and it worked as expected.

Ah, okay.  Thank you.  I did try that fix and followed the directions to the letter, but had exactly the same result.  In fact, the reason I tried the embedded version was my failure to get the integration software to work. I thought the UPnP capabilities in HWPe would make it unnecessary to do the JRiver tweaking that the workaround software requires.

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7 > HQP Embedded > xfinity Xfi Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > Sonore Optical Module Deluxe > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Optical Tier 2 > Okto DAC 8 Stereo > Topping Pre90 Preamp > Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Computer Desk System: Synology DS-218+ NAS > Dell XPS 8930/NUC 10 i7  > HQP Desktop > xfinity Xfi Router > EtherRegen > ultraRendu > Topping D90 DAC > Audioengine A5+'s

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40 minutes ago, stefano_mbp said:

@Mike Rubin ... Geoffrey's sw was in fact indicated for HQPlayer Desktop

Yes, my licensed copy of HQP is Desktop .  I tried Geoffrey's software with that.

 

Thank you for the configuration information for JRiver. I will check my server settings .

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7 > HQP Embedded > xfinity Xfi Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > Sonore Optical Module Deluxe > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Optical Tier 2 > Okto DAC 8 Stereo > Topping Pre90 Preamp > Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Computer Desk System: Synology DS-218+ NAS > Dell XPS 8930/NUC 10 i7  > HQP Desktop > xfinity Xfi Router > EtherRegen > ultraRendu > Topping D90 DAC > Audioengine A5+'s

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6 hours ago, stefano_mbp said:

then in Audio - Format set PCM 16-bit

 

Did you test if the PCM 24-bit (aka L24) option works? Otherwise, any 24-bit file tracks in the playlist will be bit depth reduced & therefore not bit-perfect. Presumably, leaving the setting as PCM 24-bit for any 16-bit files would be zero padded to construct the L24 stream, so shouldn't be an issue.

We are far more united and have far more in common with each other than things that divide us.

-- Jo Cox

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4 hours ago, stefano_mbp said:

@Cebolla @Mike Rubin ... this one seems to be the best configuration of the DLNA Server in JRiver as original resolution and bit depth are both preserved

 

then in Audio - Mode: Original (as you can see Format is now greyed out)

 

dlna2.jpeg.09cebb95ededa1189d5a92d497a15d91.jpeg

 

and here two examples while playing

 

16/44.1

dlna2-1.thumb.jpeg.c907f26e7e6abdc51f90e0c0b1170b8d.jpeg

 

24/96

dlna2-2.thumb.jpeg.c0d911de3c81f5f177873d03d4b1b083.jpeg

Got this working!  Thank you very much!

Living room:  Synology 218+ NAS > NUC 10 i7 > HQP Embedded > xfinity Xfi Router > Netgear GS348 Switch > Sonore Optical Module Deluxe > Sonore Signature Rendu SE Optical Tier 2 > Okto DAC 8 Stereo > Topping Pre90 Preamp > Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini > Revel F32 Concertas

 

Computer Desk System: Synology DS-218+ NAS > Dell XPS 8930/NUC 10 i7  > HQP Desktop > xfinity Xfi Router > EtherRegen > ultraRendu > Topping D90 DAC > Audioengine A5+'s

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On 10/20/2021 at 2:55 PM, Cebolla said:

Instead of the 1s fixed time, how about allowing the user to set the UPnP end of track time adjustment, say from a range 1s -10s default 1s (assuming you have enough buffer, or can increase the buffer to accommodate, if user unnecessarily selects 10s in quick control point/media server case)?

 

Technically, it would only need adding a configuration option(s). But on the other hand it is band-aid for something that should work without. I'm just always concerned about number of configuration options, I already get so much complaints about configuration being too complex. At the moment there are three internal parameters that control this behavior.

 

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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3 hours ago, vgrubb said:

I haven't used DLNA or UPNP much over the years, but I'm curious as to whether the sound quality varies with the different servers (JRiver, Minim, etc.) used to send to HQPlayer.

The difference between Jriver and Minimserver is not subtle. I found Jriver presented a coarse resolution compared with Minimserver given everything else was the same, server, endpoint, cabling and so on.

This is not using HQPLAYER,  but direct to a Lumin U1. 

Also tried Plex, just crashed on startup, maybe the OS was not suitable.

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On 10/22/2021 at 6:36 AM, stefano_mbp said:

While Audirvana works “as is” with HPQe JRiver needs some more sw to integrate with HQPe.

@Geoffrey Armstrong wrote some time ago the piece of sw needed, as far as I can remember it worked on Windows only, for this reason I didn’t try it as I’m on Mac.

 

I cannot find the thread where he described it but you can try to PM him to obtain some information.

I cannot help you on micro rendu as I don’t have that device, I tried with my SOtM SMS200 Neo and it worked as expected.

It's true, it only works on Windows. This is because when the guys behind J River ported it to Mac, for some reason, they left out the feature that allows you to offload playback to an external app (such as mine) by file type.

Owner of: Sound Galleries, High-End Audio Dealer, Monaco

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On 10/22/2021 at 9:06 AM, stefano_mbp said:

@Mike Rubin ... Geoffrey's sw was in fact indicated for HQPlayer Desktop

Actually, I have tested my sw in the past with embedded and it did work. I just need to point out though that in the most recent version of HQPlayer, Jussi has introduced an encryption feature for communication between HQPlayer and other apps. This is a great feature, which I asked for myself. Unfortunately though, I have not had time to update any of my apps to take advantage of it yet. Because of that, if anyone's trying to use newer versions of HQPlayer with this feature, they probably won't work with HQAV. Perhaps @miska you could just post here from which version HQPlayer incorporates the encryption feature? My sw will only work with versions prior to that.

Owner of: Sound Galleries, High-End Audio Dealer, Monaco

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