I have had it with Roon, their lack of support, their user forum, and it's users...

[kennyb123]

3 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Now instead of losing control of the audio device, Roon is saying the NAS is offline. It isn't. I have a constant ping to it and it's response time hasn't gone above 0.4ms, and none of my other SMB connections to the NAS from other devices have been effected. 

 

Playback cruising along, then just stops. This seems familiar. 

These outdoor zones - are they connected over wifi?  RAAT has struck me as awfully brittle.  Delays anywhere along the path will cause playback to stop.  The error messages tend not to be helpful either.  But you know that already.  

[The Computer Audiophile]

6 minutes ago, kennyb123 said:

These outdoor zones - are they connected over wifi?  RAAT has struck me as awfully brittle.  Delays anywhere along the path will cause playback to stop.  The error messages tend not to be helpful either.  But you know that already.  

I wish it was that easy :~)

 

This setup has only one zone in use, an Ethernet device on the same switch. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

Ah, I've been listening with the lights low in my office for 39 minutes or so. All of a sudden a blast of continuous white noise, and this on my phone. 

 

Any guesses what the problem will be blamed on? 🙃

 

 

[AudioDoctor]

26 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Ah, I've been listening with the lights low in my office for 39 minutes or so. All of a sudden a blast of continuous white noise, and this on my phone. 

 

Any guesses what the problem will be blamed on? 🙃

 

 

 

This happens to me as well. Everything on my audio net has a fixed IP and are all connected to the same switch that is physically in the room.

[jvvita]

Not to blame your network  (as I agree with all that has been said about roon’s posture of blaming the client’s network setup), but I used to have serious dropouts when I used a managed switch, and I had to had a rockOS in my chain. When I replaced the switch by an unmanaged one, the problems were gone. Now I can even use roon + hqplayer in the same machine (intel i9-10900k).  Cheers!

[The Computer Audiophile]

4 minutes ago, jvvita said:

Not to blame your network  (as I agree with all that has been said about roon’s posture of blaming the client’s network setup), but I used to have serious dropouts when I used a managed switch, and I had to had a rockOS in my chain. When I replaced the switch by an unmanaged one, the problems were gone. Now I can even use roon + hqplayer in the same machine (intel i9-10900k).  Cheers!

Thanks for the input. Seriously. 
 

Roon often says to use unmanaged switches, but says we can use managed switches as well. I really wish Roon would identify issues with managed switches so we could adjust the settings. Managed switches are required for some environments. I was at a house this week with 128 wireless lights. These need their own VLAN or else it’s going to be a mess. 

[jvvita]

I feel your pain. I have about 30 security cameras, and iptv, both on Vlan. I went to the extreme of a second cable run from the unmanaged switch to the main router just to accommodate this situation. So the audio system is on a totally different network, bound only by the router. 

 

Roon support has told me that the problem was with multicast packages. But I could not get it fixed, no matter how much I tried. So I gave up and took the longer road. 

[AudioDoctor]

Roon needs to make software that can integrate into a normal network, whether it has managed switches or not. From simple to complex. It is simply ridiculous for them to expect someone to create another entire network simply for their software they refuse to make work like every single other piece of software that works on a network.

 

edit: You know what works 100% perfectly, 100% of the time? HQPlayer...  same network. same everything. 

 

edit 2: AND, HQP sounds better...

[ssh]

My EtherREGEN connects a sonicTransporter (with a USB tethered + 5TB drive) to an ultraRendu. The ultraRendu's USB out goes to my Bricasti M3 and no dropouts.

 

System is (almost) always playing Roon on random. I have left my home for weeks and music is playing when I'm back home. Not every time, but most of the time.

 

 

[AudioDoctor]

4 minutes ago, ssh said:

My EtherREGEN connects a sonicTransporter to an ultraRendu. The ultraRendu's USB out goes to my Bricasti M3 and no dropouts.

 

System is (almost) always playing Roon on random. I have left my home for weeks and music is playing when I'm back. Not every time, but most of the time.

 

 

 

I have left mine running while I made a quick trip out for something during the day and it is almost never still playing when I get back.

[ssh]

Each system is unique. Roon works for me but it is pretty stupid of the company not to offer solutions for users who have problems.

 

For me, the two best things I ever did in audio was getting the $500 Roon lifetime membership and getting back to stereo/mono.

 

The dumbest thing was when I sold my Mac MC60s.

 

 

Live & learn.

 

[cjf]

Knock on wood my Windows 10 Core server has been working fine with Roon but the one Ubuntu Roon endpoint I use everyday at my desk (Intel NUC i5) connected directly to my Benchmark DAC3 via USB loses connectivity to the audio device like 3 times within an 8hr window everyday day. It all started after the 1.8 Roon update.

 

Gotta close all my shit down and reboot the damn thing each time 🤬

 

Maybe Roon needs to hop aboard the AES67 boat and drop the craptastic Multicast RAAT protocol that only works on flat networks. They just took the easy way out for endpoint discovery purposes and to cater to non network savvy users but in the process greatly limited their platforms capabilities.

 

If you want to make yourself sick open up a network monitor sometime and watch how "Chatty" Roon is hammering everything on the same Subnet at all times. Looks like a DOS Attack

[The Computer Audiophile]

52 minutes ago, cjf said:

Knock on wood my Windows 10 Core server has been working fine with Roon but the one Ubuntu Roon endpoint I use everyday at my desk (Intel NUC i5) connected directly to my Benchmark DAC3 via USB loses connectivity to the audio device like 3 times within an 8hr window everyday day. It all started after the 1.8 Roon update.

 

Gotta close all my shit down and reboot the damn thing each time 🤬

 

Maybe Roon needs to hop aboard the AES67 boat and drop the craptastic Multicast RAAT protocol that only works on flat networks. They just took the easy way out for endpoint discovery purposes and to cater to non network savvy users but in the process greatly limited their platforms capabilities.

 

If you want to make yourself sick open up a network monitor sometime and watch how "Chatty" Roon is hammering everything on the same Subnet at all times. Looks like a DOS Attack

Also look at the logs. It’s insane how much is written constantly and how much internet communication is required. 

[AudioDoctor]

That explains why my network is so much snappier and just works better when Roon is off. 

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

On 7/4/2021 at 9:17 PM, R1200CL said:

So how can SQ be improvement ? Does anyone at Roon or you know ?

 

SQ can be improved simply by using a better DAC 🙂 

I get all the complaints about the lack of support, fanatic user community, and server performance, but when it comes to audio quality, the problem does not lie with Roon... 

[jvvita]

38 minutes ago, hopkins said:

 

SQ can be improved simply by using a better DAC 🙂 

I get all the complaints about the lack of support, fanatic user community, and server performance, but when it comes to audio quality, the problem does not lie with Roon... 

Seconded

[R1200CL]

1 hour ago, hopkins said:

but when it comes to audio quality, the problem does not lie with Roon

Interesting. I also can’t fully understand why people says different players sound better. I wonder why players sounds differently ? As long as you compare CD quality PCM playback. And especially if you use the same HW for installed SW. 

[davide256]

My guess... Roons "are you the active roon instance?" background check is causing the drops when connection to the validation server is poor. I routinely

switch between windows and linux Roon instances, theres random delay, misbehavior when switching.

[Iving]

16 hours ago, cjf said:

If you want to make yourself sick open up a network monitor sometime and watch how "Chatty" Roon is hammering everything on the same Subnet at all times. Looks like a DOS Attack

 

15 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Also look at the logs. It’s insane how much is written constantly and how much internet communication is required. 

 

15 hours ago, AudioDoctor said:

That explains why my network is so much snappier and just works better when Roon is off. 

 

Leaving aside:

dropouts,

and unsolicited adverts for overpriced irrelevant computers,

and all the "electronic turbulence" possibly associated with that network chatter - the kind that we audiophiles endlessly try to mitigate,

and all the other personal prejudices I suffer about online abuse - such as being told what kind of music I might like,

respectfully I just don't understand why or how Roon users can tolerate such unwarranted interference ... 

even lifetime subscribers.

Isn't it sometimes better to cut your losses and run?

Never to return?

Like from a scissors-wielding ex?

I mean it's not like a lifetime subscription paralllels sacred marriage or anything.

Down with all that kind of shenanigans,

and very best wishes to all those who must escape her clutches!

[AudioDoctor]

3 hours ago, hopkins said:

SQ can be improved simply by using a better DAC 🙂 

 

 

which one do you suggest I get?

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

50 minutes ago, AudioDoctor said:

 

which one do you suggest I get?

 

Nothing you would take seriously given how much you have invested in your digital system. The point is, I doubt there is anyone here (with a "high end" system) using another software that does not implement heavy tweaking to make it sound better. So what's so special about your configuration? Did you really think Roon was going to solve everything? 

[AudioDoctor]

6 minutes ago, hopkins said:

 

Nothing you would take seriously given how much you have invested in your digital system. The point is, I doubt there is anyone here using another software that does not implement heavy tweaking to make it sound better. So what's so special about your configuration? 

 

I am not alone in considering Roon's SQ to be sub par, and when I want to listen for anything other than convenience I turn Roon off and use other players, specifically HQPlayer. Perhaps the question you need to ask yourself is, why don't I hear the difference?

 

edit: It doesn't take mega dollars to hear the differences either, in my opinion. I can hear it clear as day with a raspberry Pi4 into a Schiit Modi multibit.

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

Just now, AudioDoctor said:

 

I am not alone in considering Roon's SQ to be sub par, and when I want to listen for anything other than convenience I turn Roon off and use other players, specifically HQPlayer. Perhaps the question you need to ask yourself is, why don't I hear the difference?

 

I don't use Roon any longer, but I did not stop not for SQ reasons.. 

 

DACs, even those that cost 20.000$, are sensitive to what's happening upstream. You expect Roon to work like HQPlayer but they are completely different software, with different functionality! You can't have it all... 

[AudioDoctor]

1 minute ago, hopkins said:

 

I don't use Roon any longer, but I did not stop not for SQ reasons.. 

 

DACs, even those that cost 20.000$, are sensitive to what's happening upstream. You expect Roon to work like HQPlayer but they are completely different software, with different functionality! You can't have it all... 

 

 

 

Weird assumptions, but ok...

[Qhwoeprktiyns]

1 minute ago, AudioDoctor said:

 

Weird assumptions, but ok...

 

You could have opened a topic to request all the Roon functionality to be added to HQPlayer... It would have been interesting...